This is to whom the shoe fits.

[zone]

That includes anybody, for that is the required belief as to who Christ is according to Christ himself who spoke the words of God on this earth

well keep clicking like and supporting your friend ellis, who teaches jews don't need to/are not able to believe in Jesus of Nazareth.
he'll deny it, and you'll find some way to make it not matter.

end of discussion with you anyways - you worship the creation and are an unrepentant polythesist
'scuse me.

 

[mark54]

And it should be added Zone, that the Trinitarian mniisters in nearly all cases demand no more from the pultits, it is only fanatics on the internet who seem to from my experiance

 

[Blain]

Okay, this is what i have come to know. First off to have salvation we all we must do is repent, believe Jesus is the son of god and believe it is because he sacrificed himself we may come before the throne clean and then we must give him our hearts and just love and have faith in him. Its that simple, i fail to see how that or any of the prophesies that are fulfilled that prove jesus is who he says he is can be twisted or misinterpreted. I mean its right in our face in his word, why must faith become so complicated? Doesn't he say all we have to do is love and have faith in him? will not everything else fall into place as we get to know him more?

 

[zone]

And it should be added Zone, taht the Trinitarian mniisters in nearly all cases demand no more from thev pultits, it is only fanatics on the internet who seem to from my experiance

blah blah blah

this is about whether jews can believe in some future messiah while hating Jesus Christ and be saved by Law or some magic blinding related to a magical 70th week.

bye

 

[zone]

Okay, this is what i have come to know. First off to have salvation we all we must do is repent, believe Jesus is the son of god

then Therapon's thesis is not for you.
bye for now

 

[mark54]

well keep clicking like and supporting your friend ellis, who teaches jews don't need to/are not able to believe in Jesus of Nazareth.
he'll deny it, and you'll find some way to make it not matter.

end of discussion with you anyways - you worship the creation and are an unrepentant polythesist
'scuse me.

There goes your Christianity based on head theology again Zone, devoid of the leading of the Holy Spirit I am afraid

I will admit that I would prefer to worship, or have communion with someone of Ellis views than I would a Trinitarian who in effect believed a person would be damned for standing on the requirement of belief unto salvation Christ himself laid down, absolutely

 

[Therapon]

yes...perhaps time for a refresher:

Yes, but so many private posted me or asked me not to leave in a thread that I was led of the Lord to stay. You see Zone, much as you may wish it, not everyone disrespects me, misrepresents what I write or disagrees with it. Your bias is so obvious I usually just ignore you, but explaining while I am still here is warranted.

 

[JaumeJ]

It is possible for those who do not know Jesus, Yeshua, to hate Him, while loving Yahweh, God's Anointed Whom they have not been given the ability to connect to Jesus. It sounds weird, but God's ways are not our ways, and I thank Him profoundly for this. God will justify the ungodly, this I know from the Word; this is by no means declaring all ungodly as saved, rather God has His uses for everything taking even what is not to bring down that which is.

 

[Therapon]

It is possible for those who do not know Jesus, Yeshua, to hate Him, while loving Yahweh, God's Anointed Whom they have not been given the ability to connect to Jesus. It sounds weird, but God's ways are not our ways, and I thank Him profoundly for this. God will justify the ungodly, this I know from the Word; this is by no means declaring all ungodly as saved, rather God has His uses for everything taking even what is not to bring down that which is.

The Jews don't hate their Messiah and their Messiagh is Jesus. But so-called Christians throughout the Christian era have hated, persecuted and murdered Jews by the millions so they do indeed hate the what they believe our Jesus to be.

How many times a Jew has said to me, "But you Christians hate us." I've had to tell him, "Some may, but I'm not one of them."

Of course, in our blind, stupid bigotry, we have to say they are going to hell, because if we don't, we have to accept that we Christians sent them there by what we have done to them during the Christian era.

Now if those of you who are so arrogantly sure your doctrine is right, if you don't think that angers the heart of God, I have to wonder if you really know Him.

 

[JaumeJ]

Please reread the post. The reference of hating is hating Jesus for not actually knowing Him, yet they love God's Anointed. In other words there are many who love Jesus without knowing Him, yet. I do try to be as explicit as is possible. Perhaps I have worded this wrong?
I know I love people, especially Jews, and this for no other reason than I have been given to do so.[QUOTE=Therapon;929406]

The Jews don't hate their Messiah and their Messiagh is Jesus. But so-called Christians throughout the Christian era have hated, persecuted and murdered Jews by the millions so they do indeed hate the what they believe our Jesus to be.

How many times a Jew has said to me, "But you Christians hate us." I've had to tell him, "Some may, but I'm not one of them."

Of course, in our blind, stupid bigotry, we have to say they are going to hell, because if we don't, we have to accept that we Christians sent them there by what we have done to them during the Christian era.

Now if those of you who are so arrogantly sure your doctrine is right, if you don't think that angers the heart of God, I have to wonder if you really know Him.

[/QUOTE]

 

[Therapon]

I will admit that I would prefer to worship, or have communion with someone of Ellis views than I would a Trinitarian who in effect believed a person would be damned for standing on the requirement of belief unto salvation Christ himself laid down, absolutely

I just have to ask, brother, what has some Trinitarian done to you that you use the term so negatively? <smile>

 

[Therapon]

Oops, this was my post so I better try that again . . .

The Jews don't hate their Messiah and their Messiagh is Jesus. But so-called Christians throughout the Christian era have hated, persecuted and murdered Jews by the millions so they do indeed hate the what they believe our Jesus to be.

How many times a Jew has said to me, "But you Christians hate us." I've had to tell him, "Some may, but I'm not one of them."

Of course, in our blind, stupid bigotry, we have to say they are going to hell, because if we don't, we have to accept that we Christians sent them there by what we have done to them during the Christian era.

Now if those of you who are so arrogantly sure your doctrine is right, if you don't think that angers the heart of God, I have to wonder if you really know Him.

Therapon

 

[Abiding]

Is this thread now the checkpoint rally staging area for unual doctrinal adherents?

Ok bye

 

[Ariel82]

the guy is blue is hot ...



.....he looks like blue cotton candy with a dash of peppermint.

<yes random, totally unrelated and easily ignore. lol>

 

[Therapon]

Is this thread now the checkpoint rally staging area for unual doctrinal adherents?

It appears so, LOL, come on in the water is fine and it's a lot better than dead formalism.

 

[mark54]

I just have to ask, brother, what has some Trinitarian done to you that you use the term so negatively? <smile>

When I was fifty, I first ventured onto an internet website. I had been to Trinitartian churches for over thirty years, there had never been a problem. I had friends in them, helped out at church clubs, no doctrinal problems whatsoever.

But when I reached the tender age of 50, I ventured onto a Christian intenet website. There was a debate entitled

'Did Jesus claim to be God when he walked this earth'

In my simnplicity I simply wrote 'no' in a post, and left the debate, but I was immediatley hounded, and told I was misleading people, I was shocked. after all I had never heard any minister in any Trinitarian church I had ever been to say Christ was God Himself.
And I was harrassed to discuss the subject, one after another wanted to prove to me I was wrong and couldn't be a Christian unless i accepted Christ was God. And the names I was called. It didn't matter how much scripture I brought forth to support my views, I was told I was a heretic, damned in need of psychiatric help etc, and all because I believed Jesus was simply the Son of God. And so now I know now this is officially the doctrine of the churches, you must believe Christ is God, though they don't preach it from the pulpits(or hardly any do)

Well to me scripture is the bottom line. I don't mind anyone believing Jesus is God Himself if they want to, but when you are mercilessluy attacked for standing on the plain words of Christ when he walked this earth and called the names I have been it does unfortunately leave a sour taste in your mouth
Thiough to be fair, it is always a tiny minority who attack you as such and in nearly every case they vare people who look to scholars and theologians to learn, and rarely mention the Holy Spirit in their posts
Strange though, that official Trinitarian belief demands a person believes Christ is God Himself unto salvation but I have never heard any mnister actually prteach it, just the fanatics on websites like these
It has left me endeared to non Trinitarians at times, as they seem friendlier and less judgemental, than a few that undoubtedly give Trinitarianism a bad name

 

[hattiebod]

So, you are not saying that the Jews do not need to know Jesus? some here seem to think thats what you are saying....I have a few questions and forgive me everyone if they seem infantile! I read that God says all the way through the OT they are His 'chosen' and beloved people, He does not say they will however be his 'perfect' people.He says He will never forsake them...so I take that as never. I do wonder though.... I cannot understand how all those Jews who trusted God before Jesus walked on the earth (aka God walked on the earth...) are able to go home to Him, but now, as we have the OT revealed, they are not. I know, I know...there are so many verses in the NT saying there is just one way through Jesus Christ, but I am asking a question, forgive me....what if a Jew believes in God, THE creator God, totally and utterly but through ignorance does not see that Jesus has already been and is now at Gods right hand? they still wait for Jesus, in hope, they wait in faith, even if that faith is miss guided it is still in our God....are they too condemned? I know some Christians believe the Jewish race and Israel are no longer important, in as much as the 'Church' has replaced them...we will just have to disagree on that one coz I do not subscribe to 'replacement theology'. (oops....i can almost here the sharp intakes of breath from here but I am not asking this to divide but just coz I am interested in how so many of us can read the same book and be so divided! I await with great interest for what I am sure will be a 'mixed' response! <><

 

[Therapon]

Please reread the post. The reference of hating is hating Jesus for not actually knowing Him, yet they love God's Anointed. In other words there are many who love Jesus without knowing Him, yet. I do try to be as explicit as is possible. Perhaps I have worded this wrong? I know I love people, especially Jews, and this for no other reason than I have been given to do so

Oh, I wasn't disagreeing with you, brother. Just venting. Sorry if I appeared to misunderstand you.

 

[hattiebod]

and all because I believed Jesus was simply the Son of God. And so now I know now this is officially the doctrine of the churches, you must believe Christ is God, though they don't preach it from the pulpits(or hardly any do)

Hi, i am a little confused. I thought Jesus was / is the Son of God but as there is the trinity, he is Father , Son & Holy Spirit...we pray to God, through the power of the Holy Spirit, to God...have i got it totally wrong in your opinion? <><

 

[mark54]

and all because I believed Jesus was simply the Son of God. And so now I know now this is officially the doctrine of the churches, you must believe Christ is God, though they don't preach it from the pulpits(or hardly any do)

Hi, i am a little confused. I thought Jesus was / is the Son of God but as there is the trinity, he is Father , Son & Holy Spirit...we pray to God, through the power of the Holy Spirit, to God...have i got it totally wrong in your opinion? <><

My dear sister, if you take my advice, leave the debate and never discuss it, for many will be eager to give you their views.
If you have peace seing Father, Son and Holy Spirit the way you do, leave it at that, don't let the theologian or scholar on the internet trouble you
As one minister put it to me on another website
Many come onto the internet who think they know
Don't let anyone take your peace away by trying to show you they are an authority on this subject
Trust me!