Was sex Adam and Eve part of the curse
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yeah one wife, not more. A simple doctrine against polygamy, which was common at the time. This is only applicable for the married. This letter was written to Timothy, was he married?
There are many verses in the Bible that I interpret much more literally than others.
For example:
| Revelation 6:12 - And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; |
As someone who is familiar with biology, and who has worked with some of the top genetic engineering firms on the planet, I understand what is being said in the above verse. It has to do with the moment of conception. Something terrible is about to be birthed. The moon is symbolic of female seed. The sun is symbolic male seed. Their union causes the stars to fall, i.e., non-human 'children' to be created:
| Revelation 6:13 - And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. |
The fig tree is humanity, not Israel as some believe. Something non-human is about to 'bud' and 'put forth leaves':
| Mark 13:28-31 - Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near: So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors. Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done. Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away. |
We are now at the tender part. Summer is coming. Humanity 2.0 is putting forth its leaves. Genetically engineered 'humans' are springing up everywhere.
'This Generation' refers to the tares, the unredeemed. It's not the 'Pepsi Generation' or 'Generation X' or whatever. The 'pass' is the Second Death.
The Woman of the Apocalypse describes conception as well. The moon is the ovum. The sun she is clothed with is Abraham's seed. This is the 'meat of the word' that is never taught.
The Vine is a reference to RNA. The Redeemed will be grafted, i.e., gene spliced into it. God is using universal symbolism and language that can be understood at any point in time by just about anyone. We just happen to live in an age where the symbolism is better understood.
Christians tend to believe God is ignorant and has no idea in the world how DNA works. They believe the Bible was authored by 'goat herders', so how could they know anything?
Lovette said:
reneweddaybyday said:
reneweddaybyday said:
And that was the point made by Jesus when He told the pharisees "Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so" (Matthew 19:8).
We no longer live in the the very first chapters in Genesis, but the truth in Genesis 3:15 is a true today as it was when God said it ... just as the truth in Genesis 2:24 is as true today..
reneweddaybyday said:
and fyi ... I'm not "lecturing" you or anybody else. You are in such a snit over a post I submitted that you cannot let go long enough to comprehend that God established a relationship which you want no part of ... and anyone who is (or was as in my case) in a blessed God established relationship can't say anything about it lest we upset Lovette (who's not interested anyway).
reneweddaybyday said:
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I misunderstood nothing of your preaching soly based on the narrative of marriage as an established fact.
reneweddaybyday said:
you most certainly did misunderstand and I base my claim on the fact that you believe I implied that "there's a spouse dropped from the sky for every good christian" ... when I said no such thing.
You are seriously asking me why I am speaking of an "already married couple" when speaking of marriage? ... I'll leave that for you to ferret out if you can Sherlock.
The one with the "unsubstantiated assumption" is the one who cannot figure out why when someone is speaking about marriage, they're speaking about an "already married couple" and then asks foolish and unlearned questions rather than accept the fact that what God ordained for marriage is as true today as it was back when He first established it notwithstanding the fact that satan has duped some folks into believing something other than what God established.
reneweddaybyday said:
I do not worship marriage. I worship God, Who is the One Who established the marriage relationship.
You consider marriage "a human institution" because you do not understand what God established from the very first chapters in Genesis.
While we no longer live in the very first chapters in Genesis, God's truth concerning the marriage relationship does not change. We are the ones who changed what God established ... with help from the one who will do everything and anything he can to obstruct God's truth.
And that was the point made by Jesus when He told the pharisees "Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so" (Matthew 19:8).
We no longer live in the the very first chapters in Genesis, but the truth in Genesis 3:15 is a true today as it was when God said it ... just as the truth in Genesis 2:24 is as true today..
My pastor is a married man who speaks highly of marriage. He understands the relationship as God intended it ... with both husband and wife devoted first to God. Despite your objections, it is absolutely possible to be devoted to God and have a spouse.
reneweddaybyday said:
We each have to live our own lives. God is still God whether we are married or unmarried.
so now you've appointed yourself as the one who can tell folks what can or cannot be discussed in the forum?
and fyi ... I'm not "lecturing" you or anybody else. You are in such a snit over a post I submitted that you cannot let go long enough to comprehend that God established a relationship which you want no part of ... and anyone who is (or was as in my case) in a blessed God established relationship can't say anything about it lest we upset Lovette (who's not interested anyway).
I am not married now and I worship God. I thank God for the blessed relationship I had with my husband during our sojourn together on this earth ... I thank God for the time I have now ... just as you thank Him for the time you have.
reneweddaybyday said:
As mentioned in a prior post, Paul was responding to the church at Corinth concerning matters about which he had received writing. We do not have that writing in front of us. All we know is that Paul was addressing some issues that had cropped up. Continue reading chapter 8 where Paul addresses issues relating to idolatry and eating things offered to idols. Marriage was not the only issue Paul dealt with in his response to the letter had had received.
you are the one who responded to a post submitted by me in which you have no interest ... other than to cast aspersions on what God established for husbands and wives. You are not a husband. You are not a wife. Yet you want to lecture concerning a topic of which you are completely ignorant. You may know about the "human institution like all other human institutions" ... which does not equal you knowing that which God established.
I have never claimed marriage is for everyone. Your claim that I am "presuming that there's a spouse dropping from the sky for everyone" is just more of your bafflegab ... insisting I said something I never said and/or implied something I never implied ... and I have already acknowledged that "marriage is NOT for everyone" ... despite your denial that I acknowledge marriage is not for everyone.
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Sexless marriages are getting to be a new thing today. When women are able to cast off the pressure and what they feel as “duty“, they enter a whole new life, that is simply two irresistible to ever go back to. So where does this pressure, or negative resignation come from surrounding sex in a marriage (or woman’s view of sex)?
reneweddaybyday said:
37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark
Again, using your logic ... since you're still eating and drinking, do you consider yourself one of the "clueless bums the Lord Jesus warned about"?
reneweddaybyday said:
Notice the verse does not say "woe to them that are married".
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The "clueless bums the Lord Jesus warned about" were the folks who ignored the preacher of righteousness (Noah) before the flood came. Jesus was not portraying marriage in the abysmal manner you believe in.
Matthew 24:37-38
37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark
Again, using your logic ... since you're still eating and drinking, do you consider yourself one of the "clueless bums the Lord Jesus warned about"?
reneweddaybyday said:
you're so focussed on your own narrative concerning marriage that you gloss right over these words "But even if you do marry, you have not sinned; and if a virgin marries, she has not sinned".
look, Lovette, God established the marriage relationship. It is God Who fully equips both husband and wife for whatever "trouble in the flesh" comes along ... just as it is God Who fully equips a single man or woman for whatever "trouble in the flesh" comes along. God is God whether a person is married or single.
Matthew 24:19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
Notice the verse does not say "woe to them that are married".
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reneweddaybyday said:
You know more about the "human institution of marriage" compared to the very little you know about what God established for the husband and wife. smh
agree concerning singleness.
agree concerning marriage is not for everyone.
Being in a marriage with both spouses committed to the Lord is not putting oneself "back in chains".
reneweddaybyday said:
reneweddaybyday said:
That you refuse to believe what I have told you does not equal me "speaking sanctimoniously concerning marriage" ... nor does it mean I "decline to acknowledge that marriage is for all mankind". I have already acknowledged that "marriage is NOT for everyone" ... despite your denial that I acknowledge marriage is not for everyone.
reneweddaybyday said:
Lovette said:
reneweddaybyday said:
reneweddaybyday said:
... under that logic ...
since the world does not believe God created the heavens and the earth ... does that mean the big bang theory is true?
since the world does not believe the Lord Jesus Christ is Lord of all ... does that mean the Lord Jesus Christ is not Lord of all?
I worship God Who established the marriage relationship. Period.
Perhaps you have never been exposed to a solid godly marriage and that may be why you hold marriage in such disdain.
Perhaps you have never been exposed to a solid godly marriage and that may be why you hold marriage in such disdain.
your response is a clear indication that you have never been exposed to a solid godly marriage.
Would to God you would study God's Word concerning the truth of the marital relationship as opposed to the "human institution of marriage".
You know more about the "human institution of marriage" compared to the very little you know about what God established for the husband and wife. smh
My relationship with my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ is well tended to, Lovette. And, believe it or not, my husband had a very fine, strong relationship with the Lord ... even while gasp married!!!
disagree concerning "no divorce under any circumstance".
agree concerning singleness.
agree concerning marriage is not for everyone.
A husband can be yoked to the Lord Jesus Christ ... a wife can be yoked to the Lord Jesus Christ ... and both can serve the Lord Jesus Christ as God has intended in His Word.
Being in a marriage with both spouses committed to the Lord is not putting oneself "back in chains".
reneweddaybyday said:
I did not compare your idea of "modern marriage to Mary and Joseph's". I said that the pharisees accused Jesus of having been born of fornication when it is clear that Mary and Joseph were married. Matthew 1:19 tells us Joseph was the husband of Mary.
And God tells us in 1 Peter 2:13-17 that we are to "Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake" ... so long as the ordinance of man is not in conflict with God's Word.
reneweddaybyday said:
You are speaking "sociologically" concerning marriage and I am speaking "biblically" concerning marriage. When you mix mans wisdom in with God's wisdom, you no longer have God's wisdom. You should get a clue what the marriage relationship can be when both husband and wife are committed first to God and then to each other. I never denied that there are ups and downs in a marriage ... the peaks and valleys we all go through whether we are married or not.
I am speaking truth concerning marriage.
That you refuse to believe what I have told you does not equal me "speaking sanctimoniously concerning marriage" ... nor does it mean I "decline to acknowledge that marriage is for all mankind". I have already acknowledged that "marriage is NOT for everyone" ... despite your denial that I acknowledge marriage is not for everyone.
reneweddaybyday said:
I do not worship marriage in and of itself. I respect the marriage God established for man and woman.
That satan has duped folks into what you believe concerning marriage is a tragedy.
That satan has duped folks into what you believe concerning marriage is a tragedy.
Speaking the truth of God's Word concerning marriage is not an "obsession with marriage" ... it is an "obsession with" the truth of God's Word ... "despite your denial".
Lovette said:
You're preaching a prosperity gospel.
reneweddaybyday said:
Nope, I'm talking about the marriage relationship established by God.
Nope, I'm still talking about the marriage relationship established by God ... which you deny. You are so dead set against marriage that you cannot even submit to the truth of God's Word concerning the relationship He established. Is marriage for everyone? No. Can marriage be a blessing to both spouses? Yes.
reneweddaybyday said:
No one is denying we live in a sinful and broken world ... that the world has not only "infinitesimally deviated" from God's original design, the world has collosally deviated from God's original design.
... under that logic ...since the world does not believe God created the heavens and the earth ... does that mean the big bang theory is true?
since the world does not believe the Lord Jesus Christ is Lord of all ... does that mean the Lord Jesus Christ is not Lord of all?
All your attempts to infer that the Lord Jesus Christ "portrayed marriage in a negative way", have miserably failed.
reneweddaybyday said:
Genesis 2:10 And a river went out of Eden to water the garden; and from thence it was parted, and became into four heads.
There was a river which flowed out of Eden which eventually became the head of four rivers. One of the rivers was the Euphrates.
I believe Eden was "the example and shadow of heavenly things", just as the tabernacle in the wilderness was "the example and shadow of heavenly things".
I also know that the 'man' made in "our image, after our likeness" was Adam.
I also know that all descendants of Adam and Eve were begotten after the likeness and image of their parents. Until new heaven/new earth, we "see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face:now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known" (1 Corinthians 13:12).
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Do you believe there is a Euphrates river in heaven?
ok ... I do not believe the Euphrates is depicted in heaven.
Genesis 2:10 And a river went out of Eden to water the garden; and from thence it was parted, and became into four heads.
There was a river which flowed out of Eden which eventually became the head of four rivers. One of the rivers was the Euphrates.
I believe Eden was "the example and shadow of heavenly things", just as the tabernacle in the wilderness was "the example and shadow of heavenly things".
I am not "terrified" of anything God has revealed to us ... I stand in awe with utmost reverence and respect for God. We are unable to comprehend God's pure and unblemished Holiness. There are no words we could use to describe Him and if we try, our words utterly fail at encompassing God's true magnificence.
I know who the 'us' and 'our' is in Genesis 1:26.
I also know that the 'man' made in "our image, after our likeness" was Adam.
I also know that all descendants of Adam and Eve were begotten after the likeness and image of their parents. Until new heaven/new earth, we "see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face:now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known" (1 Corinthians 13:12).
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I'm seriously asking you to drop the narrative, if you truly agree marriage is NOT for everyone, no matter how hard it is for you to imagine.
The only deception is your idolatry of marriage. Yes, God ordained marriage, which Satan perverted, and Jesus acknowledged that - "in the beginning it was not so." What you don't understand is that his became flesh to die for our sins, not to get us married.
God's truth is also taught in Matt. 19:11-12, from the mouth of God itself. Marriage is not for everyone, and that should be taken as an honor, a gift.
God's truth is also taught in Matt. 19:11-12, from the mouth of God itself. Marriage is not for everyone, and that should be taken as an honor, a gift.
The only relationship God intends and guarantees is a relationship with Himself through Lord Jesus. No other human relationship is promised.
You're deriding the OP's thread. And you still don't understand the difference between the idolatry of marriage and marriage itself. God established all kinds of blessings, including marriage relationship, but they're not for everyone. The question is, do you worship God for himself or what he has to offer? Do you worship the Creator or his creations? You say you worship God, I don't believe you, because you keep identifying him as the one who "established marriage", you can only know him through your idol. I'm not upset, I'm glad you enjoy it, but plz keep your idol to yourself.so now you've appointed yourself as the one who can tell folks what can or cannot be discussed in the forum?
and fyi ... I'm not "lecturing" you or anybody else. You are in such a snit over a post I submitted that you cannot let go long enough to comprehend that God established a relationship which you want no part of ... and anyone who is (or was as in my case) in a blessed God established relationship can't say anything about it lest we upset Lovette (who's not interested anyway).
Again I don't believe you, as long as you only identify God by "blessed relationship". This is like only loving your husband for his house and bank accounts. I thank him just for who he is, for his glory, for every breath I take and every day I get to live serving him.
Is every boy born and destined to be a husband? Is every girl born and destined to be a wife? Yes or no? Marriage is not for everyone, you still don't understand the difference between the idolatry of marriage and marriage itself. God established all kinds of blessings, including marriage relationship, but they're not for everyone.
Then why do you keep blabbering on the narrative of marriage, even though it's not for everyone? Don't you know that Paul, Timothy, John and the Lord himself never married? Are you holier than all of them?
I'm only as clueless as the Lord himself who ate and drank with his disciples. Can you fast when the bridegroom is present?
No he doesn't, Paul taught the opposite, he wants his followers to serve "without care", marriage is for those who lack the spiritual fruit of self control, and the consequence is theirs to bear.
Notice what the OP does say, "be fruitful and multiply'.
I've been exposed enough to your idolatry of marriage. The only solid godly marriage is between God's only son and his church. And human marriage is corruptible on the other hand.
The truth of that is God's eternal bond between Lord Jesus and his church, anything else is a poor imitation. Do you understand the marriage with Jesus? As his bride? I don't think you do, 'cause Lord Jesus doesn't seem enough to you, his death of the cross doesn't seem enough to you, you have to seek validation from a husband, and you couldn't shut up about it.
So is my relationship with him. He shed his precious blood to wash away my sins, I don't need a virgin's precious blood added on to that.
That's the word of God, explicitly stated.
Now to the married I command, yet not I but the Lord: A wife is not to depart from her husband. But even if she does depart, let her remain unmarried or be reconciled to her husband. And a husband is not to divorce his wife. (1. Cor. 7:10-11)
You don't know if both spouses are committed to the Lord, that's just your wishful thinking. You can only commit yourself to the Lord, salvation is not and cannot be forced upon.
What if when it is in conflict with God's word? Concerning the same sex marriage ruling?
You're speaking of a false idol.
As long as you're harping on "godly marriage" among "equally yoked Christians", you're asserting that as the only true acceptable form of marriage; all other forms of marriage, in other countries and cultures, are essentially a fraud, a failure.
The truth of God's Word is that celibacy is a gift, "he who does not give in marriage does BETTER," 1 Cor. 7:38.
There's no promise of a "spouse" from God in the first place. I ask you again, if you never had the opportunity to meet anybody, while everybody else around you seem to have their luck, would you still worship God? Do you worship God FOR his blessing - or do you worship him DESPITE the lack of his blessing?
I submit to God just as I am and the life I've been living in as a testimony of His truth. Hoever anybody else lives is not of my business.
Is the world involved in marriage? Does the government, which doesn't believe in either Lord Jesus Christ, Creation or God's original design for marriage, still have the power to issue marriage certificate? Did you use the world's service to find a husband, host wedding and enjoy other benefits?
since the world does not believe God created the heavens and the earth ... does that mean the big bang theory is true?
since the world does not believe the Lord Jesus Christ is Lord of all ... does that mean the Lord Jesus Christ is not Lord of all?
Only as negative as the Sadducees' ridiculous hypothesis. You're thinking just like them, you're holding onto things of this world, you have no faith in resurrection, where there's no marriage.
And you still don't understand the difference between idolatry of marriage and marriage itself.
From the pit of hell. Such an attitude is deeply destructive to a marriage.
Let me put this straight - God's truth concerning marriage is simple, married stay married, singles stay single, 1 Cor. 7:26-27, "I suppose therefore that this is good because of the present distress—that it is good for a man to remain as he is: Are you bound to a wife? Do not seek to be loosed. Are you loosed from a wife? Do not seek a wife. " If you're already married when you get baptized in the name of the Holy Trinity, good for you, stay as you are; however, if you get baptized, you get married to the Lord. You marry another, you betray the Lord, you make a statement that the Lord is not enough, you need another to satisfy you; His grace is not sufficient, you need other's validation. Paul may spare such infidelity, but the consequence is the sinner's to bear.reneweddaybyday said:
I worship God Who established the marriage relationship. Period.Perhaps you have never been exposed to a solid godly marriage and that may be why you hold marriage in such disdain.
your response is a clear indication that you have never been exposed to a solid godly marriage.
Would to God you would study God's Word concerning the truth of the marital relationship as opposed to the "human institution of marriage".
You know more about the "human institution of marriage" compared to the very little you know about what God established for the husband and wife. smh
My relationship with my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ is well tended to, Lovette. And, believe it or not, my husband had a very fine, strong relationship with the Lord ... even while gasp married!!!
disagree concerning "no divorce under any circumstance".
agree concerning singleness.
agree concerning marriage is not for everyone.
A husband can be yoked to the Lord Jesus Christ ... a wife can be yoked to the Lord Jesus Christ ... and both can serve the Lord Jesus Christ as God has intended in His Word.
Being in a marriage with both spouses committed to the Lord is not putting oneself "back in chains".
reneweddaybyday said:
I did not compare your idea of "modern marriage to Mary and Joseph's". I said that the pharisees accused Jesus of having been born of fornication when it is clear that Mary and Joseph were married. Matthew 1:19 tells us Joseph was the husband of Mary.
And God tells us in 1 Peter 2:13-17 that we are to "Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake" ... so long as the ordinance of man is not in conflict with God's Word.
reneweddaybyday said:
You are speaking "sociologically" concerning marriage and I am speaking "biblically" concerning marriage. When you mix mans wisdom in with God's wisdom, you no longer have God's wisdom. You should get a clue what the marriage relationship can be when both husband and wife are committed first to God and then to each other. I never denied that there are ups and downs in a marriage ... the peaks and valleys we all go through whether we are married or not.
I am speaking truth concerning marriage.
That you refuse to believe what I have told you does not equal me "speaking sanctimoniously concerning marriage" ... nor does it mean I "decline to acknowledge that marriage is for all mankind". I have already acknowledged that "marriage is NOT for everyone" ... despite your denial that I acknowledge marriage is not for everyone.
reneweddaybyday said:
I do not worship marriage in and of itself. I respect the marriage God established for man and woman.That satan has duped folks into what you believe concerning marriage is a tragedy.
Speaking the truth of God's Word concerning marriage is not an "obsession with marriage" ... it is an "obsession with" the truth of God's Word ... "despite your denial".
Lovette said:
You're preaching a prosperity gospel.
reneweddaybyday said:
Nope, I'm talking about the marriage relationship established by God.
Nope, I'm still talking about the marriage relationship established by God ... which you deny. You are so dead set against marriage that you cannot even submit to the truth of God's Word concerning the relationship He established. Is marriage for everyone? No. Can marriage be a blessing to both spouses? Yes.
reneweddaybyday said:
No one is denying we live in a sinful and broken world ... that the world has not only "infinitesimally deviated" from God's original design, the world has collosally deviated from God's original design.
since the world does not believe God created the heavens and the earth ... does that mean the big bang theory is true?
since the world does not believe the Lord Jesus Christ is Lord of all ... does that mean the Lord Jesus Christ is not Lord of all?
All your attempts to infer that the Lord Jesus Christ "portrayed marriage in a negative way", have miserably failed.
The husband of one wife and believing children. Sounds like marriage is a requirement.
Depends on your definition of sex. If it's the traditional one, that only emcompasses the penetrative kind, then the right attitude shall be subjected to the woman's monthly cycle, limit it to the ovulating week, about two weeks after period. It is prescribed in Lev. 15:19, 28, "uncleanness" therein literally means "unfit", in that context, unfit for sexual intercourse (Lev. 18:19). After the two weeks of uncleanness, there was a tradition of "customary purification", a relaxing bath known as "mikvah", then it's good to preceed in bed.
Then you're implying Paul, Timothy, and all single priests and pastors are frauds. If that's a requirement, why didn't Paul himself meet that? Why didn't Timothy? All we know is that he was a young man whom Paul circumcised, and he followed his ministry ever since, no marriage.
And don't tell me that they were just mouthpieces of God. The single group Jesus hated the most, more than the soldiers who whipped him and crucified him, was the hypocrites who imposed the law and all "requirements" only on others but not themselves.
No. Women are susceptible to this attitude (spirit) and if they’re not careful, the serpent could lie to them again, causing them to feel as a doormat, and tail at God for letting the man rule over her. Her only control is playing on the man’s weakness - his desire for sex.
Paul said that is to prevent polygamy men become deacon, elders.
Common practice in church today, divorced men shouldn't be church leaders. They can teach, but can't be deacon, nor elders.
That "attitude" is the natural way to live as God intended, instructed in the Torah, and it's backed by science, two weeks after period is the most fertile and desirable time in a woman's monthly cycle, even I as a man knows that. Every animal has a mating cycle, so does human, although it's a monthly cycle rather than yearly.