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Ahh, so somehow the prohibition is now just the "physical" dead we can't pray to. Gosh, I don't see that verse in the Scriptures.
You're the one adding to the Scriptures. You keep ignoring the plain truth of Scripture. Those in heaven are NOT dead. They watch us, cheer us on, and pray for us. The Lord Himself affirms that they are not dead, telling those who claim otherwise "you have been greatly deceived."
I may not have included the exact verses, but EVERY statement I made is found from Scripture.
The simple, plain Scriptural truth is this. We are all one family in Christ. Death cannot separate us from His Love, and thus also from our Christian family. Those brothers and sisters in Christ who have gone to Heaven are aware of our actions, they rejoice when someone repents, they cheer for us, and they offer their prayers to God. We know that they are holy because nothing unholy can enter Heaven. And we know that the prayers of a holy man has tremendous effect as well. So, knowing this, how can you say that it's against the Scriptures to ask our brothers and sisters in Christ to pray for us? Why do you insist on contradicting the very clear words of Our Lord saying that they are not dead? Why do you insist that death somehow is able to overcome Christ's love and the bond with our family? Are you saying that death is greater than Christ?
You're the one adding to the Scriptures. You keep ignoring the plain truth of Scripture. Those in heaven are NOT dead. They watch us, cheer us on, and pray for us. The Lord Himself affirms that they are not dead, telling those who claim otherwise "you have been greatly deceived."
I may not have included the exact verses, but EVERY statement I made is found from Scripture.
The simple, plain Scriptural truth is this. We are all one family in Christ. Death cannot separate us from His Love, and thus also from our Christian family. Those brothers and sisters in Christ who have gone to Heaven are aware of our actions, they rejoice when someone repents, they cheer for us, and they offer their prayers to God. We know that they are holy because nothing unholy can enter Heaven. And we know that the prayers of a holy man has tremendous effect as well. So, knowing this, how can you say that it's against the Scriptures to ask our brothers and sisters in Christ to pray for us? Why do you insist on contradicting the very clear words of Our Lord saying that they are not dead? Why do you insist that death somehow is able to overcome Christ's love and the bond with our family? Are you saying that death is greater than Christ?
The original KJ Bible contains the Apocrypha. The so-called Catholic Bible reads the same as any other Bible. I have been reading the Word a long time, and there is no mention of asking those who sleep with their fathers to pray for the living.
These past few days, here in Spain, there are processions all over the country, some with people carrying various versions of imagined likenesses of Mary and of Jesus. In many cities there are multiple versions with multiple imagined likenesses of each. Each IMAGE has a different name for its particular power attributed it. They also have competitions between the Marys. I cannot understand how this came about. There was never such a thing in the practices of our founding fathers of the church. The apostles did not practice such things.
One of the saints here is nicknamed "The Moor Killer," that would be James who is also called Santiago and who is actually the brother of Jesus, Jacob. I say is, because all sleep until the last Trumpet is sounded. This is in all Bibles. It is a misnommer to refer to any real Bible as Catholic or Protestant, since they all have the same teachings.
I do not understand the unscriptural behavior of the folks in this country, not at all. I know when the pope visited here, over €2,000,000.00 was paid for the preparations for his visit in Valencia City alone. It was nice and clean though, on top of a bridge. Those nasty poor who had been lodging under the bridge had been "cleaned out" for his visit. Nice. God bless all in Yeshua...............
These past few days, here in Spain, there are processions all over the country, some with people carrying various versions of imagined likenesses of Mary and of Jesus. In many cities there are multiple versions with multiple imagined likenesses of each. Each IMAGE has a different name for its particular power attributed it. They also have competitions between the Marys. I cannot understand how this came about. There was never such a thing in the practices of our founding fathers of the church. The apostles did not practice such things.
One of the saints here is nicknamed "The Moor Killer," that would be James who is also called Santiago and who is actually the brother of Jesus, Jacob. I say is, because all sleep until the last Trumpet is sounded. This is in all Bibles. It is a misnommer to refer to any real Bible as Catholic or Protestant, since they all have the same teachings.
I do not understand the unscriptural behavior of the folks in this country, not at all. I know when the pope visited here, over €2,000,000.00 was paid for the preparations for his visit in Valencia City alone. It was nice and clean though, on top of a bridge. Those nasty poor who had been lodging under the bridge had been "cleaned out" for his visit. Nice. God bless all in Yeshua...............
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C
I ask you where have I "prohibited" it to just the physical dead, when I said,
Just so you know, that game of twisting words will not work on me. I assume you understand that people do know how to read and that they, hopefully, will read the orginal?
Honestly, will you stop implying things. I said:
I may not have included the exact verses, but EVERY statement I made is found from Scripture.
We are all one family in Christ. --- Here is the patience of the saints: here are they who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus (Rev 14:12). In Jesus's teachings, has he ever told us to pray to anyone except to God?What did the Catholic church do to this second commandment, and what did they do the make up this deleted commandment:
Death cannot separate us from His Love, and thus also from our Christian family. --- That is presumptious. One of the things which can separate us from Christ is misdirected prayers and the affirmative "amen" to those other than God.
Those brothers and sisters in Christ who have gone to Heaven are aware of our actions, they rejoice when someone repents, they cheer for us, and they offer their prayers to God. We know that they are holy because nothing unholy can enter Heaven. --- The angels are holy, are we to pray to them also? Revelation tells us not to crouch to (worship) angels, but only pay homage to (worship) God.
And we know that the prayers of a holy man has tremendous effect as well. So, knowing this, how can you say that it's against the Scriptures to ask our brothers and sisters in Christ to pray for us? --- Again I ask, where does it say that it is God ordained to pray to anyone except to Him? Again I say, Jesus prayed to no one except to the Father.
　
Why do you insist on contradicting the very clear words of Our Lord saying that they are not dead? --- Why do you insist that I insist this. Tell me, how many times do I have to say that we have a great cloud of witnesses in Heaven? Are you wanting me to say that they are bodily resurrected? I am sure you understand the difference I make when I say "physical" and "spiritual", let us agree that there is a difference.
　
Why do you insist that death somehow is able to overcome Christ's love --- What does Christ's love have to do with praying to the saints in Heaven? I am certain God's love for us was displayed upon the cross. I am certain His love was not meant to set us free to pray to man-made statues, angels, humans. There is only one who is worthy of all adoration, Christ our Savior and God.
and the bond with our family? Are you saying that death is greater than Christ? ---No, Scripture says that Christ is greater than the physical dead, angels, even the saints in Heaven. How many mediators do we need? Does not the Son intercede for you? Is this to great of a job for Him alone?
S
Processions are a common part of Catholic practice, either carrying a crucifix or a image of a Saint. Usually they end in a church for either a Mass, the Rosary, or one of the liturgical hours. There are certain "wonder-working" images (so called because many miracles have come about from them) that reside in Spain that would have been on procession as well.
James is called "The Moor Killer" in Spain because during the Reconquista the Knights of Santiago played a pivotal role in driving out the Moors
As if the Pope dictated that they be removed, that was strictly the doing of the Spanish government. And just so you know cites love to host WYD because it's a boon to their businesses since you have millions of people that need somewhere to stay and need to eat. buy clothes, etc.
James is called "The Moor Killer" in Spain because during the Reconquista the Knights of Santiago played a pivotal role in driving out the Moors
As if the Pope dictated that they be removed, that was strictly the doing of the Spanish government. And just so you know cites love to host WYD because it's a boon to their businesses since you have millions of people that need somewhere to stay and need to eat. buy clothes, etc.
From another thread, not only are individuals picking the teachings that please them, they now choose which god to pray to and to which to attribute miracles. Real miracles are of God, anything else is of satan.
Anyone today may call himself a Christian, but few are they who listen to Jesus Christ and follow His teachings. Most religious people today tend to follow the favorite teachings of the moment on christianity, having itching ears they have teachers who teach what they want to hear.
If anyone hears Jesus, and believes Him, and adheres to His teachings then that person is a follower of Christ.
The pope is not Jesus Christ's representative on earth, and no pope has ever been infallible. To say anyone other than our Lord, Yeshua, is infallible is of satan.
Anyone today may call himself a Christian, but few are they who listen to Jesus Christ and follow His teachings. Most religious people today tend to follow the favorite teachings of the moment on christianity, having itching ears they have teachers who teach what they want to hear.
If anyone hears Jesus, and believes Him, and adheres to His teachings then that person is a follower of Christ.
The pope is not Jesus Christ's representative on earth, and no pope has ever been infallible. To say anyone other than our Lord, Yeshua, is infallible is of satan.
C
If, as you say in another thread and as the popes proclaim in their letters, the Catholic church gave us the written word of God, then at which point must we conclude the popes to be error when one of the founding fathers of the Catholic religion said the Catholic church have given us the complete Bible, yet 1300 years later, they added to Scripture? They can only be right once.
Originally Posted by SantoSubito
The Catholic Church gave you the Bible, it gave you the theological foundation you use for your Faith to this very day, it defended Europe from the Muslims (via the Crusades) and brought Christianity to your ancestors. I'd say you owe it quite a bit.
You emphasize that EVERY statement you made is found in scripture. Prove it, because I know you're wrong and can't prove it. But we have shown scripture that proves what catholicism does is EVIL in the eyes of YHVH. And that IS biblical fact, no matter how much you attempt to twist scripture around.
S
Well considering broad acceptance of the books that Catholics call Deuterocanon by churches outside the Roman Empire (Ethiopia for one) I would say accepted.
So did most original Protestants accept the Protestant Bible? Or did Martin Luther thrust it upon them?
Not only that but theres no real resistance to the books in history (Jerome I know is going to be brought up here).
So did most original Protestants accept the Protestant Bible? Or did Martin Luther thrust it upon them?
Not only that but theres no real resistance to the books in history (Jerome I know is going to be brought up here).
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