Why I now believe that salvation can be lost.

Winner winner chicken dinner.....and how many of those future sins were covered.....ALL OF THEM

It does not say they died twice, It says they are doubly dead (not only spiritually, But they have fallen from the state of Grace, they heard the word of truth, that could have saved them, and they rejected it. That had it in their grasp and let it go. But nice try
Can the bible contradict itself? How can God say one thing, then go against his own promises?

Oh and PS, Peter denied Jesus 3 times, Did Jesus deny him? Or welcome him with open arms?

Hello and thanks for your answer. However, I have MANY, MANY other Verses too. Here is another example.

"These men are hidden reefs [elements of great danger to others] in your love feasts when they feast together with you without fear, looking after [only] themselves; [they are like] clouds without water, swept along by the winds; autumn trees without fruit, doubly dead, uprooted and lifeless " Jude 12 AMP

If they died twice then it means they already had been born again.

13Brothers, I do not consider myself yet to have laid hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, 14I press on toward the goal to win the prize of God’s heavenly calling in Christ Jesus. 15All of us who are mature should embrace this point of view. And if you think differently about some issue, God will reveal this to you as well.…https://biblehub.com/philippians/3-14.htm

This is true for those who accept the atonement and abide in the vine.

Back in Peter and Paul's day, the great controversy was if believers still needed to be circumcised. There was a great divide over circumcision.

Paul said neither circumcision or uncircumcision profits a believer - it really didn't matter because circumcision was under the old covenant.

Yeshua/Jesus was circumcised on the 8th day, by so doing He fulfilled the human requirement in all males to be circumcised. In His Body He fulfilled ALL the Law for us. There's no need to argue over works for salvation anymore - He fulfilled them ALL.

Grace is sufficient now. The Law of Grace. The great exchange - His Blood for our sins and His Righteousness for our filthy rags.

Why are we arguing? We need to be rejoicing!! What manner of love is this???!!! WOW!

Why has God done this for us? We don't deserve it...... Yet, He did it.

God wants us to focus on knowing Him and loving Him. Let's stop wasting time arguing and spend time getting to know Him more and spend time loving Him. FOCUS on Him is the key!

Everybody.........FOCUS!!! Can you see Him........

Back in Peter and Paul's day, the great controversy was if believers still needed to be circumcised. There was a great divide over circumcision.

Paul said neither circumcision or uncircumcision profits a believer - it really didn't matter because circumcision was under the old covenant.

Yeshua/Jesus was circumcised on the 8th day, by so doing He fulfilled the human requirement in all males to be circumcised. In His Body He fulfilled ALL the Law for us. There's no need to argue over works for salvation anymore - He fulfilled them ALL.

Grace is sufficient now. The Law of Grace. The great exchange - His Blood for our sins and His Righteousness for our filthy rags.

Why are we arguing? We need to be rejoicing!! What manner of love is this???!!! WOW!

Why has God done this for us? We don't deserve it...... Yet, He did it.

God wants us to focus on knowing Him and loving Him. Let's stop wasting time arguing and spend time getting to know Him more and spend time loving Him. FOCUS on Him is the key!

Everybody.........FOCUS!!! Can you see Him........

Let's stop wasting time arguing...

Regarding Philippians 3:8-14 [keeping its context of "the Christlike MIND" in the section of Scripture bracketed by 2:2,3,5 on one end, and 3:15,16,19 on the other end (re: 'mind/minded')]:

..."all of us who are mature should take such a view of things. And if on some point you think differently, that too God will make clear to you. Only let us live up to what we have already attained." Philippians 3:15-16


[quoting from Sir Robert Anderson's book "Forgotten Truths"]

"Appendix 4 - Philippians 3:8-14 [for CONTEXT]

"PHILIPPIANS 3:8-141 NOTE CHAPTER 7

"IF the commonly received exegesis of Philippians 3:8-14 be correct, we are faced by the astounding fact that the author of the Epistle to the Romans and of the 15th chapter of 1 Corinthians -- the Apostle who was in a peculiar sense entrusted with the supreme revelation of grace -- announced when nearing the close of his ministry that the resurrection was not, as he had been used to teach, a blessing which Divine grace assured to all believers in Christ, but a prize to be won by the sustained efforts of a life of wholly exceptional saintship.
"Nor is this all. In the same Epistle he has already said, "To me to live is Christ, and to have died is gain"; whereas, ex hypothesi, it now appears that his chief aim in life was to earn a right to the resurrection; and that death, instead of bringing gain, would have cut him off before he had reached the standard of saintship needed to secure that prize! For his words are explicit, "not as though I had already attained."

"Here was one who was "not a whit behind the chiefest Apostles"; who excelled them all in labours and sufferings for his Lord, and in the "visions and revelations" accorded to him; whose prolonged ministry, moreover, was accredited by "mighty signs and wonders by the power of the Spirit of God." And yet, "being now such an one as Paul the aged," [it is wrongly suggested] he was in doubt whether he should have part in that resurrection which he had taught all his pagan Corinthian converts to hope for: for to them it was he wrote the words, "we shall all be changed."
"Such is the exposition of the Apostle's teaching in many a standard commentary. And yet the passage which is thus perverted reaches its climax in the words, "Our citizenship is in heaven, from whence we are looking for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall fashion anew the body of our humiliation that it may be conformed to the body of His glory."
" "Our citizenship is in heaven" here is the clew to the teaching of the whole passage. The truth to which his words refer is more clearly stated in Ephesians 2:6 - God has "quickened us together with Christ, and raised us up with Him, and made us sit with Him in the heavenly places in Christ." More clearly still is it given in Colossians 3:1-3: "If then ye were raised together with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is seated on the right hand of God. Set your mind on the things that are above, not on the things that are on earth. For ye died, and your life is hid with Christ in God."

"Ephesians and Colossians, be it remembered, were written at the same period of his ministry as Philippians; and in the light of these Scriptures we can read this chapter aright. To "win Christ" (ver. 8), or to apprehend, or lay hold of, that for which he had been laid hold of, or apprehended (ver. 12); or in other words, to realize practically in his life on earth what was true of him doctrinally as to his standing before God in heaven -- this is what he was reaching toward, and what, he says, he had not "already attained."
"The "high calling" of ver. 14 is interpreted by some to mean Christ's calling up His own to meet Him in the air (a blessing assured to all "who are alive and remain unto the Coming of the Lord"); but this is not in keeping with the plain words -- God's high calling in Christ Jesus, i.e. what God has called us (made us) to be in Christ.
"If this passage refers to the literal resurrection, then the words "not as though I had already attained must mean that, while here on earth, and before the Lord's Coming, the Apostle hoped either to undergo the change of ver. 21, or else to win some sort of saintship diploma, or certificate, to ensure his being raised at the Coming. These alternatives are inexorable; and they only need to be stated to ensure their rejection.

"One word more. If the Apostle Paul, after such a life of saintship and service, was in doubt as to his part in the resurrection, no one of us, unless he be the proudest of Pharisees or the blindest of fools, will dream of attaining it. In fact we shall dismiss the subject from our minds."

--Sir Robert Anderson, Forgotten Truths, Appendix 4, pgs 145-147

http://articles.ochristian.com/article12455.shtml


[end quoting; bold, underline, and brackets mine]

____________

So, Philippians 3:8-14 (esp vv.11-14,15) is referring to (as he says), "to realize practically in his life on earth what was true of him doctrinally as to his standing before God in heaven"... that is, "in the here and now"

Do you think during the Tribulation, people will likewise be arguing over whether taking the mark of the beast would void your salvation by faith alone?

Saved people will not take it...the bible is clear....your argument is moot Gongshow!

Do you think during the Tribulation, people will likewise be arguing over whether taking the mark of the beast would void your salvation by faith alone?

Abiding in the vine is indicative of bearing fruit, not remaining saved.....!!

I just wanted to say, I really admire your patience for a fellow poster who can't seem to read your name correctly. It is a lesson to me for sure, about humility.

Well a pastor who does not correctly understand the word repentance and what it means in the original Greek is already off on the wrong track.

Here is what they have posted which is wrong


View attachment 201174

He is obviously doing it deliberately to provoke, but as I have said to another of his target, treat that as a price of debating over the Internet.

You cannot control what others do, you can only control how you respond.

Do you believe we are in a spiritual war?

What does earnestly contend for the faith mean?

What does fight the good fight mean or stand prepared as for battle?

Why are we commanded to armor up with the whole armor of God and take up the sword of the Spirit?

Why does Paul constantly oppose and hammer false gospels and or error?

I really like you, but in a war with eternal consequences the soldiers MUST COME OUT OF THE TRENCHES and engage the enemy.......

Note what Paul states...and he is not talking about those in the world, but rather those that portray themselves as believers. All that preach false gospels ARE ENEMIES of the Cross and true believers!!

For many walk, of whom I often told you, and now tell you even weeping, that they are enemies of the cross of Christ.

We can love people while absolutely hating and opposing what they stand for at the same time

Everybody.........FOCUS!!! Can you see Him.