Replacement theology? Yes or No.
- Thread starter Gideon300
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Where did Jesus teach a pretrib rapture?
In the Olivet Discourse, Jesus says the gathering of His elect occurs "immediately after the tribulation of those days" (Matt. 24:29-31).
He then describes His coming, the visible signs, and the gathering of believers in one sequence.
If Jesus taught a pretrib rapture, where is the passage in which He explicitly separates the gathering of believers from His post-tribulation coming?
Simply saying "Jesus taught a pretrib rapture" is not enough.
The burden is to show the text where Jesus places the resurrection/gathering of believers before the tribulation rather than after it.
Does anyone know what it means, when the Bible uses the word first fruits?
There is no way, that you can have first fruits without a harvest.
So the entire gathering of the church, and and then the entire gathering of the Jews, gathered in revelation 14, are both tied to 2 completely separate First fruits harvest.
one gathering has Jesus, the first fruits. The other gathering has a 144000 Jewish born again ethnic Jewish men.
There is no way, that you can have first fruits without a harvest.
So the entire gathering of the church, and and then the entire gathering of the Jews, gathered in revelation 14, are both tied to 2 completely separate First fruits harvest.
one gathering has Jesus, the first fruits. The other gathering has a 144000 Jewish born again ethnic Jewish men.
"Firstfruits" does not automatically require two different harvests any more than Christ being called the firstfruits requires a separate resurrection from all believers.
In Scripture, firstfruits are the initial portion offered to God that guarantees the greater harvest to come (1 Cor. 15:20-23; James 1:18). Christ is called the firstfruits of the resurrection because His resurrection guarantees the resurrection of all who belong to Him.
Revelation 14 calls the 144,000 "firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb" (Rev. 14:4), but the text does not explicitly say they are the firstfruits of a separate Jewish resurrection harvest. It simply identifies them as a special group set apart to God.
The burden is to prove from the text that "firstfruits" in Revelation 14 requires two distinct end-time gatherings.
The term itself only establishes a relationship between an initial portion and a larger harvest.
It does not, by itself, define the timing or number of harvests.
Jesus used Noah gathered before the flood.
Jesus used lot as an analogy to WHEN would be his coming.
Was lot removed pre city burning or after as your doctrine would need?
Was Noah taken up over a mile into the sky post flood or DURING the entire flood?
BTW that is found in mat 24 and Luke 17.