Why isn’t the new covenant part of “Isaiah only”?

Based on a holistic reading of the writers of God's scripture, talking with Paul, and not against each other, of one restored covenant people of God, this would be an interpretation of Ephesians 2:

Ephesians 2 (ESV)

11 Therefore remember that at one time you Gentiles in the flesh (Gentile-scattered, adopted Ephramites, Ephraim northern kingdom, Assyrian exile into all the nations) , called "the uncircumcision" by what is called the circumcision, which is made in the flesh by hands— 12 remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel (Jews, Judah southern kingdom, returned already at Jesus' / Yeshua's time from Babylonian captivity) and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. 14 For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility 15 by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances (once written on stone, now written on our hearts, for obedience out of our free will for those who love Jesus / Yeshua for his atonement offering on the cross, and his resurrection that conquered death), that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two (two houses of Israel, Ephramites and Jews, ancient northern and southern split kingdoms of Israel), so making peace, 16 and might reconcile us both to God in one body through the cross (the Church of restored Israel, consisting of both Gentile-adopted, scattered Ephraimites and Jews), thereby killing the hostility. 17 And he came and preached peace to you who were far off (Gentile-adopted, scattered Ephraimites) and peace to those who were near (Jews). 18 For through him we both (Gentile-adopted, scattered Ephraim, and Judah) have access in one Spirit to the Father. 19 So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God (the Church of restored Israel under King Jesus the Messiah / Yeshua ha'Mashiach), 20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus himself being the cornerstone, 21 in whom the whole structure, being joined together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord. 22 In him you also are being built together into a dwelling place for God by the Spirit (the Church of restored Israel under King Jesus the Messiah / Yeshua ha'Mashiach).

Also it is a danger to limit your readings of scripture to that of Paul, as Peter (the apostle who Jesus / Yeshua called the rock on whom he will build his Church / restored covenant people / restored Israel:


2 Peter 3 (ESV)

15 And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, 16 as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures. 17 You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability. 18 But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be the glory both now and to the day of eternity. Amen.

In the words of John, the beloved disciple and apostle of Jesus / Yeshua, who also brought us the book of Revelation:


John 11 (ESV)

48 If we let him go on like this, everyone will believe in him, and the Romans will come and take away both our place and our nation." 49 But one of them, Caiaphas, who was high priest that year, said to them, "You know nothing at all. 50 Nor do you understand that it is better for you that one man should die for the people, not that the whole nation should perish." 51 He did not say this of his own accord, but being high priest that year he prophesied that Jesus would die for the nation, 52 and not for the nation only, but also to gather into one the children of God who are scattered abroad. 53 So from that day on they made plans to put him to death. 54 Jesus therefore no longer walked openly among the Jews, but went from there to the region near the wilderness, to a town called Ephraim, and there he stayed with the disciples.

Galatians 3: …27For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed and heirs according to the promise.…

I think your words in bold portray me of something I did not infer nor stated, lest I am misunderstanding. I agree with you that the animal sacrificial system of the old covenant pointed towards Christ / Messiah's future atonement sin offering on the cross, just as the future animal sacrificial system prophesied for the Ezekiel temple (Ezekiel 46:20 portraying the future sin offerings, to be made in this future temple, where water will flow from the temple, watering the desert) yet to be built, will point backwards to Christ / Messiah's atonement sin offering on the cross.

God's old covenant was broken much later than Abraham's time, when the old covenant was established, by Jacob/Israel's descendants, when the two houses split, and they both went into the Assyrian captivity and the Babylonian captivity, never yet to return from the Assyrian captivity, but returned by the time of Christ / Messiah from the Babylonian captivity. All of God's old covenant people that died in God's covenant, like Abraham is not in Hades but in paradise, awaiting to be in Heaven in future, to be worshipping at God's throne:


Luke 16 (ESV)

22 The poor man died and was carried by the angels to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried, 23 and in Hades, being in torment, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham far off and Lazarus at his side.

The scriptures point to it that God has one covenant people. He has an old and new covenant with his covenant people.

This is incorrect. God has a distinct plan for the Church (redeemed Jews and Gentiles in one Body) and another distinct plan for redeemed and restored Israel on earth. The eternal home of the Church is the heavenly New Jerusalem, whereas the eternal home of future Israel is "Greater Israel" on earth (from the Nile to the Euphrates).

EZEKIEL 48:THE LAND OF ISRAEL UNDER CHRIST WITH ALL TRIBES PRESENT
1 Now these are the names of the tribes. From the north end to the coast of the way of Hethlon, as one goeth to Hamath, Hazarenan, the border of Damascus northward, to the coast of Hamath; for these are his sides east and west;...
... a portion for Dan.
... a portion for Asher.
... a portion for Naphtali.
... a portion for Manasseh.
... a portion for Ephraim.
... a portion for Reuben.
... a portion for Judah.
...23 As for the rest of the tribes, from the east side unto the west side, Benjamin shall have a portion.
...Simeon shall have a portion.
... Issachar a portion.
...Zebulun a portion.
...Gad a portion.
...29 This is the land which ye shall divide by lot unto the tribes of Israel for inheritance, and these are their portions, saith the Lord GOD.

Anyone can see that this is definitely NOT the Church. Gentiles are excluded.

The tribes of Judah, Benjamin, and Levi is of the Jews that returned from their Babylonian captivity. Messianic Jews is part of the Body of Christ / Messiah.

The tribes of Dan, Asher, Naphtali, Manasseh, Ephraim, Reuben, Simeon, Issachar, Zebulun, Gad were scattered into the four corners of the earth, into the Gentile nations, following their Assyrian captivity. Where are their descendants today?

Scripture shows that God has a special nation with which he will honor his promises to them

It also shows he will make way for the world to be saved including people in that nation

You must learn To separate the two

Scriptures do separate between two peoples, it separates those that honour God and the Lamb, and those that do not. Do you believe that there will only be 144,000 of ALL the tribes of Israel (not just the three Jewish tribes) that will one day appear before the throne of God, and that the rest will be non-Israel, a great multitude from every nation, tribes and peoples and languages that no one could number. And where is the other 10 tribe members (non-Jewish tribes) of Israel today who were scattered into all nation, tribes and tongues (Reuben, Gad, Asher, Naphtali, Manasseh, Simeon, Issachar, Zebulun, Ephraim/Joseph, Dan)?


Revelation 7 (ESV)

1 After this I saw four angels standing at the four corners of the earth, holding back the four winds of the earth, that no wind might blow on earth or sea or against any tree. 2 Then I saw another angel ascending from the rising of the sun, with the seal of the living God, and he called with a loud voice to the four angels who had been given power to harm earth and sea, 3 saying, "Do not harm the earth or the sea or the trees, until we have sealed the servants of our God on their foreheads." 4 And I heard the number of the sealed, 144,000, sealed from every tribe of the sons of Israel: 5 12,000 from the tribe of Judah were sealed, 12,000 from the tribe of Reuben, 12,000 from the tribe of Gad, 6 12,000 from the tribe of Asher, 12,000 from the tribe of Naphtali, 12,000 from the tribe of Manasseh, 7 12,000 from the tribe of Simeon, 12,000 from the tribe of Levi, 12,000 from the tribe of Issachar, 8 12,000 from the tribe of Zebulun, 12,000 from the tribe of Joseph, 12,000 from the tribe of Benjamin were sealed. 9 After this I looked, and behold, a great multitude that no one could number, from every nation, from all tribes and peoples and languages, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed in white robes, with palm branches in their hands, 10 and crying out with a loud voice, "Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!"

Ephesians 2 (ESV)

12 remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.

How did you get this out of Benjamin's post? I don't see anywhere that he even hinted anything of the sort.

Thanks for the response Jim,

I believe we left off about 6 weeks ago, and I believe you were in the (Partial Preterist) camp, and have now moved into the (Full Preterist) camp?

You dont believe in a future literal Second Coming of Jesus Christ in the heavens?

Only those that desire to maintain a false Millennial Kingdom on this existing earth (Deny) the facts of scripture below

When Jesus Christ is revealed, immediately after the tribulation, its (Fire Time)

Matthew 24:29-30KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-8KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Nahum 1:5KJV
5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.

2 Peter 3:10-12KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

Which part of that verse calls us the new Israel?

Vs 13 says we are in Christ Jesus, in the Body of Christ. Are you using that verse for your doctrine that we are now Israel?

I suppose all the words in bold are your own interpretation. Would that be a correct inference?

BenjaminN said:

Ephesians 2 (ESV)

12 remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.


I think the verse is clear, we were separated from Christ, without God, alienated from Israel, strangers to the covenants of promise, but now in Christ Jesus we have been incorporated into Israel.

No, those are the terms described in these other passages of scriptures, referencing the same oneness of restored Israel (Jews & Gentiles, Judah & Ephraim):

To discern the scriptures we have to realise the following:

God's old covenant was with Abraham, through his descendants son Isaac, and grandson Jacob (and Jacob was renamed Israel by God, after he struggled with God and overcame).

God's old covenant with Jacob/Israel was broken by Israel's disobedience (pagan worshipping, offering their children to Baal, etc.), through their disobedience to God's old covenant Israel got split into two kingdoms, the southern kingdom Jews under Judah (tribes of Judah/Benjamin/Levi), and the northern kingdom Ephraimites under Ephraim's half tribe of Joseph son of Jacob (remainder of the twelve tribes of Israel). For them breaking God's covenant the Ephraimites went into a very long Assyrian captivity scattered to all the nations (to this day they have not been regathered and are still identity lost, scattered among the nations, we do not know who their offspring are). For breaking God's covenant the three tribes of Jews (excluding the Ephraimite tribes), went into a short period of captivity to Babylon, retained their identity and returned to the three tribes' of Judah's southern land of Judea (not the complete Israel as the promised land to all twelve tribes).

The curse for breaking God's old covenant is found in Deuteronomy 28 and the specific curse of being scattered with a lost identity (forgetting you are Israel) among the nations is found in verse 64:


Deuteronomy 28 (ESV)

64 "And the Lord will scatter you among all peoples, from one end of the earth to the other, and there you shall serve other gods of wood and stone, which neither you nor your fathers have known.

Jesus / Yeshua removed Israel's curse under God's old covenant, with God's new covenant with his chosen people Israel, who will now regain their lost identity, and come into one under Jesus / Yeshua out from their scatteredness among all the nations:


John 11 (ESV)

48 If we let him go on like this, everyone will believe in him, and the Romans will come and take away both our place and our nation." 49 But one of them, Caiaphas, who was high priest that year, said to them, "You know nothing at all. 50 Nor do you understand that it is better for you that one man should die for the people, not that the whole nation should perish." 51 He did not say this of his own accord, but being high priest that year he prophesied that Jesus would die for the nation, 52 and not for the nation only, but also to gather into one the children of God who are scattered abroad. 53 So from that day on they made plans to put him to death. 54 Jesus therefore no longer walked openly among the Jews, but went from there to the region near the wilderness, to a town called Ephraim, and there he stayed with the disciples.

Some of God's old and new covenant children of Israel, are not at all of the blood descendants of Jacob/Israel, through the promises made to Jacob's father Isaac and his father Abraham, but were adopted by Israel, like those of mixed blood that left with Israel in the Exodus out of Egypt, and Ruth (who as formerly non-Israelite became the great-grandmother of King David, from whose lineage Jesus / Yeshua was born) the Moabite. Jesus also welcomed the Canaanite woman from among the Gentiles into the new covenant, that showed she was either of mixed scattered lost Ephraim/Israel blood, or wanted to be adopted into Israel's covenant.


Exodus 12 (NLT)


37 That night the people of Israel left Rameses and started for Succoth. There were about 600,000 men, plus all the women and children. 38 A rabble of non-Israelites went with them, along with great flocks and herds of livestock.


Ruth 1 (ESV)

2 The name of the man was Elimelech and the name of his wife Naomi, and the names of his two sons were Mahlon and Chilion. They were Ephrathites from Bethlehem in Judah. They went into the country of Moab and remained there.

8 But Naomi said to her two daughters-in-law, "Go, return each of you to her mother's house. May the Lord deal kindly with you, as you have dealt with the dead and with me.

15 And she said, "See, your sister-in-law has gone back to her people and to her gods; return after your sister-in-law." 16 But Ruth said, "Do not urge me to leave you or to return from following you. For where you go I will go, and where you lodge I will lodge. Your people shall be my people, and your God my God.


Matthew 15 (ESV)

22 And behold, a Canaanite woman from that region came out and was crying, "Have mercy on me, O Lord, Son of David; my daughter is severely oppressed by a demon." 23 But he did not answer her a word. And his disciples came and begged him, saying, "Send her away, for she is crying out after us." 24 He answered, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel." 25 But she came and knelt before him, saying, "Lord, help me." 26 And he answered, "It is not right to take the children's bread and throw it to the dogs." 27 She said, "Yes, Lord, yet even the dogs eat the crumbs that fall from their masters' table." 28 Then Jesus answered her, "O woman, great is your faith! Be it done for you as you desire." And her daughter was healed instantly.


Under the new covenant God's laws for his chosen people Israel under Jesus / Yeshua (blood and adopted) have not changed, his laws are not any more written on tablets of stone making us slaves of the law, but are now written on our hearts and minds, making our will and obedience in harmony with God's will and law, out of our love for Jesus / Yeshua who wrote those laws on our hearts and minds with his blood atonement.


Hebrews 8 (ESV)

8 For he finds fault with them when he says: "Behold, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will establish a new covenant with the house of Israel (scattered and adopted Ephramites / Christians among all the nations of the earth) and with the house of Judah (Jews), 9 not like the covenant that I made with their fathers on the day when I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt. For they did not continue in my covenant, and so I showed no concern for them, declares the Lord. 10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws into their minds, and write them on their hearts, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

What I think can help you there is to consider what many hold as the first rule of joining online discussion forums. Never take anything said on a forum personally.
You have no idea who you are actually speaking to in a forum. Think of all those people who have been catfished online. They thought they were speaking to someone who pretended to be their ideal man, woman. In reality they were speaking to the exact opposite. Someone who was taking full advantage of the anonymity of the Net just to play games with peoples emotions.

That can be said about any forum anywhere in cyberspace. Remember too, as I found this myself, that scripture that warns you about the enemy of God. He prowls the earth like a hungry lion seeking souls to devour.
The Internet has simply provided him more hunting ground.

I am God’s child, scripture has to come first.

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I respect that. I'd venture to say all Christians would. If you encounter those who don't respect that then I'd say the passage that tells you to test the spirits may come to mind.
Not everyone who says to him, Lord, Lord....."I never knew you."

In Jeremiah 31:31 it tells us “I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah”. If it is true that we are not included when God speaks to Israel and Judah, wouldn’t it then follow that we are not included in the new covenant? Yet everyone knows that we are included.

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Not everyone.
There is a group of people who call themselves the Christian Identity Movement.
They're white racists and they disavow Israel's place in the new covenant entirely.
Once upon a time there was another group known as 11th Hour Remnant Messenger.They believed that Caucasians were the true biblical Israel, not Jews.

There is also a doctrine known as Supersessionism, or Replacement Theology. The idea there is that the church has replaced the Jews as God's chosen people.
Paul destroys this doctrine in Romans 11:18 do not boast over the branches. But if you boast, remember that you do not support the root, but the root supports you.
The Supersessionist will argue that does not pertain to their doctrine.

And you can't discount the fact that there are people out there that thrive on hurting people and their feelings. One sure avenue to accomplish that in spades anonymously online is to make slights against your faith and your understanding.
This does not apply to those who genuinely disagree with your exegesis of course. You can usually tell the difference between them.

I hope your feedback will help. I read the OT as to me as well as Israel, so I even sometimes pray with the 23rd Psalm. What am I not understanding?

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Great choice to reinforce your armor against the enemy.
Maybe consider that those who attack you personally or speak to hurt your feelings in matters of your faith and understanding, especially since you're so open about that, are perhaps God's way of testing you. 1 Peter 3:15 “But sanctify Christ as Lord in your hearts, always being ready to make a defense to everyone who asks you to give an account for the hope that is in you, yet with gentleness and reverence."

Maybe add this to your prayers. Psalm 119:41 May I experience your loyal love O Lord,and your deliverance,as you promised. 42 Then I will have a reply for the one who insults me, for I trust in your word.

God loves you. And from what I've read you certainly do love him. Tighten your armor. As long as you have God no enemy can stand against you.

Thanks for sharing with us your interpretation.

Why would the time and place a covenant was given have such a profound effect on the covenant itself? A covenant is a communication that God makes with us. The old covenant is a promise that a person or nation would be cursed or blessed according to his obedience to commands. Then a set of rules were given, commands given. It is another way of saying that if you steal you go to jail on this earth. It had nothing to do with the forgiveness that the Lord offered them, the eternal security they had when they repented of sin. It listed the sin they were to repent of. The God given laws of atonement still stood, it did not cancel those laws.

In the same way, the new covenant does the same thing, only we have forgiveness, not atonement. And the law is not a set of rules any longer, it has been improved making the old covenant obsolete. Now we are given the law of the Lord in our spirit and heart.

Care to share yours?