666 Mark of Beast A non-left behind/dispensational/Hal Lindsey perspective

1still_waters · Jun 23, 2012

***PLEASE WATCH ALL OF IT BEFORE KNEE JERK REACTING...*******
Here is a different perspective on 666 and the mark of the beast. Different than what most hear coming out of most American 'prophetic' teaching.

This is an alternative to the left-behind/tim lahaye/Scofield/Dispensational understanding.

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Gary DeMar - What is the "Mark of the Beast"? - YouTube

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Gary DeMar - Why is 666 the "Number of the Beast"? - YouTube

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The Beast of Revelation (11 of 25) The Number of the Beast? - YouTube

I may post some more later.

1still_waters · Jun 23, 2012

peterT · Jun 24, 2012

If it is symbolic how does the stop you from buying and selling?

17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

If it is symbolic how would you know if you have taken the mark or not?

And what would be the difference between us and them when Jesus comes.

The angels come and separate the wicked from among the just and first he gathers the tares into bundles

30Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

The tares take the mark because they are Gather together first.then gather us wheat into his barn.

The wicked could say to God in the last day I never received the mark of the beast in my right hand, or in my foreheads.

What better way to show God that you do live by faith and walk by faith than to have to literally live and walk by faith because you won’t be allowed to buy or sell.

Yes scripture with scripture, just because it has been symbolic in the past doesn’t necessary mean it’s symbolic in the future, especially when it says And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark.

If it was symbolic no one could stop us from buying.

Repentantnut · Jun 25, 2012

Anything that leaves a freakin mark on the hand or forehead that is required to buy or sell is the mark. It might pretty well be the rfid, or a tatoo, or a bar code whatever. When I read some comments like...only for medical purpose, yeah right, until the bank voids your cards and tell you they will setup you account or nip or access to buy and sell on the aleady inserted chip if be. so hum what a deception indeed. It cannot be forced on you, may thecrows feed us... and/or rapture come. But the worship of the beast will be mandatory. So God Save us.

enochson · Jun 25, 2012

Repentantnut said:

Are you all blind. Man has allways whorship his flesh why do you think god kill it. the mark of the beast is the flesh of a man body,soul and spirit nothing more talk god for Jesus christ who change it to 777 that is when you get your butt of the throne with the freewill crap.

loveme1 · Jun 25, 2012

enochson said:

Yes, that mark(flesh) really stops us buying or selling, quite sure the flesh is what leads us to buy and sell...

May I ask who taught you this stuff?

Is there a label to your way of thinking?

eternally-gratefull · Jun 25, 2012

loveme1 said:

I would like to know the same, He has some odd beliefs I have never heard before.

eternally-gratefull · Jun 25, 2012

enochson said:

777? Where do you get this?

Free will crap? God did not make us robots. he made is for his pleasure, he wanted to take care of us, he gave us freewill. Non free will is crap!

Grandpa · Jun 25, 2012

Our Father, who art in heaven, hallowed be your name, Your kingdom come, Your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven.

God's will be done.

peterT · Jun 25, 2012

God seal on his people is symbolic

But the mark of the beast it’s the number of a man. It’s not Gods seal or number

And man in his history as put a mark on man lots of times, the Jews, the slaves’ cattle, and street gangs etc. etc. and so on

What’s wrong with good old fashion scripture and sticking to the script?

For it says.

Revelation 13:16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads
17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark
Rv14 9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
10The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
Revelation 15:2 And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God.

Revelation 16:2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.

Revelation 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Revelation 20:4And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

1still_waters · Jun 25, 2012

peterT said:

God seal on his people is symbolic

But the mark of the beast it’s the number of a man. It’s not Gods seal or number

And man in his history as put a mark on man lots of times, the Jews, the slaves’ cattle, and street gangs etc. etc. and so on

What’s wrong with good old fashion scripture and sticking to the script?

For it says.

Revelation 13:16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads
17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark
Rv14 9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
10The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
Revelation 15:2 And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God.

Revelation 16:2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.

Revelation 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Revelation 20:4And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Valid point. Then since we're sticking to the text. They certainly received this mark around 2000 years ago, seeing Jesus told them in Chapter 1 that this was all to happen quickly/soon/near in their time.

peterT · Jun 25, 2012

1still_waters said:

Is that you saying that Revelation is fulfilled already ?

Rv19:10-for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

Not the spirit of history.

Luke24;25T hen he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:

1still_waters · Jun 26, 2012

peterT said:

I think a good amount of it is. Not his final coming.

He said these things will happen near/soon. *shrugs*.

If we're striving for literal interpretations, you gotta take that literal.

That was said in the MOST didactic part of Revelation. Yet those who favor literalism for ALL of revelation, decide the MOST didactic part is all the sudden NOT literal.

peterT · Jun 26, 2012

1still_waters said:

That sounds like john was introducing himself in chapter 1 and giving his thoughts on the matter. Because he thought the time was at hand.

Or there is no time in the spirit, and in Gods eyes it will shortly come to pass because there is no time in the spirit.

Rv10:6And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer: 7But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

Do you think that the mark of the beast is already fulfilled?.

1still_waters · Jun 26, 2012

peterT said:

Lol there is no indication it's personal opinion. He's writing as an inspired writer.

See what I mean. For some reason the most didactic part, the most literal, is for some reason dismissed by those who claim they wanna take EVERYTHING so literal.

1still_waters · Jun 26, 2012

peterT said:

This shows John isn't just giving personal opinions in Rev 1.

Rev 22 says, in Jesus' own words...

10 Then he told me, “Do not seal up the words of the prophecy of this scroll, because the time is near.

peterT · Jun 26, 2012

1still_waters said:

Then it must be no time in the spirit then because in your own words not all Revelation is fulfilled.

The difference between you and me on the mark of the beast is, I teach and preach it as it is written and you don’t. I have not added or taken away from the word but you are trying too.

And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark.

If it’s already happened or happening then have you been buying or selling lately?

loveme1 · Jun 26, 2012

Though many may have come to believe or consider Revelation to have been fulfilled or symbolic etc...

I think when things come to pass, that it will come into their minds and they will remember all that was written....

Fundamental information will be in their minds, and it will all click........

For Yahvah God and Yahshua the Messiah's Glory I pray it will.........

So, even if you are unsure what every verse means, familiarize yourself with what is written and hold fast.

Pray and seek the truth.

1still_waters · Jun 26, 2012

peterT said:

Lol so you'll take the mark as literal, but NOT the repeated references to these things being near/soon/at hand/coming quickly as literal? *face palm*

So near can also mean far away? What words would Jesus have used if he had meant to tell them near? Oh he would have said near!

If statements like near/quickly/soon in Revlation don't mean what we know them to mean then I guess there could be a 2000+ year gap between the second woe and third woe because it says..

Revelation 11:
14 The second woe is past. Behold, the third woe is coming quickly.

Of course then you'll flip back to wanting to take time statements like quickly/soon as literal.

I just find it sadly funny that quckly/soon/near/at hand is taken literally in every place in the NT, except in these four or five verses Revelation! If we let scripture interpret scripture, then it has to mean the same thing in these few verses that it meant in the MANY verses. Especially when it's in a non-symbolic part of the text, and especially when you DEMAND we take so much LITERALLY, even if it's in a more symbolic part of the text.

Keep in mind, in prophetic text, God communicates time to us on our level. When he means to communicate near to us on our level he says near. When he means to communicate far away to us on our level he says far away. Look at what he did in Daniel. To communicate far away to them on their level, he didn't say near/soon. He used words to indicate a longer passage of time...

Daniel 8:26
“And the vision of the evenings and mornings Which was told is true; Therefore seal up the vision, For it refers to many days in the future.”

Daniel 10:14
Now I have come to make you understand what will happen to your people in the latter days, for the vision refers to many days yet to come.”

So how do I know the mark of the beast has already happened?

Because Jesus told them those things were going to happen soon, and because God has a solid record of communicating such things to us on our level so we can understand when something is near, soon or far away.

Abiding · Jun 26, 2012

haha cool! good coffee read thread

666 Mark of Beast A non-left behind/dispensational/Hal Lindsey perspective

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