2 Kinds Of Faith
- Thread starter GracethroughfaithinChrist
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Wow, that's good stuff there VCO. i can't tell you how many times, no matter how we say it,....... Born again, saved by Grace, we received the Promise, have the Holy Spirit, it somehow don't get through to people and still many can't understand and almost never believe our report. i struggle with relaying this great message that God still saves and sends the Holy Spirit into men's hearts through faith in Jesus Christ and repentance.
I woke up dancing, anointed with the Holy Spirit after putting a gun in my mouth the night before receiving this Wonderful free Gift and almost had given up then; then God in His great mercy forgave me, anointed me,put His Word in my heart, lit a path before me, and my life has been blessed ever since. How many times has it crossed our mind that we say if i was lying about having received the Holy Spirit i would be guilty of blasphemy and have my name removed from the book of life, who is going to do that? Since declaring this great news we haven't receive any favor from men but are instead treated like a simpleton, an over zealous and uneducated person, or treated like a crazy person? No big mystery to me that it's easier for men to label us that way then to rethink what they have been taught.
I woke up dancing, anointed with the Holy Spirit after putting a gun in my mouth the night before receiving this Wonderful free Gift and almost had given up then; then God in His great mercy forgave me, anointed me,put His Word in my heart, lit a path before me, and my life has been blessed ever since. How many times has it crossed our mind that we say if i was lying about having received the Holy Spirit i would be guilty of blasphemy and have my name removed from the book of life, who is going to do that? Since declaring this great news we haven't receive any favor from men but are instead treated like a simpleton, an over zealous and uneducated person, or treated like a crazy person? No big mystery to me that it's easier for men to label us that way then to rethink what they have been taught.
You are using the English definition of the Word "Believeth".
Try using the Jewish Definition of the word, since the Apostles were all Jews and NOT English Gentlemen, it is for sure the Jewish Definition that they used. That is NOT just simple acknowledgement of facts.
BUT RATHER the Jewish Definition of the word "Believeth" involves believing with all your heart, all your mind, and all your Soul, SO DEEPLY that you are willing to put your entire weight, submission to, and Trust upon what you claim to believe.
"Sola fide emphasizes salvation as a free gift. The Roman Catholic Church of the time emphasized the use of indulgences (donating money) to buy status with God. Good works, including baptism, were seen as required for salvation. Sola fide stated that salvation is a free gift to all who accept it by faith (John 3:16). Salvation is not based on human effort or good deeds (Ephesians 2:9)."
http://www.gotquestions.org/five-solas.html
http://www.gotquestions.org/five-solas.html
Wow, how similar are our testimonies. Two of the three time I attempted suicide, I had my pistol against my head with the trigger half pulled, when an overwhelming TERROR swept over me. Not terror that I was going to die, I really wanted to die, but rather ULTRA TERROR of the FACT that Hell was for REAL AND IT WAS FOREVER.
The third night, I got drunk as I could without passing out, and tried to arrange a fatal motorcycle accident for myself. I knew where there was a FRESHLY poured Gravel Road, with very thick gravel. I am totally ashamed of what I said to GOD that night. With my helmet off, leaning out over the handle bars so that I would hit head first, I taunted GOD, saying: "If You want me, You can take me anywhere You want on this mile." I hit that mile on my dirt bike with the throttle wide open (65 mph) on that loose gravel, AND THE BIKE DID NOT EVEN WOBBLE THE ENTIRE MILE. I went home sobered up thinking about what happened, and at about 5 AM, it hit me, I CANNOT RIDE A BIKE LIKE THAT EVEN SOBER AND I WAS TOTALLY DRUNK. THEN something inside of me broke, (I think it was the pride of running my own life my own way); and I found myself on my knees weeping and crying huge tears, crying out to HIM, "LORD forgive me, if you have a purpose for my life, you are going to have to come into it and run my life, because I CAN'T DO IT. I am making a total mess of it!" I knew I was surrendering complete control to HIM, and NO ONE IN THE CHURCH I ATTENDED EVER TOLD ME TO PRAY LIKE THAT. I believe the Holy Spirit gave it to me, when I needed it MOST.
The third night, I got drunk as I could without passing out, and tried to arrange a fatal motorcycle accident for myself. I knew where there was a FRESHLY poured Gravel Road, with very thick gravel. I am totally ashamed of what I said to GOD that night. With my helmet off, leaning out over the handle bars so that I would hit head first, I taunted GOD, saying: "If You want me, You can take me anywhere You want on this mile." I hit that mile on my dirt bike with the throttle wide open (65 mph) on that loose gravel, AND THE BIKE DID NOT EVEN WOBBLE THE ENTIRE MILE. I went home sobered up thinking about what happened, and at about 5 AM, it hit me, I CANNOT RIDE A BIKE LIKE THAT EVEN SOBER AND I WAS TOTALLY DRUNK. THEN something inside of me broke, (I think it was the pride of running my own life my own way); and I found myself on my knees weeping and crying huge tears, crying out to HIM, "LORD forgive me, if you have a purpose for my life, you are going to have to come into it and run my life, because I CAN'T DO IT. I am making a total mess of it!" I knew I was surrendering complete control to HIM, and NO ONE IN THE CHURCH I ATTENDED EVER TOLD ME TO PRAY LIKE THAT. I believe the Holy Spirit gave it to me, when I needed it MOST.
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Amen brother, Praise be to God our Father and Jesus Christ!...... i'm very grateful that He saved you by His Grace and mercy ,that the gun didn't fire on those attempts, and also that you didn't die on your bike that shameful night, and that God led you into repentance and surrender to Him. You have a powerful testimony brother VCO, thank you very much for sharing this with us brother VCO and all glory to be to God.
There is a little more to it, that I hesitate to tell, because some make fun of it.
Right after I surrendered to HIM, I fell on my face still weeping, and I had a vision or maybe it was a dream, but it seemed too vivid for a dream. I was kneeling at the cross looking up at Him, crying out: "Forgive me, Forgive me!" I knew that every sin that I ever committed, was like putting another one pound weight on Him, pulling down all the more on those nails to through his wrists. The Jews consider the wrists to be part of the hands, but I did not know that at that time; yet the nails were in His wrists. Through my tears of mourning over my utter sinfulness, I saw some blood fall from each wrist. It splashed on each of my forearms, and I could feel the warmth of the blood. I KNEW BEYOND A SHADOW OF A DOUBT THAT MEANT I WAS FORGIVEN. I laid there still sobbing, but not as hard as before, until I fell asleep. Sometime about an hour after I fell asleep on that floor, I got up and went to bed.
I knew He was going to do something with my life, but I did not know that I had to get into the Word to get the spiritual growth part rolling. About six months later, still TRUSTING WITHOUT A DOUBT that the Lord was going to do something with my life, I had my headset radio on at work, listening to my Country and Western Channel, and suddenly I could not STAND to hear one more "somebody done somebody wrong song"; so I changed the Channel. It was a nasty divorce after only six months of marriage that drove me to the three attempts at suicide. Anyhow, I changed the channel and landed on the Christian Radio Station that I did not know existed, just as Dr. John MacArthur was starting a 72 night, verse by verse study of Revelation. I was HOOKED for life on good Bible Teaching.
Did HE ever use me? OH YES, BIG TIME. As I got grounded in the Word by the teachings of Dr. John MacArthur and Chuck Swindoll, and Dr. Ed Young on TV, and later Dr. Richard LEE, Dr. Adrian Rodgers, Dr. Ben Haden, Dr. Gil Rugh, Dr. Zola Levitt, and a couple others; I would occasionally try to witness to co-workers. Then one night after the latest rejection, a thought flashed through my head, "It is finished, move West." I could not shake the feeling that GOD wanted me to move WEST. Through a series of minor miracles with financing, and a job opening that was not supposed to be there, I ended up accepting a Job and we moved to Susanville, California, 90 miles NW of Reno. OH YES, God had brought me my soul mate, and we were introduced by a mutual friend, and were married about a five years when we moved to California, and we have been married over 35 years now.
What kind of miracle with financing, got us to Susanville, CA. The Night I told the guy on the phone that I would take the job and be there in two weeks, I knew we did not have the money to move. I put my 2 year old car up for sale in the paper and on the radio's Swap Shop, but 12 days later NOT ONE PERSON HAD INQUIRED ABOUT IT. My plan was to sell the car and lease a new one to drive to California from Nebraska. We had to LEAVE on Monday Morning, and I had NO OFFERS on the Car by Saturday night. That night a Neighbor was pounding on my door after midnight, to tell me that a drunk teenager was spinning kitties in the loose gravel besides my parked car and lost control and totaled my Nissan. I got more out of insurance than I had it advertised in the paper for. I paid off the car, leased a new one, drove to California, paid utility deposits, first and last month's rent, and had $90 left over for groceries, until my first paycheck came in. I THINK GOD SERIOUSLY WANTED ME IN CALIFORNIA.
Why Susanville? It was there at a men's Prayer breakfast, I was invited to get involved in the Match Two Prison Ministry, and I could not refuse. Two years later that thought came back, "It is finished, move West". YET AGAIN, through some minor miracles the door opened to move to Crescent City, where we attended Ft. Dick Bible Church about a mile from where Pelican Bay State Prison was being built. As soon as I heard they had hired a Protestant Chaplain, I Volunteered to help him. He showed me a letter where the Governor had refused to let him hire an Assistant Chaplain, telling him he had to learn to depend on Community Volunteers. I was the first Volunteer Chaplain to Minister in the Security Housing Unit (the Hole) that housed 1500 of the most violent inmates in the State of California. I worked as a Volunteer Chaplain there for 9 years and then moved back to Susanville, where I was a Volunteer Chaplain for 6 more years at High Desert State Prison, another super max prison, before retiring and moving close to grand-kids. Did I lead lots of them to the Lord? NO, but I learned to rejoice over the Few.
Right after I surrendered to HIM, I fell on my face still weeping, and I had a vision or maybe it was a dream, but it seemed too vivid for a dream. I was kneeling at the cross looking up at Him, crying out: "Forgive me, Forgive me!" I knew that every sin that I ever committed, was like putting another one pound weight on Him, pulling down all the more on those nails to through his wrists. The Jews consider the wrists to be part of the hands, but I did not know that at that time; yet the nails were in His wrists. Through my tears of mourning over my utter sinfulness, I saw some blood fall from each wrist. It splashed on each of my forearms, and I could feel the warmth of the blood. I KNEW BEYOND A SHADOW OF A DOUBT THAT MEANT I WAS FORGIVEN. I laid there still sobbing, but not as hard as before, until I fell asleep. Sometime about an hour after I fell asleep on that floor, I got up and went to bed.
I knew He was going to do something with my life, but I did not know that I had to get into the Word to get the spiritual growth part rolling. About six months later, still TRUSTING WITHOUT A DOUBT that the Lord was going to do something with my life, I had my headset radio on at work, listening to my Country and Western Channel, and suddenly I could not STAND to hear one more "somebody done somebody wrong song"; so I changed the Channel. It was a nasty divorce after only six months of marriage that drove me to the three attempts at suicide. Anyhow, I changed the channel and landed on the Christian Radio Station that I did not know existed, just as Dr. John MacArthur was starting a 72 night, verse by verse study of Revelation. I was HOOKED for life on good Bible Teaching.
Did HE ever use me? OH YES, BIG TIME. As I got grounded in the Word by the teachings of Dr. John MacArthur and Chuck Swindoll, and Dr. Ed Young on TV, and later Dr. Richard LEE, Dr. Adrian Rodgers, Dr. Ben Haden, Dr. Gil Rugh, Dr. Zola Levitt, and a couple others; I would occasionally try to witness to co-workers. Then one night after the latest rejection, a thought flashed through my head, "It is finished, move West." I could not shake the feeling that GOD wanted me to move WEST. Through a series of minor miracles with financing, and a job opening that was not supposed to be there, I ended up accepting a Job and we moved to Susanville, California, 90 miles NW of Reno. OH YES, God had brought me my soul mate, and we were introduced by a mutual friend, and were married about a five years when we moved to California, and we have been married over 35 years now.
What kind of miracle with financing, got us to Susanville, CA. The Night I told the guy on the phone that I would take the job and be there in two weeks, I knew we did not have the money to move. I put my 2 year old car up for sale in the paper and on the radio's Swap Shop, but 12 days later NOT ONE PERSON HAD INQUIRED ABOUT IT. My plan was to sell the car and lease a new one to drive to California from Nebraska. We had to LEAVE on Monday Morning, and I had NO OFFERS on the Car by Saturday night. That night a Neighbor was pounding on my door after midnight, to tell me that a drunk teenager was spinning kitties in the loose gravel besides my parked car and lost control and totaled my Nissan. I got more out of insurance than I had it advertised in the paper for. I paid off the car, leased a new one, drove to California, paid utility deposits, first and last month's rent, and had $90 left over for groceries, until my first paycheck came in. I THINK GOD SERIOUSLY WANTED ME IN CALIFORNIA.
Why Susanville? It was there at a men's Prayer breakfast, I was invited to get involved in the Match Two Prison Ministry, and I could not refuse. Two years later that thought came back, "It is finished, move West". YET AGAIN, through some minor miracles the door opened to move to Crescent City, where we attended Ft. Dick Bible Church about a mile from where Pelican Bay State Prison was being built. As soon as I heard they had hired a Protestant Chaplain, I Volunteered to help him. He showed me a letter where the Governor had refused to let him hire an Assistant Chaplain, telling him he had to learn to depend on Community Volunteers. I was the first Volunteer Chaplain to Minister in the Security Housing Unit (the Hole) that housed 1500 of the most violent inmates in the State of California. I worked as a Volunteer Chaplain there for 9 years and then moved back to Susanville, where I was a Volunteer Chaplain for 6 more years at High Desert State Prison, another super max prison, before retiring and moving close to grand-kids. Did I lead lots of them to the Lord? NO, but I learned to rejoice over the Few.
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1) I am not Catholic. One cannot buy or earn God's grace but receive God's grace and receiving God's grace means accepting the conditions God has put upon His grace....those conditions being belief, Jn 8:24; repentance, Lk 13:3,5; confession, Mt 10:32,33; baptism Mk 16:16.
2) salvation is not by faith only for Eph 2:8 shows it takes BOTH God's grace and man's faith and not faith only to be saved
3) God's grace is not unconditional else everyone would be saved but is conditional upon man's obedience, Heb 5:9
4) baptism is not just a good work but an obedient work. God commanded baptism therefore being baptized is working God's righteousness (Acts 10:35) and necessary to have sins remitted (Acts 2:38). God commanding baptism makes it necessary if for no other reason.
5) "not of works" of Eph 5:9 refer to works of merit and not obedience to God (Heb 5:9) or the good works a Christian is required to do (Eph 2:10) to maintain salvation.
As to these statements of yours above see post #74 where i clearly stated;
That's why i put that out here about sola fide,....... it was just for you Seabass, to bring clarity on the "faith alone" thing, it's another biblical based sola that came from the time of Reformation (but still applicable now, however faith without works is dead, "Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance", get it?) and was related to "the alignment of new evangelicals with apostasy". A meatier topic if you will, but it was not about faith vs works, as that particular thread had more to do with biblical inerrancy, the "Chicago Statement on Biblical Inerrancy", the RCC's influence in changing faith to a living faith and how that has influenced major changes in Western Christianity.
You blindly picked through Richard's statements without any clue as to what the thread was about (just like you have attempted to do here and on several other threads at CC,why you haven't been banned here yet?, escapes my understanding ) and it really shows like today, that you do not produce fruits of the Spirit like brotherly love and patience, but instead you bare constant briars and thorns, showing to all here the spirit of division and of error . What a miserable state to be in, it isn't easy kicking against the pricks eh Seabass?
That's why i put that out here about sola fide,....... it was just for you Seabass, to bring clarity on the "faith alone" thing, it's another biblical based sola that came from the time of Reformation (but still applicable now, however faith without works is dead, "Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance", get it?) and was related to "the alignment of new evangelicals with apostasy". A meatier topic if you will, but it was not about faith vs works, as that particular thread had more to do with biblical inerrancy, the "Chicago Statement on Biblical Inerrancy", the RCC's influence in changing faith to a living faith and how that has influenced major changes in Western Christianity.
You blindly picked through Richard's statements without any clue as to what the thread was about (just like you have attempted to do here and on several other threads at CC,why you haven't been banned here yet?, escapes my understanding ) and it really shows like today, that you do not produce fruits of the Spirit like brotherly love and patience, but instead you bare constant briars and thorns, showing to all here the spirit of division and of error . What a miserable state to be in, it isn't easy kicking against the pricks eh Seabass?
I looked through the former posts for Romans 10:12-17 (KJV)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
[SUP]13 [/SUP] For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
[SUP]14 [/SUP] How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
[SUP]15 [/SUP] And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!
[SUP]16 [/SUP] But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
[SUP]17 [/SUP] So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
There is only one particular faith God is looking for. Whatever man says it is will by necessity match up to what God says it is, or it is not faith that pleases God. I will not equate acceptable faith as in sitting into a rocking chair believing it will support me. That is natural "faith" such chairs will support a human. It is really knowledge coupled with some logic plus reason, not true gospel 'faith'.
Whatever else is regarded as a manifestation of faith pleasing to God is spiritually invalid with God.
Once satisfying God with appropriate faith, a Christian ought to expect works of righteousness to follow, proving he has the acceptable faith. The acceptable works must verify righteousness of Christ, matching up with the works of Christ and the apostles. Then we of acceptable faith will be found to perform even greater works of righteousness than they.
In no manner may any work of man-approved righteousness pass off as qualification of being righteous in Christ. Salvation in Christ must be evidenced by expected works of HIS righteousness, or greater.
There remains only one faith that matters.
As for John's baptism, that pointed to the eternal baptism John said must come from Jesus, the Christ. John's water baptism was but a sign of the better to come from Jesus. His was pre-New Covenant. Once the New came, the old passed away. Seek only that Spirit baptism of Christ. It is the only baptism accepted by God.
[SUP]12 [/SUP] For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
[SUP]13 [/SUP] For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
[SUP]14 [/SUP] How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
[SUP]15 [/SUP] And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!
[SUP]16 [/SUP] But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
[SUP]17 [/SUP] So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
There is only one particular faith God is looking for. Whatever man says it is will by necessity match up to what God says it is, or it is not faith that pleases God. I will not equate acceptable faith as in sitting into a rocking chair believing it will support me. That is natural "faith" such chairs will support a human. It is really knowledge coupled with some logic plus reason, not true gospel 'faith'.
Whatever else is regarded as a manifestation of faith pleasing to God is spiritually invalid with God.
Once satisfying God with appropriate faith, a Christian ought to expect works of righteousness to follow, proving he has the acceptable faith. The acceptable works must verify righteousness of Christ, matching up with the works of Christ and the apostles. Then we of acceptable faith will be found to perform even greater works of righteousness than they.
In no manner may any work of man-approved righteousness pass off as qualification of being righteous in Christ. Salvation in Christ must be evidenced by expected works of HIS righteousness, or greater.
There remains only one faith that matters.
As for John's baptism, that pointed to the eternal baptism John said must come from Jesus, the Christ. John's water baptism was but a sign of the better to come from Jesus. His was pre-New Covenant. Once the New came, the old passed away. Seek only that Spirit baptism of Christ. It is the only baptism accepted by God.
