Your Attitude is Typical in America. Because no one Challenges you to Back it up. "In Your Church". So you own a Church do You? OH...You In Charge Now? You "Encourage Giving" do You" You Compel", Do You" ? Come to The Mission Field and Talk this, I Beg You. You are whats wrong with this "American Church", as if there was ever such a thing. They will kill you here for your Arrogance. I dont blame them. You Educated? I doubt it. I sat under people like you. Dominant Kings, You are no Shepard, You would Abandon the Sheep here. They have no Money for you Here. Tell me what gives you the right to Rebuke? Your Anger and Hate, is very apparent. GET A REAL JOB! I sold everything to come here. I Financed my own Mission Station Here In SE Asia. I Never asked anyone for anything. Leave That Man alone. No one cares what you know, No one cares what you think you "Allow". "What Ever Measure", "Pressed Down And Shaken Together". The only thing that makes your words so Important to you, is your Ego. Cult Leader. Your "Toleration" of what is Preached will soon go away. Ill be straight up with you young man, you keep your piece, this aint your World and you need to treat people better. Im just Happy someone is Preaching. Grace is a very wide Body of Water, that I refuse to Judge. Return to your "First Love".
Religious Tithing
- Thread starter Guardian1970
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I'm not in America.
I have and can back it up. Confidently.
Don't be a dumb a**.
Yawn.
Why would I bother since you won't listen?
See first comment above.
Bring it on. You will answer to Jesus for your attitude.
More than you, likely.
You don't know jack about me.
Look in the mirror and say that.
Matthew 6:2.
I have and can back it up. Confidently.
Don't be a dumb a**.
Yawn.
Why would I bother since you won't listen?
See first comment above.
Bring it on. You will answer to Jesus for your attitude.
More than you, likely.
You don't know jack about me.
Look in the mirror and say that.
Matthew 6:2.
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There's this uber cool new invesntion you should check out, it's called "paragraphs" 
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Wow. Really? "Pastors and small group leaders"??? title being about "Tithing"?
Yet what I see is bickering and ugliness here!!! This is NOT Godly speak in this room! Godly speak is comfort, teaching with a loving attitude! not ranting and raving because someone misspells a word or two, or thinks differently than you.
Remind me to NOT attend any of your churches!!!!! Wow.
Yet what I see is bickering and ugliness here!!! This is NOT Godly speak in this room! Godly speak is comfort, teaching with a loving attitude! not ranting and raving because someone misspells a word or two, or thinks differently than you.
Remind me to NOT attend any of your churches!!!!! Wow.
Tithing is a guide to give at least 10%, but we should give more whenever possible.
We have a really good example of how God hates those who hold back from giving in Acts 5:1-11
But a certain man named Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a possession. 2 And he kept back part of the proceeds, his wife also being aware of it, and brought a certain part and laid it at the apostles’ feet. 3 But Peter said, “Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and keep back part of the price of the land for yourself? 4 While it remained, was it not your own? And after it was sold, was it not in your own control? Why have you conceived this thing in your heart? You have not lied to men but to God.”
5 Then Ananias, hearing these words, fell down and breathed his last. So great fear came upon all those who heard these things. 6 And the young men arose and wrapped him up, carried him out, and buried him.
7 Now it was about three hours later when his wife came in, not knowing what had happened. 8 And Peter answered her, “Tell me whether you sold the land for so much?”
She said, “Yes, for so much.”
9 Then Peter said to her, “How is it that you have agreed together to test the Spirit of the Lord? Look, the feet of those who have buried your husband are at the door, and they will carry you out.” 10 Then immediately she fell down at his feet and breathed her last. And the young men came in and found her dead, and carrying her out, buried her by her husband. 11 So great fear came upon all the church and upon all who heard these things.
We see God had no mercy on this man and his wife, for holding back what they were supposed to give to to the Church. God killed both of them, so that should be a serious lesson for all of us to give generously or we could end up like that poor couple.
We have a really good example of how God hates those who hold back from giving in Acts 5:1-11
But a certain man named Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a possession. 2 And he kept back part of the proceeds, his wife also being aware of it, and brought a certain part and laid it at the apostles’ feet. 3 But Peter said, “Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and keep back part of the price of the land for yourself? 4 While it remained, was it not your own? And after it was sold, was it not in your own control? Why have you conceived this thing in your heart? You have not lied to men but to God.”
5 Then Ananias, hearing these words, fell down and breathed his last. So great fear came upon all those who heard these things. 6 And the young men arose and wrapped him up, carried him out, and buried him.
7 Now it was about three hours later when his wife came in, not knowing what had happened. 8 And Peter answered her, “Tell me whether you sold the land for so much?”
She said, “Yes, for so much.”
9 Then Peter said to her, “How is it that you have agreed together to test the Spirit of the Lord? Look, the feet of those who have buried your husband are at the door, and they will carry you out.” 10 Then immediately she fell down at his feet and breathed her last. And the young men came in and found her dead, and carrying her out, buried her by her husband. 11 So great fear came upon all the church and upon all who heard these things.
We see God had no mercy on this man and his wife, for holding back what they were supposed to give to to the Church. God killed both of them, so that should be a serious lesson for all of us to give generously or we could end up like that poor couple.
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No, "tithing" is not "a guide to give at least 10%" at all. It is a requirement under the Mosaic Law to bring a tenth of your crops and every tenth animal to the temple (tabernacle); there is no "give" at all (double entendre intended). As Christians are not under the Mosaic Law, there is no minimum percentage for giving.
We are encouraged to give generously and even sacrificially, but "whenever possible" is not in Scripture anywhere.
No, we don't. Acts 5:1-11 is about honesty (and appearances). It has nothing whatsoever to do with tithing, and nothing to do with "holding back from giving". Ananias and Sapphira were put to death because of their dishonesty. From verse 4: "You have not lied to men but to God.”
Fundamentally wrong, as explained above. Verse 4 clearly shows that the money belonged to A&S to do with as they pleased: "While it remained, was it not your own? And after it was sold, was it not in your own control?"
That is seriously wrong. The warning is to honesty, not generosity. The fear-based giving you promulgate is not biblically sound.
We are encouraged to give generously and even sacrificially, but "whenever possible" is not in Scripture anywhere.
No, we don't. Acts 5:1-11 is about honesty (and appearances). It has nothing whatsoever to do with tithing, and nothing to do with "holding back from giving". Ananias and Sapphira were put to death because of their dishonesty. From verse 4: "You have not lied to men but to God.”
Fundamentally wrong, as explained above. Verse 4 clearly shows that the money belonged to A&S to do with as they pleased: "While it remained, was it not your own? And after it was sold, was it not in your own control?"
That is seriously wrong. The warning is to honesty, not generosity. The fear-based giving you promulgate is not biblically sound.
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There are many other scriptures which could be applied to show how important it is to give generously and sacrificially.
Agreed, it not set at 10% under the new covenant. If we consider that everything we have belongs to God, then we get a different perspective towards our money.
what about the parable of the talents, which shows God blesses those who are good stewards of their money so they can be a greater blessing to those in need. And Jesus told the rich young ruler to go and sell all he has and give it to the poor. We see that giving generously is required if we are to inherit the Kingdom of God.
I have found too many Christians make excuses for not giving generously, they complain about the cost of living and kinds of other excuses. I don't find any examples in the bible to excuse people for not giving, even that old lady was blessed for giving her last two mites, so if she can give her last few coins so can all of us give generously who live in the prosperous west.
Agreed, it not set at 10% under the new covenant. If we consider that everything we have belongs to God, then we get a different perspective towards our money.
what about the parable of the talents, which shows God blesses those who are good stewards of their money so they can be a greater blessing to those in need. And Jesus told the rich young ruler to go and sell all he has and give it to the poor. We see that giving generously is required if we are to inherit the Kingdom of God.
I have found too many Christians make excuses for not giving generously, they complain about the cost of living and kinds of other excuses. I don't find any examples in the bible to excuse people for not giving, even that old lady was blessed for giving her last two mites, so if she can give her last few coins so can all of us give generously who live in the prosperous west.
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OK, I understand but how do we know how much we should give. My Church calls giving "tithes and offerings", this suggests that tithing is still observed in the new testament Church.
I don't know of any new testament passages where tithing was abolished or done away with. It seems to remain as a guide as to how much of our money we should give. I don't want to confuse this with some of the other old testament requirements which were abolished, such as dietary etc.
I don't know of any new testament passages where tithing was abolished or done away with. It seems to remain as a guide as to how much of our money we should give. I don't want to confuse this with some of the other old testament requirements which were abolished, such as dietary etc.
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You're thinking of the tithe as money; it was never money under the Law. Until you grasp that fundamental distinction, the confusion will remain.
I have no idea how much you or anyone else should give; that is between you, your spouse (if you're married), and the Lord.
Perhaps you earn literally just enough to pay the bills: then pay your bills. Don't presume upon God's provision by giving your bill money to the Church; that's actually theft. Instead, ask the Lord for additional income so that you may support the Church.
Perhaps you earn enough that you have "discretionary income". Assign some of that for your local church and some for other giving. You are also free to use some for your own interests.
The point is this: you need to develop your relationship with the Holy Spirit and trust His guidance on where and how much you should give. In this sense, "tithing" is actually laziness, because you assume you're doing God's will and you will likely ignore His nudges to do something different.
It suggests that many church leaders haven't done their homework on the subject. Some leaders will use the term "tithes and offerings" to keep peace on the subject.
Consider this: tithing (under the Mosaic Law) was designed to support the Levites and priests, who do not exist in the New Testament Church. The produce (not money!) was brought to the temple and eaten by those who worked there. Further, it was only payable by those who produced crops or raised animals. Fishermen, loggers, clerks and craftsmen were all exempt.
I have to break off here but I will return to this later.
I have no idea how much you or anyone else should give; that is between you, your spouse (if you're married), and the Lord.
Perhaps you earn literally just enough to pay the bills: then pay your bills. Don't presume upon God's provision by giving your bill money to the Church; that's actually theft. Instead, ask the Lord for additional income so that you may support the Church.
Perhaps you earn enough that you have "discretionary income". Assign some of that for your local church and some for other giving. You are also free to use some for your own interests.
The point is this: you need to develop your relationship with the Holy Spirit and trust His guidance on where and how much you should give. In this sense, "tithing" is actually laziness, because you assume you're doing God's will and you will likely ignore His nudges to do something different.
It suggests that many church leaders haven't done their homework on the subject. Some leaders will use the term "tithes and offerings" to keep peace on the subject.
Consider this: tithing (under the Mosaic Law) was designed to support the Levites and priests, who do not exist in the New Testament Church. The produce (not money!) was brought to the temple and eaten by those who worked there. Further, it was only payable by those who produced crops or raised animals. Fishermen, loggers, clerks and craftsmen were all exempt.
I have to break off here but I will return to this later.
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