Personal thoughts about homosexuality

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I believe homosexuality is most often a product of environment and conditioning. My step daughter is lesbian because she was molested by a man when she was a child. My wife and I pray that she will be delivered from it

That's what I said earlier on some thread. That gays turn gay due to some physical or sexual trauma, or how their brought up to believe that there's nothing wrong with being gay. Too bad nobody tells them if they don't repent their lifestyle, they're headed for hell.
 
Are you sure that is why? I was molested by a man as a child and it did not make me a homosexual. So that is why I ask. If being molested as a child is what it takes to make someone gay perhaps there would be a lot more gay people? I dunno.

I imagine it affects everyone differently. Some are more sensitive to trauma than others. Some handle it better, while others break down and dissociate.
 
I believe homosexuality is most often a product of environment and conditioning. My step daughter is lesbian because she was molested by a man when she was a child. My wife and I pray that she will be delivered from it

Are you sure that is why? I was molested by a man as a child and it did not make me a homosexual. So that is why I ask. If being molested as a child is what it takes to make someone gay perhaps there would be a lot more gay people? I dunno.
Also, I am sorry to hear about your step daughter,
and pray with you and yours for her deliverance.
 
That's what I said earlier on some thread. That gays turn gay due to some physical or sexual trauma, or how their brought up to believe that there's nothing wrong with being gay. Too bad nobody tells them if they don't repent their lifestyle, they're headed for hell.

ROM 1
"21
Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; ..."
 
Love covers a multitude of sins. Any who love are of God.

Wow, such bad theology, I don't know where to begin.

Okay, let me start with the 1 John 4:7 Scripture you quoted -- the word for "love" there is agape. This type of love refers to Christian, godly love, so this Scripture is NOT saying that any old love that anyone feels automatically makes a person a child of God.

You are also implying that Muslims, Hindi, Buddhists and anyone else who may not have faith in Jesus Christ can come to the Father simply by loving anyone. Scripture is very clear that no one comes to the Father except through Jesus Christ (John 14:6)

And while love does, indeed, cover a multitude of sins, it is only the love of the Father that performs that miracle of reconciliation. (John 3:16) But that Fatherly love is only, again, available through Jesus Christ.

Bottom line: we sinners cannot approach God simply by "loving others." That would make it a works game and not an act of grace.
 
I imagine it affects everyone differently. Some are more sensitive to trauma than others. Some handle it better, while others break down and dissociate.
I don't think I handled it well. My life bears that out. Still, there must be
so many factors and variables that go into the making of one's sexual
orientation... I don't think anybody really knows a single reason why.
 
Oh, you disagree with Scripture?

Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God.
Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God.

1 John 4:7

Above all, love each other deeply, because love covers over a multitude of sins.
1 Peter 4:8

I'll counter it with scripture.

John 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
 
Paul chose two words in the New Testament that specify what the Old Testament meant from Leviticus 18.

Leviticus 18:22 Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it [is] abomination.

1 Corinthians 6:9 Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders

1 Corinthians 6:10 nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

homosexuals, g733 ἀρσενοκοίτης arsenokoitēs

The word for Homosexuals or “arsenokoitēs” is made up of two words. It is from ἄρρην (G730) and κοίτη (G2845).
G730 – arrēn means “male”. G2845 – koitē means “bed”.

So the term “nor homosexual offenders” means “nor male in bed” and is a reference to Leviticus 18:22.

Leviticus 18:22 "'Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable. (NIV)

Links:
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Lev&c=18&v=1&t=KJV#top
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=1Cr&c=6&v=9&t=KJV#9
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=G733&t=KJV
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?Strongs=G730&t=KJV
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?Strongs=G2845&t=KJV

Copyright Information, New International Version (NIV)

THE HOLY BIBLE, NEW INTERNATIONAL VERSION®, NIV®
Copyright © 1973, 1978, 1984 by International Bible Society®
Used by permission. All rights reserved worldwide.

Romans 1:24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
Romans 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
Romans 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
Romans 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
 
Wrath of God defined
Researched by Chuckt

"(1:18) The apostle now speaks of the wrath of God inasmuch as 'the revelation of the righteousness of God (v.17) is needed in view of the revelation of His wrath, from which only God's righteousness (whether it be His justifying sentence or the righteousness He bestows on man) can deliver' (Denney). 'Wrath' is orge. The word is used of God's wrath in Matthew 3:7, Romans 1:17, 12:19, and is defined by Trench as 'a wrath of God who would not love good unless He hated evil, the two being inseparable, that He must do both or neither.' It is used of our Lord when, after healing the man with the withered hand, He observed the hardness of heart of the Pharisees, and looked upon them with anger (Mk. 3:5). Orge is an anger 'which righteous men not merely may, but as they are righteous, must feel; nor can there be a surer and sadder token of an utterly prostrate moral condition than the not being to be angry with sin--and sinners' (Trench). Vincent describes orge as God's personal emotion with regard to sin. It represents God's abhorrence and hatred of sin."1

(There is more of the definition here which supports this translation.)

"Translation: For there is revealed God's wrath from heaven upon every lack of reverence and (every) unrighteousness of men who the truth in unrighteousness are holding down."2

1 Word Studies in the Greek New Testament, Volume 1, Kenneth Wuest, Eerdmans, p. 28-29

2. "The New Testament" (An Expanded Translation) by Kenneth Wuest on Romans 1:18.

I've actually debated people who say that Romans 1 doesn't speak about Homosexuality so I researched the scholars:

What do the scholars have to say about Romans Chapter 1? They all say it is Homosexuality being discussed. Since all of my debaters are without Bible degrees, they are sadly misinformed by those Homosexuals who wish to change what the Bible says because the majority of scholars do support the interpretation that Romans 1 has to do with Homosexuality. My debaters are misinformed..

“b. Abandoned to sexual perversion (1:26-27)
1:26-27. Also God gave them over to shameful lusts (lit., ‘passions of disgrace’). This involved, as the text states, both sexes engaging in homosexual instead of heterosexual relationships. Women deliberately exchanged natural relations (with men in marriage) for unnatural ones (with other women). This is the second ‘exchange’ the unregenerate made (cf. v.25). Men...were inflamed with lust (orexei,’sexual lust,’ used only here in the NT and differing from the more common word for lust in v.26).

The words translated women and men in these verses are the sexual words ‘females’ and ‘males.’ Contemporary homosexuals insist that these verses mean that it is perverse for a heterosexual male or female to engage in homosexual relations but it is not perverse for a homosexual male or female to do so since homosexuality is such a person’s natural preference. This is strained exegesis unsupported by the Bible. The only natural sexual relationship the Bible recognizes is a heterosexual one (Gen. 2:21-24; Matt. 19:4-6) within marriage. All homosexual relations constitute sexual perversion and are subject to God’s judgment. Such lustful and indecent acts have within them the seeds of punishment (due penalty).”-“The Bible Knowledge Commentary” (An Exposition of the Scriptures by Dallas Seminary Faculty, p.444.

“When the Bible declares that homosexual practices are ‘against nature’ (Rom. 1:26), it is referring to biological nature, not sociological nature. First, sex is defined biologically in Scripture from the very beginning. In Genesis 1, God created ‘male and female’ and then told them to ‘be fruitful and increase in number’ (Gen. 1:27-27, NIV). This reproduction was only possible if He was referring to a biological male and female.

“Second, sexual orientation is understood biologically, not sociologically, when God said ‘for this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and they will become one flesh’ (Gen. 2:24, NIV. For only a biological father and mother can produce children, and the reference to ‘one flesh’ speaks of a physical marriage.
“Thirdly, the Romans passage says that ‘men committed indecent acts with other men.’ This clearly indicates that this sinful act was homosexual in nature (Rom. 1:27, NIV).

“Fourth, what they did was not natural to them. They ‘exchanged’ the ‘natural relations’ for the unnatural ones (Rom. 1:26, NIV). So the homosexual acts were pronounced unnatural for homosexuals too.

“Fifth, homosexual desires are also called ‘shameful lusts’ (v. 26, NIV). So it is evident that God is condemning sexual sins between those of the same biological sex. Homosexual acts are contrary to human nature as such, not just to a homosexual’s sexual orientation.”-“When Critics Ask” by Dr. Norman Geisler, p438-439

“Because they exchanged the real God for false gods, by way of temporary punishment they exchanged natural sexual intercourse for homosexuality. 25. Paul breaks out of the foul atmosphere of vice and idolatry into the fresh air of a doxology. 27. Perversion is their idolatry: Gk. plane (lit. ‘wandering’) is often used in the LXX.”-“The International Bible Commentary”, F.F. Bruce, General Editor, p.1320

“Long before this chapter was penned, the Lesbians and others throughout refined Greece had been luxuriating in such debasements;”-“Commentary On The Whole Bible” by Jamieson, Fausset and Brown, p.1142.

“Although today the world seeks to popularize and legitimize homosexuality, nevertheless it is despicable to God and condemned by Him.”-Liberty Bible Commentary, p.345

“Does the Bible really condemn homosexuality? The answer is yes, it does. In every place it mentions any homosexual practice it roundly condemns the practice. In no place does it speak positively on homosexuality.”-“Hard Sayings of the Bible” by Walter C. Kaiser Jr, Peter H. Davids, F.F. Bruce, Manfred T. Brauch, p.545



“What is true historically and theologically is in measure true, however, experientially. The ‘gay’ facade is a thin veil for deep-seated frustration. The folly of homosexuality is proclaimed in its inability to reproduce the human species in keeping with the divine commandment (Ge 1:28). To sum up, what people do with God has much to do with their personal character and lifestyle. Throughout the passage they are represented as actively choosing a religion and a lifestyle; they are not being taken captive against their will.”
-“Zondervan NIV Bible Commentary”, Volume 2: New Testament, p.528-529

“In my book Reasoning Through Romans, I define these sins,...”-“Thru The Bible Commentary”, Romans by Dr. J. Vernon McGee.42

“I believe our text hints at the latter. In verse 27, Paul writes,’they receive in themselves that recompense of their error’ (verse 27). It could very well be that ‘the recompense of their error’ manifests itself in a chemical that affects the psychology of a person who practices this kind of error.

Homosexuality damages people psychologically. It changes who they are and what they could be. Knowing this, God says,’Stay away from it.’”-p.878, Jon Courson’s Application Commentary
 
I believe homosexuality is most often a product of environment and conditioning. My step daughter is lesbian because she was molested by a man when she was a child. My wife and I pray that she will be delivered from it

I join you in your prayers... We have friends who were part of our small group way back when (15 or so years ago), and their oldest son had "come out", and was living/working in New York. They were deeply saddened and worried about him, and his choices, but it appeared he had made his mind up about the life he wanted to live.
We still included him in our group prayers, and our private prayers.
We were surprised to hear from them a couple of years ago that he had met a girl, and they had decided to marry. We saw them in church when they came to visit... the last I heard, they were still happily married. Does he still have homosexual temptations? Probably. Does he give in to them? It appears not....

NEVER underestimate the power of prayer in changing lives... just because it doesn't happen in OUR time frame, God's Spirit moves at the RIGHT pace to effect the changes...
 
Same sex attraction (burning in the heart for the same sex) along with the other inordinate affections is not just sinful behavior but and is a strong influence of evil that comes from the prince and power of the air and strong demonic activity in the imaginations of the heart that involves the passions and appetites of the flesh. Even if some of you do not agree with this you have to consider the fact that this same sex attraction is unseemly and it goes against the natural use of men and women or the natural order that governs nature. Consequently, not being according to nature they are given over to it without restraint, for man was made for the woman and the woman for the man.
 
Firstly I am fully aware that the Bible condemns Homosexuality. I believe it is unnatural but I don't profess to understand it.
God also Condemns Murderers Liars Hypocrites, and basically anyone who is not saved.
According to Scripture the only way to salvation is faith in Christ, that goes for everyone including Homosexuals.
 
tanakh......ok....whether you profess to understand why same sex partners do what they do physically to each other or not has nothing to do why GOD CONDEMNS it. The fact remains....ALL sin is offensive to GOD...however....there seems to be a STIGMA associated with the Gay community, in case you are NOT aware of it. Gays that believe in a GOD, claim that GOD made them that way and that it is perfectly acceptable to be labelled a GAY Christian. I have met many self proclaimed gays who shamefully associate their chosen lifestyle with the very name of CHRIST, the name above All names. Gays that don't believe in GOD, well. there ya go....they end up with all the others who claim "NO GOD". Very few gays actually get fully delivered, nor do they want to be delivered from their sick lifestyle. Yes, the Holy Spirit can deliver anyone from anything...should they choose to do so. Homosexuality in today's world, is fully accepted, praised, given 'coming out" parties, parades and more...and you can be a gay democrat, Christian, marine sarge, pastor, boy scout leader and more and be supported by law. So, with that being said, why would a gay want to NOT continue in their lustful sexual exploits? Murderers, liars, hypocrites who do not change are not supported by law. They, eventually end up in the same place with gays too. GOD sees that justice is done.. No change, no heaven.
 
It is a sin. Those that do these things have no part in the Kingdom of God. Let them alone to pursue what so ever they will but don't try to justify there sins and then tell them it is ok. We should desire that they would turn from this and to the Lord but it cannot be both ways. You either are his child OR you are not. Our God is a Jealous God and he won't share his glory with those who do these thing.
Indeed, homosexuality is a sin:

You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination. Lev 18:22 RSV

Keep in mind, though, that it is not the only sin.
 
It is possible that gays are born with a inclination toward that sexual sin. I am not excusing their behavior. But we are all born with a sin nature. Some of us have tendencies for sexual immorality, be it a man and woman, a man and man, or a woman and woman. Gays and lesbians have no monopoly on sexual immorality. Neither do men, plenty of woman have similar issues.
But, I digressed. What is not a temptation to some is a pitfall for others. We have all observed people who have a habitual problem in a particular sin area, Christian or not (although the Christian should be progressing in eradicating that; sometimes it is immediate, sometimes it is a process). It could be gossip, something I rarely did, before I was saved or after. It could be greed, gambling, addictive personalities, whatever. Some of us struggle mightily with certain sin while others look at them and say "why is that a problem for them?'
Maybe Jesus was referring to this in part when he said take the lank out of your eye first.
It is a scientific fact that we are genetically regressing. Our DNA is weakening. It has now been proven that our emotions actually become part of our cellular gene structure. Who is to say that one is born with or without a inclination toward gay behavior, or a hetorosexual predisposition toward perverse behavior. Also a particular sin pattern is passed from generation to generation. Who can say if a specific sin propensity has not entered the actual body of the unborn baby in a physical manner, which we do not yet understand, but which science is implying may be very likely. God made us in wonderful and mysterious ways.
Again, I am not condoning gay sin and behavior. At the end of the day, if one is born with that inclination, or if he picked it up another way, it can be overcome through the precious blood of our Lord. Any lbgt individual reading, don't be deceived, sin is sin, and Jesus does not approve of it. He loves you, and washes you clean if you come to Him. Don't allow this worlds depraved arguments tell you that it is natural behavior.
 
Josef, I absolutely 1000% disagree with your first sentence. Gays are NOT born gay!! God hates the sin of homosexuality so why would he make babies born with an inclination to like the same sex later on in life? Let's say for a moment that God DOES make gay people. Then are those gays not required to repent that lifestyle? I mean, if God made them that way, then it must be natural, right? However, they DO need to repent because God did NOT make them gay, so therefore they can't say that.