baptized INTO moses. do you understand what that means? Moses was their leader. They were PLACED INTO (baptized) UNION with him
could you please show where (in any language) the israelites are said to have been baptized INTO moses...into union with moses? why would they be baptized INTO union with moses? he couldn't save anyone!
you clearly don't get it.
the word is unto - to (consecrate to), not
into.
They were not baptized INTO water. The cloud and the sea where the things they experienced with moses. The sea was parted BY AND THROUGH moses. And the cloud and pillar of fire at night was to LEAD moses, and they followed MOSES.
you clearly have a pressing need to negate water as something the New Covenant Gospel includes, so let's leave Moses and go to Peter mentioning Noah.
1 Peter 3 18 because also Christ once for sin did suffer -- righteous for unrighteous -- that he might lead us to God, having been put to death indeed, in the flesh, and having been made alive in the spirit, 19 in which also to the spirits in prison having gone he did preach, 20 who sometime disbelieved, when once the long-suffering of God did wait, in days of Noah -- an ark being preparing -- in which few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water; 21 also to which an antitype doth now save us -- baptism, (not a putting away of the filth of flesh, but the question of a good conscience in regard to God,) through the rising again of Jesus Christ,
struggle with that, go to any language you know, check any commentary you wish - they all reiterate exactly what peter has just said - it is not the ark he is referencing, it is the water. he makes clear that water alone merely cleanses dirty flesh. it is the appeal (repentance and confession) to God for a clean conscience according to His promise of the forgiveness (remission) of sins - repent and be baptized.
in exact accordance with what Jesus ordained (here's yet another translation, commas removed) even with "in" - no "then" conjunctive:
Matthew 28 19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit
No it does not. if you believe this, you might as well be circumcized also. because your trying to earn your salvation by your works. and not by the work of Christ.
trying to "earn" my salvation by being baptized? (i must laugh at this). can you show me where Jesus taught that? or paul the preacher of justification by grace through faith taught baptism was anathema as 'working for salvation'? if you can't show anyone in the New Testament saying that, you ought to stop teaching it.
since you're not addressing the greek (you've misrepresented) take the commas out, and read it as a literal english translation.
there is no conjunctive adverb
"then" or any other "time" descriptor used in peter's instruction, nor Christ's.
and is a coordinating conjunctive - it links
ideas of equal importance to each other. it is a single command of two things needful for the remission of sins, with two promises attached (it goes without saying they have heard the message and believed it):
do: repent and be baptized
receive: remission of sins and the Holy Spirit
Acts 2 38 and Peter said unto them Reform and be baptized each of you on the name of Jesus Christ to remission of sins and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit,
if someone is insistent that these commands be broken up as separate commands to obey the Gospel, separated by time or some other factor, it looks more like this:
1) repent/reform
2) and be baptized on the name of (be consecrated unto) Jesus Christ to (unto/ for the) remission of sins
3) and receive the gift of the Holy Spirit
which doesn't help your case at all.
baptize DISCIPLES. you baptize THEM/ Jesus did not tell them to go and make people disciples by baptizing them, He said make them disciples. and THEN baptise them
red-letter for you. what did Jesus say? this:
Matthew 28 19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit
or this:
Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, then baptize them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit
Baptized INTO Christ. No where in this passage does it say they were baptized INTO water. That is the issue, people see the word and ASSUME water is involved, Which was my point, even in the gree, the word BAPTIZE did not mean water. You could be baptized in water in the greek, but it does not mean it HAS to be water. there are many examples of the word baptize used in greek literature where NO WATER is involved.
do you wish to post examples of greek literature (in greek if possible please)?
or do you wish to just read and agree with what Jesus said?
Romans 6 3are ye ignorant that we, as many as were baptized
to Christ Jesus,
to his death were baptized?
Think about what your saying, If baptizm ALWAYS means water, then look at your interpretation (literal)
For as many as were baptized in water in Christ, did put on Christ. There are TWO subjects there that one is baptized into, this makes no sense. Christ is the one we are baptized into in this passage, NOT WATER.
i did not say it always means water. i said that is what we are commanded to do, and you yourself admitted you are not able to baptize with the Holy Spirit. so what's the problem?
you even say it yourself, but refuse to admit it, because you have developed a fanatical 'anti-works' gospel which writes off the ordinance of baptism as 'a work', even going so far as to equate it with paul's curse on Old Covenant circumcision as a 'work'. this is pretty poor scholarship.
[adjusted for correct grammar]:
For as many as were baptized in water unto (to) Christ, did put on Christ. There are TWO subjects there that one is baptized into, this makes no sense. Christ is the one we are baptized unto/to/consecrated to/determined to obey and receive forgiveness from/follow in this passage, NOT WATER.
we are baptized unto Christ, and so put on Christ, receiving remission of sins.
we repent, are baptized in water, and receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
sorry you still won't accept it.
ex:
Christ's orders are to "baptize": "dip" them, as Munster's Hebrew Gospel renders it; that is, in water, which, though not expressed, is implied; for with no other baptism could the apostles baptize: not with the Holy Ghost, and with fire; for this was Christ's peculiar prerogative; but with water, which they in obedience to this commission practised, Acts 8:36, and which was to be done
correctly, "into the name." Baptizing into the name has a twofold meaning. 1. Unto, denoting object or purpose, as εἰς μετάνοιαν, unto repentance (Matthew 3:11); εἰς ἄφεσιν ἁμαρτιῶν, for the remission of sins (Acts 2:38).
