sunday worship is it just tradition ?

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Genesis 2:2-3 KJV
(2) And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested(H7673) on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
(3) And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested(H7673) from all his work which God created and made.

H7673
שׁבת
shâbath
shaw-bath'
A primitive root; to repose, that is, desist from exertion; used in many implied relations (causatively, figuratively or specifically): - (cause to, let, make to) cease, celebrate, cause (make) to fail, keep (sabbath), suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) rest, rid, still, take away.

Lao, you said God GAVE the sabbath at creation.
your post shows nothing of the kind.
this distortion by SDA has been refuted repeatedly.

maybe i'm wrong - if i see Adam & Eve being told to rest or do anything you do today on the 7th day, i consider it.

btw - do you leave your home on the sabbath? how far away is your church? do you drive there? turn on the heat & lights?

aren't you lifting chairs and DOING things on the sabbath?

what does THAT have do the Sinai sabbath the Israelites were commanded to do?
 
Let's be honest about Sunday worship here...

“Most Christians assume that Sunday is the biblically approved day of worship. The Catholic Church protests that it transferred Christian worship from the biblical Sabbath (Saturday) to Sunday, and that to try to argue that the change was made in the Bible is both dishonest and a denial of Catholic authority. If Protestantism wants to base its teachings only on the Bible, it should worship on Saturday.” Rome’s Challenge www.immaculateheart.com/maryonline Dec 2003

“Is not every Christian obliged to sanctify Sunday and to abstain on that day from unnecessary servile work? Is not the observance of this law among the most prominent of our sacred duties? But you may read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation, and you will not find a single line authorizing the sanctification of Sunday. The Scriptures enforce the religious observance of Saturday, a day which we never sanctify.” James Cardinal Gibbons, The Faith of Our Fathers (1917 edition), p. 72-73 (16th Edition, p 111; 88th Edition, p. 89).

“For example, nowhere in the Bible do we find that Christ or the Apostles ordered that the Sabbath be changed from Saturday to Sunday. We have the commandment of God given to Moses to keep holy the Sabbath day, that is the 7th day of the week, Saturday. Today most Christians keep Sunday because it has been revealed to us by the [Roman Catholic] church outside the Bible.” Catholic Virginian, October 3, 1947, p. 9, article “To Tell You the Truth.”

Catholic Church Changed Sabbath To Sunday Statements

But you don't have to view this site only, Google 'who changed the Sabbath to sunday'.

Dan 7:23 Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.
Dan 7:24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

The Beast power at the end time...

Rev 17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
Rev 17:13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.
Rev 17:14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Dan 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

There is one Law that has to do with time...

Exo 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
Exo 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

It is all according to whom your authority is, whether it be the scriptures or the Catholic church.
 
The sabbath of the Lord was given before sin entered into this world so its original intent was not meant to teach about salvation in Christ. Both Adam & Eve were created on the 6th day and the next the kept the sabbath with God. What do you think they did on that first sabbath?
We know that Adams' sin didn't bring sin into the world, but into man (Romans 5:12). Sin was already here via the fall of Satan. It was God foreknowledge at His creation that man would fall, but it was God's intent that humans, the crowning jewel of His creation, would forever be an extension of His glory not just the day after creation, but the all the days to follow. The word Sabbath isn't even mentioned in Genesis. Where is God's command for Adam to observe this day? Why is it absent? Was Enoch taken up by God because he walked close with God one day a week?

Do you suppose that when God came down and walked during the cool of day, seeking fellowship, that this it was a Sabbath? and that God only desired fellowship on one day? Scripture does not tell us. Let me ask you this, how did Adam keep track of this day?, no parchment to write on, writing on the ground could have eroded away? Sure, maybe God reminded him, would He do so prior to the Sabbath?. If you were stranded on an island, how long do you think it would take for you forget what year it is, month it is, day it is?

I realize I will not convince you on my view of the Sabbath, nor will you convince me. It is in my limited understanding of whole scripture, that Christ came to restore all things, but this has a "it is now, but not yet" aspect and has not fully manifested in the reality/epic of time because Christ is still building His Church. However it certain for me that the reality of what is to come can be actualized now.
 
Well the harshities of the law have been lifted but we should still observe his day we observe sunday why not saturday too
 
B ut let it be all by choice for the Lord does not want forced but it is the heart the lord wants the heart is more than a motion a strong feeling
the heart from the heart comes on s unrestrained will to do everything possible
 
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B ut let it be all by choice for the Lord does not want forced but it is the heart the lord wants the heart is more than a motion a strong feeling
the heart from the heart comes on s unrestrained will to do everything possible

This Lord that won't force anyone, I don't know who He is...

Rev 16:1 And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways, and pour out the vials of the wrath of God upon the earth.
Rev 16:2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.
Rev 16:3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.
Rev 16:4 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood.
Rev 16:5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus.
Rev 16:6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy.
Rev 16:7 And I heard another out of the altar say, Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous are thy judgments.
Rev 16:8 And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire.
Rev 16:9 And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.
Rev 16:10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,
Rev 16:11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.
Rev 16:12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
Rev 16:13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
Rev 16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
Rev 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
Rev 16:16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
Rev 16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
Rev 16:18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.
Rev 16:19 And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.
Rev 16:20 And every island fled away, and the mountains were not found.
Rev 16:21 And there fell upon men a great hail out of heaven, every stone about the weight of a talent: and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceeding great.

Sounds like He is going to do some serious forcing here. How about the 200,000,000 man army?

Rev 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
Rev 19:12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
Rev 19:13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
Rev 19:14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
Rev 19:16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.
Rev 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;
Rev 19:18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.
Rev 19:19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.
Rev 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
Rev 19:21 And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

He tosses the Beast and the False Prophet into the Lake of Fire and the rest of the armies are slain and their bodies left on the battlefield for the birds to eat. Their death is particularly gruesome...

Zec 14:12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Don't kid yourself, Christ is going to FORCE people to obey Him when He returns.
 
(excerpt from article found at)

SUNDAY WORSHIP - Why do most Christians worship on Sunday when the Old Testament commandment sets apart Saturday as the day of worship? • ChristianAnswers.Net


At the very beginning, the church in Jerusalem met every day in the temple and in private homes (Acts 2:46). Since the first believers were all Jewish, it seems safe to assume that they continued to participate in Jewish synagogue and temple worship for some time.
However, the New Testament makes it clear that the observance of a particular day was not imposed as a binding obligation. Romans 14:5-6 makes it clear that there was some freedom in the matter of special days. Colossians 2:16-17 commanded the church not to allow anyone to act as their judge in regard to sabbath days. And Galatians 4:9-10 warns against going back under the Law by insisting on the legal requirement of special days

Great well thought out post.

Some of the early church Fathers wrote that Christians gathered on the 8th day of the week (Monday). The number 8 represents a new beginning. You can't partially keep the Mosaic laws. It is all or none. If a Christians observes the Mosaic law he is in a religious system that doesn't need Christ. So if you keep the Sabbath, you mock the work of Christ.

1 So Christ has truly set us free. Now make sure that you stay free, and don’t get tied up again in slavery to the law. 3 If you are trying to find favor with God by being circumcised, you must obey every regulation in the whole law of Moses. 4 For if you are trying to make yourselves right with God by keeping the law, you have been cut off from Christ! You have fallen away from God’s grace.

5 But we who live by the Spirit eagerly wait to receive by faith the righteousness God has promised to us. 6 For when we place our faith in Christ Jesus, there is no benefit in being circumcised or being uncircumcised. What is important is faith expressing itself in love. Gal 5:1-5

Paul had to consistently deal with legalism. Those who claim we must obey the Sabbath are pushing legalism not the law of love. They false teachers claiming to be workers of the truth but are future kindling for hell. You can not put new wine in an old wine skin. The two are incompatible.
 
Yes it limits you from manmade ideas like Sunday keeping. But the flip side is that it enforces the word of God about these things over man. The word of God says the seventh day is His blessed day he made for you to fellowship with him.

You are 100% correct if people are preaching we must only attend church on a specific day, Saturday or Sunday or any other day, it is clearly error. I never support any person or system that would claim one day is the correct day to worship--that would make me a legalistic Judaizer. I have never once claimed Sunday or any other day must be kept.

Col. 2:16 makes it very clear that we can worship on any day and no one is to judge us in this freedom. Sabbath keeping is part of the old wine skin, the Mosaic law. You can not pour new wine into an old wine skin.
 
You are 100% correct if people are preaching we must only attend church on a specific day, Saturday or Sunday or any other day, it is clearly error. I never support any person or system that would claim one day is the correct day to worship--that would make me a legalistic Judaizer. I have never once claimed Sunday or any other day must be kept.

Col. 2:16 makes it very clear that we can worship on any day and no one is to judge us in this freedom. Sabbath keeping is part of the old wine skin, the Mosaic law. You can not pour new wine into an old wine skin.

I guess the prohibition against murder is an old wine skin also? How about the prohibition against bestiality?
 
I guess the prohibition against murder is an old wine skin also? How about the prohibition against bestiality?

God's moral laws are absolute and unchangeable. Murder will always be wrong. So Murder is obviously not a part of the old or new wine skin.

Old wine skin/wine are the Mosaic laws or Old Covenant.
New wine skins/ new wine is the New Covenant.

So your argument fails miserably as the terms do not apply to murder. I often see that Sabbatarians can't see that the old Covenant has ceased. They continue to think we must honor the Sabbath in a legalistic fashion. In fact legalism underpins almost all cults.

Even while Jesus was on the earth he was bringing the new covenant even before his death/Resurrection. He plucked grain from the field and healed on the Sabbath--violations of the old Mosaic laws. Jesus even downgraded the dietary laws by saying "It is not what goes in that defiles a man, it is what comes out of him".

My freind it is time for you to cast off the yoke of Moses and try on the new yoke of Christ.
 
God's moral laws are absolute and unchangeable. Murder will always be wrong. So Murder is obviously not a part of the old or new wine skin.

Old wine skin/wine are the Mosaic laws or Old Covenant.
New wine skins/ new wine is the New Covenant.

So your argument fails miserably as the terms do not apply to murder. I often see that Sabbatarians can't see that the old Covenant has ceased. They continue to think we must honor the Sabbath in a legalistic fashion. In fact legalism underpins almost all cults.

Even while Jesus was on the earth he was bringing the new covenant even before his death/Resurrection. He plucked grain from the field and healed on the Sabbath--violations of the old Mosaic laws. Jesus even downgraded the dietary laws by saying "It is not what goes in that defiles a man, it is what comes out of him".

My freind it is time for you to cast off the yoke of Moses and try on the new yoke of Christ.

Are you part of the new covenant?
 
Yep

YAHWEH =

"Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, But the bSeventh Day is the cSabbath of Yahweh your Heavenly Father. In iyou shall do no work."

Man =

“From this we may understand how great is the authority of the church in interpreting or explaining to us the commandments of God - an authority which is acknowledged by the universal practice of the whole Christian world, even of those sects which profess to take the holy Scriptures as their sole rule of faith, since they observe as the day of rest not the seventh day of the week demanded by the Bible, but the first day. Which we know is to be kept holy, only from the tradition and teaching of the Catholic church.” Henry Gibson, Catechism Made Easy, #2, 9th edition, vol. 1, p. 341-342.

The topic of this thread is Sunday worship, not Sunday rest.
 
Yes it is specifically for worship...

Lev 23:2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.
Lev 23:3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.

What is a convocation?

H4744
מקרא
miqrâ'
mik-raw'
From H7121; something called out, that is, a public meeting (the act, the persons, or the palce); also a rehearsal: - assembly, calling, convocation, reading.

It is a day for public meeting, for a called out assembly, a holy convocation.

Well convocate then! I'm still waiting to be invited to a Sabbath barbeque, hint hint. I'll bring grape juice because I'm alkie. :) All of the kosher delis and restaurants in Los Angeles are closed from Friday 3 PM to Sunday lunch, I'm getting really hungry... :( Well it's Sabbath, food offered to idols is always available from the Hare Krishna temple, and it's all vegetarian, exactly like the SDA diet. :rolleyes:

Num 28:9 ¶ And on the sabbath day two lambs of the first year without spot, and two tenth deals of flour [for] a meat offering, mingled with oil, and the drink offering thereof: 10 [This is] the burnt offering of every sabbath, beside the continual burnt offering, and his drink offering.

Should we require a weekly medical examination Dr. Mengele?

Deut 23:1 He that is wounded in the stones, or hath his privy member cut off, shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD.



Christ was crucified on Wednesday (the Passover, 31AD) and buried about sunset. Now either He told the truth, or He lied...

Mat 12:39 But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:
Mat 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

He arose from the tomb on Sabbath afternoon at about sunset or else the only sign He gave failed.

People argue about the days quite a bit. Let's assume that you're correct, that He arose on the Sabbath. That's work, not rest--because Christianity is not Judaism.

Luke 9:23 ¶ And he said to [them] all, If any [man] will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.
 
Lao, you said God GAVE the sabbath at creation.
your post shows nothing of the kind.
this distortion by SDA has been refuted repeatedly.

maybe i'm wrong - if i see Adam & Eve being told to rest or do anything you do today on the 7th day, i consider it.

btw - do you leave your home on the sabbath? how far away is your church? do you drive there? turn on the heat & lights?

aren't you lifting chairs and DOING things on the sabbath?

what does THAT have do the Sinai sabbath the Israelites were commanded to do?

You know asking him about his way of keeping Sabbath is no argument for scripture. We all sin. My unrighteous behavior has no bearing of what scripture says or whether I am right or wrong.

We all fall short in our walk with God, and doing so makes us hypocrites.

That is like telling a famous art critic they are wrong because he is not an artist himself.
 
Monsieur Dickey:

the sabbath day is the seventh day.
have you entered His rest yet?

or are you saying, even after He has said : This is the Place of Repose...no....i will not?

please tell me exactly how you observed the Sabbath this week Tannar.


1) If I do or do not observe the Sabbath is as germane to the conversation as what color underwear Saddam Hussein was buried in is. The Bible says what it says or it does not. KEEP the personal bs out of here MS Catty.

2) The Sabbath Day, is not His Rest. A SABBATH simply means rest time. HIS REST using the same word "Sabbath" does NOT replace the "Sabbath >>>>>>DAY<<<<<<" without just simply spitting on the Bible and editing a word out of it. WHILE PREACHING to lead people to HIS REST, HE ( I know you think He's an idiot for this.. ) defended the SABBATH DAY more than any other commandment in his ministry.

3) "Or are you saying...." What I AM saying is you can't have a conversation without trying to go all personal.

The Bible says what it says. YOUR OPINION AND JABS AT ME DO NOT CHANGE IT'S WORDS.

Which brings me to the point, rather than answer my question, you are doing anything you can to avoid it.

I'd suggest that is pretty telling, no?

Do you know the difference in the Sabbath Day and HIS SABBATH?
 
we have 1,000+ commandments in the church epistles - not ONE of them is sabbath observance.


Not a one is defended to the Pharisees as much as the Sabbath DAY is.

So, what's your point? Jesus was an idiot and didn't understand the Church HE is the High Priest of?
 
God's moral laws are absolute and unchangeable. Murder will always be wrong. So Murder is obviously not a part of the old or new wine skin.

Old wine skin/wine are the Mosaic laws or Old Covenant.
New wine skins/ new wine is the New Covenant.

So your argument fails miserably as the terms do not apply to murder. I often see that Sabbatarians can't see that the old Covenant has ceased. They continue to think we must honor the Sabbath in a legalistic fashion. In fact legalism underpins almost all cults.

Even while Jesus was on the earth he was bringing the new covenant even before his death/Resurrection. He plucked grain from the field and healed on the Sabbath--violations of the old Mosaic laws. Jesus even downgraded the dietary laws by saying "It is not what goes in that defiles a man, it is what comes out of him".

My freind it is time for you to cast off the yoke of Moses and try on the new yoke of Christ.

Just WHAT do you think the covenant that was done away with was? Are you considering the WHOLE OLD TESTAMENT, to be the "old covenant" Cuz I'm hoping you aren't as that's a really simple, nearly childish way of looking at the word.

The Decalogue was it's own covenant.

The promise to Abraham was it's own covenant.

If you break part of one of the covenants you do away with the whole of it. You are PRETTY selective in what verses you wish to apply to your theology. WHO ARE YOU to take the covenant GOD WROTE and start editing it? Is yo mama proud of that job? Does it pay good? God's Editor, sounds like something out of mary had a little lamb in wonderland.

The covenant PAUL discusses repeatedly is the one you HAD TO BE CIRCUMCISED FOR. That wouldn't even apply to the Decalogue.

The Sabbath was declared the Sabbath and made for Adam to recognize it's holiness by God.

GOD is teh AUTHOR of that covenant.
YOU HAVE NOTHING from GOD saying do away with the Decalogue.

And unless you say Paul is uninspired and doesn't belong in the NT He explains you can't splice two sides of what you don't like together and remove pieces.