The Commandments of God (according to scripture)

Well done, you can even put grace under the Law. I don't know how you can have a sabbath day when time is meaningless. The sabbath was made for the well being of the Israelites. The Israelites were not created in order to serve the sabbath.

I am in Christ, which means that I am a new creation. I have died to the Law and I live by the faith of the Son of God. The physical temple has been destroyed so I can't obey the law even if I wanted to. I'll say it again, the Law is the Shadow. Jesus is the reality. I already have God's character - His holiness and His nature - His righteousness. That is because Jesus is my life. It's called the New Covenant because it is new. The old has passed away. You should try living by grace sometime. I am full of joy and peace right now. I don't have to wait for the Kingdom of God. Jesus has given me His life in abundance. Jesus is my rest, and that is every moment of the day.

Paul is contrasting the Old Covenant to the New Covenant. From stables of stone (Deut 4:13) to tables of the heart (law in heart Heb 8:10) and Jesus shows us exactly what this looks like giving two examples as principles quoting right from the Ten Commandments applying the Ten not only keeping the letter but also applying it to our thoughts and feelings where sin and matters of the heart start from. If one removes anger and contempt from our hearts, thou shalt not murder would automatically be kept. This is how we keep the law in our heart, and it applies to all Ten Commandments as Jesus said not to break the least of these and the spirit of the law is greater, not lessor.

Matthew 5:19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I say to you, that unless your righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven.

21 “You have heard that it was said to those of old (Old Covenant) , ‘You shall not murder, and whoever murders will be in danger of the judgment.’ 22 But I say to you that whoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment. (New Covenant in Action) And whoever says to his brother, ‘Raca!’ shall be in danger of the council. But whoever says, [g]‘You fool!’ shall be in danger of [h]hell fire. 23 Therefore if you bring your gift to the altar, and there remember that your brother has something against you, 24 leave your gift there before the altar, and go your way. First be reconciled to your brother, and then come and offer your gift. 25 Agree with your adversary quickly, while you are on the way with him, lest your adversary deliver you to the judge, the judge hand you over to the officer, and you be thrown into prison. 26 Assuredly, I say to you, you will by no means get out of there till you have paid the last penny.

27 “You have heard that it was said [i]to those of old, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ 28 But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29 If your right eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell. 30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.

Not only should we literally not commit adultery or murder or breaking the least of these commandments we should not even think it the heart, where sin starts in the heart and what the new covenant is about God's law in our hearts Heb 8:10

Jesus makes another connection to the New Covenant and the Ten Commandments showing us how our heart is far from Him, the opposite of the New Covenant, law in our hearts. When we keep our rules/traditions over the commandments of God.

Matthew 15:3 He (Jesus) answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother’ (direct quote from the Ten Exo 20:12) and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 5 But you say, ‘Whoever says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is a gift to God”— 6 then he need not honor his father [a]or mother.’ Thus you have made the commandment of God of no effect by your tradition. 7 Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying:

8 ‘These people [c]draw near to Me with their mouth,
And honor Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
9 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ”

And there are lots of parallel teachings to this.

1 John 2:3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. (law in our hearts NC) 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him (heart is far from Me). 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God [a]is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

There are many other parallel verses, but I love how God's Word always harmonizes. Jesus wants our hearts and thoughts changed and if we are walking in His Spirit the law is automatically kept why there is no condemnation, the carnal mind does not have God's law in the heart and why they are not subject to it Rom 8:7-8 but those with faith keep God's law through love and faith. 1 John 5:3 Rom 3:31 John 14:15 Exo 20:6 Rev 14:12 Rev 22:15

Jesus said the Sabbath was made for man Mark 2:27 and grace is not a license to break God's law.

Romans 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? 2 Certainly not! How shall we who died to sin live any longer in it?

Jesus gives rest, He is not rest, Jesus is not the Sabbath commandment, He is the Creator, not the creation and a commandment is just that, not a suggestion.

well that is the thing, in the kingdom of heaven you have to follow the commandments... better get used to them but b=no worries it is written
I understand the concept of obedience to GOD and I follow the commandments they are based on Love and are good. many people fail to know this, how obedience to GOD is essential, we have had many good example of disobedience in the bible and what it brings, death.

the LAW of Moses was given to the israelites in the desert. they were a rebellious people, they were in Egypt worshipping false GODS, they were slaved with no moral, ethical or hygienic laws. The mosaic laws was essential then to correct these shortcomings. I admit many if the laws written by Moses have enormous values ans describe in detail how to behave, do or not to do, they would provide a great foundation to any society. However as you know all of this at the heart of the law and commandments is love. this is what Jesus came to explain, not to follow the law blindly but with the heart, He Magnified the commandments explaining and expanding their true meaning.

Now what do you do with all of the ceremonial laws, civil laws, are you saying these are forever? Jesus paid the price of our sins forever, will sacrifices resume in the Kingdom of heaven? I would like to hear from you on these obsolete laws that can no longer be followed.

Blessings.

Amen i suspect several people that insist upon the law have never actually read it very carefully

“Behold, I set before you this day a blessing and a curse;

a blessing, if ye obey the commandments of the LORD your God, which I command you this day:

and a curse, if ye will not obey the commandments of the LORD your God, but turn aside out of the way which I command you this day, to go after other gods, which ye have not known.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭11:26-

“And the LORD said unto Moses, Behold, thou shalt sleep with thy fathers; and this people will rise up, and go a whoring after the gods of the strangers of the land, whither they go to be among them, and will forsake me, and break my covenant which I have made with them.

Then my anger shall be kindled against them in that day, and I will forsake them, and I will hide my face from them, and they shall be devoured, and many evils and troubles shall befall them; so that they will say in that day, Are not these evils come upon us, because our God is not among us?”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭31:16-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“The earth also is defiled under the inhabitants thereof; because they have transgressed the laws, changed the ordinance, broken the everlasting covenant. Therefore hath the curse devoured the earth, and they that dwell therein are desolate: therefore the inhabitants of the earth are burned, and few men left. The earth shall reel to and fro like a drunkard, and shall be removed like a cottage; and the transgression thereof shall be heavy upon it; and it shall fall, and not rise again.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭24:5-6, 20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:”
‭‭Jeremiah‬ ‭31:31-32‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Hearken unto me, my people; and give ear unto me, O my nation: for a law shall proceed from me, and I will make my judgment to rest for a light of the people. My righteousness is near; my salvation is gone forth, and mine arms shall judge the people; the isles shall wait upon me, and on mine arm shall they trust.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭51:4-5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Incline your ear, and come unto me: hear, and your soul shall live; and I will make an everlasting covenant with you, even the sure mercies of David.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭55:3‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me: and the Lord, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even the messenger of the covenant, whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come, saith the LORD of hosts.”
‭‭Malachi‬ ‭3:1‬ ‭

Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me:

“The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;

As it is written in the prophets, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, Which shall prepare thy way before thee. John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭1:1-2, 4‬ ‭

and the Lord, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even the messenger of the covenant, whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come, saith the LORD of hosts.”

“For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭11:13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“The law and the prophets were until John:

since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭16:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, and saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭1:14-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“how shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord,

and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;

God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭2:3-4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

life begins for us at Jesus not Moses

“Paul is contrasting the Old Covenant to the New Covenant. From stables of stone (Deut 4:13) to tables of the heart “

right he’s contrasting the old testament with the New Testament I couldn’t agree more ….let’s take what he’s saying in for a moment

“But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

how shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?

For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory. For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth. For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech: and not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished: but their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭3:7-15‬ ‭

several things he’s made clear there right given you called it exactly right he’s contrasting the old covenant word of Moses and also the commands wrotten on stone tablets here are several points he makes there

Of the Old Testament the words of Moses he says

“the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, “

“if the ministration of condemnation be glory,”

“not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished: but their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; “

But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.”



Of the New Testament the word of Christ he says

“shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?”

much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:

which vail is done away in Christ

he is contrasting the two seperate covenants I agree what Moses the old covenant mediator said and what Jesus the mediator of the new covenant said are contrary and contrast at nearly every point one is this

“Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions,

till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; ( Jesus )

and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:19‬ ‭KJV‬‬


And offer this

“And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.”
‭‭Leviticus‬ ‭20:10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Now the lord and the gospel

“they say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act. Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou? So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her. And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst. When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee? She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more. Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:4-5, 7, 9-12‬ ‭

The old covenant law condemns and holds sinners guilty it’s why it’s written as it is it’s meant to do what it does

“Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭3:19-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

It doesn’t justify me before God if I don’t kill anybody I need to love people the way Jesus taught in the gospel

It doesn’t justify me if I don’t commit adultery I need to love my wife as Jesus taught

It doesn’t justify a person for what they don’t do ….thou shalt not is speaking to a sinner the gospel is what we need to repent and believe moving forward it’s contrary to what moses taught moses law was prophetic pertaining to Jesus ……it’s not what God wills the gospel is what God wills and what can save us give us the holt ghost remit our sins give us his own word

the law is contrary because it’s for the old creation those who need to find Christ are under the law those set free walk in Christ

You seem to be adding the law you want into these scripture instead of allowing the scripture to interpret itself, which it does if one allows.

For example Gal 3:19 does not say the Ten Commandments and no where in the context of Galatians 3:19 refers to the Ten Commandments. The law that ended until the Seed would come is not the law that defines sin, the Ten Commandments, it is animals sacrifices as it always pointed forward to Jesus and His Great Sacrifice read Hebrews 9 and Hebrews 10. So instead of sacrificing animals in the New Covenant when we sin (break God’s law) we can go directly to Jesus who is our Sacrificial Lamb 1 Cor 5:7 when we confess, repent and have a change in direction What did not change is the law that defines sin, the Ten Commandments Romans 7:7 Mat 5:19-30 and what we will be judged by James 2:10-12 Rev 22:15, Mat 5:19-30. Wouldn’t it be sad if we really were supposed to keep the commandments of God and faith of Jesus until the end of time, just like scripture tells us Rev 14:12 only to instead listen to the crowd who teaches we no longer need to obey God the way He asks. Jesus addressed this scenario in scripture Mat 5:19-30 Mat 7:21-23. It always best to place our faith in Jesus, He will never lead us down the wrong path.

“You seem to be adding the law you want into these scripture instead of allowing the scripture to interpret itself, which it does if one allows.”

So why did you just explain everything and never even look at what it says ? Or adress any of the scripture I’ve oreeentee throughout the thread and what the nt says about the old ? I agree the Bible interprets itself ….form is ts ce your saying gay Galatians 3 is about animal sacrifice but it’s never mentioned anywhere in the chapter or the book so what is your basis for explaining he’s only talking about animal sacrifice when he’s not he talking about the ordination of angels and mediation of Moses that was set in place until Jesus came ?

It has nothing to do with animals sacrifice it’s about what he’s saying

“For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them. Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions,

till the seed should come to whom the promise was made;

and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:10-12, 19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That part you don’t apparently see you don’t have to ever tell someone who would kill “ thou shalt not kill “ you only have to say that when murder becomes an issue ….thou shalt not kill was added because of the sin of murder

The law given to Moses did not exist before mankind became sinful it came after mankind became sinful 430 years after Abraham lives and died the law is an addition because of sin it’s not part of a born again Christian’s life that’s what the New Testament is about

try the niv maybe but instead of just explaining it’s about animal sacrifice when it’s not even touching that subject read what is being said it is well explained just like you first said there…but not if we don’t let what it says be true

Jesus doesn’t teach us “ thou shalt not kill “ ……Jesus teaches us to love one another in deed and truth in action

Because if we learn to just treat other humans with love we will never need to be told don’t kill anyone

yoy don’t serve God by trying not to sin you serve God by hearing and following after the things Jesus taught us to do then you won’t be sinning youll be serving God

The Old Testament cannot ever change a sinner the New Testament will change sinners who hear and believe the gospel

if you treat people right from a good heart there’s no reason for us to be told don t kill them. …..we won’t kill have idols and worship false gods we won’t steal and cheer and commit adultery …if we learn from and follow Jesus

the ot isn’t Christianity the gospel is

You aren’t going to be judged by what’s in Moses book or written on stone tables given to an exclusive people your going to be judged by Jesus and the words he spoke in the gospel

the old testement your hearing Gods authority given to angels having thier own disposition given to Moses who had his own judgements about sin

dont you ever notice and wonder why the nt is saying this

“Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2:16-18‬ ‭

“For if the word spoken by angels was stedfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompence of reward; how shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭2:2-3‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The word of angels and Moses cannot save a person it’s a different covenant

Jesus words the mediator of the new covenant his words can save sinners who are condemned by the law ….actually bring them to change and repentance

Im not sure really the disagreement there’s an old covenant and there’s a new covenant the Bible explains that well one was fulfilled one will be at the end of the world

wow man now Jesus used to be an angel……lol because you found a scripture referring to Moses striking a rock two times …..

nehemiah jesus was never an angel he created angels and men …..

Jesus is God

Just read what’s here Nehemiah

“And they made a calf in those days, and offered sacrifice unto the idol, and rejoiced in the works of their own hands.

Then God turned, and gave them up to worship the host of heaven; as it is written in the book of the prophets, O ye house of Israel, have ye offered to me slain beasts and sacrifices By the space of forty years in the wilderness? Yea, ye took up the tabernacle of Moloch, And the star of your god Remphan, Figures which ye made to worship them: And I will carry you away beyond Babylon.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭7:41-43‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Therefore now go, lead the people unto the place of which I have spoken unto thee:

behold, mine Angel shall go before thee:

nevertheless in the day when I visit I will visit their sin upon them.”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭32:34‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared. Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for my name is in him.”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭23:20-21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That is not Jesus It’s an angel God ordained over the people because they worshipped the calf like Stephen is saying you can’t say that is Jesus Jesus is all about pardoning sin tbat angel would not pardon sin that’s why the law is what it is

“Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭13:8‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for my name is in him.”

“And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day.

And the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp.

And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses.”
‭‭Numbers‬ ‭15:32, 35-36‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The law is ordained of the angels Afro the purpose of not remitting sin not pardoning sin because it’s for this reason

“Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭3:19-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

It’s meant to hold all sinners guilty without excuse that’s why the anfel won’t pardon sin it’s why he commanded things like that or this

“But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel: then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you.”
‭‭Deuteronomy‬ ‭22:20-21‬ ‭

The man wasn’t told “ repent and don’t work on the sabbath anymore “ and I’ll forgive you because the angel wouldn’t pardon sin he was executed for his sin immediately . The law is for another woman who had pre marital sex repentance just execution commanded by the law for the others to kill the sinner

Jesus Christ doesn’t teach people to judged and condemn sinners among us and put them to death …..the ordination over the law does that because it was an addition and response to mans sin

“Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions,

till the seed should come to whom the promise was made;( until Jesus came )

and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the gospel is God in the flesh speaking his eternal word and giving his spirit to believers and then dying for their sins according to the law and giving them a new way a better way that leads to life everlasting

the Old Testament of course came from God god ordained angels over the people under the law and Moses was made the one mediator of the law

the reference the rock bekng Christ is a reference to Moses stocking the rock instead of speaking To it when it gave then water in the desert ……

“And Moses lifted up his hand, and with his rod he smote the rock twice: and the water came out abundantly, and the congregation drank, and their beasts also.”
‭‭Numbers‬ ‭20:11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Christ gives the Holy Ghost to believers the rock is a prophetic figure of that

“In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.

He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)”
‭‭John‬ ‭7:37-39‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The ot is a pattern a prophetic foretelling it’s not the reality of anything Jesus and the gospel is the reality Christ being the rock has nothing to do with him being an angel

“being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.

For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, This day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, And he shall be to me a Son? And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭1:4-6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Angel can just mean messenger.

Did you not see that I identified this Angel as "the Angel of the LORD", which is another designation for Christ in the OT? So once again, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit were with the Israelites. Not an ordinary angel.

Do you know who spoke to Moses at the burning bush? Evidently you do not.
So let me fill you in from Scripture.

EXODUS 3: THE ANGEL OF THE LORD IS JESUS, ALSO CALLED "GOD" IN THIS CHAPTER
Now Moses kept the flock of Jethro his father in law, the priest of Midian: and he led the flock to the backside of the desert, and came to the mountain of God, even to Horeb.
2And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed.
3And Moses said, I will now turn aside, and see this great sight, why the bush is not burnt.
4And when the LORD saw that he turned aside to see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said, Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I.
5And he said, Draw not nigh hither: put off thy shoes from off thy feet, for the place whereon thou standest is holy ground.
6Moreover he said, I am the God of thy father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. And Moses hid his face; for he was afraid to look upon God.
7And the LORD said, I have surely seen the affliction of my people which are in Egypt, and have heard their cry by reason of their taskmasters; for I know their sorrows;
8And I am come down to deliver them out of the hand of the Egyptians, and to bring them up out of that land unto a good land and a large, unto a land flowing with milk and honey; unto the place of the Canaanites, and the Hittites, and the Amorites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites.
9Now therefore, behold, the cry of the children of Israel is come unto me: and I have also seen the oppression wherewith the Egyptians oppress them.
10Come now therefore, and I will send thee unto Pharaoh, that thou mayest bring forth my people the children of Israel out of Egypt.
11And Moses said unto God, Who am I, that I should go unto Pharaoh, and that I should bring forth the children of Israel out of Egypt?
12And he said, Certainly I will be with thee; and this shall be a token unto thee, that I have sent thee: When thou hast brought forth the people out of Egypt, ye shall serve God upon this mountain.
13And Moses said unto God, Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God of your fathers hath sent me unto you; and they shall say to me, What is his name? what shall I say unto them?
14And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
15And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, The LORD God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations.
16Go, and gather the elders of Israel together, and say unto them, The LORD God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, of Isaac, and of Jacob, appeared unto me, saying, I have surely visited you, and seen that which is done to you in Egypt:
17And I have said, I will bring you up out of the affliction of Egypt unto the land of the Canaanites, and the Hittites, and the Amorites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, unto a land flowing with milk and honey.
18And they shall hearken to thy voice: and thou shalt come, thou and the elders of Israel, unto the king of Egypt, and ye shall say unto him, The LORD God of the Hebrews hath met with us: and now let us go, we beseech thee, three days' journey into the wilderness, that we may sacrifice to the LORD our God.
19And I am sure that the king of Egypt will not let you go, no, not by a mighty hand.
20And I will stretch out my hand, and smite Egypt with all my wonders which I will do in the midst thereof: and after that he will let you go.
21And I will give this people favour in the sight of the Egyptians: and it shall come to pass, that, when ye go, ye shall not go empty:
22But every woman shall borrow of her neighbour, and of her that sojourneth in her house, jewels of silver, and jewels of gold, and raiment: and ye shall put them upon your sons, and upon your daughters; and ye shall spoil the Egyptians.

Does the New Testament say that Jesus is God? Absolutely

Did Christ say that He is "IAM"? Absolutely.

Did the Angel of the LORD identify Himself as "I AM"? Absolutely

This is the “ pre incarnate “ Jesus though as you already understand sister

“In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭1:1‬ ‭KJV‬‬

It’s why we need to hear the gospel and believe

“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

….He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.

And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.”
‭‭John‬ ‭1:1, 3, 10, 14‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: for by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: and he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭1:15-18‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Jesus is God manifest in the flesh an angel never became flesh and died for us our God and creator did …

“And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭3:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭2:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Ive heard that too in the late seventies it was really popular but the Bible is very clear about who Jesus is before he is born in the flesh and also clear about who he was not

how does that impact those scriptures that are showing the vast difference in Jesus and angels ?

“hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high; being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.

For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, This day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, And he shall be to me a Son? And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, And his ministers a flame of fire.


But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: A sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; And the heavens are the works of thine hands:

But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, Until I make thine enemies thy footstool?

Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭1:2-8, 10, 13-14‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I don’t see how arguing angel could
Mean messenger impacts any of what it’s saying about angels and the son of God who became a man not an angel Jesus is the lord made flesh he’s never been an angel he became a man

“For verily he took not on him the nature of angels;

but he took on him the seed of Abraham.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭2:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

But brother I don’t dispute that angels are heavenly messengers that’s really clear in the Bible and that’s what I’m saying about the law the word is coming from this ordination as soon as they worshipped the calf everything changed that’s what Stephen is explaining in acts chapter 7 of course people don’t want to read it because it’s “ wordy “ they say it’s also relevant and clear

“Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared. Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for my name is in him.”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭23:20-21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

now to be clear here brother and relevant to what your saying is the next sentence

“But if thou shalt indeed obey his voice, and do all that I speak;

then I will be an enemy unto thine enemies, and an adversary unto thine adversaries.”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭23:22‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Understand I’m not saying that the law isn’t of God ….I’m saying this happened as Moses was in the cloud receiving the commandments ….

“And they made a calf in those days, and offered sacrifice unto the idol, and rejoiced in the works of their own hands. Then God turned, and gave them up to worship the host of heaven; ( angels ) as it is written in the book of the prophets, O ye house of Israel, have ye offered to me slain beasts and sacrifices By the space of forty years in the wilderness? ( he’s asking the question have you been worshipping me all this time ?)

( then he answers) Yea, ye took up the tabernacle of Moloch, And the star of your god Remphan, Figures which ye made to worship them: And I will carry you away beyond Babylon….

( so what I’m gettin at is when you read the words of Moses in the law you are getting that disposition Hod warned then about )

who have received the law by the disposition of angels, and have not kept it.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭7:41-43, 53‬ ‭KJV‬‬

so…this

Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for my name is in him.”

(He says he will not pardon your transgressions my authority is in him )

now look at the law look at what the dispostion is upon e writhing in it

“And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day. And the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp. And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses.”
‭‭Numbers‬ ‭15:32, 35-36‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death. And if a man lie with his daughter in law, both of them shall surely be put to death: they have wrought confusion; their blood shall be upon them. If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. And if a man take a wife and her mother, it is wickedness: they shall be burnt with fire, both he and they; that there be no wickedness among you. And if a man shall lie with his uncle's wife, he hath uncovered his uncle's nakedness: they shall bear their sin; they shall die childless. And if a man shall take his brother's wife, it is an unclean thing: he hath uncovered his brother's nakedness; they shall be childless. Ye shall therefore keep all my statutes, and all my judgments, and do them: that the land, whither I bring you to dwell therein, spue you not out.”
‭‭Leviticus‬ ‭20:10, 12-14, 20-

Brother Jesus wasn’t an Angel the Bible clearly tells us he created angels and men and heaven and earth he’s the lord manifest in the flesh is all I’m saying the angels were given rule over Israel when they broke the commandment the very first thing he commanded them they broke as he was writing the commandments then as stephens says there

Then God turned, and gave them up to worship the host of heaven;

The whole law came from God it’s a different ordination for a different purpose and people it isn’t Christianity it’s prophetic pertaining to Christianity though a witness of it

the gospel is where our faith is that’s all I’m saying remeber brother a third of the angels followed satans rebellion ……and will inherit eternal damnation with him also with people who follow him as well even Satan is a messenger the messenger of our covenant was Jesus our lord and God

“And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness. And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭5:19-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

There’s a different ordination over the law of Moses and he’s the mediator Moses .

The Gospel is God the Father presenting his word in the Son and promising believers his holy spirit will come to live within and be with them

The ot is this

“Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

It’s why you see all the references to contrast the old and new

“Therefore we ought to give the more earnest heed to the things which we have heard, lest at any time we should let them slip.

For if the word spoken by angels was stedfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompence of reward; ( the ot law )

how shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, ( the gospel of the kingdom ) and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;

God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will? ( acts of the apostles )

For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭2:1-5‬

The law wasn’t meant to save souls ….it’s meant to condemn sinners and make them were they need a savior need salvstion

My comment was just a general comment. More was being discussed than simply the difference between Jesus and angels. I don't think anyone was arguing that Jesus wasn't in every way superior to angels. But I can certainly be wrong.
And Merry Christmas brother.

I would not exclude service in other ways, nor limit the scope to a local church.

I have been a HIDDEN PROPHET since July 1996, and by definition, not able to be a member of a local church, by the Lord's personal command.

And since I am also commissioned to Lead Jesus people home , I must keep myself from any affiliation so as to remain totally neutral before all.
Yours Jepethiel.

Dear @Pilgrimshope I do understand your objections, and imagine they are very much the same
as those who object to God becoming a human being, which some angels have also done. I also
understand that you do accept Jesus was God incarnate, and that the Bible makes this plain, even
as some do not see it and fail to accept it. However, I do hope you reconsider and take a closer
look at some of the instances that have been given. It is similar to people saying nobody can
see God and live... the Bible does say that, and yet there were those who clearly did see God but
did not die as a result (though they would have eventually met their end one way or another).

Consider also that God is not incapable of manifesting as an angel should He desire to do so.
That may be a good place to start, though it would not be a good place to leave off, as JWs do.