Did God plan for man to fall to prove something to Satan and his angels?

[Mouse_Cheeks]

Well then?

From your own confession...
Did God present a wager after all!

It's not my confession.

It's God's word.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

God made a wager with Satan.

no God did not make a wager with satan.

God made a statement of fact ...

Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him;
he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns evil.

satan went so far as to command God to put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face (Job 1:11).

God allowed Satan to challenge Job's commitment to his faith in God.
God allowed Satan to do almost all that he wished in testing Job. Except Satan could not kill Job.

God gave limited permission to satan (i.e. He did, to a limited extent, remove the hedge - Job 1:10).

He did this so he could win a bet against Satan.

nope.

And therein prove Job's faith was unshakable.

God did not "prove Job's faith was unshakable".

God made a statement of fact ... God reiterated in vs 8 what is written in vs 1 ... satan challenged God to His face ... Job was tested and Job passed the test.

Sometimes I read about these faithful men and women in Scripture and I wonder if I would pass the tests they went through. I think to myself "wow ... would I stand strong if I faced that situation?" I like to think I would ... Hebrews 12 tells us to consider the Lord Jesus Christ ... Who endured such contradiction of sinners against himself, lest ye be wearied and faint in your minds ... and then reminds us Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin.

We are so blessed and we have such wonderful examples to study and draw from. As we keep our hearts focused on the Lord Jesus Christ, He leads us along ... walks with us through all our afflictions. If we take our focus off of Him, we falter.
.

 

[ewq1938]

You just contradicted yourself.

God made a wager with Satan. God allowed Satan to challenge Job's commitment to his faith in God.
God allowed Satan to do almost all that he wished in testing Job. Except Satan could not kill Job.

He did this so he could win a bet against Satan. And therein prove Job's faith was unshakable.

Job's faith fell apart and God lost that bet.

 

[Genez]

Jesus was correct........

"Few find it."

 

[GWH]

The unanswered question. And, the question never asked?

Was it good for God's plan for man to fall?

What was going on with God providing the Cross before man was created? (Revelation 13:8)

God created man knowing full well that man would fall.
And, His plan has been to glorify His name before all!

So, I ask.

Did God plan for man to fall?
Was it to prove something to Satan and his angels?



grace and peace............

God planned for fallen man to be able to live in heaven,
which proved His omnilove (Matt. 5:44&48, 22:37, Rom. 5:5-8, 1Tim. 2:3-4, Ezek. 33:11)
and omniscience/wisdom (Jer. 10:12, 1Cor. 1:30, Col. 2:3).

 

[Genez]

God planned for fallen man to be able to live in heaven,
which proved His omnilove (Matt. 5:44&48, 22:37, Rom. 5:5-8, 1Tim. 2:3-4, Ezek. 33:11)
and omniscience/wisdom (Jer. 10:12, 1Cor. 1:30, Col. 2:3).

Omnilove is one thing.

Agape love is another.

Put down your toy, and learn what agape means.
It is an impersonal love.

 

[Genez]

God planned for fallen man to be able to live in heaven,
which proved His omnilove (Matt. 5:44&48, 22:37, Rom. 5:5-8, 1Tim. 2:3-4, Ezek. 33:11)
and omniscience/wisdom (Jer. 10:12, 1Cor. 1:30, Col. 2:3).

Omnilove is actually God.
God does not provide God.

God is love!

God manifests agape love to man as God's means to relate to man who does not warrant love,
as to get man to become what would warrant love.

why?

 

[GWH]

Omnilove is one thing.

Agape love is another.

Put down your toy, and learn what agape means.
It is an impersonal love.

Agape = omni.
Learn what synonymous means.
IOW, omnilove means God has agape love for everyone/all humanity.

 

[Mouse_Cheeks]

no God did not make a wager with satan.

God made a statement of fact ...

Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him;
he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns evil.

satan went so far as to command God to put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face (Job 1:11).





God gave limited permission to satan (i.e. He did, to a limited extent, remove the hedge - Job 1:10).





nope.





God did not "prove Job's faith was unshakable".

God made a statement of fact ... God reiterated in vs 8 what is written in vs 1 ... satan challenged God to His face ... Job was tested and Job passed the test.

Sometimes I read about these faithful men and women in Scripture and I wonder if I would pass the tests they went through. I think to myself "wow ... would I stand strong if I faced that situation?" I like to think I would ... Hebrews 12 tells us to consider the Lord Jesus Christ ... Who endured such contradiction of sinners against himself, lest ye be wearied and faint in your minds ... and then reminds us Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin.

We are so blessed and we have such wonderful examples to study and draw from. As we keep our hearts focused on the Lord Jesus Christ, He leads us along ... walks with us through all our afflictions. If we take our focus off of Him, we falter.
.

All of Job 1 shows God made a wager with Satan.

Job suffered so God could prove his point regarding Jobs faith.
https://www.biblestudytools.com/job/1.html

 

[Genez]

Agape = omni.
Learn what synonymous means.
IOW, omnilove means God has agape love for everyone/all humanity.

OK...OK... you can keep your toy.

 

[GWH]

OK...OK... you can keep your toy.

I'll keep my concept of God, but you can share it/Him.

 

[brightfame52]

Why do you believe God had to "come to know" anything ... do you believe God did not know Adam and Eve would eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil?

... and I am in agreement with what @Genez posted here
.

evasion

 

[brightfame52]

That is God's way of saying something is an absolute certainty before it unfolds in time.
And, treats that certainty as an accomplished reality forever.

God already sees the future.

Of course He sees it since He predetermined it duh, how else does He see it?

 

[Genez]

Of course He sees it since He predetermined it duh, how else does He see it?

God sees all things that could have been.

Out of all that could have been?
He narrows everything down to what will be.
That is what He predetermines.

He knows a thousand and one ways you would be stubborn about something.
But, He only has to predetermine a manifestation of a few ways to determine you are stubborn.

What He predetermines are those few ways.
Why? So you would see them for yourself and be without excuse.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

evasion

nope ... you said:

Can you explain how did He come to know ?

in response to my statement [emphasis added]:

God made provision for mankind ... knowing Adam and Eve would eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

so I asked you:

Why do you believe God had to "come to know" anything ... do you believe God did not know Adam and Eve would eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil?

God is eternal ... infinite.

We are finite ... we are the ones who have to "come to know".

So, no, my response to you was not evasive ... I was asking you to clarify your statement.

Do you believe God did not know Adam and Eve would eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil?
.

 

[brightfame52]

God sees all things that could have been.

Out of all that could have been?
He narrows everything down to what will be.
That is what He predetermines.

He knows a thousand and one ways you would be stubborn about something.
But, He only has to predetermine a manifestation of a few ways to determine you are stubborn.

What He predetermines are those few ways.
Why? So you would see them for yourself and be without excuse.

He sees it since He predetermined it duh, how else does He see it?

 

[brightfame52]

nope ... you said:




in response to my statement [emphasis added]:




so I asked you:






God is eternal ... infinite.

We are finite ... we are the ones who have to "come to know".

So, no, my response to you was not evasive ... I was asking you to clarify your statement.

Do you believe God did not know Adam and Eve would eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil?
.

Yeah He knows because He is the first cause and determiner of all things

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Yeah He knows because He is the first cause and determiner of all things

God did not "cause" Adam and Eve to sin. God tells us exactly what happened (Gen 3).

God's will was clearly stated:

Genesis 2:17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it

Nowhere in Scripture do we read that God was the "cause" of Adam and Eve eating of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

The fact that God knew they would eat and He devised His plan of redemption for mankind before Adam and Eve ate does not mean that God caused Adam and Eve to sin.
.

 

[brightfame52]

God did not "cause" Adam and Eve to sin. God tells us exactly what happened (Gen 3).

God's will was clearly stated:

Genesis 2:17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it

Nowhere in Scripture do we read that God was the "cause" of Adam and Eve eating of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

The fact that God knew they would eat and He devised His plan of redemption for mankind before Adam and Eve ate does not mean that God caused Adam and Eve to sin.
.

He is the first cause and determiner of all things

 

[reneweddaybyday]