If Adam's death caused death to all , Jesus's death should cause life to all right? - regardless of our choice -

Scarlett7297 · May 31, 2022

Literally speaking , for one man Adam , all were punished to death and it was by the choice made by Adam and we didn't have a say in this and so all regardless of making any choice we are counted as those who are dying. So , now by one , Jesus , the resurrection should come to all....regardless of whether we make the choice or not , right?

For if by the transgression of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many. 1 Corinthians 15:21-23 For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive.

So , because of Christ , resurrection has to be guaranteed for all humans. Isn't that right?
Have a look at this -

- much more did the grace of God and the gift

All of us agree that grace and a gift are a good thing? Also all of us agree that the angels ...when they met the 3 wise men ,mentioned about - good tidings to all men?

I mentioned this last point because - I know some of you might argue that , yes , we will be resurrected - some to the resurrection of life and some to the resurrection of condemnation according to John 5:29

John 5:29 (King James Version)And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Now , regardless of our choice made in this life whether or not we accept Jesus , all men should receive the good tidings if you take into consideration that when Adam ate the fruit , we his children , didn't ourselves eat it but still death came to all regardless of whether their actions were good or bad. Those who chose to do good were exempt from death? No right?. Death came to all. Now therefore, those of us humans over here who have not believed in Jesus are doing what ? - choosing to be disobedient to the gospel ? - is this good? Most of us will say - it isn't. The gospel is the truth. Regardless , they will be given life because good didn't cancel death because of Adam , and so bad doesn't cancel life given by Jesus. Isn't it? Therefore, the "gift" should come to all men regardless, right? So everyone gets resurrected from the dead (supposing you are with me till now) - how is it a "grace of God and the gift" - if some of us humans are waking up from our graves only to go for eternal hell fire? It's worse than just dying and going to our grave.
Now if you might argue that - no soul dies - then I have to ask you , why did Jesus die? - to save only our physical bodies....or to save our soul as well? and so there - did Adam's sin also mean that with our body , our soul will be in the punishment ?(since the argument is that soul can't die) but it will be in an awful place (hell) and Jesus saved us from just that. But then again...if in Adam all die (soul - and body ) , and am calling the death of soul as - second death because it's alive right? but in hell (that is second death as far as my knowledge is concerned) ...then in Jesus all live (soul and body) - and thus if the second death is what the death of the soul is in relation to Adam , doesn't it have to be exactly the opposite ( as per the verse given above - 1 corinthians) - and what can be opposite to the death I cited here? - Life. The verse says alive.

This has got me a bit on the edge and I need some strong point of views from my fellow Christians. Be free to correct me, wherever I am wrong.

Roughsoul1991 · May 31, 2022

Scarlett7297 said:

Literally speaking , for one man Adam , all were punished to death and it was by the choice made by Adam and we didn't have a say in this and so all regardless of making any choice we are counted as those who are dying. So , now by one , Jesus , the resurrection should come to all....regardless of whether we make the choice or not , right?

For if by the transgression of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many. 1 Corinthians 15:21-23 For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive.

So , because of Christ , resurrection has to be guaranteed for all humans. Isn't that right?
Have a look at this -

- much more did the grace of God and the gift

All of us agree that grace and a gift are a good thing? Also all of us agree that the angels ...when they met the 3 wise men ,mentioned about - good tidings to all men?

I mentioned this last point because - I know some of you might argue that , yes , we will be resurrected - some to the resurrection of life and some to the resurrection of condemnation according to John 5:29

John 5:29 (King James Version)And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Now , regardless of our choice made in this life whether or not we accept Jesus , all men should receive the good tidings if you take into consideration that when Adam ate the fruit , we his children , didn't ourselves eat it but still death came to all regardless of whether their actions were good or bad. Those who chose to do good were exempt from death? No right?. Death came to all. Now therefore, those of us humans over here who have not believed in Jesus are doing what ? - choosing to be disobedient to the gospel ? - is this good? Most of us will say - it isn't. The gospel is the truth. Regardless , they will be given life because good didn't cancel death because of Adam , and so bad doesn't cancel life given by Jesus. Isn't it? Therefore, the "gift" should come to all men regardless, right? So everyone gets resurrected from the dead (supposing you are with me till now) - how is it a "grace of God and the gift" - if some of us humans are waking up from our graves only to go for eternal hell fire? It's worse than just dying and going to our grave.
Now if you might argue that - no soul dies - then I have to ask you , why did Jesus die? - to save only our physical bodies....or to save our soul as well? and so there - did Adam's sin also mean that with our body , our soul will be in the punishment ?(since the argument is that soul can't die) but it will be in an awful place (hell) and Jesus saved us from just that. But then again...if in Adam all die (soul - and body ) , and am calling the death of soul as - second death because it's alive right? but in hell (that is second death as far as my knowledge is concerned) ...then in Jesus all live (soul and body) - and thus if the second death is what the death of the soul is in relation to Adam , doesn't it have to be exactly the opposite ( as per the verse given above - 1 corinthians) - and what can be opposite to the death I cited here? - Life. The verse says alive.

This has got me a bit on the edge and I need some strong point of views from my fellow Christians. Be free to correct me, wherever I am wrong.

It is true that all fell under the curse of Adam but was it Adam that gave rise to sin? No, Adam gave rise to the fall due to the first sin. Human by design are sinful due to free will. It was God's only design to allow choice.

All of humanity came under the curse due to every individuals inability to be perfect.

Scripture tells us Jesus saves all who will believe, that God wishes none to perish and all to come to salvation. Scripture says that God draws all mankind unto Himself and that none are without excuse.

Jesus paid for the sins of all manind but He didn't take the will of all mankind.

Scripture says wide is the way to destruction but narrow is the way to life and not many will find it.

So every individual is accountable to Adams curse only in context that God knew that would be the outcome of free will. We all choose sin.

But God provided a way to give anyone salvation by faith in Christ. We must choose to die in sin or live in Christ.

Jocund · May 31, 2022

Scarlett7297 said:

Literally speaking , for one man Adam , all were punished to death and it was by the choice made by Adam and we didn't have a say in this and so all regardless of making any choice we are counted as those who are dying. So , now by one , Jesus , the resurrection should come to all....regardless of whether we make the choice or not , right?

For if by the transgression of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many. 1 Corinthians 15:21-23 For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive.

So , because of Christ , resurrection has to be guaranteed for all humans. Isn't that right?
Have a look at this -

- much more did the grace of God and the gift

All of us agree that grace and a gift are a good thing? Also all of us agree that the angels ...when they met the 3 wise men ,mentioned about - good tidings to all men?

I mentioned this last point because - I know some of you might argue that , yes , we will be resurrected - some to the resurrection of life and some to the resurrection of condemnation according to John 5:29

John 5:29 (King James Version)And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Now , regardless of our choice made in this life whether or not we accept Jesus , all men should receive the good tidings if you take into consideration that when Adam ate the fruit , we his children , didn't ourselves eat it but still death came to all regardless of whether their actions were good or bad. Those who chose to do good were exempt from death? No right?. Death came to all. Now therefore, those of us humans over here who have not believed in Jesus are doing what ? - choosing to be disobedient to the gospel ? - is this good? Most of us will say - it isn't. The gospel is the truth. Regardless , they will be given life because good didn't cancel death because of Adam , and so bad doesn't cancel life given by Jesus. Isn't it? Therefore, the "gift" should come to all men regardless, right? So everyone gets resurrected from the dead (supposing you are with me till now) - how is it a "grace of God and the gift" - if some of us humans are waking up from our graves only to go for eternal hell fire? It's worse than just dying and going to our grave.
Now if you might argue that - no soul dies - then I have to ask you , why did Jesus die? - to save only our physical bodies....or to save our soul as well? and so there - did Adam's sin also mean that with our body , our soul will be in the punishment ?(since the argument is that soul can't die) but it will be in an awful place (hell) and Jesus saved us from just that. But then again...if in Adam all die (soul - and body ) , and am calling the death of soul as - second death because it's alive right? but in hell (that is second death as far as my knowledge is concerned) ...then in Jesus all live (soul and body) - and thus if the second death is what the death of the soul is in relation to Adam , doesn't it have to be exactly the opposite ( as per the verse given above - 1 corinthians) - and what can be opposite to the death I cited here? - Life. The verse says alive.

This has got me a bit on the edge and I need some strong point of views from my fellow Christians. Be free to correct me, wherever I am wrong.

I'm having a hard time understanding what exactly you are asking.

There are conditions for entering the covenant of Christ, if that is what you are asking.

Deuteronomy · May 31, 2022

Scarlett7297 said:

Hello Scarlett, Adam's 'sin' is the reason that he died (first spiritually, and then eventually, physically). His sin is also the reason that we are all born dead (spiritually), and why we all die physically as well, since we, as the progeny of Adam and Eve, are begotten in their fallen/tarnished image. All of us who are, "in Adam", that is (there was, after all, One Person, in the whole of human history, who was not born, "in Adam", PTL).

And all who choose to remain, "in Adam", will die.

In a somewhat similar way, all who make the "choice" to come to saving faith in/be saved by the Lord Jesus, IOW, those who are now (or who will be) "in Christ", all of these (and these alone) will be "made alive".

~Deut

Amanuensis · May 31, 2022

I don't believe he intended for us to understand him as promoting some kind of spiritual physics.

Keep it simple. Adam and Eve failed the test. Jesus passed the test and so Jesus made the way for us to follow Him in obedience.

Death came by Adam but we all sin our own sins.

We have all been invited to the banquet of eternal life in the Kingdom of God but if we allow ourselves to be preoccupied with the affairs of this life and make excuses, Jesus says.

not one of those who were invited will get a taste of my banquet. Luke 14:24

Magenta · Jun 1, 2022

Scarlett7297 said:

Wrong. The resurrection to life ever after is predicated on faith in the shed righteous
blood of Jesus Christ. Those not raised to life ever after are raised to condemnation
and everlasting contempt. In other words, they pass out of life into the second death.

Scarlett7297 said:

No. First comes the physical, then the spiritual. If one is not born again by faith in Christ,
Who is Himself the source of life, the giver and sustainer of life, then following the
resurrection and judgment of all at the end of this age they, not being covered by
grace, are judged and condemned under the law, which all have failed, and they pass
into the second death, which those covered by grace through faith in the shed righteous
blood of Christ for the remission of their sins, escape, being reconciled to God.

2ndTimothyGroup · Jun 1, 2022

Jesus died for those who were foreknown:

Romans 8:29-30 NKJV - "For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified."

It seems to me that the question become this:

Do we believe the Bible? Do we believe Rom 8:29-30?

Magenta · Jun 1, 2022

2ndTimothyGroup said:

Romans 8:28

Runningman · Jun 1, 2022

Scarlett7297 said:

Literally speaking , for one man Adam , all were punished to death and it was by the choice made by Adam and we didn't have a say in this and so all regardless of making any choice we are counted as those who are dying. So , now by one , Jesus , the resurrection should come to all....regardless of whether we make the choice or not , right?

For if by the transgression of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many. 1 Corinthians 15:21-23 For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive.

So , because of Christ , resurrection has to be guaranteed for all humans. Isn't that right?
Have a look at this -

- much more did the grace of God and the gift

All of us agree that grace and a gift are a good thing? Also all of us agree that the angels ...when they met the 3 wise men ,mentioned about - good tidings to all men?

I mentioned this last point because - I know some of you might argue that , yes , we will be resurrected - some to the resurrection of life and some to the resurrection of condemnation according to John 5:29

John 5:29 (King James Version)And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Now , regardless of our choice made in this life whether or not we accept Jesus , all men should receive the good tidings if you take into consideration that when Adam ate the fruit , we his children , didn't ourselves eat it but still death came to all regardless of whether their actions were good or bad. Those who chose to do good were exempt from death? No right?. Death came to all. Now therefore, those of us humans over here who have not believed in Jesus are doing what ? - choosing to be disobedient to the gospel ? - is this good? Most of us will say - it isn't. The gospel is the truth. Regardless , they will be given life because good didn't cancel death because of Adam , and so bad doesn't cancel life given by Jesus. Isn't it? Therefore, the "gift" should come to all men regardless, right? So everyone gets resurrected from the dead (supposing you are with me till now) - how is it a "grace of God and the gift" - if some of us humans are waking up from our graves only to go for eternal hell fire? It's worse than just dying and going to our grave.
Now if you might argue that - no soul dies - then I have to ask you , why did Jesus die? - to save only our physical bodies....or to save our soul as well? and so there - did Adam's sin also mean that with our body , our soul will be in the punishment ?(since the argument is that soul can't die) but it will be in an awful place (hell) and Jesus saved us from just that. But then again...if in Adam all die (soul - and body ) , and am calling the death of soul as - second death because it's alive right? but in hell (that is second death as far as my knowledge is concerned) ...then in Jesus all live (soul and body) - and thus if the second death is what the death of the soul is in relation to Adam , doesn't it have to be exactly the opposite ( as per the verse given above - 1 corinthians) - and what can be opposite to the death I cited here? - Life. The verse says alive.

This has got me a bit on the edge and I need some strong point of views from my fellow Christians. Be free to correct me, wherever I am wrong.

I think I see what you're getting at and I've noticed it before, too, but I wasn't sure how to approach it. Of no fault of our own, death to all came through Adam. In order to make life through Christ congruent with death through Adam, we all should receive life (resurrection) without ever having actually done anything including have faith and getting water baptized.

Since that's contrary to the Biblical narrative, I dismissed it as a misinterpretation. I think Paul is trying to say that the possibility of resurrection comes through Christ. I certainly don't think Paul was preaching Universalism.

Lifted_by_the_word · Jun 1, 2022

Deuteronomy said:

Before a baby leaves the womb it is already been made a way for with the spirit,water,and the blood.it happens right from the moment a males sperm enters the egg.The womans ovaries are in the image of the covenants(water and blood.)Her other part is the spirit.A baby leaving the womb has his spirit.

Also, as a baby comes out(passover) it is being washed with the water and the blood.The moment someone knows right from wrong and chooses wrong,They become a enemy of God.I say a enemy of God because it's true.A young child can become a enemy of God.I'd rather not sugar coat it.

Runningman · Jun 1, 2022

2ndTimothyGroup said:

That's a bit shortsighted and would ultimately lead to there being no reason to preach the gospel since His death would only be for those He foreknew, making the salvation of the foreknown completely an act of God. There would be nothing a mere man could do.

Jesus died for everyone and everyone has the chance to receive the gift of the salvation of their soul through faith.

JaumeJ · Jun 1, 2022

2ndTimothyGroup said:

I do not say a firm no to the being foreknown in your reference abovee, however I have always understood this to mean being foreknown in this age after having accepted Jesus Yeshi Yan as Lord and Savior. Not wanting toargue, just shareing what I have come to believe. I do read and like your posting, so this is not some kind of oblique attack, simply a sharee ofanothers understaqnding. You have alreay shown me a few things which I totally accept and was not aware of, not fully. God bless you.

birdie · Jun 1, 2022

Scarlett7297 said:

It would be easy to read the following verse: "For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive." as saying that every human being died thanks to Adam and every human being will be saved thanks to Christ. However, the word "all" is referring to saved persons, not to all humans. We find this use of the word "all" in Romans 11 for example: "And so all Israel shall be saved:" Israel in this scripture is referring to any human being that God saves, but not to all of humanity. It is a popular notion that Adam was the source of the fall of mankind generally. However, we should consider the following scripture: "And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression." This would seem to indicate that the woman, a picture of all believers incidentally, was in the transgression and not Adam. Adam was a picture of Christ. When Christ went to the cross it was not because he was a sinner. He did, however, become sin so that he would take upon himself the judgment that would have come upon believers. In that sense, true believers die in Christ. They are dead with him in that respect. In the respect that he died for them. Even so, since God resurrected Christ from the dead, the believers also take part in his life, his resurrection. "For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive."

Subhumanoidal · Jun 1, 2022

Scarlett7297 said:

Literally speaking , for one man Adam , all were punished to death and it was by the choice made by Adam and we didn't have a say in this and so all regardless of making any choice we are counted as those who are dying. So , now by one , Jesus , the resurrection should come to all....regardless of whether we make the choice or not , right?

For if by the transgression of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many. 1 Corinthians 15:21-23 For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive.

So , because of Christ , resurrection has to be guaranteed for all humans. Isn't that right?
Have a look at this -

- much more did the grace of God and the gift

All of us agree that grace and a gift are a good thing? Also all of us agree that the angels ...when they met the 3 wise men ,mentioned about - good tidings to all men?

I mentioned this last point because - I know some of you might argue that , yes , we will be resurrected - some to the resurrection of life and some to the resurrection of condemnation according to John 5:29

John 5:29 (King James Version)And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Now , regardless of our choice made in this life whether or not we accept Jesus , all men should receive the good tidings if you take into consideration that when Adam ate the fruit , we his children , didn't ourselves eat it but still death came to all regardless of whether their actions were good or bad. Those who chose to do good were exempt from death? No right?. Death came to all. Now therefore, those of us humans over here who have not believed in Jesus are doing what ? - choosing to be disobedient to the gospel ? - is this good? Most of us will say - it isn't. The gospel is the truth. Regardless , they will be given life because good didn't cancel death because of Adam , and so bad doesn't cancel life given by Jesus. Isn't it? Therefore, the "gift" should come to all men regardless, right? So everyone gets resurrected from the dead (supposing you are with me till now) - how is it a "grace of God and the gift" - if some of us humans are waking up from our graves only to go for eternal hell fire? It's worse than just dying and going to our grave.
Now if you might argue that - no soul dies - then I have to ask you , why did Jesus die? - to save only our physical bodies....or to save our soul as well? and so there - did Adam's sin also mean that with our body , our soul will be in the punishment ?(since the argument is that soul can't die) but it will be in an awful place (hell) and Jesus saved us from just that. But then again...if in Adam all die (soul - and body ) , and am calling the death of soul as - second death because it's alive right? but in hell (that is second death as far as my knowledge is concerned) ...then in Jesus all live (soul and body) - and thus if the second death is what the death of the soul is in relation to Adam , doesn't it have to be exactly the opposite ( as per the verse given above - 1 corinthians) - and what can be opposite to the death I cited here? - Life. The verse says alive.

This has got me a bit on the edge and I need some strong point of views from my fellow Christians. Be free to correct me, wherever I am wrong.

There is a direct, physical, lineage from Adam and Eve. That sin was passed down you could almost say genetically in a sense.
However that is not the case with Jesus. We are not all physically descended from Jesus. So how could we all inherit what he has.
It's not until you become a child of God that you gain what your father has. Not all people are God's children, only those that choose to be.

Nehemiah6 · Jun 1, 2022

Scarlett7297 said:

The best way to correct your erroneous idea is to take ALL Gospel truth into account.

Had you carefully noted that Paul spoke about "many" receiving the gift of eternal life in Romans, the "all" in Corinthians would be a reference to the "many" in Romans 5:15. The reason being the phrase "in Christ" is found in Corinthians. Only the saved are "in Christ".

Rom 5:15 For if by the transgression of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many.
1 Corinthians 15:21-23 For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive.

This chapter in Corinthians is about the resurrection unto life. There is also another resurrection -- the resurrection unto damnation.

Magenta · Jun 1, 2022

John 3:16

p_rehbein · Jun 1, 2022

Scarlett7297 said:

Literally speaking , for one man Adam , all were punished to death and it was by the choice made by Adam and we didn't have a say in this and so all regardless of making any choice we are counted as those who are dying. So , now by one , Jesus , the resurrection should come to all....regardless of whether we make the choice or not , right?

WRONG!

But, hey, thanks for playing

Mem · Jun 1, 2022

p_rehbein said:

...I think she left behind her parting gift

2ndTimothyGroup · Jun 1, 2022

@Scarlett7297

I am extremely sorry for how you are being responded to, here. Please do not be discouraged as I imagine that you are.

Again, I am so sorry.

2ndTimothyGroup · Jun 1, 2022

Scarlett,

I completely understand where you are coming from, as this is one of the mysteries that I have looked to unfold as I read the entire Bible. Literally, I have cataloged Scriptures that indicate ALL humans will be saved as well as passages that indicate otherwise. After comparing all collected Scriptures, I had to conclude that not all will be saved. Consider the following passages:

Luke 13:24-25 NKJV - "Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able. 25 "When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock at the door, saying, 'Lord, Lord, open for us,' and He will answer and say to you, 'I do not know you, where you are from . . ."

Luke chapter 13 is clear that not all will be saved, and that is because there are those who have not come from God. This causes me to believe that there are those who belong to the fallen angels as described in Genesis chapter six. And then there are the descendents of these creations that were once again found on the earth after Noah's flood. These are abominations, which God called to be completely destroyed. They are not of God, but of something else. So, we know that at least, the very least, these evil abominations are not granted the keys to Heaven.

These come from what I call the "Seven Nations" that make up the abominations. They are:

Hittites, Girgashites, Amorites (from Ai), Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites, and Jebusites

And then there are many sub-Seven Nations that are also included. So, as we read the Old Testament, we ought not be overly concerned to find that God completely wipes them out, including women, children, and even the animals. They were all corrupt and not "from" God . . . as indicated in Luke chapter 13 above. Many are overwhelmed by the Old Testament, even calling God an Evil God because He called that these men, women, and children be killed . . . but they were not like you and me. They were something completely different. And it is possible, just possible, that these "people" or creations, still exist and walk this planet today. It is difficult for me to determine.

I hope this finds you well. Respectfully,

2TG

If Adam's death caused death to all , Jesus's death should cause life to all right? - regardless of our choice -

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