Replacement theology? Yes or No.

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WayneNSO said:
To me it is all of human history from the time it was written until the time the physical Kingdom is established on Earth. What's that saying? Prophecy is history in the making, and History is prophecy fulfilled ? Or something like that :) To me chapter 9 is so detailed about Mohammed it can be nothing else. But that is just my opinion, I know no one on here will agree, because most think everything is in the past or everything is in the future. Just chipping in my two cents :)
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The books in the Bible are written to specific audiences. They have real meaning to those to whom they were written unless otherwise stated. One should assume their message is for the audience they were written to.

That said, every generation can make applications from the scripture, but to assume the details in the books do not apply to its audience is without merit.
 
WayneNSO said:
Why would the Jews be told in Daniel 2 and 7 about the succession of Empires? Because at the end of everything we have the Kingdom of God, Paradise restored, the resurrection etc
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That's not what those chapters teach exactly, but you are on the right path. God's kingdom was established in the 1st century definitely with the coming of Messiah. He said so...the kingdom is at hand. And it did begin in Jerusalem with the early church. But you are looking for a literal physical kingdom when the kingdom is in you, and me, and every other Christian. And like the mustard seed, it began small and has been growing ever since.
 
Cameron143 said:
The books in the Bible are written to specific audiences. They have real meaning to those to whom they were written unless otherwise stated. One should assume their message is for the audience they were written to.

That said, every generation can make applications from the scripture, but to assume the details in the books do not apply to its audience is without merit.
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Of course it applied to those reading it at the time. That is why the early church fathers prayed for the Roman Emperors, because they knew that according to the Revelation, once they were gone, the man of sin would appear, which did happen, the Papacy sat in the seat of the Roman Emperors, keeping the divided Empire together under then. Even the early popes agreed with the interpretation.

The church at the time might not of understood everything but the meanings unfold through history. Instead of having prophets like ancient Israel and Judah had throughout their times, we have the revelation in their place, speaking to each generation.
 
Cameron143 said:
That's not what those chapters teach exactly, but you are on the right path. God's kingdom was established in the 1st century definitely with the coming of Messiah. He said so...the kingdom is at hand. And it did begin in Jerusalem with the early church. But you are looking for a literal physical kingdom when the kingdom is in you, and me, and every other Christian. And like the mustard seed, it began small and has been growing ever since.
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I agree that is when it began, but we do not have the complete fulfilment yet - else why do we still have death ? Death and Hades are thrown into the lake of fire when the Kingdom and resurrection is established. If we have that now, why do things wax worse and worse and why do we still have death ?
 
If God knows the end from the beginning which can not be debated then certainly he knows this modern Israel.
So what does he say about Israel?

A Chosen People​



Deu 7:6 For you are a holy people to the Lord your God: marked out by the Lord your God to be his special people out of all the nations on the face of the earth.

Deu 7:7 The Lord did not give you his love or take you for himself because you were more in number than any other people; for you were the smallest of the nations:

Deu 7:8 But because of his love for you, and in order to keep his oath to your fathers, the Lord took you out with the strength of his hand, making you free from the prison-house and from the hand of Pharaoh, king of Egypt.

Deu 7:9 Be certain, then, that the Lord your God is God; whose faith and mercy are unchanging, who keeps his word through a thousand generations to those who have love for him and keep his laws;

Deu 7:10 Rewarding his haters to their face with destruction; he will have no mercy on his hater, but will give him open punishment.

Deu 7:11 So keep the orders and the laws and the decisions which I give you today and do them.

Deu 7:12 And it will be, that if you give attention to these decisions and keep and do them, then the Lord will keep his agreement with you and his mercy, as he said in his oath to your fathers.

Deu 7:13 And he will give you his love, blessing you and increasing you: he will send his blessing on the offspring of your body and the fruit of your land, your grain and your wine and your oil, the increase of your cattle and the young of your flock, in the land which by his oath to your fathers he undertook to give you.

Deu 7:14 You will have greater blessings than any other people: no male or female among you or among your cattle will be without offspring.

Deu 7:15 And the Lord will take away from you all disease, and will not put on you any of the evil diseases of Egypt which you have seen, but will put them on your haters.
 
WayneNSO said:
Of course it applied to those reading it at the time. That is why the early church fathers prayed for the Roman Emperors, because they knew that according to the Revelation, once they were gone, the man of sin would appear, which did happen, the Papacy sat in the seat of the Roman Emperors, keeping the divided Empire together under then. Even the early popes agreed with the interpretation.

The church at the time might not of understood everything but the meanings unfold through history. Instead of having prophets like ancient Israel and Judah had throughout their times, we have the revelation in their place, speaking to each generation.
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You don't actually understand what the book of Revelation is about. When I have time, I'll break it down for you. But in the meantime, what is the book of Deuteronomy about? If you don't understand the book of Deuteronomy, you will never understand the book of Revelation.
 
WayneNSO said:
I agree that is when it began, but we do not have the complete fulfilment yet - else why do we still have death ? Death and Hades are thrown into the lake of fire when the Kingdom and resurrection is established. If we have that now, why do things wax worse and worse and why do we still have death ?
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The kingdom of God came definitively with Christ. It has been coming progressively since. And it will come consumatively when Christ returns. This is what history is building towards.
 
Cameron143 said:
You don't actually understand what the book of Revelation is about. When I have time, I'll break it down for you. But in the meantime, what is the book of Deuteronomy about? If you don't understand the book of Deuteronomy, you will never understand the book of Revelation.
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I think it is you that does not understand, but I would like to see how you break it down, maybe start a new thread when you do ?
 
Cameron143 said:
That's your evidence? Actually knowledge did increase. Much greater understanding came with the teachings of Jesus and the disciples. Much more of God's redemptive plans were made known.

You still haven't given any support for anything being imminent and coming to pass circa 95 AD.
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Yes, they were made known to the Gentile nations, but not the Jewish nation of Israel. That's why Romans 11:25 tells you that the Jews have been temporarily blinded until the fullness of the Gentiles comes in, which isn't complete yet. Once it does, Jesus will turn back His focus on the Jews.
 
Revelation1v8 said:
Yes, they were made known to the Gentile nations, but not the Jewish nation of Israel. That's why Romans 11:25 tells you that the Jews have been temporarily blinded until the fullness of the Gentiles comes in, which isn't complete yet. Once it does, Jesus will turn back His focus on the Jews.
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So you agree it was a time of the expansion of knowledge?
 
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