Genuine vs....

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Liamson

Senior Member
Feb 3, 2010
3,078
69
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"They seem like the perfect boyfriend, and in the beginning, they are attentive, thoughtful, generous, and kind. You become enamored and are swept off your feet. Although you may hear murmurings from friends or family that he seems “too nice” or that they just “have a hunch about him,” you brush aside their comments. You only have eyes for him, and in those eyes, he’s “the one.”

The relationship moves quickly, and he makes you feel chosen and special, as if the secrets he shares are only between you two. He seeks your sympathy, telling you woes about his hard life and the many people who have taken advantage of or hurt him. He might even speak disparagingly about his “crazy” ex-girlfriend or ex-wife, and you swallow the one-sided character assassination without question…"



Today I was researching the difference between Authenticity and Genuineness, as it relates to character. For all intents and purposes this is practically splitting hairs. My conclusions are, in this discussion irrelevant but, I did stumble across something that I found to be infinitely more meaningful to me. (and I would hope to you)

Here's the setup...

A lot of women I know complain that the men in their life do not pursue them with any sort of drive. They say that most men are usually friendly, but they don't want friends, they want to be fought over and fought for. They want to know that they are valuable and worth pursuing. They want to fall in love.

On the flip side...

Most of the single men I know and am friends with, don't do anything unless they feel compelled to. They move when they are captivated by something that moves them. They are sincere and genuine. They know what is good and what is right, nothing else is important to them.

Here is the inconsistency...

I have one friend who pursues as if he is captivated. He will chase hard for about a month. He will be fun and exciting and adaptable. But its not real. He's not trying to sleep with these women but, he is trying to get them to fall in love with him. He becomes what women want. Where my conscience would rip me apart, for portraying feelings that I do not have, he has no hangups. Then after about 3-5 weeks of "falling in love" and leading her to believe that he is the one, he simply stops talking to her and ignores her until she goes away.

The thing that scares me...

The real thing looks about like what he does. When a man and a woman fall in love, they become crazy and irrational. They show a multitude of different kinds of affection from notes to flowers to gifts to hugs to promises to whatever moves them but, when a person gives the appearance of falling for someone for the sake of finding out whether or not she is more than a pretty face, I tend to become...

images
 
I know women who do this too. It's like "falling in love" is a hobby for them. They seem far more in love with "falling in love" than actually BEING in love, and the poor guy is often left wondering what he did wrong. I often wonder whether they ever do actually come to love anyone. They probably do it for far different reasons than men though.

So..why do you think guys do this sort of thing? I call them collectors. :) Is it some sort of ego thing or what?
 
I think it has to do with something that is missing inside. Like an itch that cannot be scratched, they attempt to make it go away by simulating what it should be like if they were actually whole.

I suppose they might also do it for social validation. "If I can get a beautiful woman to love me then I must be worth something."
 
Could be a few reasons why a man would disappear after the pursuit is over:

- Afraid of getting too close (too much intimacy and/or commitment for him to deal with)

- Loses interest once he's 'conquered' her (the challenge is gone)

- Once he gets close enough, he realizes that he doesn't really love her (she's not the idea of her that he had in his head)
 
- Once he gets close enough, he realizes that he doesn't really love her (she's not the idea of her that he had in his head)

If I push him about it, this is what he says. But then I have to wonder how he didn't know..... 5 weeks of constant exposure is a really long time.

It also doesn't help that he's an ESFP.
 
There are many reasons people do things such as this, but you struck an important note in mentioning the disconnect between perception and reality.

Things, on one level, are not what we make them. They are, regardless of us. Most are noting your attitude and other changeable/controllable factors when mentioning this, however.

So, that said....perhaps we should learn to live a little less in our heads and more in reality as a first step. Apart from that, the value we esteem others/ourselves with is important. Apathy can quite aptly lead to atrocity.

Again, these are just peices to a much larger puzzle, which also looks different for each person. Nonetheless, the basics/universals are just that.
 
If I push him about it, this is what he says. But then I have to wonder how he didn't know..... 5 weeks of constant exposure is a really long time.

It also doesn't help that he's an ESFP.

well I think that if he was being honest he wouldn't just leave her hanging without any idea about why he doesn't want to continue pursuing her. Just the fact that he cuts it off with what seems to be a total disregard for her feelings leads me to believe that its more about reason #2 (the challenge is over, he's accomplished his goal).
 
Funny thing is...if you figure out that a guy is playing games like this and walk away, he'll normally get upset with YOU :rolleyes:
 
Could be a few reasons why a man would disappear after the pursuit is over:

- Afraid of getting too close (too much intimacy and/or commitment for him to deal with)

- Loses interest once he's 'conquered' her (the challenge is gone)

- Once he gets close enough, he realizes that he doesn't really love her (she's not the idea of her that he had in his head)

I was positive the bold line said loses connection to the internet.

Also we should add, discovers her sister,friend,cousin, is more attractive to us.

Never introduce your friends to your date right away.
 
I know women who do this too. It's like "falling in love" is a hobby for them. They seem far more in love with "falling in love" than actually BEING in love, and the poor guy is often left wondering what he did wrong. I often wonder whether they ever do actually come to love anyone. They probably do it for far different reasons than men though.

So..why do you think guys do this sort of thing? I call them collectors. :) Is it some sort of ego thing or what?

Frankenstein and Dracula have nothing on you
Jekyll and Hyde join the back of the queue
The female of the species is more deadly than the male

Oh she wants to conquer the world completely
But first she'll conquer me discreetly
The female of the species is more deadly than the male

Female Of The Species Lyrics
by Space
 
"They seem like the perfect boyfriend, and in the beginning, they are attentive, thoughtful, generous, and kind. You become enamored and are swept off your feet. Although you may hear murmurings from friends or family that he seems “too nice” or that they just “have a hunch about him,” you brush aside their comments. You only have eyes for him, and in those eyes, he’s “the one.”

The relationship moves quickly, and he makes you feel chosen and special, as if the secrets he shares are only between you two. He seeks your sympathy, telling you woes about his hard life and the many people who have taken advantage of or hurt him. He might even speak disparagingly about his “crazy” ex-girlfriend or ex-wife, and you swallow the one-sided character assassination without question…"



Today I was researching the difference between Authenticity and Genuineness, as it relates to character. For all intents and purposes this is practically splitting hairs. My conclusions are, in this discussion irrelevant but, I did stumble across something that I found to be infinitely more meaningful to me. (and I would hope to you)

Here's the setup...

A lot of women I know complain that the men in their life do not pursue them with any sort of drive. They say that most men are usually friendly, but they don't want friends, they want to be fought over and fought for. They want to know that they are valuable and worth pursuing. They want to fall in love.

On the flip side...

Most of the single men I know and am friends with, don't do anything unless they feel compelled to. They move when they are captivated by something that moves them. They are sincere and genuine. They know what is good and what is right, nothing else is important to them.

Here is the inconsistency...

I have one friend who pursues as if he is captivated. He will chase hard for about a month. He will be fun and exciting and adaptable. But its not real. He's not trying to sleep with these women but, he is trying to get them to fall in love with him. He becomes what women want. Where my conscience would rip me apart, for portraying feelings that I do not have, he has no hangups. Then after about 3-5 weeks of "falling in love" and leading her to believe that he is the one, he simply stops talking to her and ignores her until she goes away.

The thing that scares me...

The real thing looks about like what he does. When a man and a woman fall in love, they become crazy and irrational. They show a multitude of different kinds of affection from notes to flowers to gifts to hugs to promises to whatever moves them but, when a person gives the appearance of falling for someone for the sake of finding out whether or not she is more than a pretty face, I tend to become...

images

To be perfectly authentic and genuine I've never liked the idea of pursuing a woman with such vigor. I am more like the older lion who watches how the other younger males fail and then I don't do that. Oh but then when I see what doesn't work then I go after them. Still hasn't worked though. I guess my lack of sharp teeth, six pack abs and desire for children has left me to on the outskirts of the pack to be eaten by hyenas.

Or maybe I am trying to catch butterflies with bullets and not a net. I bet that makes sense.
 
I think it has to do with something that is missing inside. Like an itch that cannot be scratched, they attempt to make it go away by simulating what it should be like if they were actually whole.

I suppose they might also do it for social validation. "If I can get a beautiful woman to love me then I must be worth something."

Valid, such a great word. If someone who seems to be something inclines their head towards us meager masses we have validity.

Living the life I have lived of an in-valid I can perfectly identify with that desire. Oh just cast your beam upon me that I may burn in your greatness! For I am lowly and without reason!

I think validity is what a large sum of us live and die on.
 
Funny thing is...if you figure out that a guy is playing games like this and walk away, he'll normally get upset with YOU :rolleyes:

You found him out and stopped the game. He thought no one could do that. You quit the game and took your ball home. Now he feels he can't play with others either because they will also see his shallowness.

Just a guess.
 
Valid, such a great word. If someone who seems to be something inclines their head towards us meager masses we have validity.

Living the life I have lived of an in-valid I can perfectly identify with that desire. Oh just cast your beam upon me that I may burn in your greatness! For I am lowly and without reason!

I think validity is what a large sum of us live and die on.


Have you ever had things that other people wanted?

Did it make you feel good or like you were living out someone else's dream? Like it was an impersonal affair.

Have you ever had objectively what the world wants and yet found it to be lacking, not in the sense that there was something missing about it but rather because it did not fulfill the itch that was needing to be scratched.

Have you ever felt yourself measured against your personal hopes and dreams and found yourself wanting, not for failure or for having tried and lost, but for having given up to settle for a lesser aim, one that if met or not met would not be too personal to face?

What does a person do when the very idea of finding what your heart desires most is unbearable, because it might touch a nerve too close to home and stir something that was buried long ago, out of fear of disappointment. Instead there is the external pursuits, which can be reinforced by everyone around.

This to me is why men buy nice sports cars. The 911 turbo in and of itself is nothing but, as a symbol it embodies the idea that its owner has "made it" and is objectively beyond judgement. Its like a dog at the park who has a toy and is the envy of every other dog there. He wants it because it is wanted, not because it is valuable to him. And like the dog park, when other dogs no longer drool over his toy, he drops it and goes after a new one.

A man wishes to fall in love and marry a beautiful woman, he wants her to be smart and wise but, most importantly, he wants her to adore him. He wants her to see the part of him that he thinks she will find beautiful. The world can see that she is beautiful but, by his winning her heart, he is attempting to establish himself as being worthy. Even if the world can't see it, they don't need to, because all they need to do is see her and know that she sees it. She becomes the physical representation of how he values himself.

I love it when couples are best friends that get married because, they don't have to prove anything. The world is their burrito, they can take it or leave it. If they do something it is for each other, themselves or their family.


If you've seen the movie the Grey, you probably know what I'm getting at. We all die. And in the end it won't matter how much validation we had or how we wanted the world to see us. (christian culture is not exempt from this) Rather it is how we loved, how much, how deeply and how freely were we to show the world what love really means.
 
Here's the setup...

A lot of women I know complain that the men in their life do not pursue them with any sort of drive. They say that most men are usually friendly, but they don't want friends, they want to be fought over and fought for. They want to know that they are valuable and worth pursuing. They want to fall in love.

On the flip side...

Most of the single men I know and am friends with, don't do anything unless they feel compelled to. They move when they are captivated by something that moves them. They are sincere and genuine. They know what is good and what is right, nothing else is important to them.

I feel this tension in my life and it is... quite frankly annoying. A couple of years ago I dated a girl and did this, tried to be the perfect bf and pretended I was in love. - my intention was not to pretend that I was in love, more to actually be in love, it is a bit weird to understand, I don't fully understand it now. In the end up I ended seriously messing myself up for a decent amount of time and hurting her quite substantially.

Now... I find this frustrating at times. On the less serious side, sometimes I meet people who I would like to get to know better. Yet I feel it is irresponsible to ask them out on a date, quite frankly because I think it would be silly to get their hopes up. I can't marry anyone, what I want (possibly need, guess God knows that) is very specific. After talking to someone for a short while you can generally work out whether they are suitable or not. After becoming friends you can tell even more.

At this point though - When you are interested in a friend but are unsure of things. Do you just continue to be better friends and say something when you are sure, or as sure as you can be, do you just speak up and risk hurting feelings given you are unsure? I feel at this point some girls want to be chased, they want you to be sure. I find this so hard and I am not able to pretend that I am more interested than I am - nor would I want to. I'd love to be able to pursue a girl fully and completely, but for me I need to be relatively certain before I can fully commit myself. I also struggle to let a girl develop feelings for me when I am at this point. I don't want to hurt them and don't want to let them have feelings for me when I am not sure, even if there is a chance it will work.

Do you guys feel the same? Do you pursue someone even if you aren't sure? What level of certainty do you have?

Hmmm, I feel I am more complaining than actually contributing to this conversation.