More about Israel.

[Thaddeus]

Not according to ethnicity, if God saves anyone, even elect, its according to Grace Rom 11:5-7

5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded.

The only ethnic jews God saves/saved were a remant according to grace not race

You need a whole bible, not just part of one.
Again the word of the Lord came to me: 17 ‘Son of man, when the people of Israel were living in their own land, they defiled it by their conduct and their actions. Their conduct was like a woman’s monthly uncleanness in my sight. 18 So I poured out my wrath on them because they had shed blood in the land and because they had defiled it with their idols. 19 I dispersed them among the nations, and they were scattered through the countries; I judged them according to their conduct and their actions. 20 And wherever they went among the nations they profaned my holy name, for it was said of them, “These are the Lord’s people, and yet they had to leave his land.” 21 I had concern for my holy name, which the people of Israel profaned among the nations where they had gone.

22 ‘Therefore say to the Israelites, “This is what the Sovereign Lord says: it is not for your sake, people of Israel, that I am going to do these things, but for the sake of my holy name, which you have profaned among the nations where you have gone. 23 I will show the holiness of my great name, which has been profaned among the nations, the name you have profaned among them. Then the nations will know that I am the Lord, declares the Sovereign Lord, when I am proved holy through you before their eyes.

24 ‘“For I will take you out of the nations; I will gather you from all the countries and bring you back into your own land. 25 I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean; I will cleanse you from all your impurities and from all your idols. 26 I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit in you; I will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my Spirit in you and move you to follow my decrees and be careful to keep my laws. Ezekiel 36:16-27

 

[brightfame52]

You need a whole bible, not just part of one.

You dont understand that passage, and Im not about to labor for you.

 

[Thaddeus]

You dont understand that passage, and Im not about to labor for you.

I understand just fine, for I accept what is plainly stated in it. You and others on the other hand have to theologise to overturn the plain words of the chapter, for they do not fit in with your errant views

 

[Thaddeus]

You dont understand that passage, and Im not about to labor for you.

Same here:
In those days and at that time,
when I restore the fortunes of Judah and Jerusalem,
2 I will gather all nations
and bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat.
There I will put them on trial
for what they did to my inheritance, my people Israel,
because they scattered my people among the nations
and divided up my land.
3 They cast lots for my people
and traded boys for prostitutes;
they sold girls for wine to drink.
4 ‘Now what have you against me, Tyre and Sidon and all you regions of Philistia? Are you repaying me for something I have done? If you are paying me back, I will swiftly and speedily return on your own heads what you have done. 5 For you took my silver and my gold and carried off my finest treasures to your temples.You sold the people of Judah and Jerusalem to the Greeks, that you might send them far from their homeland.

7 ‘See, I am going to rouse them out of the places to which you sold them, and I will return on your own heads what you have done. 8 I will sell your sons and daughters to the people of Judah, and they will sell them to the Sabeans, a nation far away.’ The Lord has spoken.

9 Proclaim this among the nations:
Prepare for war!
Rouse the warriors!
Let all the fighting men draw near and attack.
10 Beat your ploughshares into swords
and your pruning hooks into spears.
Let the weakling say,
‘I am strong!’
11 Come quickly, all you nations from every side,
and assemble there.
Bring down your warriors, Lord!
12 ‘Let the nations be roused;
let them advance into the Valley of Jehoshaphat,
for there I will sit
to judge all the nations on every side.
13 Swing the sickle,
for the harvest is ripe.
Come, trample the grapes,
for the winepress is full
and the vats overflow –
so great is their wickedness!’
14 Multitudes, multitudes
in the valley of decision!
For the day of the Lord is near
in the valley of decision.
15 The sun and moon will be darkened,
and the stars no longer shine.
16 The Lord will roar from Zion
and thunder from Jerusalem;
the earth and the heavens will tremble.
But the Lord will be a refuge for his people,
a stronghold for the people of Israel.

​

17 ‘Then you will know that I, the Lord your God,
dwell in Zion, my holy hill.
Jerusalem will be holy;
never again will foreigners invade her.
18 ‘In that day the mountains will drip new wine,
and the hills will flow with milk;
all the ravines of Judah will run with water.
A fountain will flow out of the Lord’s house
and will water the valley of acacias.
19 But Egypt will be desolate,
Edom a desert waste,
because of violence done to the people of Judah,
in whose land they shed innocent blood.
20 Judah will be inhabited for ever
and Jerusalem through all generations.
21 Shall I leave their innocent blood unavenged?
No, I will not.’
The Lord dwells in Zion! Joel3

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

And who is this Israel that received the promises, that spread over the Earth, that in number are like the grains of sand, who have blessed the earth and inhabited the desolate places of the Earth? <----- all prophecies concerning Israel... It certainly isnt that tiny country we call Israel,

 

[dkontner]

​

John 4
24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Philippians 3
3 For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.

Circumcision of the flesh or the heart?
Romans 2
29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

 

[Thaddeus]

​

John 4
24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Philippians 3
3 For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.

Circumcision of the flesh or the heart?
Romans 2
29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Indeed:
On that day a fountain will be opened to the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem, to cleanse them from sin and impurity.

2&nbsp;‘On that day, I will banish the names of the idols from the land, and they will be remembered no more,’ declares the Lord Almighty. ‘I will remove both the prophets and the spirit of impurity from the land. 3&nbsp;And if anyone still prophesies, their father and mother, to whom they were born, will say to them, “You must die, because you have told lies in the Lord’s name.” Then their own parents will stab the one who prophesies.

4&nbsp;‘On that day every prophet will be ashamed of their prophetic vision. They will not put on a prophet’s garment of hair in order to deceive. 5&nbsp;Each will say, “I am not a prophet. I am a farmer; the land has been my livelihood since my youth.[” 6&nbsp;If someone asks, “What are these wounds on your body?” they will answer, “The wounds I was given at the house of my friends.”

​

7&nbsp;‘Awake, sword, against my shepherd,
against the man who is close to me!’
declares the Lord Almighty.
‘Strike the shepherd,
and the sheep will be scattered,
and I will turn my hand against the little ones.
8&nbsp;In the whole land,’ declares the Lord,
‘two-thirds will be struck down and perish;
yet one-third will be left in it.
9&nbsp;This third I will put into the fire;
I will refine them like silver
and test them like gold.
They will call on my name
and I will answer them;
I will say, “They are my people,”
and they will say, “The Lord is our God.”’ Zech13

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

On that day a fountain will be opened to the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem, to cleanse them from sin and impurity.

That happened at Pentecost. Scripture plainly says verse 7 was fulfilled at Christ's betrayal.

 

[brightfame52]

Same here

And my same reply applies

 

[Thaddeus]

That happened at Pentecost. Scripture plainly says verse 7 was fulfilled at Christ's betrayal.

Really Zech 13 was fulfilled at Pentecost?
I always feel added assurance in my beliefs when you disagree with them

 

[Thaddeus]

And my same reply applies

Aw and I thought you would theologise to overturn the plain words of the chapter

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

Really Zech 13 was fulfilled at Pentecost?
I always feel added assurance in my beliefs when you disagree with them

You are too dull of spirit and drunk on the whore of Babylon's wine to acknowledge that these 2 things happened 2000 years ago

The fountain of living waters was opened to the house of David at Pentecost

In that day there shall be a fountain opened to the house of David and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem for sin and for uncleanness. Zechariah 13:1​

This was fuflfilled at Christ's betrayal

Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man that is my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn mine hand upon the little ones. Zechariah 13:7​

​

Then saith Jesus unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock shall be scattered abroad. Matthew 26:31​

 

[Thaddeus]

You are too dull of spirit and drunk on the whore of Babylon's wine

Refresh my mind. Why exactly did you believe Heb12:22-24 proves Moses died perfect?

 

[Thaddeus]

You are too dull of spirit and drunk on the whore of Babylon's wine to acknowledge that these 2 things happened 2000 years ago

The fountain of living waters was opened to the house of David at Pentecost

In that day there shall be a fountain opened to the house of David and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem for sin and for uncleanness. Zechariah 13:1​

This was fuflfilled at Christ's betrayal

Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man that is my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn mine hand upon the little ones. Zechariah 13:7​

​

Then saith Jesus unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock shall be scattered abroad. Matthew 26:31​

BTW
I assume you believe one third of the people accepted Christ as their saviour when he died at Calvary, the other two thirds were struck down:
Strike the shepherd,
and the sheep will be scattered,
and I will turn my hand against the little ones.
8&nbsp;In the whole land,’ declares the Lord,
‘two-thirds will be struck down and perish;
yet one-third will be left in it.
9&nbsp;This third I will put into the fire;
I will refine them like silver
and test them like gold.
They will call on my name
and I will answer them;
I will say, “They are my people,”
and they will say, “The Lord is our God.

 

[Churchgoer]

You surprise me, if God has the right to condemn people to hell, giving them no choice in the matter, but will save others whom he chooses, it seems strange to me, you do not think, if he so chooses he can save physical Israelites en masse at a time yet to come

Of course God can! To ethnic jew, arab, Indian, Iranian.... amen to God, the Lord and savior!!!!

 

[Thaddeus]

Of course God can! To ethnic jew, arab, Indian, Iranian.... amen to God, the Lord and savior!!!!

Absolutely, however, the bible does not specifically state ethnic Arabs, Indians, Iranians will accept en mass Christ as their saviour and be saved. In Iran's case, I would think Zech14 suggest a horrendous time ahead of them

 

[dkontner]

Galatians 3:16
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Romans 9
6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

 

[Churchgoer]

Absolutely, however, the bible does not specifically state ethnic Arabs, Indians, Iranians will accept en mass Christ as their saviour and be saved. In Iran's case, I would think Zech14 suggest a horrendous time ahead of them

God prophecies many curse to unbievers, true, including eternally separation from God.
The scripture also prophesied whoever believes in Jesus, shall not perish, but have eternal life. This the the core from ot to nt. Including all ethics true believers.
There is no special privilege for any single group, except the group in covenant with Jesus.

 

[Thaddeus]

God prophecies many curse to unbievers, true, including eternally separation from God.
The scripture also prophesied whoever believes in Jesus, shall not perish, but have eternal life.
There is no special privilege for any single group, except the group in covenant with Jesus.

Absolutely!

 

[brightfame52]

The Next promise is Ezk 37:22

22 And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all.

There will be one King over them. David is a type of Christ, who sits on the Throne of David. It is not David himself as the King over them ! But it is Christ that is the One King over them. He is also the One Shepherd over them, and not David, for Christ is the One Shepherd Isa 40:10

10 Behold, the Lord GOD will come with strong hand, and his arm shall rule for him: behold, his reward is with him, and his work before him.

11 He shall feed his flock like a shepherd: he shall gather the lambs with his arm, and carry them in his bosom, and shall gently lead those that are with young.

Jn 10:16

16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

Again, this can and does apply to All the seed of Abraham that belongs to Christ Gal 3:29

29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

You see Abraham's seed and the children of Israel are the same. 4