How did the people accept what the Lord Jesus said?

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Godsgood

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Oct 31, 2024
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EPHESIANS 4:11
11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
 
Jesus told His disciples that following His departure, the Holy Spirit would come and remind the disciples of everything He (Jesus) taught them.

They then became apostles and began to share the Gospel in "Jerusalem, Judea, Samaria and the ends of the earth" (Acts 1:8).
 
How did the people accept what the Lord Jesus said

Jhn 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.
 
Like Dino246, I don't understand what Ephesians 4:11 has to do with the thread title.

I would say that Jesus tells us that His sheep hear His voice and follow Him - they accept what He says.
 
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EPHESIANS 4:11
11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
According to Ephesians 4:11, the Lord Jesus gave some to be apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors, and teachers.
How did the people who read and believed in the Holy Scriptures recognize and accept these individuals in these roles?
If these ministries were given by the Lord Jesus, how did these people come to have the ministries or positions mentioned in Ephesians 4:11?
In other words, how did they know that someone was truly called or gifted by the Lord to serve as an apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor, or teacher?
 
According to Ephesians 4:11, the Lord Jesus gave some to be apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors, and teachers.
How did the people who read and believed in the Holy Scriptures recognize and accept these individuals in these roles?
If these ministries were given by the Lord Jesus, how did these people come to have the ministries or positions mentioned in Ephesians 4:11?
In other words, how did they know that someone was truly called or gifted by the Lord to serve as an apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor, or teacher?
They searched the Scriptures DAILY to see if what they heard matched Scripture. All of the above list of guys MUST use the Word to deliver their message.

If they spoke contrary to the Word, then they were false.
 
According to Ephesians 4:11, the Lord Jesus gave some to be apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors, and teachers.
How did the people who read and believed in the Holy Scriptures recognize and accept these individuals in these roles?
If these ministries were given by the Lord Jesus, how did these people come to have the ministries or positions mentioned in Ephesians 4:11?
In other words, how did they know that someone was truly called or gifted by the Lord to serve as an apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor, or teacher?

Because God is not double-minded and because He is "full of truth" He cannot lie. It should go without saying that no true preacher of God would teach something in opposition to what is already written. I mean, that's the low hanging fruit, accepted by babes in the Lord, for testing those who claim to be apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors, or teachers.

But, the scriptures that were widely available at the time that letter was written would have been the Torah (OT) alone. Paul's letter to the Ephesians is dated sometime around 60AD. The first record of a collection of his writings is found around 140AD. However, God did not leave his people flounder for 80 years until someone could "search the New Testament" to see if what someone was preaching lined up with the writings.

We should be grateful that 1) the Holy Spirit gives witness to the spirits of the saints about the authenticity of what was being preached and 2) that the tradition of confirmation, the laying on of hands, was practiced by the church fathers. We actually have a record of these two things in the scriptures.

The elementary doctrine of "the laying on of hands" (Hebrews 6) was used as a witness to commission those who were sent by God and burdened with a measure of authority. Traditionally, Moses used this in front of the priest and the people to commission Joshua.

"Now Joshua the son of Nun was full of the spirit of wisdom, for Moses had laid his hands on him; so the children of Israel heeded him, and did as the Lord had commanded Moses."

We see this administration in the church at Antioch, led by the Holy Spirit, for the commissioning and releasing of Saul (Paul) and Barnabas as apostles:

"Now in the church that was at Antioch there were certain prophets and teachers: Barnabas, Simeon who was called Niger, Lucius of Cyrene, Manaen who had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul. 2As they ministered to the Lord and fasted, the Holy Spirit said, “Now separate to Me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them.” 3Then, having fasted and prayed, and laid hands on them, they sent them away."


Notice how they could not search the scriptures to confirm what "the Holy Spirit said" as there was no previous record of confirming Saul and Barnabas as apostles. However, the prophets and teachers had the reliable direction of the Holy Spirit. As part of their witness to others, they laid hands on the two brothers to confirm them as apostles and released them to their ministries.

Also notice that these were not just anyone: these men were "prophets and teachers" among the Antioch church. They would have had a trusted witness of the character of Christ, and following the Holy Spirit, among the brethren.

So then take Paul extends this example in the sending of Timothy. We read this account (in 2nd Timothy) of commissioning and empowerment as Paul lays hands on Timothy:

"Therefore I remind you to stir up the gift of God which is in you through the laying on of my hands."

To the saints and Thessaloniki, Paul wrote this about Timothy:

"We sent Timothy, our brother and fellow worker for God in the gospel of Christ, to strengthen and encourage you in your faith, 3so that none of you would be shaken by these trials."

The "we" in this letter is the authors of the letter: Paul, Silvanus, and Timothy ("Paul, Silvanus, and Timothy, To the church of the Thessalonians in God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ..."). Paul, Silvanus, and Timothy perpetuate this elementary doctrine in the sending of Timothy.

Lastly, it should be noted that Paul gives himself as the example for Timothy. These are words which Timothy "heard" (not read in a letter).

"Hold fast the pattern of sound words which you have heard from me, in faith and love which are in Christ Jesus. 14That good thing which was committed to you, keep by the Holy Spirit who dwells in us.
"

I chose this example to make the point that commissioned leaders, like apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors, and teachers, should have living examples of the grace the accompanies their ministries. Paul was in Antioch for years under prophets and teachers (at least) before being released as an apostle. Timothy and Silvanus walked with Paul before being released as apostles.

Of course, the ultimate example is Jesus and the 12. When He said "Go and make disciples..." the disciples knew exactly how to make disciples from the example of Jesus Christ and His three years with them. They lived, learned and were led by Him for three years before being sent out as Apostles of the Lamb. Paul, and others, perpetuates this standard with his disciples and those whom he sends.
 
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EPHESIANS 4:11
11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
We could raise the question, based on this verse, who is doing the giving and to whom did he give it? Some commentators might suggest that Christ is giving these men to his church. Some might argue that God is giving these roles to men. In my view, God the Father is giving these men to his Son.
 
We could raise the question, based on this verse, who is doing the giving and to whom did he give it? Some commentators might suggest that Christ is giving these men to his church. Some might argue that God is giving these roles to men. In my view, God the Father is giving these men to his Son.
One could argue that "His Son" and the church are the same thing in certain contexts.

But here the passage seems clear:

"But to each one of us grace was given according to the measure of Christ’s gift."

Just a few sentences later we have this:

"And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers..."

The purpose of the gifts are then noted:

"..for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ..."

The standard of which (the standard of equipping and edifying) is Christ Himself:

"..till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ..."

This is why, when this standard is met, there will be no more need of the spiritual gifts:

"But when that which is perfect has come, then that which is in part will be done away."

Until then, they are given to men for the equipping of the saints and the edification of the Body of Christ.