Forgivable or not.. the bible tell us about the one unforgivable sin but its not suicide but many say you cant ask for forgivness after your dead therefore anyone who kills themself goes to hell but is this true... what if you where a saved christian who commits suicide in a momment of weakness but asked for forgivness before the act.. can you be forgiven for a sin you havent commeted yet.. whats the bible say.... P.s im not suicidel but there was a recent suicide in my town kinda got me thinking about it because everyones saying he is in a better place an all that.
suicide
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Well the only things that I've heard in the Bible about it is the verse that says; better it is to be a living dog, than a dead lion.
Someone else made a point one time that made sense to me anyways; that a suicide is a pre-meditated murder of oneself.
We won't really know until we get there ourselves I guess, and remember that we have no right to judge anyhow.
No one truly knows another persons tribulations, and who knows what this soul went through that drove them to this point, but one can be pretty sure that this person was very badly hurt.
Hope and Pray for the best.
Y
Yachal
Guest
Though I would never condone suicide or any sin for that matter I guess it all comes down to whether or not you believe in the "Finished Work " of Christ . If I believe that Christ died for the SIN of the world and that our SIN is paid for (past,present , and future) then it is not my performance that earns my salvation rather my faith and believing on Christ. I do not believe that a prayer asking forgiveness ahead of time would be any more beneficial than not praying at all if you are of the opinion that our justification is assured by asking forgiveness for every violation of the law. At the end of the day I believe that our justification is through the faith and believing in what Christ did on the cross. As Paul stated "Christ and Him crucified". I do believe that sin in any form will affect our lives on earth with relationships and witness opportunities and in the hereafter with our rewards and service in the Kingdom, I fervently believe that my salvation is a gift that I could never earn and I must rest in that assurance.
Basically asking God for forgiveness before committing a sin, like a man asking his wife to pardon him for the adultery he intends to commit tomorrow? That is blatant disobedience and mockery of God's grace. No one can deceive God for He knows our heart. Biblical repentance is change of mind which leads to change of action so for someone to do such means their repentance was insincere.
Romans 6:1-2 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
While God's grace abounds where sin abounds, it isn't a license to sin rather it teaches us to deny ungodliness.
The premise that God automatically forgave our future sins in advance allowing us to commit them with impunity is a very dangerous one. There is no scriptural evidence for this.
Proverbs 28:13 says "He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy", and
one cannot forsake their future sins before committing them.
It is our old sins that were cleansed and forgiven at initial conversion as per 2 Peter 1:9, so sins committed after conversion can defile a Christian's garment of righteousness (Rev 3:4) thus repentance will need to be sought...
2 Peter 1:9 (KJV) But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.
2 Peter 1:9 (ESV) For whoever lacks these qualities is so nearsighted that he is blind, having forgotten that he was cleansed from his former sins.
2 Peter 1:9 (ERV) But those who don't grow in these blessings are blind. They cannot see clearly what they have. They have forgotten that they were cleansed from their past sins.
Proverbs 28:13 says "He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy", and
one cannot forsake their future sins before committing them.
It is our old sins that were cleansed and forgiven at initial conversion as per 2 Peter 1:9, so sins committed after conversion can defile a Christian's garment of righteousness (Rev 3:4) thus repentance will need to be sought...
2 Peter 1:9 (KJV) But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.
2 Peter 1:9 (ESV) For whoever lacks these qualities is so nearsighted that he is blind, having forgotten that he was cleansed from his former sins.
2 Peter 1:9 (ERV) But those who don't grow in these blessings are blind. They cannot see clearly what they have. They have forgotten that they were cleansed from their past sins.
K
Kerry
Guest
I don't think that the Holy Spirit would guide anyone to suicide. I think that is done by demon spirits. I do think that it is murder. However, there are cases of dementia.Where some is under psychiatric care ( not psychological, big difference). In this case they are not responsible for their actions. Since their mind is not right. In my opinion psychologist are snake oil people. They do not have the right to prescribe medicine, just talk. Psychiatrists can prescribe medicine due to inefficiencies in the brain or chemical properties in the body. So what I'm getting at is, if you just had a bad day and killed yourself, then I don't think you are in a good position. Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem.
This is a great question and leads to many interesting talks/debates/dialogues. Here is the real questions. First, is God sovereign and know everything about us before we even do it? Yes, he does. Good we got that much out of the way. Second, why is suicide a sin (I'd like to find where in scriptures it says suicide is an unforgivable sin). I believe the point of suicide is a sin because one is taking into their hands something that is only intended for God to do. If we take our lives or the lives of other we are for all intense purposes playing God are we not? Thirdly, Judas! This is interesting because the betrayal was prophesied long before it occurred. However, if Judas' reason for living was solely for being the traitor and thus ending his life in suicide, well then God did not give him or any 'free will' or choice in the matter. It is almost like his fate was sealed he was born condemned to an eternity of Hell. I do not like to believe it is as such. Judas did not hang himself because he wanted to "die" necessarily but because the pain and despair of having betrayed his Master Jesus was too much for him to bear. He went and returned the 40 silver coins and repented although it was too late his intentions showed a change of heart. When he saw that even with repentance it would not change what was happening to Jesus, the thought that he betrayed his Master and was causing his demise was too much for him to bear. Culturally betrayal and honor was held in higher esteem in those times than it ever does in our day and age. Perhaps a combination of those thoughts lead Judas to end his suffering. However, one could also argue, if Judas had been patient and actually listened to Jesus' words he would know that Jesus was going to be resurrected in the third day, but then again neither did the other 11.
All in all I do not believe that suicide is an unforgivable sin we do not know circumstances or thoughts of those going through with the act so we cannot claim to know. It is interesting though that Judas is referred to the one who lost his way. Lost his way in what context? Lost his way as in he killed himself, or lost his way as in was no able to continue the work of spreading the gospel? So many interesting thoughts and questions that we do not have the answer to. Far be it for me to claim what is or what is not!
God's Hand is not shortened that It cannot save. No opinion proceeding from the flesh can change this truth.
Isa 59:1
Behold, the LORD'S hand is not shortened, that it cannot save; neither his ear heavy, that it cannot hear:
Psa 51:17
The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.
Isa 59:1
Behold, the LORD'S hand is not shortened, that it cannot save; neither his ear heavy, that it cannot hear:
Psa 51:17
The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.
Another interesting point! Does the scriptures not state that those that cannot properly rationalize things (mental disorders) will not be held accountable for not understanding the message of the gospel?
The idea that suicide is a sin that condemns one's soul to hell is rooted in roman catholic tradition. We can discuss a myriad of scenarios but there is nothing to suggest that we are correct in each of our judgments. If a person is saved they go to be with the Lord. If they are lost they go into outer darkness. Methodology of the destruction of the flesh is of no consequence.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
For the cause of Christ
Roger
D
danschance
Guest
I believe, in general, suicide is unforgivable. How can you repent for the sin of suicide while you are doing it? You die in a state of unrepentant sin. You have decided not to trust in God and His plan for you. You falsely think suicide is answer, it is not. Heaven and Hell are both real. We must do everything we can to get to Heaven. If you are having suicidal thoughts, get help.
When I was in my mid 20's, I went thru some very difficult circumstances. I became depressed and stayed depressed for a year and a half. My depression only seemed to get worse. One day I parked my car and started to walk to my cubicle. It was a an awesome spring morning, nice and warm, sunny and birds chirping. I thought wow, this is a beautiful day. I think I will kill myself today. I started to calmly plan it out.
I decided to use my friends .45 caliber handgun and figured it would make a huge mess with brain matter and blood. So I figured I would leave a note, warm my friends girl friend not to go in the garage. I calmly and peacefully made these plans. Then I got scared. I had thought about suicide many times but never felt so peaceful about it. I made an appointment with an onsite psychologist and she recommended I see another psychologist.
He told me that I did not fit the normal pattern on depression and suggested there might be a medical reason for my depression. He said he would see me but only if I made an appointment with my doctor and do some tests. I did. The doctor ordered some blood work and asked me to come back in two weeks. Two weeks later, the doctor burst thru the door holding the lab work. H showed my a paper and with his finger he said "Do you see that number?". He went on and said "This means your thyroid is not doing what it is supposed to be doing". He handed me a prescription and soon my depression disappeared.
Had I not gone for help, I would of blown my brains out over a deficient thyroid. It would've been incredibly stupid and even selfish. If you have depression and think about suicide, please go get some help. It is not a terminal disease and it can be treated. No matter what your circumstances are, it is never God's will for you to kill yourself.
When I was in my mid 20's, I went thru some very difficult circumstances. I became depressed and stayed depressed for a year and a half. My depression only seemed to get worse. One day I parked my car and started to walk to my cubicle. It was a an awesome spring morning, nice and warm, sunny and birds chirping. I thought wow, this is a beautiful day. I think I will kill myself today. I started to calmly plan it out.
I decided to use my friends .45 caliber handgun and figured it would make a huge mess with brain matter and blood. So I figured I would leave a note, warm my friends girl friend not to go in the garage. I calmly and peacefully made these plans. Then I got scared. I had thought about suicide many times but never felt so peaceful about it. I made an appointment with an onsite psychologist and she recommended I see another psychologist.
He told me that I did not fit the normal pattern on depression and suggested there might be a medical reason for my depression. He said he would see me but only if I made an appointment with my doctor and do some tests. I did. The doctor ordered some blood work and asked me to come back in two weeks. Two weeks later, the doctor burst thru the door holding the lab work. H showed my a paper and with his finger he said "Do you see that number?". He went on and said "This means your thyroid is not doing what it is supposed to be doing". He handed me a prescription and soon my depression disappeared.
Had I not gone for help, I would of blown my brains out over a deficient thyroid. It would've been incredibly stupid and even selfish. If you have depression and think about suicide, please go get some help. It is not a terminal disease and it can be treated. No matter what your circumstances are, it is never God's will for you to kill yourself.
N
notconformed2theworld
Guest
You know I was wondering about this yesterday...what if were so in love with God and can't wait to see him that we just speed the process up. Im not sayin id Kill myself but I was wondering how that would work with God. Would he still let us in because we wanted to be with him and our intent was good lol
I believe it is our duty to tough out whatever is ahead for each of us in the name of Yeshua, Jesus, however your point may be quite valid to some, though not to most.
Php 1:21
For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.
Php 1:22
But if to live in the flesh, - if this shall bring fruit from my work, then what I shall choose I know not.
Php 1:23
But I am in a strait betwixt the two, having the desire to depart and be with Christ; for it is very far better:
Php 1:24
yet to abide in the flesh is more needful for your sake.
Php 1:21
For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.
Php 1:22
But if to live in the flesh, - if this shall bring fruit from my work, then what I shall choose I know not.
Php 1:23
But I am in a strait betwixt the two, having the desire to depart and be with Christ; for it is very far better:
Php 1:24
yet to abide in the flesh is more needful for your sake.
I think rationalizing these things is dangerous. We don't know people's lives, their circumstances, etc. I think these things should be left up to God where the judgement belongs. Misjudging is a sin, & promoting such judgement is also a sin. Don't take the risk & post your opinion. It's not worth it.
I really do hope and pray the thoughts presented here are from meditation and prayer. Many of us, I for one, have had loved ones very near who have committed this act, thus much loving thought and prayer has been devoted to the subject long before replying to this thread.
I believe in my earlier reply (8), some very applicable scripture is given, though it does not resolve anything for anyone.
I do know I forgive my loved one for this act, and my Father is even more forgiving I pray.
I believe in my earlier reply (8), some very applicable scripture is given, though it does not resolve anything for anyone.
I do know I forgive my loved one for this act, and my Father is even more forgiving I pray.
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BeanieD
Guest
Don't knowfor sure, but when there is a moment of weakness, that is when we turn heartily to God for help. When we ignore this one thing are we not turning our back on Him? I don't know Blessings
Why cast doubt? God is always good, returning good for evil. He tells us in the Old Testament that He desires mercy and not sacrifice. If this latter does not satisfy, perhaps the actions of our Savior in forgiving all sins may help. One thing I do know, when speaking of judgment to damnation, He teaches us if we do not judge, we will not be judged. His ways are not our ways, and there is no specific teaching on a person being driven by (perhaps) others to commit suicide. The commandment on killing deals with hatred, not desperation.
They still have to stand before God to tell their side of the stories, and then God will decide.
Suicide is a sin. But we all have stand before Him and plead for mercy by searching for reasons and starting it off by why we had fallen by accusing the ones that led us into sin as the same way as Adam has accused Eve and Eve accused the serpent. But I'm trying to stay blameless like Job so that I do not have to go through all that he say-she say.