Revolution in Iran

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ZNP said:
What I am quoting is Amos 9:11 and this was fulfilled July 1, 2025. I am not saying Christians were supposed to do this. I am simply saying that God said it would be done and it has been done.
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Maybe. This is what I am getting from my sources:

***************************************************************

"On July 1, 2025 Israel sacrificed a certified red heifer according to the Torah: true of false?"

Short answer: False (as a Torah-valid sacrifice).

What actually happened on July 1, 2025 is widely misunderstood.

What did happen​

A practice ceremony involving a red heifer was reportedly carried out by activists connected with the Temple-preparation movement (often associated with the Temple Institute and related groups).

  • The animal used was not considered kosher/valid for the ritual because it had non-red hairs.
  • The event was described as a training or rehearsal for the future ritual.
  • It reportedly took place at an undisclosed site in Samaria, not at the required location.

Why it does NOT count as the biblical ritual​

According to Numbers 19, the red heifer ceremony must meet strict requirements:

  1. Perfect red heifer with no blemish
  2. Never yoked or used for work
  3. Burned outside the camp under priestly supervision
  4. Ashes preserved for purification rites
The July 2025 event failed the first requirement, so even the groups preparing for the ritual said it did not count as the official ceremony.

Current status​

  • Several potential red heifers (including ones imported from Texas in 2022) are still being monitored.
  • As of late 2025 there was no confirmed, universally recognized red-heifer sacrifice performed according to the Torah.
✅ Conclusion:

  • A rehearsal burning occurred.
  • A valid Torah red-heifer sacrifice has not been confirmed.
 
cv5 said:
I did not read the link, but I disagree in principle.
Purim is a Israel-specific event. Only Jews are participants.

The three fall feast of Moses have yet to be fulfilled, all three are for Israel alone.

The Church does NOT go thru the Trumpets 7 year tribulation wrath, nor do we need Atonement (we already have it).
And since we are ALREADY union-ed with Christ, Tabernacles does no apply to us either!
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1Corinthians 10:6a Now these things were our examples
 
cv5 said:
And BTW, the anti-Christ of Daniel 12 is the antitype of Antiochus IV Epiphanes of Daniel 11.
And what did Antiochus do, and where did he do it?
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But that was only done to the Jews, I thought that was your reason for rejecting Purim as a type of the rapture. Purim also has a antichrist figure in Haman.
 
ZNP said:
Check the original language. Sitting in the temple is actually sitting in the holy sanctuary. There is no verse in either the old or new testament saying a third Temple building will be built during the tribulation or prior to the tribulation by the Jews. Rather Jesus and Paul refer to the church as the temple of God which Jesus will build.

You don't need a temple building to have the sacrifices and oblations, both the Temple (building) and the Taberacle contained a Holy Sanctuary. So there is no requirement to have a temple building. Read the law concerning the red heifer and you will see they have already raised the tabernacle of David with the Holy Sanctuary, they have already formed a Priesthood, and with the ashes of the red heifer they are already set to revive the oblations and sacrifices.
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Disagree.

The “abomination of desolation”
Jesus refers to Gospel of Matthew 24:15, quoting Book of Daniel:

“When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation… standing in the holy place.”

Daniel’s prophecies:
Daniel 9:27
Daniel 11:31 (the foreshadowed "type" of what will happen and WHERE yet future.)
Daniel 12:11

All describe sacrifices being stopped.

For sacrifices to be stopped, sacrifices must be happening.


1. The Greek in 2 Thessalonians 2:4​


The key passage is Second Epistle to the Thessalonians 2:4:


“…so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.” (KJV)
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Greek wording​


  • ναὸν τοῦ θεοῦ (naon tou theou) = the temple/sanctuary of God
  • ναός (naos) usually refers to the inner sanctuary (holy place/holy of holies), not the entire temple complex.

This contrasts with:


  • ἱερόν (hieron) = the whole temple complex (courts, buildings, etc.)

So linguistically:


✔ True: naos often refers specifically to the sanctuary, the sacred inner structure.


But that does not eliminate the idea of a physical temple. The sanctuary was part of the temple building, not something separate.



2. Does the Bible explicitly say a Third Temple will be built?​


The statement is technically correct in a narrow sense:


There is no single verse that plainly says:


“The Jews will build a third temple during the tribulation.”
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However, many interpreters infer it from several passages.



3. Passages that imply a functioning temple​


1. The “abomination of desolation”​


Jesus refers to Gospel of Matthew 24:15, quoting Book of Daniel:


“When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation… standing in the holy place.”
Click to expand...

Daniel’s prophecies:


  • Daniel 9:27
  • Daniel 11:31
  • Daniel 12:11

All describe sacrifices being stopped.


For sacrifices to be stopped, sacrifices must be happening.



2. The Antichrist in the temple​


Second Epistle to the Thessalonians 2:4


The man of sin sits in “the temple of God.”


Most futurist interpreters take this literally, meaning a real sanctuary.



3. Temple measured in Revelation​


In Book of Revelation 11:1–2:


“Rise, and measure **the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.”
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This passage mentions:


  • Temple
  • Altar
  • Worshippers

Again implying active temple worship.



4. Why some people reject a future temple​


Some theologians interpret these passages symbolically.


They argue:


  • The church is the temple (1 Corinthians 3:16)
  • Therefore the Antichrist sitting in the temple means corrupting the church.

But there are problems with that interpretation:


  1. Paul calls it “the temple of God,” not the church of God.
  2. The context of Daniel’s prophecy about sacrifices points to a Jewish temple setting.
  3. Jesus’ reference to “holy place” is clearly Jewish temple language.


5. What the Bible does clearly predict​


These things are clearly stated:


  1. Sacrifices resume (Daniel 9:27)
  2. They are stopped halfway through the final 7 years (Daniel 9:27; 12:11)
  3. The abomination of desolation occurs in a holy place (Matthew 24:15)
  4. The man of sin sits in the temple of God (2 Thessalonians 2:4)
  5. A temple with an altar exists in Revelation 11

Those combined lead many scholars to conclude a third temple must exist.
 
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ZNP said:
But that was only done to the Jews, I thought that was your reason for rejecting Purim as a type of the rapture. Purim also has a antichrist figure in Haman.
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Correct. And my point is that Purim has nothing whatsoever to do with the rapture or Bride of Christ.
 
ZNP said:
What I am quoting is Amos 9:11 and this was fulfilled July 1, 2025. I am not saying Christians were supposed to do this. I am simply saying that God said it would be done and it has been done.
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James was also quoting Amos 9:11, and he said it was being fulfilled then in the 1st century AD. Your interpretation comes from the pharisees who reject(ed) Christ. Without Christ they have to interpret it that way and project its fulfillment into the future
 
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ZNP said:
Check the original language. Sitting in the temple is actually sitting in the holy sanctuary. There is no verse in either the old or new testament saying a third Temple building will be built during the tribulation or prior to the tribulation by the Jews. Rather Jesus and Paul refer to the church as the temple of God which Jesus will build.

You don't need a temple building to have the sacrifices and oblations, both the Temple (building) and the Taberacle contained a Holy Sanctuary. So there is no requirement to have a temple building. Read the law concerning the red heifer and you will see they have already raised the tabernacle of David with the Holy Sanctuary, they have already formed a Priesthood, and with the ashes of the red heifer they are already set to revive the oblations and sacrifices.
Click to expand...
The wording in Second Epistle to the Thessalonians 2:4 strongly suggests that this is talking about a literal person taking a position inside what is called “the temple of God.”


Let’s look closely at the language.



1. The Greek phrase​


The key clause reads:


εἰς τὸν ναὸν τοῦ θεοῦ καθίσαι


Transliteration:
eis ton naon tou theou kathisai


Word-by-word:


  • εἰς (eis) – into / into the interior of
  • τὸν ναόν (ton naon) – the sanctuary / temple
  • τοῦ θεοῦ (tou theou) – of God
  • καθίσαι (kathisai) – to sit / take a seat / be seated

Important observations​


  • εἰς (“into”) normally indicates movement into a place, not merely “in relation to.”
  • καθίζω / καθίσαι literally means to sit down or take a seat.

So grammatically the phrase reads roughly:


“to take his seat in the temple of God.”
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That wording naturally suggests an actual act of sitting in a location.

2. Meaning of “temple” (ναός –​


As mentioned earlier:


  • ναός (naos) = the sanctuary building itself, the sacred inner structure.
  • It is distinct from ἱερόν (hieron) which refers to the whole temple complex.

This means Paul is picturing the figure inside the sacred structure, not merely somewhere on the Temple Mount.

3. Does the Greek indicate a literal person?​


Yes, very strongly.


The subject is described as:


  • ὁ ἄνθρωπος τῆς ἁμαρτίας – “the man of sin”
  • ὁ υἱὸς τῆς ἀπωλείας – “the son of perdition”

These are personal nouns, and the actions are personal verbs:


  • sits
  • exalts himself
  • shows himself

The grammar reads naturally as a specific individual performing actions.



✅ Conclusion


From the Greek of 2 Thessalonians 2:4:


  • It does indicate a literal person.
  • It describes the act of sitting in a specific sanctuary location.
  • It does not explicitly say Jerusalem, though many infer that from other prophecies.

So linguistically the verse suggests:


A real individual taking a seat inside what is called the “temple of God.”
Click to expand...
 
ChristRoseFromTheDead said:
James was also quoting Amos 9:11, and he said it was being fulfilled then in the 1st century AD. Your interpretation comes from the pharisees who reject(ed) Christ. Without Christ they have to interpret it that way and project its fulfillment into the future
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Yes, and James was wrong. Paul said that the judaizers came from James in the book of Galatians and called them "the concision".

My understanding is that James was the first cult leader and after he repented the book of James is the very best book for helping anyone in a cult.

Peter denied the Lord and then had the ministry to those who also are backsliders. I see the gospel of Mark as being the gospel of Peter and that the agenda is to those left behind during the tribulation.

Paul agreed to the persecution and killing of Jesus' disciples, he didn't see the body of Christ, after he repented his ministry revealed the body of Christ.

Your whole doctrine is based on the error of James recorded in Acts which included pushing Paul to sacrifice a bull, fortunately he was stopped by the Lord prior to that.

This is why I think the book of Hebrews is a collaboration between Paul and James to help everyone clearly see the change from the age of the law to the age of grace.
 
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cv5 said:
The wording in Second Epistle to the Thessalonians 2:4 strongly suggests that this is talking about a literal person taking a position inside what is called “the temple of God.”


Let’s look closely at the language.



1. The Greek phrase​


The key clause reads:


εἰς τὸν ναὸν τοῦ θεοῦ καθίσαι


Transliteration:
eis ton naon tou theou kathisai


Word-by-word:


  • εἰς (eis) – into / into the interior of
  • τὸν ναόν (ton naon) – the sanctuary / temple
  • τοῦ θεοῦ (tou theou) – of God
  • καθίσαι (kathisai) – to sit / take a seat / be seated

Important observations​


  • εἰς (“into”) normally indicates movement into a place, not merely “in relation to.”
  • καθίζω / καθίσαι literally means to sit down or take a seat.

So grammatically the phrase reads roughly:




That wording naturally suggests an actual act of sitting in a location.

2. Meaning of “temple” (ναός –​


As mentioned earlier:


  • ναός (naos) = the sanctuary building itself, the sacred inner structure.
  • It is distinct from ἱερόν (hieron) which refers to the whole temple complex.

This means Paul is picturing the figure inside the sacred structure, not merely somewhere on the Temple Mount.

3. Does the Greek indicate a literal person?​


Yes, very strongly.


The subject is described as:


  • ὁ ἄνθρωπος τῆς ἁμαρτίας – “the man of sin”
  • ὁ υἱὸς τῆς ἀπωλείας – “the son of perdition”

These are personal nouns, and the actions are personal verbs:


  • sits
  • exalts himself
  • shows himself

The grammar reads naturally as a specific individual performing actions.



✅ Conclusion


From the Greek of 2 Thessalonians 2:4:


  • It does indicate a literal person.
  • It describes the act of sitting in a specific sanctuary location.
  • It does not explicitly say Jerusalem, though many infer that from other prophecies.

So linguistically the verse suggests:
Click to expand...
The word translated "temple" is not the word in other places that referred to the building, but instead refers to the Holy Sanctuary. There is no verse in the New Testament or the Old Testament that says a third temple will be built by the Jews prior to the Day of the Lord or during the day of the Lord.
 
Well in terms of Britain's molding empire and the Commonwealth, while Canada are predictably apostates and serfs in line with weak Keir Starmer, one takes note of Australia whom has shown strong gumption and been on the right side of this even before the strikes occured, and is more Christian generally than the other colonies. Iran's women soccer team refused to sing the regime's national anthem. The remnant of the cult has branded them as traitors and threatened to execute them upon their return to Iran. This has caused their national soccer team to ask the Australian government for temporary asylum. May Australia give them temporary refuge until the cult's remnants can be thrown off the face of the Earth that these brave women may return to a Free Iran, praise Jesus.



 
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ZNP said:
Yes, and James was wrong. Paul said that the judaizers came from James in the book of Galatians and called them "the concision".
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No, you're wrong and really quite presumptuous to say that. It nowhere states what you're claiming. The concision refers to those who taught gentiles had to be circumcised to be saved, and Acts 15 makes it clear that James did not agree with them. In fact, he explicitly stated that he did not send anyone claiming such things.

Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment: Acts 15:24​
 
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ZNP said:
The word translated "temple" is not the word in other places that referred to the building, but instead refers to the Holy Sanctuary. There is no verse in the New Testament or the Old Testament that says a third temple will be built by the Jews prior to the Day of the Lord or during the day of the Lord.
Click to expand...
Disagree. There is MASSIVE irrefutable evidence to support a Temple in Jerusalem. In fact a Temple and sanctuary MUST exist before the Second Coming can ever occur. Likewise the rapture and the nation Israel in the land of Israel.
Not only that, all prophecy must be fulfilled and there is no other way that it can be.

Tell me this, when Jesus Messiah does come:
-where does His feet set down first?
-who's armies is He destroying?
-who is Israel fleeing from?
-who is the ultimate target that Christ seeks to destroy and make an example of?

Revelation 19:20
“The beast was taken, and with him the false prophet… These both were cast alive into the lake of fire.”
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