What must I do to be saved

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reneweddaybyday

Senior Member
#881
Mar 23, 2016
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#881
Ralph- said:
Don't get all twisted up with this, church. It's simple. It is the mature Christian in whom the word is deeply rooted and producing fruit in perseverance for whom the word can not be uprooted from them in unbelief. It is the immature Christian in whom the word is not deeply rooted that the word can be uprooted from them and they return to the world in unbelief.
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So this promise is only to "the mature Christian" and the "immature Christian" (babe in Christ) is on his/her own?


Jude 1:

24 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

25 To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.


wow ... :(
 
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Ralph-

Guest
#882
#882
reneweddaybyday said:
So this promise is only to "the mature Christian" and the "immature Christian" (babe in Christ) is on his/her own?
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No, the promise is not only for the Christian who has the word deeply rooted in their heart. It is for anyone who believes, whether the word that is in their heart is deeply rooted or not. It's just that the stronger believer who has the word more deeply rooted in his heart is the one who is not going to cast away the word of the promise from his heart in unbelief when trouble comes because of the word.



reneweddaybyday said:
Jude 1:

24 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

25 To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.
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Yes, he is able to keep the believer who has either the poorly rooted word of God in them or the deeply rooted word of God in them, from falling away. As long as you keep trusting in him you have the one who is able to keep you from falling.

If your faith is weak because your heart is not pure you will be more tempted to not rely on, or care about the sufficiency of Christ and will be more likely to cast the promises of God away when trouble and trial come as a result of the word. He will attempt to bring you back but if you resist long and hard enough he will one day stop trying and turn you over to your unbelief. Then there will be no coming back, even if you wanted to.
 
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Enocish

Junior Member
#884
Nov 9, 2017
129
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#884
MarkWilliams said:
What must one do to be saved.

I believe God decides who will be saved and who won't.

There are many scriptures which support the view that we don't decide to believe in Christ, but faith in Christ is a gift that God gives only to His elect.

Most folks don't agree with the doctrine of predestination/election, because many other scriptures say things like you must obey and remain faithful to the end etc...

These two opposing views have been debated for centuries, so today we have the benefit of many good good books on the subject but have we arrived at a consensus in the Church.

I would love to see the Church unite and resolve this dividing issue. But I fear that it will continue to be an enigma for the Church. Why can't we let the Bible be the final authority and accept what it really says and unite in the truth.
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Here is my 2 cents
1st of all Christ is the final judge,
Acts 2:38, Says to Repent and be Baptised in order to receive the Holy Spirit, Which is the golden ticket, God does not choose that for you. That is strictly your choice. That is the distinction.
But there are cases that prevent baptism and also there will be conversions at the end that their won't be time for baptism.
Again Christ will be the final judge.
But there are those that only teach repentance and they never concern themselves with baptism. whereby leaving the person with only the repentance of sin and no holy spirit.
if God chooses to let you in after that, then I would think you better have a darn good answer as to why you never got baptized.
I also believe God can tell difference between someone who has the Holy Spirit and someone doesn't.
Just sayin, You asked I answered.
 
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justpassinthrough

Senior Member
#885
Oct 31, 2015
2,290
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#885
reneweddaybyday said:
Or it could be because God gives faith to all and those who are weak in faith are those who suppress the truth in unrighteousness ... i.e. they do not believe (not because they don't have faith but because they reject the truth).

On the other hand, those who are strong in faith are those who believe God's Word. They are obedient to the instruction and their faith is increased (strengthened).
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More of your guessing?
 
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justpassinthrough

Senior Member
#886
Oct 31, 2015
2,290
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#886
reneweddaybyday said:
Why did they not believe if (according to you) "If we have faith, it's because God spoken to us, moved upon us, inspired us by communicating with us"?

You are saying that God withholds faith from some who hear and gives faith to others who hear. What is the criteria for God giving faith to some and not others?
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Why would you even say such a thing.


They way the bible says we receive faith, is by hearing God speak to them.


It's up to the person to believe in their heart and obey what they heard.



JPT
 
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reneweddaybyday

Senior Member
#888
Mar 23, 2016
7,021
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#888
justpassinthrough said:
reneweddaybyday said:
I believe faith was already inherent in Abraham when God spoke to him.
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Faith for what?
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Faith to hear the Word of God when spoken to Him. I believe God, in His foreknowledge and knowing Adam would sin, provided faith as an inherent attribute in order for man to hear Him (or His Word — Scripture) when spoken.

 
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oldethennew

Banned
#890
Feb 28, 2016
11,311
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#890
believe that our Saviour demands of us, IF He is calling us, that we 'must have'
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PS. 34:18.
The LORD is near unto them that are of a broken heart; and saves such as be of a contrite spirit.

51:17.
The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, You wilt not despise.

ISA. 57:15.
For thus saith The High and Lofty One that inhabits eternity, whose Name is Holy;
I dwell in the high and Holy place, with him also that is of a contrite and humble spirit, to revive the spirit of the humble,
and to revive the heart of the contrite ones.

66:2.
For all those things has Mine Hand made, and all those things have been, saith The LORD:
but to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembles at My Word.
 
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reneweddaybyday

Senior Member
#891
Mar 23, 2016
7,021
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#891
justpassinthrough said:
Why would you even say such a thing.
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Because some people believe God gives faith only to the "elect" and I wanted to know if that was a belief to which you held.

I have already clarified that you do not believe this and your understanding is that God gives faith to all who hear the Word of God and that some who hear remain unbelievers. I believe those who hear and remain unbelieving are those who suppress the truth in unrighteousness.


Here is our conversation:


In post #814 you said "If we have faith, it's because God spoken to us, moved upon us, inspired us by communicating with us."


I replied in post #823 and asked about Rom 10:19 which indicates all Israel heard but not all Israel had faith. I asked you why did some Israelites not have faith since all had heard?


You did not answer the question so I asked again at post #838 (the post quoted in your post #886 above).


In post #842 I asked if it had ever occurred to you that all are given faith; that faith is "dormant".


In post #845 you stated "We who hear the Gospel have faith."


In post #850 i indicated your statement conflicts with what is written in Scripture because Rom 10:18 tells us that all heard but some rejected what was heard.


Finally, in post #852 you stated “You receive faith by hearing the Gospel. ... Just because a person hears the Gospel and thereby receives faith by that hearing, doesn't insure they will believe and obey.”


At that point, I knew you believed that believers and unbelievers alike receive faith.




justpassinthrough said:
They way the bible says we receive faith, is by hearing God speak to them.
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Again, Rom 10:17 says faith ek hearing … hearing dia Rhēma


I showed you the example that Abraham had faith that God would raise Isaac from the dead even though Abraham had not specifically heard that Rhēma from God.


Abraham’s faith in the resurrection was a conclusion he had come to. I believe his conclusion was based upon God’s promise and God's covenant that he (Abraham) would be the father of many nations. Abraham knew that he and Isaac would return because Isaac had no children at the time.



 
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theanointedsinner

Guest
#892
#892
for those unborn babies, that haven't even born physically, what must they do to be saved?

be predestined somehow:unsure:
 
Deade

Deade

Called of God
#893
Dec 17, 2017
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Vinita, Oklahoma, USA
yeshuaofisrael.org
#893
theanointedsinner said:
for those unborn babies, that haven't even born physically, what must they do to be saved?

be predestined somehow:unsure:
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I've got the answer: God is not done with them. For now, you will just have to trust me. You have other things to work on first. PM me. happy-dancing.gif
 
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justpassinthrough

Senior Member
#895
Oct 31, 2015
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#895
reneweddaybyday said:
Faith to hear the Word of God when spoken to Him. I believe God, in His foreknowledge and knowing Adam would sin, provided faith as an inherent attribute in order for man to hear Him (or His Word — Scripture) when spoken.
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You can believe what ever you choose to believe.



Abraham had faith when God spoke to him.

Abraham was justified, made righteous, when he obeyed His voice.



JPT
 
mailmandan

mailmandan

Senior Member
#896
Apr 7, 2014
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#896
justpassinthrough said:
You can believe what ever you choose to believe.
Abraham had faith when God spoke to him.

Abraham was justified, made righteous, when he obeyed His voice.
JPT
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Abraham was “accounted as righteous” when he believed God (Genesis 15:6; Romans 4:2-3) and was “shown to be righteous” when he obeyed God in Genesis 22–James 2:21.
 
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Ralph-

Guest
#897
#897
reneweddaybyday said:
Again, you ignore the parable of the forgiving father in Luke 15. :(
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The prodigal son had to repent and come back. Hebrews 6:4 shows us that God does not leave the door open for repentance open forever. Later, in Hebrews 12:17 the author uses Esau to illustrate God making repentance impossible, even if you want to repent. The Galatians show us that God is willing to give space for repentance and come back to trust in Christ. The sum total of Biblical counsel shows us that God will make an effort to bring the ex-believer back to repentance but that after a time he will turn them over to their choice to no longer believe if they do not respond. God is long suffering, not forever suffering.
 
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Ralph-

Guest
#899
#899
mailmandan said:
Abraham was “accounted as righteous” when he believed God (Genesis 15:6; Romans 4:2-3) and was “shown to be righteous” when he obeyed God in Genesis 22–James 2:21.
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In the end you have to be justified both ways to be saved when Jesus comes back. Faith without works can not save (James 2:18). Iin the end, fields with thorns and thistles are burned, not harvested (Hebrews 6:7-8).
 
mailmandan

mailmandan

Senior Member
#900
Apr 7, 2014
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#900
Ralph- said:
In the end you have to be justified both ways to be saved when Jesus comes back. Faith without works can not save (James 2:18). Iin the end, fields with thorns and thistles are burned, not harvested (Hebrews 6:7-8).
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Faith without works cannot save y
Ralph- said:
In the end you have to be justified both ways to be saved when Jesus comes back. Faith without works can not save (James 2:18). Iin the end, fields with thorns and thistles are burned, not harvested (Hebrews 6:7-8).
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“Faith without works is dead” does not mean that we are saved by works and faith that merely “claims” to be genuine but produces no works is not authentic faith, but is an empty profession of faith/dead faith (James 2:14).

Also, fields with thorns and thistles does not represent genuine believers. All genuine believers are fruitful, but not all are equally fruitful.

You crack me up Ralph. You MUST have the last word in ANY argument and anything that someone says to you after that is the beginning of a new argument. :giggle:

It must be extremely important to you to believe that you are always right. :unsure:
 
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