No kissing/hand holding before marriage?

[KrisWampler]

I have encountered women here and there who absolutely refuse to kiss or hold hands with a man before marriage. No peck on the cheek, and certainly not the lips. No holding hands whatsoever. Some will abstain from any physical contact at all, which means no hugs I guess.

This seems to be relatively rare, but is there any biblical basis for this? Seems more like an overreaction. One girl who told me this had slept with a man outside of marriage. So it seems like she took a 180 degree turn to the other extreme. In other words, she was using this as a response to what she did.

Each to their own, but honestly, it seems like a huge red flag and probably indicative of more serious underlying issues. I'm not aware of anything in the Bible that condones much less requires this.

 

[Lynx]

All I know is, if I ever marry it won't be for the touch of her hand or lips.

To each her own, and I'll cross that bridge when I come to it, IF I ever come to it. I may never fall in love with a lady who keeps standards like that. We'll see.

 

[Lynx]

For some reason this thread reminded me of an old song...

But each time we talk, I get the same old thing
Always no hug-ee no kiss-ee until I get a weddin' ring
My honey my baby, don't put my love upon no shelf
She said don't hand me no lines and keep your hands to yourself

 

[GoodRanger]

I have encountered women here and there who absolutely refuse to kiss or hold hands with a man before marriage. No peck on the cheek, and certainly not the lips. No holding hands whatsoever. Some will abstain from any physical contact at all, which means no hugs I guess.

This seems to be relatively rare, but is there any biblical basis for this? Seems more like an overreaction. One girl who told me this had slept with a man outside of marriage. So it seems like she took a 180 degree turn to the other extreme. In other words, she was using this as a response to what she did.

Each to their own, but honestly, it seems like a huge red flag and probably indicative of more serious underlying issues. I'm not aware of anything in the Bible that condones much less requires this.

Christianity isn’t anti-sex. There are several parts of the Bible that suggest against chastity. When I speak of chastity here, I mean the type where people refuse to do anything remotely sexual unless they are married.

There is a Bible book called Song of Songs, also called Song of Solomon. It’s a basically a sex poem. Some theologians interpret it to be a metaphor for God’s love for his adherents, and that might be true to some extent, but several of the scriptures are clearly sexual like Song of Songs 7:1-3: “How beautiful your sandaled feet, O prince’s daughter! Your graceful legs are like jewels, the work of an artist’s hands. Your navel is a rounded goblet that never lacks blended wine. Your waist is a mound of wheat encircled by lilies. Your breasts are like two fawns, like twin fawns of a gazelle.”

There is also the Book of Hosea. It’s about a prostitute named Gomer. God tells his prophet to marry her. She accepts but is continually unfaithful. Hosea 1:2-3 says, “When the Lord began to speak through Hosea, the Lord said to him, ‘Go, marry a promiscuous woman and have children with her, for like an adulterous wife this land is guilty of unfaithfulness to the Lord.’ So he married Gomer daughter of Diblaim, and she conceived and bore him a son.” The following scriptures indicate the Hosea’s children aren’t really his.

The Book of Hosea tells about how Gomer kept cheating on her husband and having sexual relations with the wrong type of men who abused her. Yet her Hosea kept loving her and giving her gifts even as she was unfaithful. Later in the book one of her lovers doesn’t want her anymore, so he sells her at a wife auction. God tells Hosea about the wife auction, and Hosea goes and buys her. The story ends by Gomer saying sorry and remaining faithful.

The book is a metaphor about God’s undying love for believers. We are all unfaithful to God when we sin, but God continues to love us even when we’re bad. Just as Hosea accepted his prostitute wife when she had no choice but to return to him, God will do likewise for all sinners who repent.

There is also the part in the Gospels where a woman was caught in the act of adultery, and the pharisees tried to trap Jesus. Instead Christ decided to forgive her. He told the adulterous woman to quit cheating and return to her husband.

There are plenty more scriptures I can talk about that show Christianity isn’t anti-sex. But I think I’ve already made this point and don’t need to elaborate further.

Some people want to have sexual relations with only one person in their entire life. There isn’t anything wrong with that; it’s their choice. However, it’s important to understand that this view isn’t endorsed by the Bible.

 

[inukubo]

Funny you bring this up. I have actually been considering abstaining from kissing a woman until I marry her. There is no real Biblical reason for it, but I was thinking what good does it do to kiss someone you are not married to? It only excites you physically and may create the illusion of being in love when you are not. I'm sure this line of thought is spurred on by my previous marriage where we basically skipped building a friendship and connecting emotionally so we had no solid relational foundation. If I get married again, I want it to be with my absolute best friend and don't want my head clouded up with unnecessary physical complications. It may be overkill, but that's kind of what I've been thinking.

So I can understand why some women may choose to do this as well. I don't necessarily see it as a red flag, I just see them as being careful and cautious. I personally would rather date someone who is careful and cautious about their actions than someone who doesn't give them any thought.

 

[Phoneman-777]

For some reason this thread reminded me of an old song...

But each time we talk, I get the same old thing
Always no hug-ee no kiss-ee until I get a weddin' ring
My honey my baby, don't put my love upon no shelf
She said don't hand me no lines and keep your hands to yourself

"And I said, Honey, I'll live with you for the rest of my life, she said no huggee, no kissee until ya make me yo' wife...."

 

[Oblio]

For some reason this thread reminded me of an old song...

But each time we talk, I get the same old thing
Always no hug-ee no kiss-ee until I get a weddin' ring
My honey my baby, don't put my love upon no shelf
She said don't hand me no lines and keep your hands to yourself

Don't call it old. It can't be old. If it's old, then I'm old. But there's no way that I'm old. I'm too young to be old. Wahhhh! Lol
BTW...that's a great song!

 

[Gideon300]

I have encountered women here and there who absolutely refuse to kiss or hold hands with a man before marriage. No peck on the cheek, and certainly not the lips. No holding hands whatsoever. Some will abstain from any physical contact at all, which means no hugs I guess.

This seems to be relatively rare, but is there any biblical basis for this? Seems more like an overreaction. One girl who told me this had slept with a man outside of marriage. So it seems like she took a 180 degree turn to the other extreme. In other words, she was using this as a response to what she did.

Each to their own, but honestly, it seems like a huge red flag and probably indicative of more serious underlying issues. I'm not aware of anything in the Bible that condones much less requires this.

I have encountered women here and there who absolutely refuse to kiss or hold hands with a man before marriage. No peck on the cheek, and certainly not the lips. No holding hands whatsoever. Some will abstain from any physical contact at all, which means no hugs I guess.

This seems to be relatively rare, but is there any biblical basis for this? Seems more like an overreaction. One girl who told me this had slept with a man outside of marriage. So it seems like she took a 180 degree turn to the other extreme. In other words, she was using this as a response to what she did.

Each to their own, but honestly, it seems like a huge red flag and probably indicative of more serious underlying issues. I'm not aware of anything in the Bible that condones much less requires this.

"Do not lead us into temptation.........." It's especially an issue in the modern world, where sex outside of marriage is considered normal and someone who refrains is a freak. If a Christian, male or female, has a weakness in this area, it is better for that person to set strict boundaries. If the other party objects, then it becomes a question of what the relationship is based on. Early advice given to me was never do in private what you would not do in public. Seems reasonable, not that reason enters many relationships, at least in the beginning.

 

[tourist]

Don't call it old. It can't be old. If it's old, then I'm old. But there's no way that I'm old. I'm too young to be old. Wahhhh! Lol
BTW...that's a great song!

I'm too old to be young.

 

[3angelsmsg]

@KrisWampler you make an very good point. These girls maybe know its their weak point which can get them to fall. Past relationships and experiences has forced them to act this way. I, myself am not sure which position to take on this. But purity starts in the heart. It starts from inside (heart) to the outside actions. My only contribution would be to say, if we are in the right identity of being in Christ and be depended on Him for love. Physical touch would not be necessity that is just my opinion. Jesus was on earth and he was single. And proved that love for God is sufficient.

 

[seoulsearch]

Some people want to have sexual relations with only one person in their entire life. There isn’t anything wrong with that; it’s their choice. However, it’s important to understand that this view isn’t endorsed by the Bible.

I have always been taught that this is indeed what the Bible teaches -- that if you are ever to have sexual relations at all, you must marry one person and it must be with only that person for the rest of your life.

Could you please clarify your perspective here?

Are you saying that your view is that this is NOT what the Bible teaches and that it somehow supports having sex with multiple people, both outside and in addition (adultery) to marriage?

I'm not saying this to criticize; I'm just wondering if this is really what you're trying to say and how you came to that conclusion.

Surely you don't think the examples you gave are somehow a way of endorsing sex with multiple partners?

 

[GoodRanger]

I have always been taught that this is indeed what the Bible teaches -- that if you are ever to have sexual relations at all, you must marry one person and it must be with only that person for the rest of your life.

Could you please clarify your perspective here?

Are you saying that your view is that this is NOT what the Bible teaches and that it somehow supports having sex with multiple people, both outside and in addition (adultery) to marriage?

I'm not saying this to criticize; I'm just wondering if this is really what you're trying to say and how you came to that conclusion.

Surely you don't think the examples you gave are somehow a way of endorsing sex with multiple partners?

My view on this subject is a bit difficult to explain.

I am a young adult who has never had a girlfriend before. I haven’t dated or had sexual relations in the past. The reason for this probably has to do with the fact that my social aptitude wasn’t so great when I was younger (I didn’t develop normal social skills and understanding until a later age); it’s also because women don’t seem to be attracted to me much, since my appearance is only okay.

I want to get married and have a family, but I want the woman I meet to be a virgin like me. I remember all the bullies and aloof, non-committal guys in high school and early adult years were having sex with their girlfriends; meanwhile I didn’t have anyone, and all I wanted was just one girl to care about. If I meet a potential wife and she has had a boyfriend before, I would have to break off relations with her because I am upset about her having sexual relations with other people before me, and I’m deeply insecure about it.

I want a virgin like me to commit to for life, but I don’t want to wait until marriage for sexual relations. Marriage is a government contract that recognizes a partnership between a man and a woman for purposes like taxes, property rights, and the like. Why would I need the government’s endorsement to have sex? That doesn’t make any sense.

My post you quoted wasn’t what I believe about chastity and sexual relations. It was about what the Bible says about it, which is different from my own views. In fact, I doubt God approves of me rejecting a woman if she had a boyfriend/sexual relations before, because the Bible emphasizes things like forgiveness.

So yeah, my beliefs about sex and what the Bible says about sex appears to be different.

It appears that Christianity doesn’t endorse dating (meaning having a girlfriend/boyfriend for relationship and sex), but it doesn’t condemn it either. Several scriptures are critical of sexual immorality, but I think that is referring to things like promiscuity, prostitution, cheating, etc. and not dating.

 

[seoulsearch]

My view on this subject is a bit difficult to explain.

I am a young adult who has never had a girlfriend before. I haven’t dated or had sexual relations in the past. The reason for this probably has to do with the fact that my social aptitude wasn’t so great when I was younger (I didn’t develop normal social skills and understanding until a later age); it’s also because women don’t seem to be attracted to me much, since my appearance is only okay.

I want to get married and have a family, but I want the woman I meet to be a virgin like me. I remember all the bullies and aloof, non-committal guys in high school and early adult years were having sex with their girlfriends; meanwhile I didn’t have anyone, and all I wanted was just one girl to care about. If I meet a potential wife and she has had a boyfriend before, I would have to break off relations with her because I am upset about her having sexual relations with other people before me, and I’m deeply insecure about it.

I want a virgin like me to commit to for life, but I don’t want to wait until marriage for sexual relations. Marriage is a government contract that recognizes a partnership between a man and a woman for purposes like taxes, property rights, and the like. Why would I need the government’s endorsement to have sex? That doesn’t make any sense.

My post you quoted wasn’t what I believe about chastity and sexual relations. It was about what the Bible says about it, which is different from my own views. In fact, I doubt God approves of me rejecting a woman if she had a boyfriend/sexual relations before, because the Bible emphasizes things like forgiveness.

So yeah, my beliefs about sex and what the Bible says about sex appears to be different.

It appears that Christianity doesn’t endorse dating (meaning having a girlfriend/boyfriend for relationship and sex), but it doesn’t condemn it either. Several scriptures are critical of sexual immorality, but I think that is referring to things like promiscuity, prostitution, cheating, etc. and not dating.

Thank you for taking the time to answer and explain what you believe.

 

[cinder]

I have encountered women here and there who absolutely refuse to kiss or hold hands with a man before marriage. No peck on the cheek, and certainly not the lips. No holding hands whatsoever. Some will abstain from any physical contact at all, which means no hugs I guess.

This seems to be relatively rare, but is there any biblical basis for this? Seems more like an overreaction. One girl who told me this had slept with a man outside of marriage. So it seems like she took a 180 degree turn to the other extreme. In other words, she was using this as a response to what she did.

Each to their own, but honestly, it seems like a huge red flag and probably indicative of more serious underlying issues. I'm not aware of anything in the Bible that condones much less requires this.

Well when I was younger I knew one couple who took this line and thought it was the right thing to do and married. And since I'm still in touch with family and haven't heard that they've split up I think they'll be celebrating 15 years of marriage this year. But I also know that at the time all of their young adult friends were kind of wondering how they were going to make such a big leap from pratically not touching to it's all fair game over the honeymoon. But they did and seemingly rather successfully.

Our whole culture surrounding finding someone to marry is so different from the culture when the Bible was written that any rules for dating are specific applications of much more general principles (except for that whole no fornication thing that's pretty much stated all over the new testament). So yes this could be someone's approach to staying as far away from temptation as possible and keeping themselves pure, but it's hard to say it's the (only) correct approach. I do think that it's good to discuss physical expectations and boundaries and come to an agreement on how far you'll go in a relationship before you start being physical, but that's not a first date conversation ( for the most part it comes across that anyone who needs to talk about the physical relationship on the first date is mainly after a good looking warm body to have a physical relationship with); I'd (theoretically as it's not a position I've ever been in) have that conversation about the time it's looking like the relationship is transitioning from ok we've had a few nice dates to hey I think this is someone who really could be a potential spouse ie when things look like they'll get serious and it's legitimately something that will and should come up between us.

And I think people have different levels of need to express themselves and their emotions physically. Some people fall in love with words over a computer screen without any opportunity to physically express themselves. And some people hug every acquaintance who will let them. I'd think the basic principles are don't use people as objects or tools to give yourself an emotional or hormonal high; and realize that most of your time together as a married couple will be spent living life, not having sex, so while the physical is an aspect it's not necessarily the most important.

 

[Lanolin]

I think maybe that girl just doesnt want to kiss or hold hands with you.

No need to 'red flag' her. Just respect her wishes or find someone else to kiss and hold hands with.
It doesnt sound like you are engaged to her anyway.

 

[Lanolin]

Also, covid might have something to do with it.

Kissing and hand holding is an easy way to spread infectious disease, especially a contagious virus....

 

[DeeGee]

My view on this subject is a bit difficult to explain.
I want a virgin like me to commit to for life, but I don’t want to wait until marriage for sexual relations. Marriage is a government contract that recognizes a partnership between a man and a woman for purposes like taxes, property rights, and the like. Why would I need the government’s endorsement to have sex? That doesn’t make any sense.

It may well work for you. However, every Christian who I personally know and who believes in Godly marriage (one man/one woman), and decided to engage in sex premaritally, even with their intended spouse, regretted doing so. They have each said that they should have waited until they had made the "official commitment." For some, the marriage didn't last. For a couple, the marriage never occurred. For most, the marriage has lasted, but they still regret what they believe was "breaking covenant" with God.

 

[JohnDB]

Someone once said "Water finds its own level"

Meaning that in order to feel comfortable with someone in a physically intimate way the two must be rather equal in experience levels.

And it's true to a degree...

It definitely works better if both are virgins for their honeymoon. Because we are hard wired to permanently remember the first person we were ever physically intimate with.

And if it was in the back seat of a car with fogged up windows with someone you really weren't positive of their name... well..you kinda missed out on the best part of it all and increased the chances of a marriage ending in divorce.

 

[GoodRanger]

It may well work for you. However, every Christian who I personally know and who believes in Godly marriage (one man/one woman), and decided to engage in sex premaritally, even with their intended spouse, regretted doing so. They have each said that they should have waited until they had made the "official commitment." For some, the marriage didn't last. For a couple, the marriage never occurred. For most, the marriage has lasted, but they still regret what they believe was "breaking covenant" with God.

Thank you for the heads up. I’ll keep your advice in mind.

I’ve experienced longstanding problems related to relationships and socialization in general. The only way I’m ever going to find a woman for marriage is with God’s help; I can’t do it on my own because of my issues.

One day a long time ago, I asked God who is my wife. I figured God knows everything, including all events that have happened, are happening, and will happen. He is an infinite being, so surely he can foresee who I will marry.

He showed me images of my wife. In fact, he has shown me images of the exact same girl for years now. She is pretty, and I really like her appearance. She is also from another country outside of the US.

Later I found out that I will meet her because God picked her out for me, not because I happen to travel to her country and meet her through a random series of events. In other words, God agreed to arrange a marriage for me. I believe he decided to do this favor for me because I have so many problems with finding someone, and he feels sorry for my inability to date or have normal relations with women. God also admires my profound Christian faith, which is very strong, so naturally he finds me worthy of granting a great favor.

I’m still not so sure I need a wedding and government document that recognizes our life partnership in order to engage in adult relations. To be honest, I don’t really want a wedding but instead prefer to register our marriage in a courthouse without a ceremony. Weddings seem like a vanity fest, at least in my opinion, and I don’t think I need one. If I love her and know she is my life partner (God arranged the marriage and cannot be wrong here), why would I need a wedding ceremony to confirm that? In my opinion, feelings and bonds that last for life are what matters most and what bind a husband to a wife, not the ceremony stuff.

 

[JohnDB]

Thank you for the heads up. I’ll keep your advice in mind.

I’ve experienced longstanding problems related to relationships and socialization in general. The only way I’m ever going to find a woman for marriage is with God’s help; I can’t do it on my own because of my issues.

One day a long time ago, I asked God who is my wife. I figured God knows everything, including all events that have happened, are happening, and will happen. He is an infinite being, so surely he can foresee who I will marry.

He showed me images of my wife. In fact, he has shown me images of the exact same girl for years now. She is pretty, and I really like her appearance. She is also from another country outside of the US.

Later I found out that I will meet her because God picked her out for me, not because I happen to travel to her country and meet her through a random series of events. In other words, God agreed to arrange a marriage for me. I believe he decided to do this favor for me because I have so many problems with finding someone, and he feels sorry for my inability to date or have normal relations with women. God also admires my profound Christian faith, which is very strong, so naturally he finds me worthy of granting a great favor.

I’m still not so sure I need a wedding and government document that recognizes our life partnership in order to engage in adult relations. To be honest, I don’t really want a wedding but instead prefer to register our marriage in a courthouse without a ceremony. Weddings seem like a vanity fest, at least in my opinion, and I don’t think I need one. If I love her and know she is my life partner (God arranged the marriage and cannot be wrong here), why would I need a wedding ceremony to confirm that? In my opinion, feelings and bonds that last for life are what matters most and what bind a husband to a wife, not the ceremony stuff.

Because SHE might want one or need one later to remember how much you cared about her possible feelings in the future about it.

That's why you have a wedding celebration. I know that you and she are the focus but it's FOR HER and everyone else... you are a very distant 23rd reason to have one.