My fiance doesn't believe in the Trinity

Hello everyone

My fiance and I have known each other for 6 years, have been dating for 3 years, and have been engaged for 4 months.

I've always known that she doesn't believe in the Trinity. Despite that, I've always believed that she is the woman I'm meant to be with. I have prayed countless times for God to take her away from me if she is not the right woman for me, and He hasn't! Our relationship is pretty perfect really, but there's just this one issue that bothers me.

She identifies as a Christian, and I believe that she is a Christian. She just believes that based on an unbiased, straight-forward reading of the bible, there is nothing to prove that Jesus is God. She also can't see how Jesus praying to God in the Garden of Gethsemane makes any sense at all. I've showed her all the bible verses that we rely upon in defense of the Trinity, but she doesn't think they make a strong enough case in favour of it. In fairness to her, there are no unambiguous bible verses that clearly spell out the Trinity; rather it is a combination of verses that we use to understand the Trinity. I've showed her John 1:1, but she just doesn't see it.

She and I have had many many many conversations about this, and has told me that she will probably never change her mind about it. She has also asked that I stop trying to change her mind about it. I have told her in no uncertain terms that I will be talking to her about this for the rest of her life.

She grew up as a Mormon - but renounced Mormonism long before I met her. This is probably where her views come from. But herein lies the problem. She knows that from childhood she was fooled into believing the lies of Mormonism. She is now (understandably) extremely reluctant to simply believe things just because a lot of people say its true. So its not going to be easy to help her to understand the truth.

What should I do here? How do I help her to see the truth?

Oh and not marrying her is not an option. She is far more likely to find the truth with me than without me, in my estimation.

Thank you

There will always be a problem revealing knowledge that comes from the spirit to people who do not have the spirit

I am afraid that any attempt to convince her will likely only increase her rejection of Jesus as our divine lord.

The chat side has prayer room might be good place to ask for prayers for her and you can discuss this further maybe get some good advise.

Indeed brother levi is nearly always in that forum praying for others and also you can receive more prayers!

Well, there's one problem. You've set yourself up on a pedestal. It is a rather prideful statement to think no one can convince her if you can't.
Obviously you have no idea what will change her mind, so you may be the last person to be able to to so. And the more you push the more walls you cause her to form against the idea of the trinity. She's asked you to stop, you've disrespected her by ignoring that request. That doesn't open her up, that causes her to close off. Making you Less effective in getting through to her, and possibly more closed to the concept period.
Pushing your belief in her isn't going to be effective and if you think that is the right attitude then I pity her future with you.
And that your belief seems to be that "I can't not marry her because she needs me to tell her what to believe" is such a prideful position. So much of your attitude has Nothing to do with God. You're so bent on getting her to see things how you want her to, and building yourself up as some sort of savior figure that, ironically, you left God out if it all. And the attitude towards her is to look down at her.

You chose her. But you don't accept her. If you're going to be with her you Have to be willing to accept her for who she IS, not who You Want her to be .
If you continue down this path your relationship Will fail. You need to humble yourself, accept her for what she believes or risk losing her.
And, yes, I am a Christian and I do believe in the trinity, but I see you as being the bigger concern, not her.

I think you've misinterpreted my post. I also think you're underestimating the importance of the Trinity.

The Trinity is a core tenet of Christianity. I don't want her to believe and understand it just because I do, but because its the truth. Helping her to understand the truths of Christianity is far more important than "accepting her for who she is"; this isn't Jerry Springer. My fiance's eternity is potentially at stake here.

I never said that she NEEDS me to tell her what to believe. I never even said that it has to be me that explains anything to her at all. I just think that I could be useful, given that she often comes to me first (even before Google) when she has a question about Christianity.

If you think that I'm being "disrespectful" to her by telling her about the truths of the bible, and that its me who is the problem here, what do you suggest that I do??? Because your post was quite light on useful suggestions but heavy on criticism. I'm willing to play a very small role in helping her to understand the truth, but I can't just do nothing.

Thanks.

Thank you very much Joe and Amber - I will go to the prayer forums

What scriptures did you use in your attempt to convince her? Was it Just John 1:1 ?

Also if you believe that the trinity is a core belief of Christianity.. How can you say you believe she is a Christian when she does not believe in the trinity?

I was hoping someone would bring that up - Thank you Adstar.

I guess I have two potential answers to that question:

1. I'm deluding myself thinking that she is a Christian, and I'm being stupid in marrying her.
2. Only the Lord truly knows someone's heart, and how can I know who is or isn't saved?

What is your opinion Adstar?

What should I do?

Well i cannot answer your point 1.. Thats between you and God..

No 2 is easier We can know if someone is saved if they believe in the core doctrines of Christianity.. So if someone does not believe in the trinity then i know they do not believe in a core doctrine of Christianity so i know they do not believe Jesus is LORD.. Jesus is God.. Jesus and God are one..

I can only say what i would do.. I would not get yoked with an unbeliever.. I would not marry her until she became a Christian..

Hi Beaver,

Welcome to CC!

Do either of you go to church anywhere so that you both can receive biblical teaching and fellowship. It would be good to receive marriage counseling now before you marry also.

The scripture I think is very convincing is:

Philippians 2:5-11

Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus, who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.

Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross. For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Saying that Jesus is Lord is the same as saying Jesus is God. Everyone is going to bow down to worship Him and only God can receive worship.

Also notice in Isaiah 45:22-23:


“Turn to Me and be saved, all the ends of the earth;
For I am God, and there is no other.
“I have sworn by Myself,
The word has gone forth from My mouth in righteousness
And will not turn back,
That to Me every knee will bow, every tongue will swear allegiance.

And Romans 14:11.

For it is written,
“AS I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to ME,
And every tongue shall give praise to God.”

http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...d-why-do-some-christians-deny.html?highlight=
(link ^^^^)
maybe this will be helpful

i personally believe that if we have an unbiased opinion

the bible proves the opposite and some others share in that

there are many verses posted in here

Teach her about salvation, that Jesus died on the cross for her sins, that she should contritely confess the sins of her past life, not one by one but just say that she is sorry for the times that she has sinned, invite the Holy Spirit to live in her heart and to guide her path in a new spiritual direction.

Most Christians will not agree with everything, even if its in the bible but should pray for discernment in seeking out the truth and applying it in their lives.

You can certainly discuss these things with her but don't do it everyday and don't pressure her. Let things flow naturally.

No relation is perfect and certainly no marriage is perfect either. It takes a tremendous amount of prayer and hard worth. It's a life-long process.

Glad to have you join us. Welcome to CC.

I would have to agree with 'Ugly's' general point of 'acceptance' on your part...
Trust me on this one brother...
During the last christian-based marriage seminar that my wife and I attended - four of the main themes that women need men to know are:
1 - Listen slowly - don't try to fix them (they're not carburetors)
2 - Let your mate 'influence' you...
3 - Turn towards your mate - not away
4 - Make her feel special
All 4 of these messages are tied to your willingness to accept your new wife - you can only control the things within your control - she has to come to terms to make her own decisions...
You can choose to enjoy a life together - praying together - sharing together - working together - teaching each other - learning from each other - but it is and never will be your job to change your wife's belief system - that is her decision to make on her own...
The challenge you will face is - how will you two decide to raise your kids?
If your wife still has the same belief system by the time your kids are old enough to learn about the trinity - if your marriage is intended to survive these hurdles - refer back to #1-#4 above...
If this is the case (she remains to hold her own belief system) - unfortunately - in order for the marriage to survive the two of you will have to come to terms to continue to persevere thru compromise... Raise the kids as christians - but do not restrain her from being able to share with the kids her opinions...
Pray that thru their teachings that they will grow-up with open minds and ultimately walk with the lord...

Isa 44:8 Fear ye not, neither be afraid: have not I told thee from that time, and have declared it? ye are even my witnesses. Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any.

Isa 43:10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.
Isa 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.

There is no God beside Him,and no God formed before Him,and no God formed after Him,and He is the only Savior.

Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
Isa 9:7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.

Isa 35:4 Say to them that are of a fearful heart, Be strong, fear not: behold, your God will come with vengeance, even God with a recompence; he will come and save you.
Isa 35:5 Then the eyes of the blind shall be opened, and the ears of the deaf shall be unstopped.
Isa 35:6 Then shall the lame man leap as an hart, and the tongue of the dumb sing: for in the wilderness shall waters break out, and streams in the desert.

Isa 59:1 Behold, the LORD'S hand is not shortened, that it cannot save; neither his ear heavy, that it cannot hear:
Isa 59:2 But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.
Isa 59:12 For our transgressions are multiplied before thee, and our sins testify against us: for our transgressions are with us; and as for our iniquities, we know them;
Isa 59:13 In transgressing and lying against the LORD, and departing away from our God, speaking oppression and revolt, conceiving and uttering from the heart words of falsehood.
Isa 59:14 And judgment is turned away backward, and justice standeth afar off: for truth is fallen in the street, and equity cannot enter.
Isa 59:15 Yea, truth faileth; and he that departeth from evil maketh himself a prey: and the LORD saw it, and it displeased him that there was no judgment.
Isa 59:16 And he saw that there was no man, and wondered that there was no intercessor: therefore his arm brought salvation unto him; and his righteousness, it sustained him.
Isa 59:17 For he put on righteousness as a breastplate, and an helmet of salvation upon his head; and he put on the garments of vengeance for clothing, and was clad with zeal as a cloke.
Isa 59:18 According to their deeds, accordingly he will repay, fury to his adversaries, recompence to his enemies; to the islands he will repay recompence.
Isa 59:19 So shall they fear the name of the LORD from the west, and his glory from the rising of the sun. When the enemy shall come in like a flood, the Spirit of the LORD shall lift up a standard against him.

1Ti 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
Joh 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

2Co 5:18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.
2Co 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

There is one mediator between God and men,the man Christ Jesus.The man Christ Jesus is our Savior,for only a sinless man can reconcile mankind back to God.No man is sinless so God manifest Himself in flesh,and reconciled the world unto Himself in the person of Jesus Christ,God and man in harmony.

Jesus is God and man,for He is God manifest in flesh,and God is the only Savior who saved us by the man Christ Jesus,God's own personal human body,which He laid down His own life(1 John 3:16),and purchased the Church with His own blood(Acts 20:28).

Since Jesus is God and man He could speak from either position while He was on earth.

When He prayed to God it was his humanity that prayed,and when He said to Mary,My God,and your God,and My Father,and your Father,it was His humanity,and when He cried out on the cross My God,My God,why have you forsaken Me,it was His humanity.

When He accepted being called Lord and Master,and claimed to be Lord and Master,it was His deity,and when He said,before Abraham was,I am,it was His deity.

It throws some people off how Jesus can be God if He is in a visible manifestation for God is so much greater than that,which the heaven,and the heaven of heavens,cannot contain God.

When the Bible says God was manifest in the flesh,it means that God manifest all His attributes to the man Christ Jesus,for He is the fulness of the Godhead bodily(Colossians 2:8-10),and He has the Spirit without measure(John 3:34),and it pleased the Father that in Him all fulness should dwell(Colossians 1:19),and the Spirit in Christ is still connected to the omnipresent Spirit of God for God cannot be separated.

Jesus does not have a piece of the Spirit that moves around with Him,for there cannot be an empty space of the Spirit,and a double portion of the Spirit in another place,but Jesus moves through the Spirit,and where ever He is at the Spirit is there.

The Spirit does not have to move for the Spirit is already there,and Jesus moves through the Spirit.

If Jesus had a piece of the Spirit that moved around with Him then He could not be God,but since He moves through the Spirit then He is an omnipresent Spirit that is showing a visible image of Himself,for the Spirit in Christ is still connected to the omnipresent Spirit of God,for God cannot be separated.

The man Christ Jesus is the personal human body of God,and His visible relationship to the saints for eternity,for there is one throne in heaven,and one who sits on that throne,and it is the throne of God and the Lamb,God in the glorified body of the man Christ Jesus.

Contrary to what a lot of people believe Jesus is the only person we will see in heaven,and He told Philip if you have seen Me,you have seen the Father,and He is the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

There is only one visible manifestation of God to the saints,and that is Jesus.

There is one mediator between God and men,the man Christ Jesus.

Jesus said all power is given unto Me in heaven,and earth.

David said,the LORD said unto my Lord,sit at My right hand until your enemies become your footstool.

The Son must reign until all His enemies are conquered,and then the Son shall submit to the Father who put all things under Him,that God may be all in all.

God's right hand represents power,wisdom,and salvation.

Jesus at the right hand is a temporary role until His enemies are conquered.

Since the man Christ Jesus is the Savior,God exalted Him to exercise the throne of power,be at His right hand,until His enemies are conquered,and then the Son shall submit to the Father,stop exercising the throne of power,that God may be all in all.

God is ruling through His own humanity for the sake of the saints,for the man Christ Jesus must rule because He is the Savior,but of course it is God who saved us by His own humanity.

1Ti 6:14 That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:
1Ti 6:15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;
1Ti 6:16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

Jesus is God,who dwells in the light that no person can approach unto,and no person has seen Jesus,and no person will ever see Jesus,for He is an invisible Spirit who showed a visible manifestation of Himself to save humanity,and to have a visible relationship with His people for eternity.

Out of the two of you, who do consider to be the more loving, understanding, compassionate, Christ-like person? No one is truly alike or equally the same and more often than not, can be quite opposite.

To me if someone is a truly loving and beautiful hearted person, then that makes them more of a Christian than those who intellectualise belief systems (that is all they are, belief systems, mind sets) as being more important than love.

Why for example, do you remain together, if it is not love that is the reason, that love is somehow 'higher', far beyond the differences?

Love is the branch. The arrangement of the mind, is however, forever changing. But people like to tell themselves it never changes. It changes constantly.

Maybe you do not like my opinion, or maybe you agree with it, it doesn't really matter. Already the mind is re-arranging. But if we love each other humbly as fellow beings on this planet, that is what matters.

From separation of difference, to amalgamation of differentness.

This is impossible if you believe The Bible is the literal word of God.

See if she cherry picks what she reads. Or maybe she has some other source that makes her deny Christ's divinity.

And stress that Christ was fully human as well as fully divine, and needed to pray and follow God's direction just as we do. The Bible says his wisdom increased, meaning he went through the learning process like a human too.

◄ Luke 2:52 ►
King James Bible
And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man.

I think the issue is she doesn't believe The Bible is God's literal word. I can't imagine how with an "unbiased and straightforward" read, you don't come to the proper conclusions unless you deny what you read. Angels, demons, God himself, His miracles, and the virgin birth all identify Him.

Show her whatever the mormon's taught her isn't in The Bible too. The trinity is just a symbol the three are one, teach her the three are one first. And you can't teach her that unless she believes The Bible is authentic truth.

I never said anything, at all, on the importance of the trinity. I was talking about you and your attitude. How, from that, you pick up I don't understand the importance of the trinity baffles me. And suggests that it's you not understanding what's being said. I Purposefully did not comment on that particular point because it was not the focus of what I was getting at.

Also I never said you were being disrespectful to her by telling her the truth of the bible. Another thing you've pulled out of thin air. What I Actually said was that she asked you to drop the subject and you have bulldozed over her wishes. Because you want to make her something she's not. Someone that believes in the trinity. And I pointed out if you can't accept her, and her beliefs, then you shouldn't be together. Trying to push someone into believing like you is a guarantee for a failed relationship.
Either accept her, her wishes and what she believes or don't be with her. But trying to change her to what you want her to be isn't right.
Not to mention it's a huge red flag that you ignore her wishes to push what you want on her. It's a red flag on your character.
Even if the trinity is true, which I believe it is, if she doesn't that's her choice. Your bullying her for not is counterproductive and the opposite of love. Man up and accept all of her or leave her. Don't try to change her.

You came for advice and when given you ignore it, argue with it and simply make things up that were never said, while being condescending. I pity her now more than ever and hope she wakes up to who you are.