The Ten Commandments are the Covenant, did you know?

[SabbathBlessing]

What was wrong with the first covenant?

The Scripture told us

Heb8:8 Because finding fault with them, He says: “Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah—9 not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they did not continue in My covenant, and I disregarded them, says the LORD. 10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

Your knowledge of the N.T is deficient.

You sin whether your under the law or not under the law.

Romans 2:12
For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law, and all who have sinned
under the Law will be judged by the Law.

No law does not mean no sin rather, no law means no violation of the law.

By this very verses shows your misunderstanding of the Scriptures you post.

For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law,
and all who have sinned
under the Law will be judged by the Law.

Why the Ten Commandments is under the mercy seat of God and what all will be Judged by regardless is we refuse His standard of righteousness. Rev11:18-19

Those who are in Christ and are keeping His commandments because God has changed us from the inside and do so through love and faith, will be reconciled back to Him.

Rev 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.

 

[TMS]

The bible is all I need and it clearly defines what the sabbath is and that it has not changed.

But it is beautiful the way God uses nature to show us the truth if we are willing to listen.

Did anyone watch the documentary about the sabbath keeping animals?

#4292, & 4293

 

[vassal]

I would assume that your contradicting what Jesus said.

Matthew 15:24
But He answered and said, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”

No contradiction it was part of God's plan, it is why he trained dis disciples to preach to all nations to preach all ht did and said and grow the Kingdom, but you know all of this already do you not?

 

[vassal]

Your first line was correct.

The Gentiles are grafted into Christ which is an unnatural process.

Jesus was only sent to Israel not to the Gentiles.

Much later God spoke to Peter about a Gentile called Cornelius.

The cultivated olive tree was Israel and the Gentiles were a wild olive tree.

The 11 apostles were assigned to the Jewish population but Paul was sent to the Gentiles.

Galatians 2:7-9
But on the contrary, seeing that I had been entrusted with the gospel to the uncircumcised,
just as Peter had been to the circumcised for He who effectually worked for Peter in his apostleship
to the circumcised effectually worked for me also to the Gentiles, and recognizing the grace that
had been given to me, James and Cephas and John, who were reputed to be pillars, gave to me and
Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, so that we might go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised.

Any other passages you struggle with just ask me and I will explain them to you.

Here is a direct and Christ centered reply:

---

You are building your entire argument on Paul while ignoring the direct words of Jesus Himself — and that is where the foundation becomes unstable.

Jesus did not leave this question open to interpretation. After His resurrection He stood before His disciples — Jews who would carry His message — and declared without ambiguity:

Go ye therefore and teach all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost. Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you. (Matthew 28:19-20)

All nations. All things He commanded. That settles it directly from the mouth of Jesus.

And before that He said:

And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations and then shall the end come. (Matthew 24:14)

Not to Israel only. To all nations.

And when a Gentile — a Roman centurion — came to Jesus with faith, Jesus did not turn him away saying He was sent to Israel only. He declared:

Verily I say unto you I have not found so great faith no not in Israel. (Matthew 8:10)

He honoured Gentile faith openly and publicly.

And the Samaritan woman at the well — neither Jewish nor a disciple — received from Jesus one of the most profound revelations of His entire ministry:

God is a Spirit and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. (John 4:24)

Jesus gave that to a Gentile woman. Freely. Deliberately.

The mission was always universal. Jesus said so Himself. That is the only voice that settles this question completely.

 

[vassal]

Galatians 2:7-9
But on the contrary, seeing that I had been entrusted with the gospel to the uncircumcised,
just as Peter had been to the circumcised for He who effectually worked for Peter in his apostleship
to the circumcised effectually worked for me also to the Gentiles, and recognizing the grace that
had been given to me, James and Cephas and John, who were reputed to be pillars, gave to me and
Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, so that we might go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised.

Any other passages you struggle with just ask me and I will explain them to you

@Cameron143 ( that is for you too as you say I write only of Jesus)

Paul in Galatians 2:7-9 is describing a practical division of missionary labour — nothing more. But here is what many people miss and it needs to be stated clearly because it is widely misunderstood:

Peter was not exclusively sent to the Jews. Acts 15:7 settles this directly. At the Jerusalem Council Peter stood up and declared to everyone present:

Men and brethren ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel and believe. (Acts 15:7)

Peter himself declares that God chose him to bring the Gospel to the Gentiles. This was not Paul speaking — this was Peter in his own words confirming that God specifically selected him to open the door of the Gospel to Gentile nations. This happened at the house of Cornelius — a Roman Gentile — where Peter preached and the Holy Spirit fell on Gentiles exactly as He had on the Jewish believers at Pentecost. (Acts 10:44-45)

So the picture is this — Peter preached to Jews initially after Pentecost but God made it unmistakably clear through the vision of Acts 10 and the house of Cornelius that the Gospel door was wide open to Gentiles. Peter walked through that door first before Paul ever began his missionary journeys.

Galatians 2:7-9 therefore describes a later practical arrangement — not an exclusive permanent assignment. Both Peter and Paul ultimately preached to both Jews and Gentiles because that was always the command of Jesus:

Go ye therefore and teach all nations. (Matthew 28:19)

And this is exactly what the Jerusalem Council confirmed in Acts 15 — one Gospel, one salvation, one Christ for all people everywhere. James confirmed it by quoting the prophet Amos:

That the residue of men might seek after the Lord and all the Gentiles upon whom my name is called. (Acts 15:17)

This was never just for Israel. It was always for all nations — exactly as Jesus commanded from the very beginning.

as you say"Any other passages you struggle with just ask me and I will explain them to you."

 

[Pilgrimshope]

The Bible also teaches that when one believes they are saved...have passed from death into life. So...salvation is spoken of as past, present, and future. That salvation is past means we have had life imparted to us and become a new creation. That it is present means that God is continuously changing us more and more into the image of His Son. That it is future means there will come a time when we put on immortality. None of this relies on anything we do. The covenant was accomplished at the cross, and the benefits are given to us over time. While I do believe obedience is important, we view it very differently. And that's why you wouldn't answer my questions. Works don't contribute anything to salvation; neither do they contribute to remaining in an estate of grace. Those issues were settled at the cross. It is finished. Jesus saying that those who endure to the end is not prescriptive to the individual. The statement is simply a declarative statement describing those who will be saved.

“The statement is simply a declarative statement describing those who will be saved.”

right he’s declaring a statement about those who will later be saved. Like this same thing

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭

Do this thing “ preach the gospel to everyone “

And this thing will happen “ anyone who believes and is baptized shall be saved …. He’s declaring it

Or this other thing will happen “whoever doesn’t believe shall be damned “ again the lords declaring it.


“The Bible also teaches that when one believes they are saved...have passed from death into life”

What he says is actually “ those who hear my word and believe him who sent me shall have eternal life and shall not come into the condemnation of judgement later . For they have passed from death to life.


“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

kinda what he’s saying here in another way

“preach the gospel to every creature.

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;

but he that believeth not shall be damned.”

 

[Cameron143]

@Cameron143 ( that is for you too as you say I write only of Jesus)

Paul in Galatians 2:7-9 is describing a practical division of missionary labour — nothing more. But here is what many people miss and it needs to be stated clearly because it is widely misunderstood:

Peter was not exclusively sent to the Jews. Acts 15:7 settles this directly. At the Jerusalem Council Peter stood up and declared to everyone present:

Men and brethren ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel and believe. (Acts 15:7)

Peter himself declares that God chose him to bring the Gospel to the Gentiles. This was not Paul speaking — this was Peter in his own words confirming that God specifically selected him to open the door of the Gospel to Gentile nations. This happened at the house of Cornelius — a Roman Gentile — where Peter preached and the Holy Spirit fell on Gentiles exactly as He had on the Jewish believers at Pentecost. (Acts 10:44-45)

So the picture is this — Peter preached to Jews initially after Pentecost but God made it unmistakably clear through the vision of Acts 10 and the house of Cornelius that the Gospel door was wide open to Gentiles. Peter walked through that door first before Paul ever began his missionary journeys.

Galatians 2:7-9 therefore describes a later practical arrangement — not an exclusive permanent assignment. Both Peter and Paul ultimately preached to both Jews and Gentiles because that was always the command of Jesus:

Go ye therefore and teach all nations. (Matthew 28:19)

And this is exactly what the Jerusalem Council confirmed in Acts 15 — one Gospel, one salvation, one Christ for all people everywhere. James confirmed it by quoting the prophet Amos:

That the residue of men might seek after the Lord and all the Gentiles upon whom my name is called. (Acts 15:17)

This was never just for Israel. It was always for all nations — exactly as Jesus commanded from the very beginning.

as you say"Any other passages you struggle with just ask me and I will explain them to you."

Sure, it was always God's plan to take the gospel to all the world. And Peter's ministry wasn't limited to Jews. But neither are the teachings of Jesus directly the totality of new covenant truth. The writings of the Apostles are also the teaching of Jesus, and further revelation given by Him. So, limiting one's teaching to the gospels is to ignore incredible truths concerning Christ and the new covenant He ushered in. By continually putting the focus on the law rather than the activity of God in the individual, you place the focus on the individual rather than Christ. And you reduce eternal life to following commandments rather than following Christ.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

How does one separate Christ from what Christ asks? John14:15 Exo20:6

This is like saying I love you God, but I am not going to focus on what you asked me to do if I love you, I am going to love you the way I want to not as you asked. Is that really love? I had a boyfriend who did this, did everything for me except the things I asked. I ended up breaking up with him. Its a selfish love. When we really love someone we want to please them and do what they say is how we love and respect them, not just what feels right to us.

Jesus said:

Luke 6:46 “But why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do the things which I say? 47 Whoever comes to Me, and hears My sayings and does them, I will show you whom he is like: 48 He is like a man building a house, who dug deep and laid the foundation on the rock. And when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently against that house, and could not shake it, for it was founded on the rock. 49 But he who heard and did nothing is like a man who built a house on the earth without a foundation, against which the stream beat vehemently; and immediately it fell. And the ruin of that house was great.”

 

[vassal]

Sure, it was always God's plan to take the gospel to all the world. And Peter's ministry wasn't limited to Jews. But neither are the teachings of Jesus directly the totality of new covenant truth. The writings of the Apostles are also the teaching of Jesus, and further revelation given by Him. So, limiting one's teaching to the gospels is to ignore incredible truths concerning Christ and the new covenant He ushered in. By continually putting the focus on the law rather than the activity of God in the individual, you place the focus on the individual rather than Christ. And you reduce eternal life to following commandments rather than following Christ.

Unfortunately Cameron, many here limit their Bible knowledge exclusively to Paul and have forgotten what Christ actually said. They focus almost exclusively on the cross — and yes, it is absolutely the core of the Gospel and the greatest act of love in all of history — but Christ did this for us and also explained so much more during His ministry. Many assume what He said was for Jews only or no longer relevant today. I see examples of this every day and it is precisely why I speak mostly of Jesus — because His teachings are being forgotten even among those who call themselves believers. He warned us Himself:

And why call ye me Lord Lord and do not the things which I say. (Luke 6:46)

As for the law — people put everything in the same basket and that is where the confusion begins. There is a critical difference between the Law of Moses and the Ten Commandments that must be understood. The Ten Commandments are not Mosaic law — they are the eternal covenant between God and humanity.

The commandments stand forever as Jesus stated clearly and repeatedly:

Think not that I am come to destroy the law or the prophets. I am not come to destroy but to fulfil. (Matthew 5:17)

Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments and shall teach men so shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven. (Matthew 5:19)

And when asked directly about eternal life Jesus never pointed away from the commandments. He pointed straight to them:

If thou wouldest enter into life keep the commandments. (Matthew 19:17)

And He tied love and obedience together inseparably:

If ye love me keep my commandments. (John 14:15)

These are not the words of Moses. These are the words of Jesus Christ Himself — God in the flesh — spoken directly and clearly to all who would follow Him.

As for the accusation of being a Judaizer — that is simply not accurate and Acts 15 settles it completely. The Jerusalem Council was clear and specific. For Gentile believers the requirement from the Law of Moses was limited to four things. (Acts 15:28-29). The Ten Commandments were never part of that debate because they were never Mosaic law to begin with. They are the covenant — written by the finger of God Himself (Exodus 31:18)

The foundation is simple and it comes directly from Christ:

Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart and with all thy soul and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. (Matthew 22:37-40)

Love is the root. The commandments are love made visible and specific in daily life. That is not Judaism. That is Christ.

Peace be with you.

 

[Cameron143]

Unfortunately Cameron, many here limit their Bible knowledge exclusively to Paul and have forgotten what Christ actually said. They focus almost exclusively on the cross — and yes, it is absolutely the core of the Gospel and the greatest act of love in all of history — but Christ did this for us and also explained so much more during His ministry. Many assume what He said was for Jews only or no longer relevant today. I see examples of this every day and it is precisely why I speak mostly of Jesus — because His teachings are being forgotten even among those who call themselves believers. He warned us Himself:

And why call ye me Lord Lord and do not the things which I say. (Luke 6:46)

As for the law — people put everything in the same basket and that is where the confusion begins. There is a critical difference between the Law of Moses and the Ten Commandments that must be understood. The Ten Commandments are not Mosaic law — they are the eternal covenant between God and humanity.

The commandments stand forever as Jesus stated clearly and repeatedly:

Think not that I am come to destroy the law or the prophets. I am not come to destroy but to fulfil. (Matthew 5:17)

Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments and shall teach men so shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven. (Matthew 5:19)

And when asked directly about eternal life Jesus never pointed away from the commandments. He pointed straight to them:

If thou wouldest enter into life keep the commandments. (Matthew 19:17)

And He tied love and obedience together inseparably:

If ye love me keep my commandments. (John 14:15)

These are not the words of Moses. These are the words of Jesus Christ Himself — God in the flesh — spoken directly and clearly to all who would follow Him.

As for the accusation of being a Judaizer — that is simply not accurate and Acts 15 settles it completely. The Jerusalem Council was clear and specific. For Gentile believers the requirement from the Law of Moses was limited to four things. (Acts 15:28-29). The Ten Commandments were never part of that debate because they were never Mosaic law to begin with. They are the covenant — written by the finger of God Himself (Exodus 31:18)

The foundation is simple and it comes directly from Christ:

Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart and with all thy soul and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. (Matthew 22:37-40)

Love is the root. The commandments are love made visible and specific in daily life. That is not Judaism. That is Christ.

Peace be with you.

I haven't argued the points you refute. I've been plain: focusing on the law and not the lawgiver is what I see as the problem. Life is not found in the law; life is in Christ. The law itself only brings death to fallen humanity; the Spirit gives life. A relationship with God based on the law brings destruction; a relationship with God in Christ brings life.

 

[vassal]

I haven't argued the points you refute. I've been plain: focusing on the law and not the lawgiver is what I see as the problem. Life is not found in the law; life is in Christ. The law itself only brings death to fallen humanity; the Spirit gives life. A relationship with God based on the law brings destruction; a relationship with God in Christ brings life.

i know you did not argue, just wanted for you to know what I do and why. Also i have written threads on other topic not just the law

 

[SabbathBlessing]

I wonder if the wisest man in the Bible, brought him destruction, only when he took his eyes off of what God asked to keep His laws did he fall. Not when he put it above his own will.

Ecc 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter:

Fear God and keep His commandments,
For this is man’s all.
14 For God will bring every work into judgment,
Including every secret thing,
Whether good or evil.

Or John through the Revelation of Jesus Himself

Rev 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.

But interestingly, Jesus said what does bring destruction

Mat 7:23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’ without law.

One can't separate loving God from keeping the commandments of God. This is sadly a doctrine coming from the other spirit who is trying to cheat us of reconciliation with God.

 

[JimiSurvivor]

Or perhaps, maybe one doesn;t understand the law of God going from tablets of stone, to tablets of the heart 2Cor3:3 Heb8:10

Since you brought it up, how does the "Law of God go from being on tablets of stone, to being written on the tablets of the heart?" Would you care to explain that process? Paul who was a minister of the New Covenant knew exactly how it worked. He wrote about it in 2 Corinthians 3:3 (which you cited):

…2You yourselves are our letter, inscribed on our hearts, known and read by everyone. 3It is clear that you are a letter from Christ, the result of our ministry, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts. ​

You also cited Heb 8:10 as a reference to (supposedly) prove your view. If you had read it before posting it you would have discovered that this scripture actually contradicts your major premises.

6Now, however, Jesus has received a much more excellent MINISTRY, just as the COVENANT He mediates is BETTER and is founded on BETTER PROMISES. 7For if that first covenant had been without fault, no place would have been sought for a second. 8But God found fault with the people and said: “Behold, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah.
God did not merely make some minor adjustments to the Original Covenant. He made an radically NEW and BETTER ONE consisting of

a "a more excellent ministry than was provided by the Temple, its system of worship
b. The Author goes on to make another point:
13 By speaking of a new covenant, He [God]has made the first one OBSOLETE; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear. (Hebrews 8:13)
The author of Hebrews tells us that making a New Covenant renders the prior covenant OBSOLETE. An example of this would be the marriage covenant which, like death itself dissolves the covenant bond between two spouses. Not only has God's original covenant with Israel become obsolete it is PASSING AWAY and "about to vanish away." This happened when the Temple was destroyed and, along with it, the Priesthood, the Sacrifices and that whole system of approaching God

 

[JimiSurvivor]

In Jeremiah 31:33, the New Covenant involves God putting the Torah in our mind and writing it on our hearts, so the Apostles did not face the issue of whether or not that verse is true and they did not face the issue of whether or not a person who wanted to become saved had to be circumcised, but rather they faced the issue of whether Gentiles are required to become circumcised in order to become saved.

Yes, I was referring to the practice of circumcision and the question of whether prospective Gentile converts had to be circumcised. Obviously under the New Covenant, no one has to be circumcised. However, "Judaizers" insist on that since they believe in a hybrid gospel of faith and performing legal works. In principle this is no different than saying all new converts have to keep Shabbat.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

Since you brought it up, how does the "Law of God go from being on tablets of stone, to being written on the tablets of the heart?" Would you care to explain that process? Paul who was a minister of the New Covenant knew exactly how it worked. He wrote about it in 2 Corinthians 3:3 (which you cited):

…2You yourselves are our letter, inscribed on our hearts, known and read by everyone. 3It is clear that you are a letter from Christ, the result of our ministry, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts. ​

What is it you don't understand about God writing His laws on tablets of stone and than writing it in tablets of the heart?

You also cited Heb 8:10 as a reference to (supposedly) prove your view. If you had read it before posting it you would have discovered that this scripture actually contradicts your major premises.

6Now, however, Jesus has received a much more excellent MINISTRY, just as the COVENANT He mediates is BETTER and is founded on BETTER PROMISES. 7For if that first covenant had been without fault, no place would have been sought for a second. 8But God found fault with the people and said: “Behold, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah.
God did not merely make some minor adjustments to the Original Covenant. He made an radically NEW and BETTER ONE consisting of

a "a more excellent ministry than was provided by the Temple, its system of worship
b. The Author goes on to make another point:
13 By speaking of a new covenant, He [God]has made the first one OBSOLETE; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear. (Hebrews 8:13)

Yes, I went through this. The New Covenant is established on better promises, not once does it say better laws- because you can't make something perfect by God more perfect Psa 19:7 or something God made holy more holy Rom7:12

The issue was never with the law or the agreement (covenant) the issue was with the harden heart of man, who won't subject themselves to the law of God and that's still the issue.

The New Covenant still has God's laws according to God Heb8:10 just written on a better surface, they become part of us, if we are submitting through the ministration of the Spirit. The old covenant the ministration was through the Levitical priesthood system, the New Covenant is through Jesus Himself why its a better promise. It established on what God will do, not our own efforts John14:15-18 but we have to cooperate with Him- we can still harden our heart, which is why the Holy Spirit calls on us to come out of our rebellion which is unbelief, disobedience and sin all used interchangeable Heb3:7-19 and accept what God writes in our hearts and minds to be part of us if we love Him John14:15-18 sadly, many love their sins John3:19-21 and won't subject themselves to the law of God Rom8:7-8

The author of Hebrews tells us that making a New Covenant renders the prior covenant OBSOLETE. An example of this would be the marriage covenant which, like death itself dissolves the covenant bond between two spouses. Not only has God's original covenant with Israel become obsolete it is PASSING AWAY and "about to vanish away." This happened when the Temple was destroyed and, along with it, the Priesthood, the Sacrifices and that whole system of approaching God

The agreement is obsolete because it was void and broken by the people. God promised not to change the words of the covenant Deut4:13 Psa 89:34 not a jot or tittle Mat5:18-19 why the New Covenant still has God's Laws Heb8:10 but written in the mind so we know to do them and written in our heart because we love Him Heb8:10 we enter this covenant by faith. Sadly many people refuse His laws just like the Israelites that never made it into the promise land. We still have ours to enter Rev14:12 Rev22:14NKJV

 

[JimiSurvivor]

I wonder if the wisest man in the Bible, brought him destruction, only when he took his eyes off of what God asked to keep His laws did he fall. Not when he put it above his own will.

Ecc 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter:

Fear God and keep His commandments,
For this is man’s all.
14 For God will bring every work into judgment,
Including every secret thing,
Whether good or evil.

Or John through the Revelation of Jesus Himself

Rev 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.

But interestingly, Jesus said what does bring destruction

Mat 7:23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’ without law.

One can't separate loving God from keeping the commandments of God. This is sadly a doctrine coming from the other spirit who is trying to cheat us of reconciliation with God.

So you believe that entering into eternal life depends on whether a person (in addition to repentance and faith) commits himself to follow all the command of the Abrahamic and Mosaic law which would inlclude circumcision. At least, the Hasidim only threatened those who drove their cars on Shabbat with physical injury. Your doctrine threatens those who believe in Jesus but do not keep Shabbat with eternal death and damnation in the "world to come." Is this not a heavy yoke to bind on His children more so than the Law of Moses which only punished Shabbat-breakers with physical death.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

So you believe that entering into eternal life depends on whether a person (in addition to repentance and faith) commits himself to follow all the command of the Abrahamic and Mosaic law which would inlclude circumcision. At least, the Hasidim only threatened those who drove their cars on Shabbat with physical injury. Your doctrine threatens those who believe in Jesus but do not keep Shabbat with eternal death and damnation in the "world to come." Is this not a heavy yoke to bind on His children more so than the Law of Moses which only punished Shabbat-breakers with physical death.

Not sure where you got that from. The Ten Commandments is not the law of Moses. It says so right in our Bibles.... how anyone ever comes to the conclusion that the commandments that start with only worshipping God is a yoke of bondage is a sad teaching not from God, when God Himself both written and spoken says He shows mercy to those who love Him and keep His commandments Exo20:6

Where is Moses in these verse? Every one of these commandments has the name of the LORD thy God. Sad many people toss these aside because they think its about Moses when God is speaking here and wrote it and they are all about our relationship with God. The last 6 on our relationship with man Rom13:9 no greater commandments than these and the summary does not remove all of these details No circumcision here, you are not understanding the different laws and their purposes. Not one person needed to get circumcised in order to keep the law of God.


Exo 20:1 And God spoke all these words, saying:
2 “I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
3 “You shall have no other gods before Me.
4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; 5 you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.
7 “You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain, for the LORD will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.
8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.


Deut 4:13 So He declared to you His covenant which He commanded you to perform, the Ten Commandments; and He wrote them on two tablets of stone.

Exo 32:16 Now the tablets were the work of God, and the writing was the writing of God engraved on the tablets.

Exo 31:18 And when He had made an end of speaking with him on Mount Sinai, He gave Moses two tablets of the Testimony, tablets of stone, written with the finger of God.

Exo 25: 16 And you shall put into the ark the Testimony which I will give you.

Exo 25:21 You shall put the mercy seat on top of the ark, and in the ark you shall put the Testimony that I will give you.


Moses wrote a different law besides the ark of God's Covenant


Deut 31:24 So it was, when Moses had completed writing the words of this law in a book, when they were finished, 25 that Moses commanded the Levites, who bore the ark of the covenant of the Lord, saying: 26 “Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there as a witness against you

 

[Soyeong]

Yes, I was referring to the practice of circumcision and the question of whether prospective Gentile converts had to be circumcised. Obviously under the New Covenant, no one has to be circumcised. However, "Judaizers" insist on that since they believe in a hybrid gospel of faith and performing legal works. In principle this is no different than saying all new converts have to keep Shabbat.

The Bible can speak against being required to do things for incorrect reasons without speaking against being required to do them for correct reasons, so the Bible denying the position that Gentiles are required to become circumcised in order to become saved as the result us not denying the position that Gentiles are required to become circumcised, such as in order to eat the Passover lamb (Exodus 12:48).

In Matthew 4:15-23, Jesus been his ministry with the Gospel message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, which was a light to the Gentiles, and the Mosaic Law was how his audience knew what sin is (Romans 3:20), so repenting from our disobedience to it is a central part of the Gospel message, which Peter argued in Acts 15:6-7 that Gentiles had heard and believed. Jesus also set a sinless example for us to follow of how to walk in obedience to the Mosaic Law and we are told to follow his example (1 Peter 2:21-22) and that those who are in Christ are obligated to walk in the same way that he walked (1 John 2:6). So Jesus spent his ministry teaching his followers to obey the Mosaic Law by word and by example and the problem that Paul had with the Judaizers was not that they were teaching Gentiles how to follow Christ but that they were wanting to require Gentiles to become circumcised (convert to being Jews) in order to become saved. The Bible repeatedly connects our faith with our obedience to God, such as with Revelation 14:12 where those who kept faith in Jesus are the same as those who obeyed God, so the problem that Paul had with the Judaizers also was not that they promoted a Gospel that connected faith with works.

The position that new coverts are not required to keep the Shabbat in order to become saved as the result is not the position that new coverts are not required to keep the Shabbat or the position that our salvation does not require us to keep the Shabbat.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

So you believe that entering into eternal life depends on whether a person (in addition to repentance and faith) commits himself to follow all the command of the Abrahamic and Mosaic law which would inlclude circumcision. At least, the Hasidim only threatened those who drove their cars on Shabbat with physical injury. Your doctrine threatens those who believe in Jesus but do not keep Shabbat with eternal death and damnation in the "world to come." Is this not a heavy yoke to bind on His children more so than the Law of Moses which only punished Shabbat-breakers with physical death.

The Sabbath is not "my doctrine" it came straight from God, written by God, spoken by God. All of the Ten Commandments came with capital punishment not just the 4th. The wages of sin is death Rom6:23 even in the NT 1John3:4 James2:11 Mat5:19-30

Jesus is trying to change our heart, so we would want to spend holy time with Him on the day He made for us Mark2:27 set aside from Creation Exo20:11 to do so, to bless Isa 56:2 and sanctity us Eze20:12 , because can't do this ourselves. Isa66:17 we need God Eze20:20

God says we join ourselves to the LORD when we keep the Sabbath Isa 56:6, man says its a yoke of bondage to spend holy time with God. There are more important things to do with my time. I'll spend time with God on my terms, not His.

Sadly, its the same story Eze20:13 Eze20:15-16 different day.