Grace Saves, Faith Receives, Christ Secures

[mailmandan]

I understand just fine because I can read. What you would need to do is show evidence that your understanding of Scripture is authoritative. I havent seen anything like that from you thus far so I have a choice to make. I can read Scripture with the brain God gave me or I could listen to you, someone who has made unsubstantiated claims of possessing authoritative biblical knowledge. Hmmm give me second.....

Apparently, you don't understand just fine and you keep asking me for evidence that my understanding of Scripture is authoritative. God's word is infallible, but mankind is not. Why would you ask me that question? When did I make unsubstantiated claims of possessing authoritative biblical knowledge? I simply read Scripture in context and properly harmonize scripture with Scripture before reaching my conclusion on doctrine. I don't claim to be the infallible interpreter of Scripture.

 

[Ouch]

Before mentioning baptism in chapter 6, Paul had repeatedly emphasized that faith, not baptism is the instrumental cause of salvation/justification. (Romans 1:16, 3:22-30; 4:4-6, 13; 5:1) That is when the old man was put to death and united in the likeness of His death, which water baptism symbolizes and pictures. Righteousness is "imputed to us who believe in Him who raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead, who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was raised up because of our justification." (Romans 4:24,25)

Paul is simply explaining the symbolism of the ordinance. A symbol is not the reality but a picture of the reality. Since believers receive the benefits of Christ’s death and resurrection (justification), and that through faith, believers must be spiritually united to Him (delivered and raised up with Him). If baptism is taken as the instrumental cause, then Paul contradicts what he had established before, namely that justification is by faith, not baptism. *Hermeneutics.

I have already provided you with multiple passages of scripture where in fact sins are remitted through repentance/belief/faith (Luke 24:47; Acts 3:19; 5:31; Acts 10:43; 13:38-39; 26:18) but you continue to disregard those passages of scripture for a couple of pet verses. If you don't properly harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching your conclusion on doctrine then, you will not properly interpret scripture and you will just end up obeying your biased church doctrine instead of His word. You would walk around mountains of grace in order to find water. You need to place your faith in the Savior God for salvation and not the water god.

You my friend can do all the talking and explaing you like.

Facts are sins are remitted in the water.

Your choice.

 

[FlyingDove]

"Nothing external removes sin."

Faith in the NAME saves, Faith in the BLOOD removes sin & the Jesus HOLY SPIRIT Baptism Forever seals the believers salvation. Water is a obedience response.

Scripture is clear:
For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul. (Lev 17:11)

"Without shedding of blood there is no remission" (Heb 9:22).

Jesus said, “This is My blood > shed for many for the remission of sins” (Matt 26:28).

He washed us from our sins in His own blood (Rev 1:5).

High Priest Foreshadow

Lev 16:21, Aaron laid both hands on the substitute, confessed the sins of the nation & imputes/transfers the sins onto the innocent victim. That was the foreshadow.

Jesus is the fulfillment.

Heb identifies Jesus as our great High Priest (Heb 4:14), called by God after the order of Melchizedek (Heb 5:10) & Mediator of the New Covenant (Heb 9:15; 12:24)

Under the Old Covenant, the priest transferred sin. Under the New Covenant, Christ performs the real sin‑transfer.

When we call on the name of the Lord (Acts 2:21 & Rom 10:13) & place our faith in Jesus' sin-atoning death & resurrection, He forgives all our sins (Heb 10:10–18) & imputes our sins onto Himself (Heb 10:10; 2 Cor 5:19; Rom 4:8, 11, 22–24). At that same moment, He baptizes the believer with His forever (Jn 14:16), salvation‑sealing (Eph 1:13, 2 Cor 1:22, 2 Cor 5:5) indwelling Holy Spirit.

Anyone can immerse someone into water. Only Jesus, who knows the true heart (Matt 9:4, Jn 6:64,Acts 1:24, Rev 2:23), can baptize with/in/by the Holy Spirit. Jesus then imputes His righteousness to us (2 Cor 5:21 & Ja 2:23) & the believer becomes the righteousness of God, thru faith placed in Christ.)

Salvation Across the Ages

Before the incarnation, God required FAITH in the promised Messiah who would come (Gen 15:6 & Isa 53). During Jesus' earthly ministry, people were called to BELIEVE that He was the Messiah (Jn 20:31). After His death & resurrection, salvation is accessed through FAITH (Rom 5:1-2) in His finished, sin‑atoning work (Rom 3:25–26 & 1 Cor 15:1–4). In every era, salvation has always been by FAITH in God's Messiah & never by ritual, never by water, never by external acts.

 

[Ouch]

"Nothing external removes sin."

Faith in the NAME saves, Faith in the BLOOD removes sin & the Jesus HOLY SPIRIT Baptism Forever seals the believers salvation. Water is a obedience response.

Scripture is clear:
For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul. (Lev 17:11)

"Without shedding of blood there is no remission" (Heb 9:22).

Jesus said, “This is My blood > shed for many for the remission of sins” (Matt 26:28).

He washed us from our sins in His own blood (Rev 1:5).

High Priest Foreshadow

Lev 16:21, Aaron laid both hands on the substitute, confessed the sins of the nation & imputes/transfers the sins onto the innocent victim. That was the foreshadow.

Jesus is the fulfillment.

Heb identifies Jesus as our great High Priest (Heb 4:14), called by God after the order of Melchizedek (Heb 5:10) & Mediator of the New Covenant (Heb 9:15; 12:24)

Under the Old Covenant, the priest transferred sin. Under the New Covenant, Christ performs the real sin‑transfer.

When we call on the name of the Lord (Acts 2:21 & Rom 10:13) & place our faith in Jesus' sin-atoning death & resurrection, He forgives all our sins (Heb 10:10–18) & imputes our sins onto Himself (Heb 10:10; 2 Cor 5:19; Rom 4:8, 11, 22–24). At that same moment, He baptizes the believer with His forever (Jn 14:16), salvation‑sealing (Eph 1:13, 2 Cor 1:22, 2 Cor 5:5) indwelling Holy Spirit.

Anyone can immerse someone into water. Only Jesus, who knows the true heart (Matt 9:4, Jn 6:64,Acts 1:24, Rev 2:23), can baptize with/in/by the Holy Spirit. Jesus then imputes His righteousness to us (2 Cor 5:21 & Ja 2:23) & the believer becomes the righteousness of God, thru faith placed in Christ.)

Salvation Across the Ages

Before the incarnation, God required FAITH in the promised Messiah who would come (Gen 15:6 & Isa 53). During Jesus' earthly ministry, people were called to BELIEVE that He was the Messiah (Jn 20:31). After His death & resurrection, salvation is accessed through FAITH (Rom 5:1-2) in His finished, sin‑atoning work (Rom 3:25–26 & 1 Cor 15:1–4). In every era, salvation has always been by FAITH in God's Messiah & never by ritual, never by water, never by external acts.

Using HIS word, EVIDENCE your statement "Nothing external removes sin." IS A LIE.

Who ever put you on this road, your blood is on there hands.

Who ever is following you, their blood is on your hands.

Acts 2:38-39
King James Version
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 22:16
King James Version
16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

 

[FlyingDove]

The issue is what Scripture says the events meant & how God Himself changed the Holy Spirit' dispensational stewardship (Acts 2 salvation given after & Acts 10 before water)

Under the Old Covenant & during early Acts, Israel's remission framework was tied to covenant repentance & national guilt (Acts 2:36–38), but remission itself always came by blood, never by water (Lev 17:11; Heb 9:22; Matt 26:28). Water purified the flesh (Heb 9:10), but only blood removed sin. Lev 17:11 For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul. That is why your claim that water remits sins cannot stand.

2ndly, Acts 2 Peter is preaching to Israel ONLY! ""Men of Judea-Vs14"" ""Men of Israel-Vs22"" at a Jewish feast, in a Jewish city, fulfilling a Jewish prophecy, under Jewish COVENANT LAWS.

The Holy Spirit is given after repentance & water because Israel's covenant initiations were physical. Just as physical circumcision initiated the Old Covenant.

Gentiles were never under Israel's purification system of part of John's water baptism or Mosaic covenant laws (Eph 2:12). Ten years after Pentecost God turns to the Gentiles in Acts 10, He does not repeat the Acts 2 order - He reverses it. The Holy Spirit/SALVATION falls on Cornelius' household while Peter is still preaching (Acts 10:44)

The Holy Spirit is Gods Gift of Eternal Life. You can't change recorded scripture:

Mark 1:8 I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost.
(NOTE: He shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost. Also see Mat 3:11, Lk 3:16 & Jn 1:33)

2 Tim 1:14 Refers to the Holy Spirit as a Good Deposit.

2 Cor 5:5, Eph 1:14 & 2 Cor 1:22. Refer to the Holy Spirit as "the earnest" = Deposit or Pledge.

Eph 1:13, 2 Cor 1:22 & Eph 4:30 Refer to the Holy Spirit as a Seal.

2 Tim 1:14 The Holy Spirit who dwells within us, guard the good deposit entrusted to you
(NOTE: The Holy Spirit dwelling within us. Is God's good deposit given us until the day of redemption)

2 Cor 5:5 God, who also hath given unto us the "earnest" of the Spirit
(NOTE: God's Holy Spirit dwelling within us is the earnest. Earnest translated from the Greek word: arrabon. Also means a deposit/pledge. In modern Greek arrabona is an "engagement ring.")

2 Cor 1:22 Who hath also "sealed us" & "given the earnest" of the Holy Spirit in our hearts
(NOTE: God has placed His Holy Spirit in the believers heart. As a DEPOSIT/PLEDGE & SEAL, until the soon coming day of our final redemption)

Eph 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
(NOTE: You heard about Christ's finished sin redemptive payment & resurrection. When you believed/trusted, Christ sealed/baptized you with His Holy Spirit).

Eph1:14 Which is the "earnest" of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession
(NOTE: The Holy Spirit by which only Christ baptizes/seals & indwells us. Is God's earnest = a down payment/pledge)

Eph 4:30 grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are "sealed" unto the day of redemption
(NOTE: Believers are SEALED with God's Holy Spirit. Christ's pledge/promise that he will come for us)

GENTILES RECEIVE GODS ETERNAL LIFE GIVING HOLY SPIRIT - BEFORE WATER! - Peter explains the process:

Acts 10:
45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
(NOTE: Vs44, Gentiles RECEIVE Gods Eternal Life Gift-the Holy Spirit - BEFORE WATER!. Vs47, Gentiles HAVE received Gods Eternal Life Gift-the Holy Spirit. - BEFORE WATER!)

Acts 11: Peter says
16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.

18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.
(NOTE: Vs16, Jesus alone baptizes with/in/by His Eternal Giving Holy Spirit. Vs18, GOD GAVE the Gentiles the same Salvation SEALING-Eph 1:13-14, 4:30, 2 Cor 1:22, 5:5, 2 Tim 1:14-FOREVER INDWELLING (Jn 14:16)- REPENTANCE GRANTING Holy Spirit- SAVED-SEALED-FORGIVEN-BY FAITH ALONE-BEFORE WATER!)

That is the dispensational shift - from a Jewish, water-mediated reception of the Holy Spirit in Acts 2 to a universal, faith-based Spirit baptism in Acts 10.

This is exactly how Gentiles become the fulfillment of God's promise to Abraham that he would be the father of many nations (Gen 17:5; Gal 3:8, 14). Not through rituals, but through faith.

Peter preached Jesus death & resurrection in Acts 2 & Acts 10. Same gospel message Paul preached (1 Cor 15:1-4 & Rom 10:9-10). But God changes the Holy Spirit administration from "repent from breaking covenant & be water baptized to receive the Holy Sprit.

Gentiles were never under any Mosaic covenants (Eph 2:12) During Peters message God changes the previous Holy Spirit' administration from repent, be water baptized & receive the Holy Spirit to ""Hear, Believe, Receive the H/S, then be water baptized.""

Scripture is clear: at Cornelius' house the baptism protocol is inverted - Holy Spirit 1st upon belief/faith, then water & that's the universal order for the Body of Christ

 

[Ouch]

The issue is what Scripture says the events meant & how God Himself changed the Holy Spirit' dispensational stewardship (Acts 2 salvation given after & Acts 10 before water)

Under the Old Covenant & during early Acts, Israel's remission framework was tied to covenant repentance & national guilt (Acts 2:36–38), but remission itself always came by blood, never by water (Lev 17:11; Heb 9:22; Matt 26:28). Water purified the flesh (Heb 9:10), but only blood removed sin. Lev 17:11 For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul. That is why your claim that water remits sins cannot stand.

2ndly, Acts 2 Peter is preaching to Israel ONLY! ""Men of Judea-Vs14"" ""Men of Israel-Vs22"" at a Jewish feast, in a Jewish city, fulfilling a Jewish prophecy, under Jewish COVENANT LAWS.

The Holy Spirit is given after repentance & water because Israel's covenant initiations were physical. Just as physical circumcision initiated the Old Covenant.

Gentiles were never under Israel's purification system of part of John's water baptism or Mosaic covenant laws (Eph 2:12). Ten years after Pentecost God turns to the Gentiles in Acts 10, He does not repeat the Acts 2 order - He reverses it. The Holy Spirit/SALVATION falls on Cornelius' household while Peter is still preaching (Acts 10:44)

The Holy Spirit is Gods Gift of Eternal Life. You can't change recorded scripture:

Mark 1:8 I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost.
(NOTE: He shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost. Also see Mat 3:11, Lk 3:16 & Jn 1:33)

2 Tim 1:14 Refers to the Holy Spirit as a Good Deposit.

2 Cor 5:5, Eph 1:14 & 2 Cor 1:22. Refer to the Holy Spirit as "the earnest" = Deposit or Pledge.

Eph 1:13, 2 Cor 1:22 & Eph 4:30 Refer to the Holy Spirit as a Seal.

2 Tim 1:14 The Holy Spirit who dwells within us, guard the good deposit entrusted to you
(NOTE: The Holy Spirit dwelling within us. Is God's good deposit given us until the day of redemption)

2 Cor 5:5 God, who also hath given unto us the "earnest" of the Spirit
(NOTE: God's Holy Spirit dwelling within us is the earnest. Earnest translated from the Greek word: arrabon. Also means a deposit/pledge. In modern Greek arrabona is an "engagement ring.")

2 Cor 1:22 Who hath also "sealed us" & "given the earnest" of the Holy Spirit in our hearts
(NOTE: God has placed His Holy Spirit in the believers heart. As a DEPOSIT/PLEDGE & SEAL, until the soon coming day of our final redemption)

Eph 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
(NOTE: You heard about Christ's finished sin redemptive payment & resurrection. When you believed/trusted, Christ sealed/baptized you with His Holy Spirit).

Eph1:14 Which is the "earnest" of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession
(NOTE: The Holy Spirit by which only Christ baptizes/seals & indwells us. Is God's earnest = a down payment/pledge)

Eph 4:30 grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are "sealed" unto the day of redemption
(NOTE: Believers are SEALED with God's Holy Spirit. Christ's pledge/promise that he will come for us)

GENTILES RECEIVE GODS ETERNAL LIFE GIVING HOLY SPIRIT - BEFORE WATER! - Peter explains the process:

Acts 10:
45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
(NOTE: Vs44, Gentiles RECEIVE Gods Eternal Life Gift-the Holy Spirit - BEFORE WATER!. Vs47, Gentiles HAVE received Gods Eternal Life Gift-the Holy Spirit. - BEFORE WATER!)

Acts 11: Peter says
16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.

18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.
(NOTE: Vs16, Jesus alone baptizes with/in/by His Eternal Giving Holy Spirit. Vs18, GOD GAVE the Gentiles the same Salvation SEALING-Eph 1:13-14, 4:30, 2 Cor 1:22, 5:5, 2 Tim 1:14-FOREVER INDWELLING (Jn 14:16)- REPENTANCE GRANTING Holy Spirit- SAVED-SEALED-FORGIVEN-BY FAITH ALONE-BEFORE WATER!)

That is the dispensational shift - from a Jewish, water-mediated reception of the Holy Spirit in Acts 2 to a universal, faith-based Spirit baptism in Acts 10.

This is exactly how Gentiles become the fulfillment of God's promise to Abraham that he would be the father of many nations (Gen 17:5; Gal 3:8, 14). Not through rituals, but through faith.

Peter preached Jesus death & resurrection in Acts 2 & Acts 10. Same gospel message Paul preached (1 Cor 15:1-4 & Rom 10:9-10). But God changes the Holy Spirit administration from "repent from breaking covenant & be water baptized to receive the Holy Sprit.

Gentiles were never under any Mosaic covenants (Eph 2:12) During Peters message God changes the previous Holy Spirit' administration from repent, be water baptized & receive the Holy Spirit to ""Hear, Believe, Receive the H/S, then be water baptized.""

Scripture is clear: at Cornelius' house the baptism protocol is inverted - Holy Spirit 1st upon belief/faith, then water & that's the universal order for the Body of Christ

You know GOD that well that HE changed being baptized in JESUS name first to after!

Are you saying that JESUS filled you with the Holy Ghost like in Acts 10, first?

Was you ever bapitzed after?

When did those in Acts 2:4 who GOD filled with the Holy Ghost first get baptized in JESUS name?

Yep, you don't know HIM as well as you think.

 

[FlyingDove]

Acts 2:38 Isn't Universal - Jesus Proves It A

Acts 2:38 can't be a universal salvation formula because the entire event is Jewish‑only—Jewish feast, Jewish city, Jewish prophecy, Jewish covenant law & a Jewish audience. ""Men of Judea-Men of Israel"") with zero Gentiles among the 3,000 saved. Acts 2 stands where it belongs: a covenant call to Israel, not a salvation formula for all peoples/nations.

When the gospel finally reaches Gentiles in Acts 10:44, Jesus Himself overrides the Acts 2 sequence & Holy Spirit seals them the moment they believe. Without circumcision, without water & before anything Peter commands.

Only Jesus Holy Spirit‑baptizes (Matt 3:11; Acts 1:5). Proving the universal pattern is Acts 10:44: Hear > Believe > Receive > the Holy Spirit.

Jesus Himself reveals the UNIVERSAL entry into the Body of Christ, Jew & Gentile pattern with His own hand.

 

[Ouch]

Acts 2:38 Isn't Universal - Jesus Proves It A

Acts 2:38 can't be a universal salvation formula because the entire event is Jewish‑only—Jewish feast, Jewish city, Jewish prophecy, Jewish covenant law & a Jewish audience. ""Men of Judea-Men of Israel"") with zero Gentiles among the 3,000 saved. Acts 2 stands where it belongs: a covenant call to Israel, not a salvation formula for all peoples/nations.

When the gospel finally reaches Gentiles in Acts 10:44, Jesus Himself overrides the Acts 2 sequence & Holy Spirit seals them the moment they believe. Without circumcision, without water & before anything Peter commands.

Only Jesus Holy Spirit‑baptizes (Matt 3:11; Acts 1:5). Proving the universal pattern is Acts 10:44: Hear > Believe > Receive > the Holy Spirit.

Jesus Himself reveals the UNIVERSAL entry into the Body of Christ, Jew & Gentile pattern with His own hand.

LOL,

Acts 2:38-39
King James Version
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

"AS MANY AS THE LORD WILL CALL", and who did the Lord call, YEP HE CALLED the Gentiles in acts 10.

So what JESUS filled them first!!

Has JESUS filled you AT ALL?

 

[FlyingDove]

Pentecost Acts 2:38 formula: repent & be baptized isn't a universal formula.

If a salvation pattern is truly universal, it must work for all people, in all places, under all conditions. Acts 2 does not!

Acts 10:45 proves NO gentiles are saved among the 3,000 souls. Every saved person at Pentecost was under Mosaic law/covenant of circumcision.

"""Can the Acts 2:38 universal salvation promoters, provide ONE verse where a gentile is saved by the Acts 2:38 formula/sequence?"""

Acts 10 salvation formula works for all people, in all places, under all under the same circumstance/UNIVERSAL!

Acts 10:44 Based on their FAITH ALONE Jesus knows the heart of man (Matt 9:4, Jn 6:64,Acts 1:24, Rev 2:23) & baptizes these gentiles with His salvation sealing (Eph 1:13-14, 4:30, 2 Cor 1:22, 5:5) Holy Spirit-without circumcision & without water. (Only Jesus Holy Spirit‑baptizes Matt 3:11; Acts 1:5).

Hear > Believe > Receive > receive the Holy Spirit formula/sequence becomes the NT UNIVERSAL-Jew & Gentile initiation into the now newly formed Body of Christ.

1 Cor 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
(NOTE: For by the Holy Spirit are we ALL baptized into one body > whether Jew or Gentile)

Col 2:11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision "made without hands", in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
(NOTE: The NT circumcision of Christ, "made without hands." is the inward, SPIRITUAL work of the Holy Spirit)

Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
(NOTE: A circumcision of the heart, in the spirit & NOT of the LAW)

The risen Jesus chooses Paul as His vessel to carry His name to Gentiles, kings, and Israel (Acts 9:15). Jerusalem pillars affirm that Paul will go to the Gentiles while they go to the circumcision (Gal 2:9), Paul preaches the risen Christ & justification by faith apart from the Law (Acts 13:30–31, 38–39). Paul declares that the one God justifies both Jew & Gentile by faith (Rom 3:29–30). The Risen Lord sent him to open their eyes so they may receive forgiveness of sins & be sanctified by faith in Him (Acts 26:16–18).

 

[Ouch]

Pentecost Acts 2:38 formula: repent & be baptized isn't a universal formula.

If a salvation pattern is truly universal, it must work for all people, in all places, under all conditions. Acts 2 does not!

Acts 10:45 proves NO gentiles are saved among the 3,000 souls. Every saved person at Pentecost was under Mosaic law/covenant of circumcision.

"""Can the Acts 2:38 universal salvation promoters, provide ONE verse where a gentile is saved by the Acts 2:38 formula/sequence?"""

Acts 10 salvation formula works for all people, in all places, under all under the same circumstance/UNIVERSAL!

Acts 10:44 Based on their FAITH ALONE Jesus knows the heart of man (Matt 9:4, Jn 6:64,Acts 1:24, Rev 2:23) & baptizes these gentiles with His salvation sealing (Eph 1:13-14, 4:30, 2 Cor 1:22, 5:5) Holy Spirit-without circumcision & without water. (Only Jesus Holy Spirit‑baptizes Matt 3:11; Acts 1:5).

Hear > Believe > Receive > receive the Holy Spirit formula/sequence becomes the NT UNIVERSAL-Jew & Gentile initiation into the now newly formed Body of Christ.

1 Cor 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
(NOTE: For by the Holy Spirit are we ALL baptized into one body > whether Jew or Gentile)

Col 2:11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision "made without hands", in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
(NOTE: The NT circumcision of Christ, "made without hands." is the inward, SPIRITUAL work of the Holy Spirit)

Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
(NOTE: A circumcision of the heart, in the spirit & NOT of the LAW)

The risen Jesus chooses Paul as His vessel to carry His name to Gentiles, kings, and Israel (Acts 9:15). Jerusalem pillars affirm that Paul will go to the Gentiles while they go to the circumcision (Gal 2:9), Paul preaches the risen Christ & justification by faith apart from the Law (Acts 13:30–31, 38–39). Paul declares that the one God justifies both Jew & Gentile by faith (Rom 3:29–30). The Risen Lord sent him to open their eyes so they may receive forgiveness of sins & be sanctified by faith in Him (Acts 26:16–18).

So easy without all of the talking and explaning how wrong you are.

1 Corinthians 7:18-40
King James Version
18 Is any man called being circumcised? let him not become uncircumcised. Is any called in uncircumcision? let him not be circumcised.

19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

Galatians 3:28
King James Version
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

We are all ONE in Christ, GOD is not the one who is dividing us IT'S MEN like you who do you follow?

 

[FlyingDove]

Pentecost Acts 2:38 formula: repent & be baptized isn't a universal formula.

If a salvation pattern is truly universal, it must work for all people, in all places, under all conditions. Acts 2 does not!

Acts 10:45 proves NO gentiles are saved among the 3,000 souls. Every saved person at Pentecost was under Mosaic law/covenant of circumcision.

"""Can the Acts 2:38 universal salvation promoters, provide ONE verse where a gentile is saved by the Acts 2:38 formula/sequence?"""

Acts 10 salvation formula works for all people, in all places, under all under the same circumstance/UNIVERSAL!

Acts 10:44 Based on their FAITH ALONE Jesus knows the heart of man (Matt 9:4, Jn 6:64,Acts 1:24, Rev 2:23) & baptizes these gentiles with His salvation sealing (Eph 1:13-14, 4:30, 2 Cor 1:22, 5:5) Holy Spirit-without circumcision & without water. (Only Jesus Holy Spirit‑baptizes Matt 3:11; Acts 1:5).

Hear > Believe > Receive > receive the Holy Spirit formula/sequence becomes the NT UNIVERSAL-Jew & Gentile initiation into the now newly formed Body of Christ.

1 Cor 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
(NOTE: For by the Holy Spirit are we ALL baptized into one body > whether Jew or Gentile)

Col 2:11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision "made without hands", in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
(NOTE: The NT circumcision of Christ, "made without hands." is the inward, SPIRITUAL work of the Holy Spirit)

Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
(NOTE: A circumcision of the heart, in the spirit & NOT of the LAW)

The risen Jesus chooses Paul as His vessel to carry His name to Gentiles, kings, and Israel (Acts 9:15). Jerusalem pillars affirm that Paul will go to the Gentiles while they go to the circumcision (Gal 2:9), Paul preaches the risen Christ & justification by faith apart from the Law (Acts 13:30–31, 38–39). Paul declares that the one God justifies both Jew & Gentile by faith (Rom 3:29–30). The Risen Lord sent him to open their eyes so they may receive forgiveness of sins & be sanctified by faith in Him (Acts 26:16–18).

 

[Nedsk]

Apparently, you don't understand just fine and you keep asking me for evidence that my understanding of Scripture is authoritative. God's word is infallible, but mankind is not. Why would you ask me that question? When did I make unsubstantiated claims of possessing authoritative biblical knowledge? I simply read Scripture in context and properly harmonize scripture with Scripture before reaching my conclusion on doctrine. I don't claim to be the infallible interpreter of Scripture.

Then if you are the infallible interpretor of Scripture everything you say is your opinion and your opinion may be completely wrong. As a.result I don't listen to you I read Scripture and since God gave me a brain I can discern that belief in the idea that faith alone saves is unbiblical

 

[FlyingDove]

Salvation Is Accessed By Faith Alone

Rom 3:24 Being ""justified freely"" ""by his grace"" ""through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus""

Rom 3:25 God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

Rom 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

Justification is God the Judge issuing a judicial verdict of righteousness to the believer, by GRACE (Grace is a GIFT received thru FAITH Rom 3:24, 4:16, 5:1-2, 15, "11:6" & "Eph 2:5 & 8") based solely on their faith in Christ's finished redemptive work) Only ONE requirement to enter into ETERNAL LIFE (eternal is also a GIFT received thru FAITH Rom 6:23, Jn 5:24) & a white robe of RIGHEOUSESS (righteousness is also a GIFT A gift given thru FAITH Rom 4:5 & 5:17-18)

How Romans 3:24–26 Defines Justification
Paul gives three coordinated elements: The ground of justification - Christ's redemptive work. Through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus" (Rom 3:24) Whom God set forth as a propitiation/atonement (Rom 3:25)

The means of justification - faith in His blood (Rom 3:25). Justifier of the one who believes in Jesus (Rom 3:26). Faith is not the ground, it is the instrument by which the believer receives the not guilty verdict.

The nature of justification - It's a judicial verdict. Justified FREELY by His grace (Rom 3:24). That He might be just & the justifier (Rom 3:26). Paul is describing God as Judge issuing a legal declaration of righteousness.

God the Judge > Judicial, Issuing a verdict of righteousness. By grace > unearned gift. Received through faith > the instrument, based solely on Christ's finished redemptive work.

Taught in Rom 3:24–26, Rom 4:5–8, Rom 5:1 & Galatians 2:16.

Justification is God the Judge issuing a judicial verdict of righteousness to the believer, by grace, received through faith in Christ's finished redemptive work.

Eternal life is a gift received through faith (Rom 6:23 & Jn 5:24),

Righteousness is a gift received through faith (Rom 4:5; 5:17–18).

One requirement, one condition, one instrument: FAITH-because every saving benefit God gives is a GIFT received through FAITH, not works

Justification is God the Judge issuing a judicial verdict of righteousness to the believer, by grace (a gift received through faith-Rom 3:24, 4:16, 5:1–2, 5:15, 11:6, Eph 2:5, 8), based solely on their faith placed in Christs finished redemptive work.

Scripture teaches only one requirement to enter eternal life-FAITH-because eternal life is a GIFT received through FAITH (Rom 6:23 & Jn 5:24) & the white robe of righteousness is also a GIFT received through FAITH (Rom 4:5; 5:17–18). Jesus did all the work & we access all His wonderful GIFTS through FAITH in His OBEDIENT (Rom 5:19) FAITHFUL (Phil 2:8) work.

 

[Nedsk]

Salvation Is Accessed By Faith Alone

Rom 3:24 Being ""justified freely"" ""by his grace"" ""through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus""

Rom 3:25 God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

Rom 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

Justification is God the Judge issuing a judicial verdict of righteousness to the believer, by GRACE (Grace is a GIFT received thru FAITH Rom 3:24, 4:16, 5:1-2, 15, "11:6" & "Eph 2:5 & 8") based solely on their faith in Christ's finished redemptive work) Only ONE requirement to enter into ETERNAL LIFE (eternal is also a GIFT received thru FAITH Rom 6:23, Jn 5:24) & a white robe of RIGHEOUSESS (righteousness is also a GIFT A gift given thru FAITH Rom 4:5 & 5:17-18)

How Romans 3:24–26 Defines Justification
Paul gives three coordinated elements: The ground of justification - Christ's redemptive work. Through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus" (Rom 3:24) Whom God set forth as a propitiation/atonement (Rom 3:25)

The means of justification - faith in His blood (Rom 3:25). Justifier of the one who believes in Jesus (Rom 3:26). Faith is not the ground, it is the instrument by which the believer receives the not guilty verdict.

The nature of justification - It's a judicial verdict. Justified FREELY by His grace (Rom 3:24). That He might be just & the justifier (Rom 3:26). Paul is describing God as Judge issuing a legal declaration of righteousness.

God the Judge > Judicial, Issuing a verdict of righteousness. By grace > unearned gift. Received through faith > the instrument, based solely on Christ's finished redemptive work.

Taught in Rom 3:24–26, Rom 4:5–8, Rom 5:1 & Galatians 2:16.

Justification is God the Judge issuing a judicial verdict of righteousness to the believer, by grace, received through faith in Christ's finished redemptive work.

Eternal life is a gift received through faith (Rom 6:23 & Jn 5:24),

Righteousness is a gift received through faith (Rom 4:5; 5:17–18).

One requirement, one condition, one instrument: FAITH-because every saving benefit God gives is a GIFT received through FAITH, not works

Justification is God the Judge issuing a judicial verdict of righteousness to the believer, by grace (a gift received through faith-Rom 3:24, 4:16, 5:1–2, 5:15, 11:6, Eph 2:5, 8), based solely on their faith placed in Christs finished redemptive work.

Scripture teaches only one requirement to enter eternal life-FAITH-because eternal life is a GIFT received through FAITH (Rom 6:23 & Jn 5:24) & the white robe of righteousness is also a GIFT received through FAITH (Rom 4:5; 5:17–18). Jesus did all the work & we access all His wonderful GIFTS through FAITH in His OBEDIENT (Rom 5:19) FAITHFUL (Phil 2:8) work.

For the one millionth time NOTHING there said faith alone. The ONLY place in Scripture where it says "faith alone", that phrase is preceded by "saved by works and not"

 

[Ouch]

For the one millionth time NOTHING there said faith alone. The ONLY place in Scripture where it says "faith alone", that phrase is preceded by "saved by works and not"

Sorry, if you don't give up you may have to challenge him and others who think something is true but sure can't back it up a million more times.

I thing the flying down the road path dove guy put me on ignore, kinda of happy about it LOL.

 

[Nedsk]

Sorry, if you don't give up you may have to challenge him and others who think something is true but sure can't back it up a million more times.

I thing the flying down the road path dove guy put me on ignore, kinda of happy about it LOL.

Well I do it because it exposes the rote memorization they all employ. They don't really know what they're posting it's just what they've been taught to say. They're used to people giving up and walking away or falling for the flashiness of their presentation. Some call me stupid some call me stubborn and which ever it might be, I don't just walk away

 

[Ouch]

Well I do it because it exposes the rote memorization they all employ. They don't really know what they're posting it's just what they've been taught to say. They're used to people giving up and walking away or falling for the flashiness of their presentation. Some call me stupid some call me stubborn and which ever it might be, I don't just walk away

AMEN, in no way did I mean for you to.

As I said, I think he put me on ignore.

We have a mission and sometimes not easy.

I told the mailman guy I was done dealing with him and the spirit told me not to give up so I went back on my word and keep going.

Those who endure until the end will be saved, GOD BLESS YOU.

What makes me sad is all I have done, didn't look like it put a dent in their armor, but may next week or next year?

Very few here battle the faith or grace only, most accept it and no idea how or why?

 

[Nedsk]

AMEN, in no way did I mean for you to.

As I said, I think he put me on ignore.

We have a mission and sometimes not easy.

I told the mailman guy I was done dealing with him and the spirit told me not to give up so I went back on my word and keep going.

Those who endure until the end will be saved, GOD BLESS YOU.

What makes me sad is all I have done, didn't look like it put a dent in their armor, but may next week or next year?

Very few here battle the faith or grace only, most accept it and no idea how or why?

I think you're the lucky one with the ignore. Lol

Only God can put a dent in that armor. The message they get is very appealing, just believe and you're assured salvation. They claim nothing we do can result in losing our salvation but they claim you just can't do whatever you want. They want it both ways.

 

[Ouch]

I think you're the lucky one with the ignore. Lol

Only God can put a dent in that armor. The message they get is very appealing, just believe and you're assured salvation. They claim nothing we do can result in losing our salvation but they claim you just can't do whatever you want. They want it both ways.

If they had any clue that GOD who sure us a forgiving GOD, but how many people was in sent to Hell during the flood and how many people was saved maybe they would think twice?

GOD, because of HIS Actions millions? drowned and only 8 people who OBEYED HIS word survived.

HE is a good GOD but EXPECTS us to be obedient and obey HIM.

I think about the one tribe in OT who didn't obey HIM, the ground opened up swallowed a whole tribe of people.

Do you think they had faith or was obedient?

Yea man, they were living for HIM just got greedy.

Plant those seeds let GOD give the increase.

GOD BLESS YOU.

 

[Ouch]

The issue is what Scripture says the events meant & how God Himself changed the Holy Spirit' dispensational stewardship (Acts 2 salvation given after & Acts 10 before water)

Under the Old Covenant & during early Acts, Israel's remission framework was tied to covenant repentance & national guilt (Acts 2:36–38), but remission itself always came by blood, never by water (Lev 17:11; Heb 9:22; Matt 26:28). Water purified the flesh (Heb 9:10), but only blood removed sin. Lev 17:11 For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul. That is why your claim that water remits sins cannot stand.

2ndly, Acts 2 Peter is preaching to Israel ONLY! ""Men of Judea-Vs14"" ""Men of Israel-Vs22"" at a Jewish feast, in a Jewish city, fulfilling a Jewish prophecy, under Jewish COVENANT LAWS.

The Holy Spirit is given after repentance & water because Israel's covenant initiations were physical. Just as physical circumcision initiated the Old Covenant.

Gentiles were never under Israel's purification system of part of John's water baptism or Mosaic covenant laws (Eph 2:12). Ten years after Pentecost God turns to the Gentiles in Acts 10, He does not repeat the Acts 2 order - He reverses it. The Holy Spirit/SALVATION falls on Cornelius' household while Peter is still preaching (Acts 10:44)

The Holy Spirit is Gods Gift of Eternal Life. You can't change recorded scripture:

Mark 1:8 I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost.
(NOTE: He shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost. Also see Mat 3:11, Lk 3:16 & Jn 1:33)

2 Tim 1:14 Refers to the Holy Spirit as a Good Deposit.

2 Cor 5:5, Eph 1:14 & 2 Cor 1:22. Refer to the Holy Spirit as "the earnest" = Deposit or Pledge.

Eph 1:13, 2 Cor 1:22 & Eph 4:30 Refer to the Holy Spirit as a Seal.

2 Tim 1:14 The Holy Spirit who dwells within us, guard the good deposit entrusted to you
(NOTE: The Holy Spirit dwelling within us. Is God's good deposit given us until the day of redemption)

2 Cor 5:5 God, who also hath given unto us the "earnest" of the Spirit
(NOTE: God's Holy Spirit dwelling within us is the earnest. Earnest translated from the Greek word: arrabon. Also means a deposit/pledge. In modern Greek arrabona is an "engagement ring.")

2 Cor 1:22 Who hath also "sealed us" & "given the earnest" of the Holy Spirit in our hearts
(NOTE: God has placed His Holy Spirit in the believers heart. As a DEPOSIT/PLEDGE & SEAL, until the soon coming day of our final redemption)

Eph 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
(NOTE: You heard about Christ's finished sin redemptive payment & resurrection. When you believed/trusted, Christ sealed/baptized you with His Holy Spirit).

Eph1:14 Which is the "earnest" of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession
(NOTE: The Holy Spirit by which only Christ baptizes/seals & indwells us. Is God's earnest = a down payment/pledge)

Eph 4:30 grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are "sealed" unto the day of redemption
(NOTE: Believers are SEALED with God's Holy Spirit. Christ's pledge/promise that he will come for us)

GENTILES RECEIVE GODS ETERNAL LIFE GIVING HOLY SPIRIT - BEFORE WATER! - Peter explains the process:

Acts 10:
45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
(NOTE: Vs44, Gentiles RECEIVE Gods Eternal Life Gift-the Holy Spirit - BEFORE WATER!. Vs47, Gentiles HAVE received Gods Eternal Life Gift-the Holy Spirit. - BEFORE WATER!)

Acts 11: Peter says
16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.

18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.
(NOTE: Vs16, Jesus alone baptizes with/in/by His Eternal Giving Holy Spirit. Vs18, GOD GAVE the Gentiles the same Salvation SEALING-Eph 1:13-14, 4:30, 2 Cor 1:22, 5:5, 2 Tim 1:14-FOREVER INDWELLING (Jn 14:16)- REPENTANCE GRANTING Holy Spirit- SAVED-SEALED-FORGIVEN-BY FAITH ALONE-BEFORE WATER!)

That is the dispensational shift - from a Jewish, water-mediated reception of the Holy Spirit in Acts 2 to a universal, faith-based Spirit baptism in Acts 10.

This is exactly how Gentiles become the fulfillment of God's promise to Abraham that he would be the father of many nations (Gen 17:5; Gal 3:8, 14). Not through rituals, but through faith.

Peter preached Jesus death & resurrection in Acts 2 & Acts 10. Same gospel message Paul preached (1 Cor 15:1-4 & Rom 10:9-10). But God changes the Holy Spirit administration from "repent from breaking covenant & be water baptized to receive the Holy Sprit.

Gentiles were never under any Mosaic covenants (Eph 2:12) During Peters message God changes the previous Holy Spirit' administration from repent, be water baptized & receive the Holy Spirit to ""Hear, Believe, Receive the H/S, then be water baptized.""

Scripture is clear: at Cornelius' house the baptism protocol is inverted - Holy Spirit 1st upon belief/faith, then water & that's the universal order for the Body of Christ

Why are you saying the first part of the book of Acts is old convenant the the seconad part is new convenent?

I DON'T CLAIM ANYTHING, YOUR STATEMENT AND YOU ARE CLAIMING THAT HIS WORD IS A LIE.

Acts 2:38-39
King James Version
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 22:16
King James Version
16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

You twisting and spining HIS word is not a good idea.

So is Acts 19 new convented?

Paul askes you HAVE YOU,

Acts 19:1 And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples,

2 He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.

3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.

4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.

5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

HAVE YOU???

Acts 10 they were COMMANDED to be bapitzed.

So WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN Acts 2, 8, 10 and 19

Acts 2 and 10 they got the Holy Ghost first WHO CARES still the same outcome.