The GIFT of Languages
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Yeah I was part of a charismatic youth group back in the day and thought I was speaking in tongues.
What it was... is a high emotional state accompanied by non linguistic free, broken speech. Bought on in a small group of convincing leaders in the church at the time.
That would have been when I was about 14. It wasn't till about 11 years later, at university when i was shown biblical Christianity that I saw that kind of thing for what it was.
L
Locoponydirtman
Guest
Ya dont have to jump from one boat to the other to disagree with the things you witnessed. I am not a cessationist, but believe those people are dead wrong about the gifts. I dont believe babbling incoherantly is tongues, but that God can and does enable the ability to speak in other languages.
That God indeed does heal, especially when one obeys the directions given in Titus. That God does the miraculous when it is expedient for Him.
You are correct that those things you mentioned are indeed out of order. They are at best indulging the flesh. I even go so far as to say they are mocking and even balspheming God.
The Lord has blessed you in this revelation.
Indeed, it is unfortunate, that the 1611 English word "tongue or tongues" is so misunderstood today. However, the word "tongue", as understood in those days, was any form of human language. This word is still employed today in some cultures and in literature. The KJV made the problem worse by adding in the word "unknown" before "tongue".
In the following verse, which is often used as a prooftext for heavenly tongues today:
1Co 13:1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. (KJV)
It was translated as a "First Class Conditional" statement - when in fact it is a "Third Class Conditional" statement in the Greek. Therefore the (ASB) is a better translation:
1Co_13:1 If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am become sounding brass, or a clanging cymbal.
The purpose the Apostle Paul had in mind, was to contrast "Love" with exaggerated hypothetical arguments, to better exalt the importance of love. Thus:
1Co 13:1 If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels - Then Paul goes to a even more extreme hypothetical:
1Co 13:2 And if I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains
Certainly, the Apostle did not expect anyone to believe that he knew "ALL" mysteries and had "ALL" knowledge nor could he remove mountains.
The story in Acts 2 is the recording of the fulfillment of a promise to Abraham back in chapter 12 of Genesis.
Abram was renamed by God to be Abraham as in the father of many nations.
Now if you understand that "tongues" or languages is a metaphoric synonym for nations....then the promise to Abraham is fulfilled in this chapter. And that God keeps ALL promises.
It is further fulfilled by Paul being the Apostle to the Gentiles....as had been the plan all along.
Today, the "cessationists" are not completely correct....but not any more correct than the Charismatics on the issue.
Charismatic congregants tend to seek after the gift of tongues to prove that they have access to God and that they have a unique relationship with God as evidenced by the public demonstration of the use of tongues.
Never once considering that scriptures say that there WAS going to be a period of time for public signs and wonders so that those who already knew God would believe the message. (Jews) These signs and wonders were a call to action...not for simple faith and belief.
However,
Let's not forget that God is not exactly a "pet on a leash". He is uncontrollable except by himself. He does as He sees fit. Where God is not about to confuse or cause confusion about his written disclosures of the future with the use of signs and wonders...nothing at all stops Him from doing so in secret or in a highly easy explainable fashion.
And there has been too many explainable miracles for this not to be the work of God in the lives of his children. Sure these stories have explainable causes....completely logical conclusions about events...but ALL these stories have a common element in their timing...inexplicable perfect timing.
God is generous to His children to the point of almost spoiling some of us rotten. To others (unbelievers) generous with financial blessings to the point of being stupid wealthy....(cessationists hate me for saying these things)
So....with today's technology...there's no such thing as a language barrier. God is omnipotent....and omnipotence requires PERFECT efficiency. No power displayed that isn't necessary or underutilized.
So....
For TLDR:
Both Cessationists and Charismatics are wrong.
Abram was renamed by God to be Abraham as in the father of many nations.
Now if you understand that "tongues" or languages is a metaphoric synonym for nations....then the promise to Abraham is fulfilled in this chapter. And that God keeps ALL promises.
It is further fulfilled by Paul being the Apostle to the Gentiles....as had been the plan all along.
Today, the "cessationists" are not completely correct....but not any more correct than the Charismatics on the issue.
Charismatic congregants tend to seek after the gift of tongues to prove that they have access to God and that they have a unique relationship with God as evidenced by the public demonstration of the use of tongues.
Never once considering that scriptures say that there WAS going to be a period of time for public signs and wonders so that those who already knew God would believe the message. (Jews) These signs and wonders were a call to action...not for simple faith and belief.
However,
Let's not forget that God is not exactly a "pet on a leash". He is uncontrollable except by himself. He does as He sees fit. Where God is not about to confuse or cause confusion about his written disclosures of the future with the use of signs and wonders...nothing at all stops Him from doing so in secret or in a highly easy explainable fashion.
And there has been too many explainable miracles for this not to be the work of God in the lives of his children. Sure these stories have explainable causes....completely logical conclusions about events...but ALL these stories have a common element in their timing...inexplicable perfect timing.
God is generous to His children to the point of almost spoiling some of us rotten. To others (unbelievers) generous with financial blessings to the point of being stupid wealthy....(cessationists hate me for saying these things)
So....with today's technology...there's no such thing as a language barrier. God is omnipotent....and omnipotence requires PERFECT efficiency. No power displayed that isn't necessary or underutilized.
So....
For TLDR:
Both Cessationists and Charismatics are wrong.
Hi this made me laugh.. not you its what I think so many times here and different forums where just verses are posted and I'm like.. ok we know this whats the point? I know they were thinking something. Bless you
It never hurts to straddle the fence.
I know....
I'm trying to make everyone happy in my own special way.
I've had help though....so as the euphemistic "Turtle on the fence post " I can say that I believe no one.
That depends on the length of one's legs, and height of the fence.It never hurts to straddle the fence.
Jesus is the narrow way. Every attempt to use this verse to separate one Christian from another is misguided at best.
By experience, I've found that to be true (ouch).That depends on the length of one's legs, and height of the fence.
The tongue of Angels…….
Genesis 16:8 KJV
And he said, Hagar, Sarai's maid, whence camest thou? and whither wilt thou go? And she said, I flee from the face of my mistress Sarai.
Genesis 16:8 KJV
And he said, Hagar, Sarai's maid, whence camest thou? and whither wilt thou go? And she said, I flee from the face of my mistress Sarai.
The tongue of many Angels…..
Revelation 5:11-12 KJV
And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands;
[12] Saying with a loud voice, Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honour, and glory, and blessing.
Revelation 5:11-12 KJV
And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands;
[12] Saying with a loud voice, Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honour, and glory, and blessing.
I appreciate feedback/sharing/correction
True Christians cannot be separated.
Nevertheless I cannot but speak what I have seen and heard.
Which is what we
all
are doing here.
I just wait for these responses, no matter what they are. I told him already that he talks exactly like my son (who is in his 40’s).
My son used to pull his hair out when I would send him a verse.
I am what I am by the grace of God.
And yet other people get the point, add to the topic, or answer more graciously.
I have learnt, that is just how people are.
Imagine if everyone spoke in the same manner.
You learn so much when you “launch out into the deep”
