Are gentiles ever Israel?

And how can we know what the Bible says without reading it in our own language, which has been interpreted from the original for us?

Instead of sidestepping my point, perhaps you'd like to stop and consider it.

By the way, the word is "have", not "haft".

You have often posted that some scriptures were given to Israel not gentiles, I had hoped you would post your viewpoint. I am sure it is based on scripture and worth listening to.

As far as bible interpretation, I believe that often the original Hebrew is sometimes almost impossible to translate so I look for biblical scholars who know Hebrew. Even that gets difficult because scripture is centuries old and word meanings change. They change in all languages when culture changes. It wasn't long ago that you would be thought very strange if you said you were buying a new mouse.

So do we believe again?

I think it is important that we don't close our minds to instructions given Israel, thinking God doesn't include us in His ways.

Lots of the Israel that is of the Hebrew race do not believe, and they are told they are cut off until they do. We are also told that God will never forget them, and we are also told that only God determines if we are saved or not. So to follow God's guidance we are to just let God decide anything about the Hebrew race. If we believe what the Lord tells us, we are not cut off.

Not so much brother. It means God forsook Israel because of their UNBELIEF, as a Nation, not as human beings, thus they were blinded only IN PART.

Rom. 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. {Until the Church is Raptured}

In other words, because of Israel's sin, God TOOK THE MANTLE from the Jews and gave it unto the Gentiles, that mantle was the Word of God, that Mantle was taking the Gospel unto the ends of the earth. The Jewish peoples would have eventually wrested the Gospel message away from the Disciples and subverted it like they did Judaism !! So God decided to make Israel as Dead Men's Bones and FORSAKE THEM for nigh 2000 years as a NATION ONLY, not as individuals, God would never turn away those who come unto Him by faith and offer to live for Him. So God forsook Israel until 1948, and we know this via the Prophecy of the Valley of Dry Bones.

Reread Romans chapters 9-11 and knowing all this it now becomes crystal clear. God is THE POTTER Paul says, so he does as He wills with the Potters Wheel. And he decided to take the Mantle away from Israel and give it to the Gentiles, and it will remain that way until the time of the Gentiles are come full {Rapture} then Israel will be given the Mantle once again, Jesus will return and Rule from Jerusalem as the King of the Jews. Amen. Paul tells the Romans not to boast, he tells them God will one day graft Israel back into the family AS A NATION, all Jews as we speak can come unto Christ just like any other person, but they are not God's vehicle to reach the world, at this time the Gentile Churches are indeed that vehicle.

Rom. 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved:{NOT EVERY Jew, but Israel AS A NATION is saved} as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: 27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. 28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes. 29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.


Rom:11 23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again.

We know this above happens via the scriptures, Israel AS A NATION, is saved because they Repent {1/3 repent, SEE Zechariah 13:8-9} and then they Flee Judea unto Petra. The 2/3 that do not repent are not saved. Not many people find the way brother, narrow is the way. Only a few Messianic Jews are in the world today, but if you look at the world population, I would say only 1 Billion out of 8 Billion are true Christians, there are supposed to be 2 billion Christians but my guess is at least half of them have no part of God in them at all. So 1 out of 8 men are not of God, therefore the Jews being blinded are more in line with most of the world brother, Nations just don't serve God in this world, Satan is over all these Nations, that is what he told Jesus in Luke 4, all these Kingdoms are his to do as he so pleases with.

So God only FORSOOK Israel as a collective entity. or as a Nation He favored, He did not forsake any Jew on earth, He accepts ALL MEN, God desires ALL MEN to come unto him, we know that via the scriptures, He doesn't want to lose one man. So God blinded them as a Nation collectively, He did not want the Jews subverting the Gospel of Jesus, so he took the mantle away from them and gave it unto the Gentile Church, but all Jews as individuals came come unto Christ. God then delivers THE NATION Israel, even though its only 1/3, its still God stepping in and bringing them back unto Him. He does so via the Two-witnesses.

75 days before the Beast Conquers Israel at the 1260, God sends the Two-witnesses {1335} to turn Israel back unto God {SEE Malachi 4:5-6}. Thus the 1/3 who repent, understand that they must Flee at the 1290 event, which happens 30 days BEFORE the 1260 Event. Its the False Prophet {Jewish High Priest} taking the SACRIFICE {Jesus} away or forbidding Jesus Worship in the Temple, or maybe even in all Jerusalem. Then he erects the AoD in a place where it ought not stand as Jesus said. That is THE SIGN for the Jews to Flee Judea brother. I love the Jewish peoples. I am showing what will actually happen, others like to be REPLACEMENT TYPES, that is not me. God has His own ways brother.

God Bless............

Interesting post. It is difficult for humans to read scripture, for we have to think of what is said through the Holy Spirit, not our fleshly minds without God in it.

You are speaking of the nation of Israel and the post is speaking of Israel that includes all people who have accepted God as their God and themselves as belonging to Him. They are two different Israels.

Gentiles cannot be regarded as being actual Israelites.

It wasn’t only the children of Israel who escaped slavery from Egypt, but gentiles also as we read in Exodus 12: 38 And a mixed multitude went up also with them; and flocks, and herds, even very much cattle.

We are to read scripture not only from the simple literal meaning, but as messages from the Lord with spiritual meaning also. God is not physical as we are but a spiritual being who thinks and acts in a spiritual way.

God made this mixed multitude all Israel, his people who God gave a special blessing. Could this scripture tell us of their future as we live in now as including us gentiles in Israel with all it’s blessings?

It tells us this is so in Gal_3:29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Except I don't think all people are considered Israel because they BELIVE, I think they are blessed by Faithful Abraham, but they are still the Gentile Church and Israel are Israel. We are all Grafted into one family tree via BELIEVING God, its that simple.

God Raptures the Gentile Church {with a few Messianic Jews, Paul, John and Peter among others} and then he delivers on his promises to Abraham to always have a seed. So BOTH Jews and Gentiles are in the Rapture and BOTH Jews and Gentiles come unto Christ AFTER the Rapture. We are all ONE AND THE SAME in that we must all come to God by FAITH ALONE.

Which is why I can't understand some who say Jesus just shows up at the end and SAVES the Jewish peoples, no, they MUST REPENT before the 70th week ends. Malachi 4:5-6 says they repent BEFORE the DOTL {1260 Event} and this is how they know to Flee Judea.

Well, God Bess brother.

Except I don't think all people are considered Israel because they BELIVE, I think they are blessed by Faithful Abraham, but they are still the Gentile Church and Israel are Israel. We are all Grafted into one family tree via BELIEVING God, its that simple.

God Raptures the Gentile Church {with a few Messianic Jews, Paul, John and Peter among others} and then he delivers on his promises to Abraham to always have a seed. So BOTH Jews and Gentiles are in the Rapture and BOTH Jews and Gentiles come unto Christ AFTER the Rapture. We are all ONE AND THE SAME in that we must all come to God by FAITH ALONE.

Which is why I can't understand some who say Jesus just shows up at the end and SAVES the Jewish peoples, no, they MUST REPENT before the 70th week ends. Malachi 4:5-6 says they repent BEFORE the DOTL {1260 Event} and this is how they know to Flee Judea.

Well, God Bess brother.

Except I don't think all people are considered Israel because they BELIVE, I think they are blessed by Faithful Abraham, but they are still the Gentile Church and Israel are Israel. We are all Grafted into one family tree via BELIEVING God, its that simple.

God Raptures the Gentile Church {with a few Messianic Jews, Paul, John and Peter among others} and then he delivers on his promises to Abraham to always have a seed. So BOTH Jews and Gentiles are in the Rapture and BOTH Jews and Gentiles come unto Christ AFTER the Rapture. We are all ONE AND THE SAME in that we must all come to God by FAITH ALONE.

Which is why I can't understand some who say Jesus just shows up at the end and SAVES the Jewish peoples, no, they MUST REPENT before the 70th week ends. Malachi 4:5-6 says they repent BEFORE the DOTL {1260 Event} and this is how they know to Flee Judea.

Well, God Bess brother.

When you speak to anyone you think of their characteristics. You don't converse with a very young child in the same way you do with an old man as an extreme example. It is the same with God. To converse with the Lord you listen to Him as God with His characteristics as we learn about them in Psalms. God created man and thinks of us as humans. There were no Jews and gentiles for hundred's of years, man was just humans. To God we are still just humans, Jews were special only because God created them to do special work for Him. God wanted them to separate themselves from gentiles only because if they socialized with gentiles they would be led to live as they lived and wouldn't learn God's way of living. The orders to eat apart from gentiles and to be fleshly circumcised kept them apart, but they were never God's laws in themselves, only to guide them to God's laws.

When Christ came and gentiles began to accept Christ and Father God took these laws of Moses away, not from Jews and gentiles as separate in His eyes but from everyone. The Jews were using the laws of Moses as these custom for Jews were called as true obedience to God's laws and thought of them as if they were the entire obedience.

God relates to man as humans, not as Jews and gentiles.

Words have meaning attached in order to serve a specific reason.

Adding new meaning to a word can destroy as in this case the intent of the author Christ. .And violate the commandment not to. (Deuteronomy 4:3)

Jesus, Yeshua, was not joking when He said we become children of Abraham. The Word is not false in saying we become "fellow heirs" with Israel.

It may surprise you in pursuing a quick study of the meanings of the words Jew and Israel. Also reading in Romans Paul's description ow what a true Jew is may open the eys wide. In some translations it is translating the word to praiser of God, but you would probably need to do a more extensive study of the two words and Paul's discourse, reading verions with Je or true Jew and praiser of God alike.

This is important tomebut not to being saved by grace in the Blood of Yeshua, Jesus….

Yes, of course .. Today we are in the times of the gentiles and a few Jews stumble in .. Is God through with Israel yet ? If so when ?

Your entire post is adding to words new meanings not found in Scripture.

God loves all people the same, but He Promised Abraham a continual seed, and God married the Jewish people Himself, so they are His bride, I love all people, but my own bride I am partial unto. I think the scripture I quoted earlier shows they are SPECIAL to God.

Rom. 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. 28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.

Paul said the Jews are LOVED by the Father, even though they are against the Gospel of Jesus Christ. It is what it is brother.

Words have meaning attached in order to serve a specific reason.


Adding new meaning to a word can destroy as in this case the intent of the author Christ. .And violate the commandment not to. (Deuteronomy 4:3)

Israel is defined as those born again. Mankind as those who do wrestle against flesh and blood of mankind and overcome because the have Emanuel .God with them .

Doctrines begin by defining words.

The question is why did he change the name of his born again bride from isral to Cjristian . The name sems befiiting. that God named her.

And Jacob was left alone; and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day.And when he saw that he prevailed not against him, he touched the hollow of his thigh; and the hollow of Jacob's thigh was out of joint, as he wrestled with him. And he said, Let me go, for the day breaketh. And he said, I will not let thee go, except thou bless me. And he said unto him, What is thy name? And he said, Jacob. And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed. Genesis 32 :24-25

As Jacob who previously did wrestle against flesh and blood and did not over come .Giving rise to the meaning of the name deceiver.

Acts 11:26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.

All of the disciples were called Christian. No division in the body in that way . Division come by doctrine not color of flesh and blood.

Some teach the name Christian that the father named us which means without adding new meaning.; "Residents of the city of Christ named after her founder Christ".

It seems to be appropriate. . the a bride named after a city. Some say it was derogatory to the Jew and therefore she was not named by the father.

I have heard that before .

Did you try and mix faith?

Which one? apostle, faith, prophecy, teacher, spiritual gifts, parables, sign gifts, we do not need men to teach us as the warning of spirit of the antichrists ..etc

It would seem you forget the author of scripture set up laws to protect the intergrtiy of His living abiding word .Change the meaning of one word it can change the whole doctrine of God by the father of lies who turns things upside down inspired earthly of the devil. the goal of the commandment verse 6.

You could call it the protector of faith as prophecy. And not after signs according to the law of signs. Signs or walking by sight are for those who believe not (no faith)

Ye shall not add unto the word(singular) which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it,(singular) that ye may keep the commandments (plural) of the Lord your God which I command you.Your eyes have seen what the Lord did because of Baalpeor: for all the men that followed Baalpeor, the Lord thy God hath destroyed them from among you. But ye that did cleave unto the Lord your God are alive every one of you this day. Behold, I have taught you statutes and judgments, even as the Lord my God commanded me, that ye should do so in the land whither ye go to possess it. Keep therefore and do them; for this is your wisdom and your understanding in the sight of the nations, which shall hear all these statutes, and say, Surely this great nation is a wise and understanding people. Deuterommy 4:2-6

The warning not to add to the whole or perfect or subtract is found in the last chapter of the book of prophecy. The bible as the the Tongue of God. Together the warnings kept the integrity down through the ages .Just like today. Change the meaning of one word sacrifice the whole council of God.

JEREMIAH 17:9 Our hearts are evil, And our Minds is corrupted, WE haft to rely on what the BIBLE says to be our Guide, Not what we think or believe.
GOD bless as HE sees fit

You didn't even begin to consider the content of my post. You ignored it and repeated the same irrelevant blather.