Busted: "Sinless" Perfectionists Debunked

[Elin]

I do have a vague memory of once coming here, to discuss the Bible. Something like that.

Good luck with that. . .

 

[Elin]

Heavens no! You have to say something relevant that can be perceived as a view on the subject matter, before you can hope to offend. I'm just getting bored. That's all. Try saying something nasty about my mother.

You're hopeless! . . .

 

[JesusIsAll]

Good luck with that. . .

It was just some fantasy I quickly shrugged off, especially on spying "Who Killed Goliath?"

 

[JesusIsAll]

You're hopeless! . . .

That's what people say, one of the reasons I'm so optimistic!

 

[Elin]

I cant type im laughing too hard

That's what he does to me too!

 

[ember]

The sincere believer is the greatest threat, truth on many levels a threat to the house of cards they live in. Just people who can stand on their own two feet, who evaluate and make their own decisions, are a threat, regardless religious convictions. Those with a lot of inner fear are scared of those who don't share that weakness. I remember once reading an essay about solitude, that mentioned the Lord Jesus and others being hated for being such a threat among the fearful and weak, that people can't stand somebody who is outside the comfort of the herd, to the extent they'd like to purge, kill the nonconformists, whose very strength is terrifying to them.

yup...that's where I was going

I am a noncomformist and a 'why' person...I don't hide and I am not fearful...so that can really rub some the wrong way

 

[ember]

ps...I have been laughing at the yo mamma jokes..

 

[JesusIsAll]

That's what he does to me too!

Mercy! Be's remindin me! Figgerin you know'd Elduh Floyd got big head, bein 144,000 'n all. Thing be, Elduh Floyd also gettin big rear, mercy! Ever sints ah git King James Bible, Floyd ain't hearin me. As uzual, he show'd up liken ta bad pennee, all wayz rite 'bout time yoo thinkin may be's normal day.

Ah runs inta him et da Mini Mart, gettin me sum Gummi Worm. I's tellin him he need stop ettin whole box 'o them wide yellow stripe, 20% mo free jumbo Snicker bar 'fore lunch, else needin mo changin New Wurld Tranzlayshun to be sayin 144,001 chozen few, Floyd lookin liken big as two! I wuz also insistin no place, nowhere, nohow King James Bible says gate ta heaven be widen, case Floyd gits mind ta havin Watchtower Gran Panjandrum git dis wide gate writ in New Wurld. (Dats "nippin it in da crud," as sayin goez, iffin yoo wunder.) I also says he needs be stoppin bedtime snackins, stop sayin, "Oh me! I jus be's sooo tired! Time to et famlee size bag ripple chip, wit 2 leeter root beer." Try ta be tellin Floyd yoo go sleep when tired, hain't no signal ta emptee Mini Mart Lays dizplay!

Now, dis time I pays fer mah Gummi Worm, checkin mah shoo lase 'n gits all set, 'fore tellin Elduh Floyd, fer hiz own good, he ain't got no King James Bible, 'n he one clog artree from havin barberque chip in hell, dat der will be no gallon Rockee Roads ice creem 'fore soul sleepin, no sireee! Elduh Floyd gits all red in face 'n ah jus takes off, gits half block ways down hard road pert near sure, 'fore Elduh Floyd reackted liken ta Pentecostal unda LSD infloooense, wich I dint want ta be seein dis here day, wantin ta hav me sum Gummi Worm in peece. Hope da Mini Mart got insurrense.

 

[Sirk]

It all comes down to their god is a stupid god. You have to conclude this. All the scripture of the Lord chastising His children would be beyond silly, if there were those He knows are just going to be tossed into the lake of fire. Their god is not omniscient or omnipotent, is really rather of an impotent klutz as they describe, that wastes his time, with watered-down blood of the cross and a very flawed, iffy plan one can't trust, an Indian giver of gifts, breaker of promises, one must suppose their explanation of the time wasting chastising that somebody eternal has much time to waste? Disowns children? Is putting on some show? This is as if not to mention scripture already given confirms that the Lord doesn't bother chastising the bastards, at all, in fact, does not waste effort on them. Their whole theology is lala land the Bible doesn't support, a Bible they do not understand.

Careful....you might charged with blasphemy for this post and be burned at the stake. You did say it nicer than I did however. Lol

 

[Rosesrock]

Not true. The Biblek says we are to train others in righteousness and teach them doctrine by the Word of God (See 2 Timothy 3:16).

The difference is we believe different doctrine....and again you have no authority over me in any way, thus i need never yo prove anything to you.

 

[JesusIsAll]

you might charged with blasphemy for this post

The sort of blessings one longs for. I love it when they talk dirty.

 

[Rosesrock]

The sort of blessings one longs for. I love it when they talk dirty.

Um...........

 

[JesusIsAll]

Um...........

Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.

 

[Rosesrock]

Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.

Phew that was close, i was told one was saddened because i didnt understand his doctrine. If i wasnt a believer i think i would have been hurt and confused why he was superior, but my liberty and freedom and security in the savior actually chuckled with me

 

[eternally-gratefull]

The difference is we believe different doctrine....and again you have no authority over me in any way, thus i need never yo prove anything to you.

i

it is almost funny.

They want us to prove it to them, They do not want to discuss anything. nor do we feel the need to prove anything to them

We are secure in our faith, and have no need or desire for them to try to prove they are right (they can;t tell us anything we have not heard before) yet they want to try to continue to prove it anyway.

 

[Yahshua]

Question to Jason.
Are you going to praise a man. For living a physical sin free life.
You cant read a persons mind.
They may have sins in their mind.
Violent or perverted. You know?

I just want to cut in and ask, Let's say this person does have violent and perverted thoughts but never acts on them...have they committed a sin of violence or perversion? Would God claim they're guilty of violence and perversion without the act?

Sin is a "work of evil"; an action of breaking God's law. If one doesn't do the work of evil one hasn't sinned right? Consequently, there's a difference between a temptation and a sin. James - an elder of the faith - says this...

James 1:13-15
14 But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. 15 Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.

Order of evil:
1) Temptation
2) Sin
3) Judgment (of Death)

Scripture says Christ was tempted in *all ways* like we are, yet he didn't commit sin. So that means he indeed had thoughts of violence and perversion also...but he resisted acting on them. With his strength, he never allowed those temptations to birth into sin.

So for me, yes I'm going to praise a man who finally is able to live a sin free life because he's living like Christ lived, which is what Christ expects. That man did it. And I know such is only possible because the Spirit of God and the mind of Christ must be in that man doing the work.

Thief on the cross was on his deathbed, He repented. Was he forgiven?

Well...the thief never actually repented. Rather he saw the sinless lamb ("he shouldn't be up here with us"). Remember (as you guys often remind believers on this forum) there was *nothing* that man (or we) can do to become justified in the eyes of God. Christ/God, with his mercy alone, forgave the thief. The thief didn't do anything to earn forgiveness.

Wow. talk about twisting the word of God.

In chapter 7. Paul spoke of the stuggle he was going through with the two natures waring within his soul (sorry, he had no war before he was saved, all he had was the flesh)

In chapter 8 Paul tells us how he won those battles.
Paul NEVER taught one had to keep faith to keep salvation. Most of what paul spoke of was fighting legalism (people like you) and how to sanctify ourselves in Christ, But he spent many passages (especially the first 2 chapters of ephesians) showing how SECURE WE ARE IN CHRIST.

Your legalism will not save you my friend, your putting yourself under law. And not under grace,

I would only ask, what about those devout believers for years who lose their faith one day and become atheists and also denounce Christ? Is their salvation kept?

 

[Rosesrock]

i

it is almost funny.

They want us to prove it to them, They do not want to discuss anything. nor do we feel the need to prove anything to them

We are secure in our faith, and have no need or desire for them to try to prove they are right (they can;t tell us anything we have not heard before) yet they want to try to continue to prove it anyway.

Thing is.... the proof was on the cross. Sad their faith isnt there to see thay

 

[Rosesrock]

I just want to cut in and ask, Let's say this person does have violent and perverted thoughts but never acts on them...have they committed a sin of violence or perversion? Would God claim they're guilty of violence and perversion without the act?

Sin is a "work of evil"; an action of breaking God's law. If one doesn't do the work of evil one hasn't sinned right? Consequently, there's a difference between a temptation and a sin. James - an elder of the faith - says this...

James 1:13-15
14 But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. 15 Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.

Order of evil:
1) Temptation
2) Sin
3) Judgment (of Death)

Scripture says Christ was tempted in *all ways* like we are, yet he didn't commit sin. So that means he indeed had thoughts of violence and perversion also...but he resisted acting on them. With his strength, he never allowed those temptations to birth into sin.

So for me, yes I'm going to praise a man who finally is able to live a sin free life because he's living like Christ lived, which is what Christ expects. That man did it. And I know such is only possible because the Spirit of God and the mind of Christ must be in that man doing the work.



Well...the thief never actually repented. Rather he saw the sinless lamb ("he shouldn't be up here with us"). Remember (as you guys often remind believers on this forum) there was *nothing* that man (or we) can do to become justified in the eyes of God. Christ/God, with his mercy alone, forgave the thief. The thief didn't do anything to earn forgiveness.



I would only ask, what about those devout believers for years who lose their faith one day and become atheists and also denounce Christ? Is their salvation kept?

Were they believers to begin with??? You are known by your fruit...

 

[JesusIsAll]

Phew that was close, i was told one was saddened because i didnt understand his doctrine. If i wasnt a believer i think i would have been hurt and confused why he was superior, but my liberty and freedom and security in the savior actually chuckled with me

Something I've commented on before, the even half mature believer of the gospel of scripture isn't fooled. It's much a wasted effort, if your receptive audience, if they even exist, is already lost in error. This is one big reason why I believe it's more trolling than anything else, trying to push buttons, seeking a bickerfest. Notice how they make every thread about them.

 

[Yahshua]

It all comes down to their god is a stupid god. You have to conclude this. All the scripture of the Lord chastising His children would be beyond silly, if there were those He knows are just going to be tossed into the lake of fire. Their god is not omniscient or omnipotent, is really rather of an impotent klutz as they describe, that wastes his time, with watered-down blood of the cross and a very flawed, iffy plan one can't trust, an Indian giver of gifts, breaker of promises, one must suppose their explanation of the time wasting chastising that somebody eternal has much time to waste? Disowns children? Is putting on some show? This is as if not to mention scripture already given confirms that the Lord doesn't bother chastising the bastards, at all, in fact, does not waste effort on them. Their whole theology is lala land the Bible doesn't support, a Bible they do not understand.

IDK...can't the same be said for a god that knows his adopted children are wholly incapable of ever maturing in the stature and image of his firstborn? Why chastise them at all? It's like beating on a mentally handicapped child who can never understand and whose development is forever arrested. Why worry about it at all if the goal of "doing no wrong" can never be reached? Why make them suffer if it will never affect a change? Such a god would be sadistic wouldn't you agree?

So there's a very thin middle ground here between the two extremes described.

Matthew 7:14
14"For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it.