christmas, is it the real birth of jesus?

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Oct 14, 2013
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#21
[h=3]3. Christ's age difference to John the Baptist[/h]The angel appeared unto Zacharias during his ministration to let him know his wife will bear him a son.

Luke 1:13
But the angel said unto him, Fear not, Zacharias: for thy prayer is heard; and thy wife Elisabeth shall bear thee a son, and thou shalt call his name John.

Elisabeth became pregnant after her husband Zacharias executed his term as priest. In the 6th month the Angel appeared unto Mary to also give her a message …


See luke 1 :24-38
 
Oct 14, 2013
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#22
[h=3]4. Summary[/h]Here's a summary of all materials mentioned above.

The calendar used in the Bible starts around Spring time which is in the time period of late March to early April.

Knowing when the Biblical year starts, we see how King David divided up the priests office during his time. When Zacharias became priest, he served in the stead or in the same month of Abija (or Abia - which is called in the New Testament). This month was around early July (being the late 4th month of the Bible calendar).

Mary became pregnant 6 months after John was conceived. This will make Jesus 6 months younger than John the Baptist. Six months after John was conceived will be around the time of early January (being the late 10th month in the Bible calendar).

A normal pregnancy will last for 9 months. Nine months after Jesus was conceived will be around the time of early October (being the late 7th month in the Bible calendar).

Our modern day calendar is not accurate because of so many modifications, but it gives us an idea of the time when JESUS was born, which was around early October.



 
May 3, 2013
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#23
4. Summary

Here's a summary of all materials mentioned above.

The calendar used in the Bible starts around Spring time which is in the time period of late March to early April.

Knowing when the Biblical year starts, we see how King David divided up the priests office during his time. When Zacharias became priest, he served in the stead or in the same month of Abija (or Abia - which is called in the New Testament). This month was around early July (being the late 4th month of the Bible calendar).

Mary became pregnant 6 months after John was conceived. This will make Jesus 6 months younger than John the Baptist. Six months after John was conceived will be around the time of early January (being the late 10th month in the Bible calendar).

A normal pregnancy will last for 9 months. Nine months after Jesus was conceived will be around the time of early October (being the late 7th month in the Bible calendar).

Our modern day calendar is not accurate because of so many modifications, but it gives us an idea of the time when JESUS was born, which was around early October.
Wow! Thanks!

I once made my calculations (I don´t remember where I published on blogger.com) but my result was close to September, near those days WHEAT is ready to be taken, which is close to September-October, in that area, according to my readings (I´ve never been there to confirm when it is grown).

Another FACT is Jesus was born in Bethlem (House of Bread) and I GUESS that area was used to produce WHEAT or to bake it.

Just remember His saying: I am the BREAD...

Your work gave me more to believe what I believed. Thanks!
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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#24
hello everyone, I would like to understand why does people celebrate a day as the jesus´s birth?
is it a biblical celebration or just made by human?
Since the date is not recorded in the Bible, it was just picked. The argument that they should not have that date because there was a pagan holiday on the same day, is a ridiculous argument. There have been SO MANY pagan religions though out the history of mankind that I would just about GUARANTEE you that there have been pagan holidays on all 365 days of the year.

So did they come close to the date of his birth? Again that is impossible to tell, because the main CLUE in Scripture involve what the weather was like that year. What Clue? The shepherds were guarding their flocks in the fields. When it started snowing they out of necessity moved their flocks to corals for the Winter. Oh you didn't know it snowed in Bethleham?

Jerusalem Snowfall Heaviest in 50 Years
israel today | Israel News - Stay Informed, Pray Informed

Jerusalem is at 2,474 ft. feet above Sea Level. Bethleham is at 2,543 ft. above sea level.

What are the chances of a global white Christmas? | MNN - Mother Nature Network
http://www.travelujah.com/blogs/entry/Let-it-snow-let-it-snow-in-Bethlehem-

Granted snow is Rare, but it does happen. However the other factor, is the night time temperatures, even if it was not a snowy year, once the temperatures were cold enough to stop the grasses from growing, the season for grazing the flocks was over. So the fact that they were still in the field indicates it was still warm enough to provide the grasses they needed to graze the flocks. That makes it anywhere from early October and as late as the First week or two of January depending on the weather.

Is it Biblical to Celebrate His Birth? You tell me, after reading these verses:
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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#25
The Shepherds and Angel were celebrating His birth. Who are we not to:

Luke 2:9-14 (NIV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] An angel of the Lord appeared to them, and the glory of the Lord shone around them, and they were terrified.
[SUP]10 [/SUP] But the angel said to them, "Do not be afraid. I bring you good news of great joy that will be for all the people.
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Today in the town of David a Savior has been born to you; he is Christ the Lord.
[SUP]12 [/SUP] This will be a sign to you: You will find a baby wrapped in cloths and lying in a manger."
[SUP]13 [/SUP] Suddenly a great company of the heavenly host appeared with the angel, praising God and saying,
[SUP]14 [/SUP] "Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace to men on whom his favor rests."
 

Agricola

Senior Member
Dec 10, 2012
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#26
I can not see what all the fuss is about to be honest. Christmas is just the official birthday of Christ, just as the monarchs of UK have an official birthday as well as thier real birthday.
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
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#27
Yeremyah 10:1-6, "Hear the word which Yahweh speaks concerning you, O house of Israyl. This is what Yahweh says: Do not learn the way of the heathen and do not be deceived by the signs of heaven; though the heathen are deceived by them For the religious customs of the peoples are vain; worthless! For one cuts a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the ax. They decorate it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, so that it will not move; topple over. They are upright, like a palm tree, but they cannot speak; they must be carried, because they cannot go by themselves. Do not give them reverence! They cannot do evil, nor is it in them to do righteousness!"

1 Kings 14:23, "Because they also built for themselves high places, sacred pillars and sacred poles on every elevated hill and under every green tree."

Yeremyah 7:9-11, "Will you steal, murder, commit adultery, vow falsely, burn incense to Baal follow hinder gods you know nothing of, And then come and stand before Me in this House upon which My Name is called, and say; We are saved! Saved to do all these abominations? Has this House, which is called with My Name, become a den of thieves in your eyes? Behold, I, even I, have seen this! says Yahweh."

Deuteronomy 12:3, "You must destroy their altars, break down their sacred pillars and burn their sacred poles. Cut down the images of their gods and wipe out their names from those places. You must not worship Yahweh your Father in such ways."

Deuteronomy 12:29:32, “When Yahweh your Father cuts off the nations from in front of you, and you displace them and live in their land, Be careful not to be ensnared into following them by asking about their
gods, saying: How did these nations serve their gods? I also will do the same. You must not worship Yahweh your Father in their way, for every abomination to Yahweh, which He hates, they have done to their gods. They even burn their sons and daughters in the fire as sacrifices to their gods. Whatsoever I command you, be careful to observe and do it, dyou shall not add to it, nor take away from it."




LOOKS JUST LIKE THESES GUYS...... :(
 
May 15, 2013
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#28
Wow! Thanks!

I once made my calculations (I don´t remember where I published on blogger.com) but my result was close to September, near those days WHEAT is ready to be taken, which is close to September-October, in that area, according to my readings (I´ve never been there to confirm when it is grown).

Another FACT is Jesus was born in Bethlem (House of Bread) and I GUESS that area was used to produce WHEAT or to bake it.

Just remember His saying: I am the BREAD...

Your work gave me more to believe what I believed. Thanks!
The first-fruit celebration represent the first fruit has been sprouted, and the day of atonement represent when it is harvest.

Matthew 13:26
When the wheat sprouted and formed heads, then the weeds also appeared.

Matthew 2:13
When they had gone, an angel of the Lord appeared to Joseph in a dream. “Get up,” he said, “take the child and his mother and escape to Egypt. Stay there until I tell you, for Herod is going to search for the child to kill him.”

1 John 4:3
but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.

Matthew 13:30
Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.’”

John 1:14
The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

John 12:24
Very truly I tell you, unless a kernel of wheat falls to the ground and dies, it remains only a single seed. But if it dies, it produces many seeds.

Matthew 9:15
Jesus answered, “How can the guests of the bridegroom mourn while he is with them? The time will come when the bridegroom will be taken from them; then they will fast.

Leviticus 16:30
because on this day atonement will be made for you, to cleanse you. Then, before the Lord, you will be clean from all your sins.

Exodus 29:37
For seven days make atonement for the altar and consecrate it. Then the altar will be most holy, and whatever touches it will be holy.
 
N

nathan3

Guest
#30
hello everyone, I would like to understand why does people celebrate a day as the jesus´s birth?
is it a biblical celebration or just made by human?
It's important because its the time God, began to dwell with man on earth :


Luke 1:41-44

King James Version (KJV)

41 And it came to pass, that, when Elisabeth heard the salutation of Mary, the babe leaped in her womb; and Elisabeth was filled with the Holy Ghost:

42 And she spake out with a loud voice, and said, Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb.

43 And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?

44 For, lo, as soon as the voice of thy salutation sounded in mine ears, the babe leaped in my womb for joy.


The day most think is the birth, is actually the conception. It would be nine months later, that Christ was born. These days are important for the very fact it marks the time God began to dwell with man on earth, when Christ was here.


It's not man made. A lot of the things have worked into it, maybe more to do with peoples stuff, then God.

But that makes it no less an important time. It's very important.

There is a way to figure the days, I'll try to get you a study that details how, you get to the date.
 
C

cjordan38

Guest
#31
No we as Christians who are saved, sanctified, and filled with the Holy Ghost are not to celebrate any day. The bible states that we should not observe any day. To celebrate Christmas is absurd because it goes against the 10 commandments. The tree is a idol. Not to mention Christmas was created to celebrate a king and not Jesus. Also no one knows the day when Jesus was born nor the time. The Jews today are not the Jews. Those Jews died out. Its just time for repentance and to accept God and receive the Holy Ghost!!!!
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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#32
Wow! Thanks!

I once made my calculations (I don´t remember where I published on blogger.com) but my result was close to September, near those days WHEAT is ready to be taken, which is close to September-October, in that area, according to my readings (I´ve never been there to confirm when it is grown).

Another FACT is Jesus was born in Bethlem (House of Bread) and I GUESS that area was used to produce WHEAT or to bake it.

Just remember His saying: I am the BREAD...

Your work gave me more to believe what I believed. Thanks!
I don't think you are right on the WHEAT. Why? I was born and raised a mid-west Nebraska, USA farmboy. WE combined our wheat in JUNE through early July at the latest, but the Corn we picked between late September and mid November, depending on the weather and dryness of the Corn.
 
Nov 18, 2013
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#33
hello everyone, I would like to understand why does people celebrate a day as the jesus´s birth?
is it a biblical celebration or just made by human?
Dec 25th is the birthday of Sol Invictus, (unconquered sun). Many Roman Emperors from Augusine to Constantine worshiped the sun god, and sun god worship also figures heavily in Roman Catholic symbolism. The Roman day of rest is Sunday.

Google "sol invictus" there is much information on this. Check out also:
Sol Invictus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
PAGAN SUN WORSHIP AND CATHOLICISM - THE PAGAN SUN WHEEL

Everything about Christmas has its origins in paganism.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
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#34
I can not see what all the fuss is about to be honest. Christmas is just the official birthday of Christ, just as the monarchs of UK have an official birthday as well as thier real birthday.
And this human reasoning will prevail in the near future...

Rev 13:11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.

Will appear as a minister of light...

2Co 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
2Co 11:15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

But speak as a dragon...

Rev 12:3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
Rev 12:4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.


Rev 13:12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.

A great religious leader who supports an economic/military leader. Have we ever seen this before in history?

Rev 13:13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
Rev 13:14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

Here comes a wonder working, miracle producing, fire calling down from heaven great religious leader that is loved and respected by the wroldand he will deceive the world.

Rev 13:15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
Rev 13:16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
Rev 13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

I can hear it now, "If I don't take this mark, I won't be able to earn a living and feed my family. My child is sick and I won't be able to buy medicine. God wouldn't want my family to do without and suffer, would He? Why, I'll just go along but really I won't accept this in my heart and God will understand."

Yep, God will understand...

Rev 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Now, don't confuse this, I am not saying xmas is the mark of the Beast. I am saying that accepting practices that God calls abominable are wrong. There is great harm.

The mark of the Beast is an example of how this happens, we reason our way around doing what God says to do or not do.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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#35
Dec 25th is the birthday of Sol Invictus, (unconquered sun). Many Roman Emperors from Augusine to Constantine worshiped the sun god, and sun god worship also figures heavily in Roman Catholic symbolism. The Roman day of rest is Sunday.

Google "sol invictus" there is much information on this. Check out also:
Sol Invictus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
PAGAN SUN WORSHIP AND CATHOLICISM - THE PAGAN SUN WHEEL

Everything about Christmas has its origins in paganism.

Like I said, there are SO MANY pagan religions in the history of mankind, that there HAS TO BE a pagan holiday on all 365 days of the year. THE DATE IS NOT IMPORTANT, however what IS IMPORTANT, is WHO you are focused on as you Celebrate.

JESUS IS THE REASON FOR THE SEASON!
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
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#36
Like I said, there are SO MANY pagan religions in the history of mankind, that there HAS TO BE a pagan holiday on all 365 days of the year. THE DATE IS NOT IMPORTANT, however what IS IMPORTANT, is WHO you are focused on as you Celebrate.

JESUS IS THE REASON FOR THE SEASON!
constantine incorporating bablonian sun worship is the reason DEC is celebrated as christmas, the day may not matter too much, but the way one celebrates does, since when is it ok to take on demon worship rituals?
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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#37
constantine incorporating bablonian sun worship is the reason DEC is celebrated as christmas, the day may not matter too much, but the way one celebrates does, since when is it ok to take on demon worship rituals?
NOT IN MY HOUSE, NOR ANY OTHER BORN AGAIN CHRISTIAN'S HOUSE.
NONE OF US THINK ABOUT PAGANISM WHEN WE ARE CELEBRATING THE BIRTH OF OUR LORD.

SO WHY DO YOU?
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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#38
The first-fruit celebration represent the first fruit has been sprouted, and the day of atonement represent when it is harvest.

. . .
t t t

Actually you will find that the Festival of First Fruits, represented HIS Resurrection, not His Birth. Watch these videos by Dr. Zola Levitt, a born again Jewish Christian Bible Teacher. I can HIGHLY recommend his video series, "The Seven Feasts of Israel", you will learn how all the Feasts were picture prophesies about Jesus Christ the Messiah, and how Jesus fulfilled all Seven of the Feasts.

ZLM Video Series: “The Seven Feasts of Israel”
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
4,615
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#39
Actually you will find that the Festival of First Fruits, represented HIS Resurrection, not His Birth. Watch these videos by Dr. Zola Levitt, a born again Jewish Christian Bible Teacher. I can HIGHLY recommend his video series, "The Seven Feasts of Israel", you will learn how all the Feasts were picture prophesies about Jesus Christ the Messiah, and how Jesus fulfilled all Seven of the Feasts.

ZLM Video Series: “The Seven Feasts of Israel”
t t t

I should mention that this is an OLD VIDEO SERIES, and Zola went home to be with the Lord on April 19th, 2006.
 
Apr 6, 2012
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#40
The popular date of December 25 as the day of Jesus’ birth therefore has no basis in Scripture. As many reference works show, it stems from a pagan holiday. Regarding the origin for the celebration of the day December 25, the Jesuit scholar Urbanus Holzmeister wrote:

“Today it is commonly admitted that the occasion for the celebration of the day December 25 was the festival that the pagans were celebrating on this day. Petavius [French Jesuit scholar, 1583-1652] already has rightly observed that on December 25 was celebrated ‘the birthday of the unconquered sun.’

“Witnesses for this festival are: (a) The Calendar of Furius Dionysius Filocalus, composed in the year 354 [C.E.], in which it is noted: ‘December 25, the B(irthday) of the unconquered (Sun).’ (b) The calendar of astrologer Antiochus (composed about 200 [C.E.]): ‘Month of December . . . 25 . . . The birthday of the Sun; daylight increases.’ (c) Caesar Julian [Julian the Apostate, emperor 361-363 C.E.] recommended the games that were celebrated at the end of the year in honor of the sun, which was called ‘the unconquered sun.’”—Chronologia vitae Christi (Chronology of the Life of Christ), Pontificium Institutum Biblicum, Rome, 1933, p. 46.

Perhaps the most obvious evidence of the incorrectness of the December 25 date is the Scriptural fact that shepherds were in the fields tending their flocks on the night of Jesus’ birth. (Luke 2:8, 12) Already by the autumn month of Bul (October-November) the rainy season was starting (Deuteronomy 11:14), and flocks were brought into protected shelters at night. The next month, Chislev (the ninth month of the Jewish calendar, November-December), was a month of cold and rain (Jeremiah 36:22; Ezra 10:9, 13), and Tebeth (December-January) saw the lowest temperatures of the year, with occasional snows in the highlands area. The presence of shepherds in the fields at night therefore harmonizes with the evidence pointing to the early autumn month of Ethanim as the time of Jesus’ birth.

Also weighing against a December date is that it would be most unlikely for the Roman emperor to choose such a wintry, rainy month as the time for his Jewish subjects (often rebellious) to travel “each one to his own city” to be registered.—Luke 2:1-3; compare Matthew 24:20.

Furthermore, the death of Jesus Christ took place in the spring, on the Passover Day, Nisan (or Abib) 14, according to the Jewish calendar. (Matthew 26:2; John 13:1-3; Exodus 12:1-6; 13:4) That year the Passover occurred on the sixth day of the week (counted by the Jews as from sundown on Thursday to sundown on Friday). This is evident from John 19:31, which shows that the following day was “a great” sabbath. The day after Passover was always a sabbath, no matter on what day of the week it came. (Leviticus 23:5-7) But when this special Sabbath coincided with the regular Sabbath (the seventh day of the week), it became “a great one.” So Jesus’ death took place on Friday, Nisan 14, by about 3:00 p.m.-Luke 23:44-46.

Summing up, then, since Jesus’ death took place in the spring month of Nisan, his ministry, which began three and a half years earlier according to Daniel 9:24-27, must have begun in the fall, about the month of Ethanim (September-October). John’s ministry (initiated in Tiberius’ 15th year), then, must have begun in the spring of the year 29 C.E. John’s birth therefore would be placed in the spring of the year 2 B.C.E., Jesus’ birth would come about six months later in the fall of 2 B.C.E., his ministry would start about 30 years later in the fall of 29 C.E., and his death would come in the year 33 C.E. (on Nisan 14 in the spring, as stated).