How do preachers or teachers explain this?

[GWH]

When a discussion of the OP devolves into an argument, it might help to get back on topic per the OP, which is "How do preachers or teachers explain this?": JOHN 14:12 12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

My answer was "In a sense, Paul did greater work measured as the number of converts."
(Gg asked for an example, but the greater number of converts WAS the example.)

So, what was the answer of @Godsgood and @DavidLamb ?

If anyone else wants to share/reiterate their answer, please do so.

Then we can compare answers and see whether they are additive agreements or contradictory disagreements.
Thanks!

 

[Godsgood]

Yet we are told that she was indeed a young girl:

NKJV Luk 8:41 And behold, there came a man named Jairus, and he was a ruler of the synagogue. And he fell down at Jesus' feet and begged Him to come to his house,
Luk 8:42 for he had an only daughter about twelve years of age, and she was dying. But as He went, the multitudes thronged Him.

True, Jesus also raised Lazarus, an adult, and the widow's son at Nain, described in Luke as a "dead man." But the passage telling us about the daughter of Jairus, though it shows us that Jesus had power to raise the dead, is not referring to some spiritual characteristic common to the widow's son at Nain and Lazarus.


Lazarus did not have to be a little girl for Jesus to raise him. He was dead, and could not display child-like characteristics.

Some events of the past are still taking place today, but by no means all of them. God is not destroying the world with a flood, as He did in Noah's day. He is not still parting the Red Sea, or bring plagues upon Pharaoh and Egypt. He is not still causing His Holy Spirit to come down like tongues of fire. However, I do agree that God's word will never pass away. As Peter wrote:

NKJV 1Pe 1:24 because "ALL FLESH IS AS GRASS, AND ALL THE GLORY OF MAN AS THE FLOWER OF THE GRASS. THE GRASS WITHERS, AND ITS FLOWER FALLS AWAY,
1Pe 1:25 BUT THE WORD OF THE LORD ENDURES FOREVER." Now this is the word which by the gospel was preached to you.

Yet we are told that she was indeed a young girl:

Because people can only understand the literal meaning of the word of God.
Therefore, it is clear to us that the girl being referred to by the Lord was most likely a normal twelve-year-old girl only.

However, the Lord said in Isaiah 55:8, “Your thoughts are not My thoughts.” Therefore, what may seem clear and understandable to human beings is not necessarily the truth.

What if I told you that the Lord’s disciples, although they were grown men with beards, were nevertheless still regarded as little children according to the Lord’s understanding?

 

[Godsgood]

Yet we are told that she was indeed a young girl:

NKJV Luk 8:41 And behold, there came a man named Jairus, and he was a ruler of the synagogue. And he fell down at Jesus' feet and begged Him to come to his house,
Luk 8:42 for he had an only daughter about twelve years of age, and she was dying. But as He went, the multitudes thronged Him.

True, Jesus also raised Lazarus, an adult, and the widow's son at Nain, described in Luke as a "dead man." But the passage telling us about the daughter of Jairus, though it shows us that Jesus had power to raise the dead, is not referring to some spiritual characteristic common to the widow's son at Nain and Lazarus.


Lazarus did not have to be a little girl for Jesus to raise him. He was dead, and could not display child-like characteristics.

Some events of the past are still taking place today, but by no means all of them. God is not destroying the world with a flood, as He did in Noah's day. He is not still parting the Red Sea, or bring plagues upon Pharaoh and Egypt. He is not still causing His Holy Spirit to come down like tongues of fire. However, I do agree that God's word will never pass away. As Peter wrote:

NKJV 1Pe 1:24 because "ALL FLESH IS AS GRASS, AND ALL THE GLORY OF MAN AS THE FLOWER OF THE GRASS. THE GRASS WITHERS, AND ITS FLOWER FALLS AWAY,
1Pe 1:25 BUT THE WORD OF THE LORD ENDURES FOREVER." Now this is the word which by the gospel was preached to you.

True, Jesus also raised Lazarus, an adult, and the widow's son at Nain, described in Luke as a "dead man." But the passage telling us about the daughter of Jairus, though it shows us that Jesus had power to raise the dead, is not referring to some spiritual characteristic common to the widow's son at Nain and Lazarus.


Lazarus did not have to be a little girl for Jesus to raise him. He was dead, and could not display child-like characteristics.

Some events of the past are still taking place today, but by no means all of them. God is not destroying the world with a flood, as He did in Noah's day. He is not still parting the Red Sea, or bring plagues upon Pharaoh and Egypt. He is not still causing His Holy Spirit to come down like tongues of fire. However, I do agree that God's word will never pass away. As Peter wrote:

NKJV 1Pe 1:24 because "ALL FLESH IS AS GRASS, AND ALL THE GLORY OF MAN AS THE FLOWER OF THE GRASS. THE GRASS WITHERS, AND ITS FLOWER FALLS AWAY,
1Pe 1:25 BUT THE WORD OF THE LORD ENDURES FOREVER." Now this is the word which by the gospel was preached to you.

Yet you acknowledge that the word of God will never pass away (Matthew 24:35).
Why, then, do you not see what you are saying in the condition of your heart?
This is because you understand the words of God only in a literal sense, making it impossible for you to fully demonstrate the truth of Matthew 24:35.

However, we who know the one true God continue to see all the things you mentioned as still taking place.
For example, the Lord raising the little girl from the dead, the great flood that destroyed many people throughout the world in the time of Noah, the parting of the Red Sea, the miracles God performed in Egypt, and the descent of the Holy Spirit like tongues of fire. We see all these things as continuing to happen and as things that will happen again.

Therefore, when we say that the word of God will never pass away, we do not mean it in the same way you do.
In your case, it is merely something you say or something that comes out of your mouth.
But in our case, we testify to it before people and demonstrate its truth.

 

[DavidLamb]

Yet we are told that she was indeed a young girl:

Because people can only understand the literal meaning of the word of God.
Therefore, it is clear to us that the girl being referred to by the Lord was most likely a normal twelve-year-old girl only.

However, the Lord said in Isaiah 55:8, “Your thoughts are not My thoughts.” Therefore, what may seem clear and understandable to human beings is not necessarily the truth.

What if I told you that the Lord’s disciples, although they were grown men with beards, were nevertheless still regarded as little children according to the Lord’s understanding?

It is certainly true that we are to become "like little children" in our following of the Saviour. But that doesn't mean that every time a child is referred to in the Bible, whether it's Jairus's daughter, the young Samuel, the lad with the five barley loaves and two fish, or any other actual child, we have to assume that there is some hidden meaning.

 

[Dino246]

When Jesus said, “Destroy this temple” (John 2:19), He was speaking in parable or dark saying about the temple.
However, because they were inside the literal temple, the Jews understood Him to be referring to the literal temple (John 2:20).
But when He revealed that the temple actually referred to His own body (John 2:21), it was no longer a parable.

The Lord’s purpose in presenting this demonstration was to emphasize how He speaks through parables. It was meant to teach those who read and believe the Holy Scriptures to humble themselves and ask the Lord for mercy, so that He Himself would reveal the meaning of His parabolic words (Mark 4:34).

But the opposite happened. Instead of humbling themselves, the people became proud, claiming that they already understood what was written and therefore insisting that the words were not parables at all. Without realizing it, they became like the disciples or the multitude who, after being fed by the Lord and failing to understand His parabolic teaching, walked away and left Him (John 6:60, 66).

It's not "parable" or "dark saying". It's a metaphor.

Instead of humbling yourself and learning, you have chosen to shut your mind to correction and persist with your errors.

 

[Dino246]

Would you claim that those words have a non-literal meaning?

The words of God have a literal meaning. People assume that this is all there is to them, so they understand them in the same way that the Jews understood the word “temple” (John 2:20). This was because the Lord said it while they were inside the temple (John 2:19).

But without realizing it, this is where people are deceived. For the literal meaning kills.
2 CORINTHIANS 3:6
6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

As an example, let me ask you this: What did John the Baptist use in his baptism?

Again, you have not understood the words correctly. Paul is not saying that literal interpretation of God's word "killeth", but rather he was contrasting the Law with the gospel. The Law is rigid and specific: do this, don't do that. It doesn't and cannot possibly cover every imaginable situation, and it does not provide for genuine forgiveness or a cleansing of the conscience. Only the Spirit does those for us.

 

[DavidLamb]

Yet you acknowledge that the word of God will never pass away (Matthew 24:35).
Why, then, do you not see what you are saying in the condition of your heart?
This is because you understand the words of God only in a literal sense, making it impossible for you to fully demonstrate the truth of Matthew 24:35.

The condition of my heart is that of a sinner saved entirely by God's grace through the work of my Saviour on the cross. Much of God's word is literally true. It is not one long parable from Genesis 1 to Revelation 22.

However, we who know the one true God continue to see all the things you mentioned as still taking place.
For example, the Lord raising the little girl from the dead, the great flood that destroyed many people throughout the world in the time of Noah, the parting of the Red Sea, the miracles God performed in Egypt, and the descent of the Holy Spirit like tongues of fire. We see all these things as continuing to happen and as things that will happen again.

That just is not so. Take the Flood for example. God actually made this promise afterwards:

NKJV Gen 9:11 Thus I establish My covenant with you: Never again shall all flesh be cut off by the waters of the flood; never again shall there be a flood to destroy the earth."

So we don't see all these things as continuing to happen and as things that will happen again.

Therefore, when we say that the word of God will never pass away, we do not mean it in the same way you do.
In your case, it is merely something you say or something that comes out of your mouth.
But in our case, we testify to it before people and demonstrate its truth.

You are making judgments about me again. Saying that God's word will never pass away certainly is not "something I say or something that comes out of my mouth." It is something that I firmly believe because it is taught clearly in the Bible. It is something that I preach, and a truth that I firmly hold.

 

[Dino246]

We are here to seek the truth, and the word of God is sacred.
Therefore, it should not be treated as something to be debated.

If, according to your belief, what you are reading is not the truth, would it not be better to simply disregard it?
For God is the One who sees and knows all things.

Do you honestly think that you should be able to state your interpretation of God's word and we should treat it as sacred? What utter hogwash! When you simply quote Scripture without commentary and without incorrect implications, there is no debate.

What is debated is your ideas about Scripture.

 

[Dino246]

This is like when the Lord Jesus, in His role as the Son of the living God

That's His identity, not a mere role.

 

[Dino246]

When we carry the Holy Spirit within us we are guided by his wisdom.
Those who link as one to that power, as Jesus said,will be able to do as he did.

Immanuel,God with us,was Holy God Spirit manifest in flesh.
Now,he is indwelling us.

"Those who link as one to that power"?

That sounds like New Age hogwash.

 

[Dino246]

When He said, "Little girl, arise" to the daughter of Jairus,

Yes, this is a parable.

Wow. Just... wow.

There is apparently no end to the depth of your errors.

 

[Dino246]

Why then are you debating it?

You are the only one saying that I am debating. I am simply sharing the truth.
And indeed, the truth can be painful. Hebrews 4:12.

When you quote Scripture without any commentary or implication, you are "simply sharing the truth".

When you insist that Jesus' words to the little girl are a parable, you are blaring your erroneous opinion. That's the painful truth you need to accept.

 

[Dino246]

Of course it isn't. He said to the dead little girl, "Arise," and she immediately arose. Straightforward words.

The term “little girl” has a corresponding meaning in the Lord’s understanding. It refers to a spiritual characteristic of a person, whether literally male or female, young or old.

For example, Lazarus, the brother of Martha and Mary Magdalene, was raised by the Lord in the same way as the little girl. Although Lazarus was a man and was no longer a child, in the presence of the Lord, Lazarus was a “little girl.” Otherwise, the Lord would not have raised him.

That's the most ridiculous thing I've read all week.

 

[rewriter]

His words will never pass away.

"In the beginning was the word,and the word was with God and the word was God....
...and the word became flesh and dwelt among us."

View attachment 293791​

I liked the photo you shared.

 

[Dino246]

However, we who know the one true God continue to see all the things you mentioned as still taking place.
For example, the Lord raising the little girl from the dead, the great flood that destroyed many people throughout the world in the time of Noah, the parting of the Red Sea, the miracles God performed in Egypt, and the descent of the Holy Spirit like tongues of fire. We see all these things as continuing to happen and as things that will happen again.

I'm beginning to think that when you use the phrase "the one true God" that you mean someone other than the God of the Bible, because you claim to know him yet believe things that are incompatible with reality.

The great flood is one-and-done. God will never repeat it. The little girl rising from the dead is also a one-time event. She hasn't been raised from the dead repeatedly across two millennia. The spiritual showdown in Egypt does not continue to take place; Moses and Pharaoh are long dead. The Red Sea was parted once, not many times.

Therefore, when we say that the word of God will never pass away, we do not mean it in the same way you do.
In your case, it is merely something you say or something that comes out of your mouth.
But in our case, we testify to it before people and demonstrate its truth.

Who is the "we" to whom you refer? Whose is the "our" in this case? Are there many of you inside your head, or are there many real people who believe the rampant errors that you hold?

 

[Bible_Locket]

I liked the photo you shared.

The face extrapolated from the shroud of Turin.

 

[rewriter]

The face extrapolated from the shroud of Turin.

That is why I like it. A single object that includes blood stains, water stains and a photographic negative, the latter fitting how Plato described the appearance of the spirit realm in the physical. 1 John 5:8 is often cited as referencing agreement, but in reality the Greek implies an object being referenced.

 

[rewriter]

That is why I like it. A single object that includes blood stains, water stains and a photographic negative, the latter fitting how Plato described the appearance of the spirit realm in the physical. 1 John 5:8 is often cited as referencing agreement, but in reality the Greek implies an object being referenced.

Be careful Bible_Locket, your heart emo could be understood as you realizing that there just might be a connection between 1 John 5:8 and Galatians 3:1. But that could also imply that maybe the earliest church had something that they actively concealed from outsiders, and with such active concealment might have unintentionally distorted how some scripture is understood.

 

[Godsgood]

It is certainly true that we are to become "like little children" in our following of the Saviour. But that doesn't mean that every time a child is referred to in the Bible, whether it's Jairus's daughter, the young Samuel, the lad with the five barley loaves and two fish, or any other actual child, we have to assume that there is some hidden meaning.

The word Little Children and Like Little Children are different. The disciples of Christ are Little Children and not Like Little Children.

 

[Godsgood]

The condition of my heart is that of a sinner saved entirely by God's grace through the work of my Saviour on the cross. Much of God's word is literally true. It is not one long parable from Genesis 1 to Revelation 22.

That just is not so. Take the Flood for example. God actually made this promise afterwards:

NKJV Gen 9:11 Thus I establish My covenant with you: Never again shall all flesh be cut off by the waters of the flood; never again shall there be a flood to destroy the earth."

So we don't see all these things as continuing to happen and as things that will happen again.

You are making judgments about me again. Saying that God's word will never pass away certainly is not "something I say or something that comes out of my mouth." It is something that I firmly believe because it is taught clearly in the Bible. It is something that I preach, and a truth that I firmly hold.

That just is not so. Take the Flood for example. God actually made this promise afterwards:

NKJV Gen 9:11 Thus I establish My covenant with you: Never again shall all flesh be cut off by the waters of the flood; never again shall there be a flood to destroy the earth."

What do you understand in Gen 9:11?