Believing and Receiving the Holy Ghost

I do understand that at times people will refuse to accept what others present from the word. But that doesn't hinder me from continuing to share it. Thankfully we are not tasked with making them believe one thing or another. According to Paul it is God who provides revelation. Our job is to continue to plant and at other times water the word that has already been planted in someone by another person.

Food for thought:
The word of God is alive. Once planted and watered like a natural seed it will bring forth fruit. We see this principle mentioned by Paul, "I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase."1 Cor 3:6

How a seed of truth is planted and watered, or by whom is not what's important. What is important is the Word of God has been implanted in a person’s soul. There can be no fruit without the planting and continual watering of a seed.

The Holy Ghost reveals truth to individuals by drawing the implanted word of God to the surface of one’s consciousness at appointed times.

The Holy Ghost gives revelation or certainty of a truth by drawing one’s attention to scriptures that harmonize with one another. God’s truth will always be confirmed within His word. Erroneous ideas result from using isolated scriptures in an attempt to establish a particular truth.

It is important to remember that God's Word will never contradict itself. When scriptures seem to defy one another the problem is not the Word. The problem will always be found in an individual's personal interpretation.

The only way to be assured that a particular scripture pertains to a given subject is when the context of 2 or 3 other scriptures line up with the scripture in question. This principle is what confirms one's understanding is correct. (2 Cor 13:1) “In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established.”

22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:

Jesus then said to them go and wait to receive power from on High, Jesus did not say wait to be saved.
This is very much the same thing we see in the Old Testament when the Spirit of the Lord came upon Prophets, Judges, Kings, and priests. NOw Jesus is teaching in John14 and 15 what the Holy Spirit will do is 1. be in you and 2. come upon you to empower you to be a witness. We have a habit of limiting God as HE can't be in a person and not be upon them to do are all prophets? do all speak in tongues? can all who are saved? Yes, as long as the Holy Spirit comes upon the yielding person, or do you thing the Holy Spirit will just make you obey God? Force you to do it. No. That doesn't mean you are not saved it means you are not mature yet and God is working with you. Yet you are still saved.

This was the EXCEPTION and there was a good reason. However, believing is immediately followed by the gift of the Holy Spirit. And no one should be misleading others since this is clearly the case in Acts 2 and Acts 10.

from what I understand, we are sealed with the Holy Spirit upon salvation,

To say receiving and being empowered by the Holy Ghost are distinct from one another is not in line with scripture. In all records depicting the actual spiritual rebirth experience people became empowered to witness when the Holy Ghost took up residence in their body. (Acts 2:1-4, 8:12-18, 9:17-18, 10:44-48, 19:1-6) As I have shown with scripture believing in the gospel message does not automatically cause the Holy Ghost to take up residence in an individual. (Acts 8:12-18, 19:1-6) Paul's experience indicates the Holy Ghost was received days after Paul's belief in Jesus as well. (Acts 9:17)

God’s truth will always be confirmed within His word. Erroneous ideas result from using isolated scriptures in an attempt to establish a particular truth. What occurred in John 20:22 was just that an isolated incident. Therefore it's purpose differed from what is clearly seen from other scriptures. Scholars indicate the record is one of a first fruits impartation that was later fulfilled on the Day of Pentecost.

It is important to remember that God's Word will never contradict itself. When scriptures seem to defy one another the problem is not the Word. The problem will always be found in an individual's personal interpretation.

The only way to be assured that a particular scripture pertains to a given subject is when the context of 2 or 3 other scriptures line up with the scripture in question. This principle is what confirms one's understanding is correct. (2 Cor 13:1) “In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established.”

Post #5 may be of interest. It addresses this.

The Acts account of Paul's interaction with the Ephesian disciples outlines the word of truth, the gospel of their salvation that he presented to them. Their belief and obedience to the message resulted in their being filled with the Holy Spirit of promise referenced in Ephesians 1:13.

I am not misleading. To mislead is to say one has the Holy Spirit the moment they believe in the gospel message. This is not backed up by scripture. The point I am making from scripture is that the experience of receiving the Holy Ghost is separate and distinct from one's belief in the message.

I disagree

you can see from the working of the Holy Spirit in the Old Testament how the Spirit of the Lord came upon the Prophets, kings, judges, and priests. Yet when the Holy Spirit did not come upon them did they stop being kings, prophets, and priests? No.

The Holy Spirit does far more than convict the world of sin as John chapters 14-15 says HE does. John20:22 is an isolated incident which after Jesus said to go and wait until you receive power from on high. What was that power for?

Jesus said " you shall receive power to be a witness " of ME". Not for salvation which I might add is not an isolated incident but the very word of Jesus before HE was taken up was You are saved, no, it was you all receive power for the ability to witness.

that isolated INCIDENT was the first time they saw the Resurrected Lord, and He Breathed on them " received the Holy Spirt".

That was not just some prophet speaking it was God saying to them, so why would this be one time mentioned event be dismissed as an isolated incident?

Did the Holy Spirit coming upon David to kill the giant needing to be done more than once or the bear or lion,

did the Spirit of the Lord Come upon Samson have to be only when he had a jaw bone of a donkey? How many times Does it take for Jesus to "breathe" on someone for it? God did confirm HIS word,

John chapter one Jesus is the Baptizer in the Holy Spirt as John said. John 20:22 Jesus resurrected came to His disciples and they received the Holy Spirt then told them to wait until they receive empowerment Acts 1:8. They did. the word of God we see the Holy Spirt not conforming to methodology, he saved and empowered, He saved then later empowered He spoke of what was coming after saving them then they were after empowered. Acts show us this. Jesus said that in John chapter 14 and 15
in you and upon in context to the Holy Spirt as it was in the Old Testament but now to all men and women AND JEWS AND GENTILES.

I'm not following you on this one

Paul states (verses below) that we are 'sealed' by the Holy Spirit and says we are included in Christ when we hear the message of truth...and then believed it. Says nothing about empowerment or gifts

It seems to me there are 2 steps. I was saved at 5, I think I was about 14 when water baptized, but did not ask God to fill me with the Holy Spirit until the age of 18...I had never been taught about that, but when I heard, I followed up. I spoke in tongues right away and do have a couple of spiritual gifts. I was definitely saved up until that point.

So, are you saying we do not have the Holy Spirit when we first believe? Do I misunderstand you?

13 And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, 14 who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession-to the praise of his glory. Ephesians 1

I think it is important as to who plants. IMO, we have literally gangs of people who do not present the truth and the multitude of denoms attests to the fact that although there is just one truth, there are thousands of opinions.

The NT mandate requires that all receive the infilling of the Holy Ghost in order to be reborn spiritually. (John 3:3-5)The indwelling Spirit is the empowerment.

Peter as well as Paul made it clear that the Holy Ghost was what people were receiving not a spiritual gift:

Acts 2:33
Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

Acts 8:17
Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.

Acts 19:2 & 6
He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed?
And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

Acts 10:47
Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?

After hearing the word of truth and believing it prompts obedience that results in one receiving the Holy Ghost. This truth is seen in the record of Paul's own experience. (Acts 9:17-18) Ananias told Paul that he must receive the Holy Ghost and get water baptized in connection to Jesus' death, burial and resurrection. Paul believed in Jesus days before actually receiving the Holy Ghost; afterward he was water baptized.

Also notice the related scriptures below. The people were receiving God's gift of the Holy Ghost not spiritual gifts in the following scriptures:
Acts 2:1-4 (120 gathered) The people believed in Jesus well before receiving the Holy Ghost
Acts 8:12-18 Belief and water baptism days before receiving Holy Ghost
Acts 10:44-48 Cornelius and others heard the message received the Holy Ghost and got water baptized afterward
Acts 19:1-6 People heard the message got water baptized and received the Holy Ghost afterward.


After receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost. The Holy Ghost imparts different gifts to individuals for ministry purposes.

1 Cor 12:1 & 4
Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant...
4 Now there are diversities (different kinds) of gifts, but the same Spirit.

1 Cor 12:8-11
For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
10 To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.

I'm honestly not seeing just what you seem to be seeing in the above passages with regards to the book of Acts. it seems to me you might be splitting hairs?

I understand scripture as stating we are sealed with the Holy Spirit when we accept Christ. Full Stop. we should be water baptized; but what some call the baptism of the Holy Spirit is not the same as being sealed when we first believed. I wrote how things happened for me and if someone says I was not actually saved until 18? I would just have to marvel that they would think such a thing because I KNOW I was saved at 5 until 18 and until now. And again, we do read that baptism, or the norm, in the NT believers, does appear to be close to belief...but that is not always possible now and frankly I have yet to hear a church where that is taught...which does not make it right or wrong I'm thinking

When I decided to be baptized as a young teen ager, it was MY decision. No one talked me into it.

I already acknowledged the gifts of the Holy Spirit.

I hope you are not saying a person is not really saved unless they speak in tongues or some such thing. I do not believe that is taught in scripture.

So, let me ask then. Is that what you believe? You can add all the scripture you like, but also answer yes or no please.

Considering the scripture I am aware of I don't see one having been indwelt without there being outward evidence.

As I mentioned previously, I just share scripture. Each of us has to come to our own conclusions. We are all on a journey of learning.

I am not misleading. To mislead is to say one has the Holy Spirit the moment they believe in the gospel message. This is not backed up by scripture.

I'm honestly not seeing just what you seem to be seeing in the above passages with regards to the book of Acts. it seems to me you might be splitting hairs?

...the fact that the Holy Ghost is not automatically received when a person believes the gospel message.

The bible does state that a person must have the Spirit to be a child of God. (Rom. 8:9) I know that many believe there is no outward evidence that accompanies the infilling of the Holy Ghost. However, I am only aware of biblical records that directly or indirectly indicate that speaking in tongues flows from an individual when they are initially filled with the Spirit. I shared those in the previous post. Considering the scripture I am aware of I don't see one having been indwelt without there being outward evidence.

As I mentioned previously, I just share scripture. Each of us has to come to our own conclusions. We are all on a journey of learning.

The Bible doesn't state that a person must have the Holy Spirit to be a child of God? I don't want to misunderstand you but there is a difference in the infilling of the Holy Spirit on a believer over one who has the Holy Spirit in them to be saved.

Your opening comment I hope you can clarify because the bible most definitely tells us we must have the Holy Spirit to be a child of God.


John chapter 14 and 15 tell us
Eph 1:13
In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,

You thought you saw something different than what I wrote. My comment was: "The bible does state that a person must have the Spirit to be a child of God. (Rom. 8:9)" (Post #33)

I disagree with your belief that the infilling of the Holy Spirit is a separate experience from one having the Holy Spirit in side of them. It is the same thing.

Acts 2:33
Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

Acts 8:17
Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.

Acts 19:2 & 6
He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed?
And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

Acts 10:47
Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?