Once saved always saved (OSAS) debunked

Its not a "belief". It is a Biblically supported doctrine. Beyond all refutation.

This doctrine in NO WAY diminishes the passages you quoted in the least. God IS love, LOVES the world, LOVES ungodly fallen men WHILE THEY WERE YET SINNERS. No doubt about it. God also calls men to repentance and has throughout the ages. Men respond to this calling and receive their salvation, which is the full, ultimate final expression of the love of God.

There is no conflict here as far as God is concerned. All of this is reconciled in the infinite mercy grace and mind of God.

The holy spirit is in fact what you spoken and the word of God is what you have spoken but many seem to think they read it with the holy spirit and many claim it yet the fruit doesn't show that. The word of God is not cryptic it's not a code that only a few can understand you just have to see and really see
. The elect do not need him to die for them because the elect are the by product of Jesus saving the ungodly. Becoming an elect is not a god given right it is something earned the ungodly and the elect are not two seperate forces to be debated about it is us we were the ungodly and he died for us and when we take that and rise with him in faith we become the elect.

You can have all the facts but that doesn't mean you understand what is there

And it would be foolish to think we do because we go into the word of God but no one has been able to fully understand it some even don't understand it at all

We all have to be serious here we can't assume we understand what we are talking about no matter how solid it may seem after all even the devil knew the scriptures and tried to tempt Jesus with them.

You have be a blank slate and seek only the truth and accept nothing less no interpreation no reasoning no understanding you go into it with your eyes set on truth and truth alone then you will be given the eyes to see then the word of God has actual power and you see the bible as a whole now you see a dimension of scripture that lays behind a hidden wall and to get through that wall you have to be willing to drop everything and assume to know nothing.

This is not a one time thing either it is a ritual a daily activity with God

Well again, I don't see it. Not with the verses I shared in my last post. I believe Christ died for all because that's what the Bible says. But we do agree on the point God loves the sinner. But how can one say God loves sinners if He created them to be that way. Sorry, still get stuck on that idea.

Example:

If we say Jesus died for the UNGODLY then we know that means every human being.

If we reason and say Jesus only died for the Elect then that [[doesn't]] mean everyone.

The Holy Spirit said UNGODLY which means God died for EVERYONE.

So to say Elect is calling God a LIAR!


NOW, DO YOU WANT TO BACK SOMEONE CALLING GOD A LIAR?

The biblical truth of election is absolutely boilerplate. So likewise Gods love for sinners. So likewise the call to repentance. So likewise man's responsibility to heed Gods calling. So likewise eternal security for the born again children of God. And much much more.

I am amazed that Christians fail to understand that all of these things are true at the same time. It's ridiculous that they pick one and deny the rest.

I don't choose sides and I don't back people unless I have reason to. People can be wrong in many things but when they post truth I will make note of it this doesn't mean I agree with their entire premise or where they coming from and I don't give a flying flip about who is right or here and I don't care what anyone says the word of God says I know the presence in the words spoken when it is done in the spirirt of truth.

Im here to get in the middle of the issue and put a stop to it, I am here to remind everyone we are for the kingdom which means if these debates don't further the kingdom their of the enemy not God.

When you go into this without being kingdom minded you get this mess people get so caught up in their debates they forget the reason they are here to begin with and the truth is not in them no matter how much what they say makes sense
You planted your seed it wasn't recieved move on and plant another side don't keep hanging around the seed you planted let it go don't try to prove or disprove don't look at this as an earthly matter where carnal minds debate and us doctrine and scripture to put in their two cents.

Just let it go you planted the seed but if you don't give it room for him to make it grow it's just a dead seed, does this discussion here bring you life? Does it give you joy? does it stir the spirit inside with a profound utterance?

You better make a stand and back the Bible.

There's no other way to interpret Jesus died for the UNGODLY than He died for the UNGODLY.

Does UNGODLY mean everyone to you or something else?

You know your really stubborn. Firstly I don't need to take a stand for the bible that is the word of God himself and in one word alone he can create all existance if anything I need the word of God to stand for me not the other way around. Im not here to argue about scripture im here to prove it I don't care about whether or not your right or wrong nor anyone else I care about the truth and bringing the kingdom I am here to get in the way and rebuke foolish arguing I am here to remind everone about the mission about the kingdom about who are in him this is my field and I only want to plant the seeds of the kingdom this is a barren field where for years everyone argues debates insults each other everyone thinking they are right and people always complain about the state of this and about people here so since no one will take up the responcsibility to make a change he called me.

You speak on the topic I speak on the real thing

No, Christ died for ALL. Here, read this and understand. You are twisting Scripture.

“Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned”

Who did death come to? ALL PEOPLE because ALL SINNED.

“But the gift is not like the trespass. For if the many died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God’s grace and the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, overflow to the many!” – Romans 5:15

“That is why we labor and strive, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all people, and especially of those who believe.” – 1 Timothy 4:10

“He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.” – 1 John 2:2

All people means just what it says. It's there in black and white.

Why would God make a stand for you when you won't make one for Him when presented with Scriptural Evidence?

No, Christ died for ALL. Here, read this and understand. You are twisting Scripture.

Because called and I said yes lets go. Just because I don't defend your post doesn't equal me not standing for him. Did I not give credit to you about the holy spirit and the word of God? I saw truth and I pointed it out but you keep whining and not listening. Your on on the same level here your not in the right frequency so your missing the point of everything I am saying, Im not standing for God or the bible I am standing with them and I'm trying to get you to see past your limited view I am saying things that are treasures from the kingdom but you have to be kingdom minded to see and recieve it you not kingdom minded that is why your words are not recieved and why they have no life or power in them. Let go and get back to the beggining of the process until you are kingdom minded your not going to be getting anywhere

"to many", not "to all".
The "all" cannot be more than those the Father gave to Christ which is not everyone. That is the limiting factor.
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The world to come is the whole world.
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No prophecy of scripture is of any private interpretation. No verse stands on its own
and must be compared to and against other verses to ascertain meaning..

Pride goeth before a long thread, and even a haughty spirit would like to be done by the Fall...Proverbs something...LIV(Loosely Interpreted Version).

Example:

If we say Jesus died for the UNGODLY then we know that means every human being.

If we reason and say Jesus only died for the Elect then that [[doesn't]] mean everyone.

The Holy Spirit said UNGODLY which means God died for EVERYONE.

So to say Elect is calling God a LIAR!


NOW, DO YOU WANT TO BACK SOMEONE CALLING GOD A LIAR?

I don't think we can remove the designation or identity of those God refers to as his elect from the salvation equation.

Also, if we accept what we're told about our state of mind as sinners, the natural carnal mind unable to accept the things of God because they are foolishness to them, and the only reason this changes is through intervention by God's Holy Spirit, then I think it becomes a difficult thing to argue God died for everyone.

That is true if the identity of everyone is understood and considered in the context of the identity of the word, everyone for whom salvation applies.

Those whose natural carnal mind for whom God's gospel was foolishness before are now through intercession of Holy Spirit those able to understand that thing of God that was formerly foolishness, the gospel.

You chose to interrupt a current discussion.

Next time, keep to yourself.

You bet I interrupted and I will do it again and don't call that a discussion you and I both know that wasn't what that was. Your probably not going to like me because I will intervene when it is required I will rebuke when needed and I give credit when needed but this whole childish arguing is going to stop don't forget who you serve and don't forget the cause abd mission you have been giving God is not messing around anymore and you better get with the program before it is to late because trust me your not going to want to miss this bus and you don't have a lot of time left.

So if you refuse to take the seed he gave me to give you that is your loss not mine I planted the seed im moving on

Predestination, Election, etc, are all relative in understanding that Jesus died for the UNGODLY.

THE beauty concerning God's Foreknowledge doesn't stop or proceed God's Plan from being fulfilled.

But what is never addressed is we only get to see the view from the side of those who are Saved.

How do we know Election wasn't for every human to be Saved?

Just because God Elects us, we still have the Free Will to accept or deny.

No one mentions that perspective because many want to present the Saved as robots who had no say in the matter.

But I remember when I felt God knocking at my heart. I remember having 2 thoughts. One being is this what I want? The other being Yes, I do.

There was no mind control taking place, there was only do I want this or not?

So, it's possible that many who were Elected said [[NO]] in that moment.

But what we POSITIVELY do know, Jesus died for the UNGODLY, which means every human being.