Marriage... What advantages are left for men?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
D

DABEARS8519

Guest
#1
Basically, in today's society, as far as marriage is concerned in the WESTERN world, it's screwed up. As a man, and men of my generation, we kind of look at marriage and we cringe. There are very few benefits to it nowadays. Aside from the Christian ideal of marriage (which sadly, very few people acknowledge anymore in western culture), marriage is somewhat of a joke. There are few, if any, advantages to marriage for men nowadays, and men take ALL the risk. What I'm saying is this: Aside from the thousands of dollars we spend on a ring, assuming we don't get turned down (since that ring is worthless after we buy it), what advantages do we gain by marrying a woman? If you go into a relationship normally, examine what you'd likely already receive. I could move in with a significant other, and I'd still receive all the benefits of a marriage (love, partnership, companionship, sex, financial support, etc). What advantage would I get from marrying that woman? I'd take all the risk based on the divorce laws of today's society. A woman could divorce me on a whim, with no reason whatsoever, and she'd automatically receive half of everything I own, she'd get the kids (if there are any), the house, the car, possibly alimony (to add to my new found financial destruction), and even child-support for the kids that I had no choice but to give up according to a judge. Also, prenuptial agreements do not hold up on most courts, since most judges simply throw them out. Basically, divorce laws in the USA are completely sided with the woman, which is outdated and completely based upon a 100 years ago, before women had the ability to live independently from her husband. It was understandable and needed back then, but nowadays, many women make more money than men, yet men have no way to win in a divorce case. If you want to look deeper into the laws of the western world, MANY laws favor women completely, when it simply is false bravado these days. For instance, NO WOMAN in the USA can rape a man. It is impossible. Why? There are no legal grounds for it. None, whatsoever. A woman cannot be charged with rape, because the rape laws in the USA are specifically worded. ------edited------- The worst a woman could be charged with, if she raped a man (and the court didn't just throw it out completely) is sexual misconduct. Consider that for a moment. A man raping a woman gets life in prison. A woman raping a man gets one year in prison, at the maximum. Also, sexual harassment laws completely favor women as well, but I won't go further into these things. I think it's safe to say, and completely unarguable to say that women are unfairly represented as victims in most of the laws based on relationships between men and women. Divorce laws are what I specifically care about in this post, however.

What I'm saying is this: Feminism currently has three "waves" or stages that it has gone through. The first-wave was great and completely needed, which dealt with obviously needed things like women's suffrage, the right to vote, etc. The second-wave movement started in the 1980s, which was completely about destroying gender roles, and basically, as a man, I view it as putting women on a pedestal and basically it was all about advancing the power and prestige of rich white women. The third-wave movement is now out, which is basically more lenient to the GLBT community, minority women, and also (somewhat) more about equality than feminism ever was a decade ago. Even still, feminism is not about equality anymore, since no woman in the western world can truly say she is unequal to a man in any way, shape, or form. What the second-wave basically did was destroy all gender roles that were created by God and written about in the Bible, and so we have divorce rates that are skyrocketed. The outcome is creating men like me who are deathly afraid of divorce, and so look at marriage as almost a stupid maneuver to ever allow ourselves to get into. It is just asking for trouble, at least with 90% of all women that I meet nowadays at my age. I still want to get married one day, and I will still take that plunge even though I could possibly destroyed in all ways by whomever I marry, despite if I am faithful, loving, and do everything I am supposed to as a husband. Either way, I will still marry, but my biggest fear in life is divorce, and so I think it needs to be discussed far more openly than most people do, and it is a far more serious matter as well. Nobody wants the word 'marriage' to be destroyed by the gay community with same-sex marriages, but nobody ever seems to realize the real problem with marriage right now is with real, different-sex marriages, the kind that God intended us to have. It is slowly being destroyed, and I simply wonder as men AND women, how we can change ourselves and our outlooks, and how we can fix something that is so obviously broken.

Let me put it his way: I'm 26 years old. I live near Chicago, in the USA. If I met 100 women, 90 of them would all be single mothers. Out of those 90, at least 80 would have been divorced at least once, and many of them would have been divorced multiple times. Out of all those women that were divorced, almost ALL of those divorces were initiated by women. Out of all those women with children, almost all of those women chose to leave the dads and/or they decided those men weren't fit to be their husbands. I'm positive that some of those men were deadbeats, but I'm also positive that not all of them were. It is a simple matter of these women having the freedom to do whatever they please, but those actions all had consequences. What it leaves is men at my age looking around, and what we find are all women who have had little common sense in who they dated, or why they dated these men, and these divorced women also make me wonder if they'd do it again, if I decided I wanted to marry them and make one of them my wife. Would they also divorce me, since they seem to value marriage so little? I'm sure not all would, as I know how to treat them better than probably any man they dated before, but divorce is almost never an action that the man takes anymore. 60 years ago, before women really broke out and fought gender roles, all divorces were ended by men, since women had few options if they decided to leave. Women were either housewives, or they worked at low-paying jobs. Women obviously are better off with what they can do now, but I wonder... Did women not realize the consequences that come along with the freedom they gained through feminism? If you look even at simple relationships, almost ALL relationships are ended by the woman. Sure, the men may be the ones who made the mistakes (although 99% of the time, both parties made horrible mistakes), but women are almost always the ones who break up with the man. It is just simply the way it is. It is not always the case, but the trend supports my theory here, so let's go with it for a few.

My question to women and men, is basically this: What can we do to fix this problem of marriage and divorce?

I recently stumbled across this video, along with the work of Dr Herb Goldberg, which basically is a counter-movement of the radical feminist movements that have raged throughout the 80's and into today's world.

Dr. Herb Goldberg Ph.D and Betty Friedan Part 1 - YouTube


This man is a genius in my eyes, since he explains why feminists became the man-haters they are perceived as (the reasons why they had the rage to begin with), and also how we can fix the issues of today's society. The woman is a well known feminist who also agreed with Dr Goldberg, and they both basically tried to mix their two rights movements together, creating an equality movement rather than one side (man) or the other (female). What they talk about is basically how to change both men and women into gaining the ability to have a lasting relationship, one that is about love and respect, rather than the weak feminine reactor (idealized victorian-era woman) and the super masculine man (still prevalent today, although less so).

I guess I just wonder though... Why is today's society, specifically the idea of marriage, so screwed up? Why have divorce rates risen so much, and why have women taken so few actions to stay in marriage these days? Is it secular culture, or does it have to do with something deeper than that? Obviously, women weren't happy with the way the Bible taught them to be, and so they reacted with rage and anger, which led to the feminist movements. That's all fine and great, but the consequences that go along with that freedom doesn't seem to have dawned on women. It's one of those things where it seems they want their cake and to eat it too.

Maybe I am off base here, but you tell me. Watch the video (there are a ton of parts, but the first video sums things up if you have a short attention span), and tell me what you think!
 
Last edited by a moderator:
F

flight316

Guest
#2
You are exactly right about everything that you said. And thank you for having the courage to say it. First let me say that just like everything else marriage and divorce have become a matter of dollars and cents ( you know the details ). I've been married and divorced and have been " ordered " to pay child support. Ok, no problem. What I find disturbing and sad is that someone so young feels this way about marriage, yet has every good reason to feel this way. I feel the same way that you do, but I didn't feel that way when I was your age ( I'm 49 ). We were having great times when I was in my twenties. That's why I don't feel so bad about my situation today because I had a great younger life. I just feel bad for todays young people concerning relationships. Its really, really tough. The way I see it is that this is a time in history where we all will suffer due to people wanting to be something different than what God clearly in His Word designed us to be. What many of us consider to be sucsess is failure in Gods eyes. Divorce rates continue to grow. Relationships are falling apart and hard to come by. Dating cites are an act of desparation. We as a people have made a huge mess of what God intended for us. Its so bad that we can't clean it up but God can and he will. But when He does it won't be pretty. Mankind will suffer like never before due to our disobediance. But for now pray that you find someone who loves God as you do. And when you find this person, do all things prayerfully and under the jurisdiction of God.
 

Nautilus

Senior Member
Jun 29, 2012
6,488
53
48
#3
No he isn't the only one. Those are the exact reasons I will probably never get married. The reward is just not worth the risk. Its ridiculous how much I would stand to lose if I got married. Only a fool would jump into it. Even worse in some states they have things called common law marriages where if you lived with a significant other for a set amount of time you might as well be married. So can anyone put forth a valid counterpoint against this?
 
K

kayem77

Guest
#4
Marriage is not about what benefits, advantages and profit you get out of it. The sole thought of a man marrying me because he can get this or that makes me cringe. If you get into a marriage thinking ''man,I hope I can make her/him do __________for me '' or "I hope she/he gives me____________ because we are married now'' are recipes for failure. Marriage has always been messed up because it's composed of two messy sinners. You can blame feminism, and I agree feminism among other things are part of the problem, but you can't really put all the blame on a single movement or a single gender.

My question to women and men, is basically this: What can we do to fix this problem of marriage and divorce?
For marriage: Marry a Christian, a genuine Christian who loves the Lord. But most importantly, BE THAT CHRISTIAN SPOUSE. Most people love to receive but they don't give anything. I'm not saying this is you...but I hear a lot of people quick to demand things from others while they don't wanna make an effort to meet the needs of others.

Divorce: The way I see it, the answer is similar. If we all had Jesus' mentality '' it is better to give than to receive'' I believe most divorces could be avoided. Atually if we all has Jesus, divorce shouldn't exist. But since this is not reality, the Bible says '' do not be yoked together with unbelievers'' and offers advice about wisdom, respect, self-control,etc.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
D

DABEARS8519

Guest
#5
I don't think you're getting the point of it. Marriage in places like the USA leave men completely and utterly vulnerable to financial ruin by the woman, and women need no reason whatsoever to divorce her husband anymore. All laws are biased toward women, as if women are naturally the victims of all relationship issues. The other issue is the mindset of these women in places like the USA, where they leave relationships constantly, as the culture dictates that if a man isn't superman, who also bends over backward for her in every single way, she will divorce him and take everything. Not all women will do this, but that's trying to find a needle in a haystack. The divorce rates prove that easily. I think it's around 80% now? Tell me that isn't just asking for financial ruin as the man. Most women simply won't understand, because men to them are security blankets, ones whom if it doesn't work out, they take everything he has anyway. They don't lose in marriage. The laws aren't equally structured to go against the person who is unfaithful or is abusive, which more and more tend to be women now. Those women can cheat, physically or emotionally abuse their husbands, and hell, she can even murder him in some cases (and her defense will automatically be "he abused me physically, pushing him out of the 100 story window was self defense!"), and she will walk away free, with his money.

The real issue is not about why you marry, because that is obviously supposed to be about love. I don't think you get the point I was making, while the men obviously did. You completely misunderstood it I think, based on focusing on the why. No man ever marries a woman for what she can give him. There are no advantages to marriage if you wanted to marry based on that, at least not for men anyways. I was focusing on the plethora of reasons why men do NOT view marriage as a viable option anymore in the western world. Marriage is simply like betting all of your financial security and future on a woman, with the odds at 90 to 1 against you. You have a better chance at getting struck by lighting almost than to find a wife who will stay and give you a successful marriage, Christian or otherwise. Christianity is largely the majority religion in the USA too, and divorce rates in Christian marriages are at the same VERY high percent as divorce rates in secular households, so that simply isn't the answer here.
 
L

libertygirl

Guest
#6
I don't blame you for being afraid. More women today are initiating divorce, taking the kids with them, and making sure the dads never see them again. :eek:

Of course the majority of people are not following God, there are a lot of "Christians" out there. So you're afraid, but you can trust God. If you truly follow Him, He will bless you. Don't date or marry anyone that doesn't meet Jesus standards.
 
D

DABEARS8519

Guest
#7
Don't date or marry anyone that doesn't meet Jesus standards.
This is much easier said than done. It is much easier to theorize about than to find, as well :) I agree with you, but it is hard to truly know a person until you date them, and even so, it is harder to REALLY now someone until you live with them. Even if both parties are completely following Jesus' standards and they live for God, the partnership simply might not be compatible, but finding that out might be too late. Divorce is too easy to get these days, and there are no healthy outcomes for the men in these situations, unless the wife decides to not pursue a settlement (which is rare).
 
P

Powemm

Guest
#8
The flesh looks to fulfill it's own desires..., the harvest is great bit the laborers few...
The world is about " I want I want I want I want ". Jesus is about " what can I give"
When we go from" I want " to "what did Jesus do for me?" and what has he done for me that I can now do for someone else, will society ever see the gaps and bridges bring us into a right relationship with anyone... it's a heart problem not a situational problem...
in Christ everything is possible
 
P

Powemm

Guest
#9
I turned this question around and asked it to myself...
What advantages Is there for a man with children (because this is becoming a growing trend as well).
the advantages are endless!!!
a child will come to know Christ through Me... I am available to partner up with someone who is carrying a load they were not built to carry Alone...to show a child what a Christ loving family looks like.. To teach them that disagreements don't mean you end things, it means there are differences in thinking and cone to a place that gives us an opportunity to speak and show respect and love as christ has shown us. It's a place for everyone to grow in their relationship in Christ . What are the advantages ??? the advantages are endless... Where I made mistakes in relationships is , I ran ahead of God thinking someone other than God was responsible for getting "me "right ... When I placed my emotions , and problems on my partner and they didn't fix it.. Well , that's a burden no one but God can handle.. And no one but God can fix within us. We must let God fix things in us before He will allow any of us to go out and be part of a solution somewhere else.. I watched a show last night where a woman had an affair and got pregnant... She did not tell her husband it was the other mans wich was of a different culture... When the baby was born, he walked into the room and saw a child, he didn't even notice it's ethnicity, he picked up the child with all the love a father could have on his face.. he never addressed his wife , he looked at her and said " what should we name Him?". the man never said a word about the affair, or
Paid any mind to the child's ethnicity... the family is still together today ... it is a true story .... give no place for the devil to get a foothold ... I had to look at my heart during that movie and I was surprised that my thoughts were not the thoughts that father had.. I saw the sin in my own heart very clearly and how I wanted to purge it out the minute I saw it... I wonder what the world would be like if we had that much love in our hearts...
 
I

imperfection

Guest
#10
I could probably understand why you would be afraid of getting married, but I gotta say that some of your points are really vague...Where do you get your statistics from?

You can't just blame one gender or a movement for the divorce rates we are facing nowadays. The problem lies with both genders overstepping their margines. I believe in the role structure the Bible gives us. I don't agree with the modern "I-am-a-woman-and-I-don't-need-men" philosophy. Men and women are not the same. It doesn't matter what you do, a woman will never be, think and feel like a man does and vice-versa.

But I also don't agree with men, that treat their wives crappy, that think that they are the boss and that think they can humilate women.

If both genders respected each other, we wouldn't have abusive husbands, and leaving wives or vice-versa. You are talking about women, as if all of them are like that and as if all women at some point just decide to leave.

A marriage can only work if both parties step into it knowing that there is no way out. Knowing that divorce is not an option. Unfortunatly there are not a lot of women thinking that way anymore....but there also aren't more men. What concerns me is that you aren't even married and you already think about how ruined you will be financially in a case of a divorce. It even sounds like you are expecting it to happen, like it was something that everyone has to face at some point.

Men and women need to respect each other. They need to accept their roles and not try to be something else by overstepping them. Marriage is something sacred that you don't just enter because you felt like it. It's a life long commitment to another person and if both parties enter their marriage with this thoughts, I'm sure that God is gonna bless that marriage with love, understanding and patience.
 
N

nw2u

Guest
#11
Powemm,
The man thought that was his child? He had no choice in that matter to make a decision. That was taken away when his spouse decided not to tell him what she had done. How will he feel when realizes he could have had his own flesh and blood to raise if only he was told the truth but, now it is too late? The folks who know but, will not tell will take advantage of his blind trust, knowing that he is gullible but, to him it is love. He then can no longer trust anyone. How selfish.

Usually, the husband is not told until he is no longer able to do anything about this. Is this love or is this just exactly what the op is talking about? We all need to think.
 
R

Relena7

Guest
#12
You should ask a happily married man what advantages there are for him being married.
You seriously need some good examples to balance this out. Don't let pessimism reside in your mind, it warps your lens on life.

One advantage I can think of is You'll never be alone. You'll always have a person who loves you by your side.
Someone who can help you with living life so you don't have to do it all on your own.

You mentioned feminism changing the gender roles, so I assume you mean you want a woman who cooks and cleans? There are plenty of gals who like to do that stuff.
Even if she isn't all 1950's about it, as long as she's doing half the work in some way, what does it matter who does what chores or jobs?

Look for the positives too and you just may find some.

I'm 26 too and I highly doubt every woman my age is a single divorced mom. I sure as heck am not. :confused:
 

Nautilus

Senior Member
Jun 29, 2012
6,488
53
48
#13
Yes but relena the point is you can more or less obtain the same advantages from a marriage by just living with someone and you take on none of the risk. Ande divorce rates among christians are just as high as none christians so that certainly isnt the answer. Oh and the guy that randomly accepted another mans child is a pushover/doormat. Clearly your wife is cheating on you, and you are just sitting by and basically condoning her behavior, nice job with the next kids that probably wont be yours either.
 
R

Relena7

Guest
#14
Yes but relena the point is you can more or less obtain the same advantages from a marriage by just living with someone and you take on none of the risk.
I assumed since this is a Christian forum, most people here look at marriage as the only acceptable option. The OP never compared it to living with someone outside of marriage.
 
S

simplyme_bekah

Guest
#15
The advantage left is when you forget what the world says about it and you focus on what our Lord says about marriage and then you obey that and then you receive blessings from our Lord and his help in having a successful marriage. Always just turn to Him and forget what the world says because in the end...who matters Him or the world?
 
L

libertygirl

Guest
#16
This is much easier said than done. It is much easier to theorize about than to find, as well :) I agree with you, but it is hard to truly know a person until you date them, and even so, it is harder to REALLY now someone until you live with them. Even if both parties are completely following Jesus' standards and they live for God, the partnership simply might not be compatible, but finding that out might be too late. Divorce is too easy to get these days, and there are no healthy outcomes for the men in these situations, unless the wife decides to not pursue a settlement (which is rare).

Your focus is to become more like Jesus Christ, and that should be her focus too. If you can serve and love the way Jesus commanded, I don't see how a marriage can fail. With Christ at the center, a marriage should flourish. You should ask God to show you people with godly marriages, so you can see for yourself.

I believe you can tell a lot about a person by how they are living out their single years. It's possible you don't see a lot of godly women in your life, so you will have to ask God to place some around you. Pray for discernment, draw closer to God, and make sure she shares the same views on marriage and family.
 

Nautilus

Senior Member
Jun 29, 2012
6,488
53
48
#17
I assumed since this is a Christian forum, most people here look at marriage as the only acceptable option. The OP never compared it to living with someone outside of marriage.
If you go into a relationship normally, examine what you'd likely already receive. I could move in with a significant other, and I'd still receive all the benefits of a marriage (love, partnership, companionship, sex, financial support, etc). What advantage would I get from marrying that woman?
Actually he did.


The advantage left is when you forget what the world says about it and you focus on what our Lord says about marriage and then you obey that and then you receive blessings from our Lord and his help in having a successful marriage. Always just turn to Him and forget what the world says because in the end...who matters Him or the world?
So that works for the roughly 50% of christians who get divorced? see not worth the risk even in a godly marriage
 
S

simplyme_bekah

Guest
#18
ahhh I do not believe that. I believe that if you pray hard enough and you believe with every fiber of your being that God will bless your marriage simply because every single day you pray over it and give it to him. Don't give up because there are good christian girls out there. I happen to be one of them so I know there are more. You need to just trust the Lord and live each day as if it is the last and do not let statistics of our world bitter your heart with cold hard ruthless facts. Why give the devil place in your mind like that? Rebuke him because it sounds like he is trying to stress you out and its working.
 
L

laly

Guest
#19
I'm not afraid to get married.. as long as it is God who is writing the best love story of my life. :p
 

Crimson_Lark

Senior Member
Apr 17, 2012
207
15
18
#20
Your concern about having more to lose financially reveals more about you and the people you choose to date than it does about marriage.