the tribulation

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NewJerusalem

Guest
#161
#161
Graybeard said:
don't you see....Israel has to exist for this to take place.....now they exist, from aprox 2500 years ago till 1948 they have been scattered all over the world.
So now that they are a nation again what is the next step?...they will build the Temple for the third time so that they can continue the sacrifice/Mosaic Law. The new Temple will most likely be built next to the Dome Mosk. In fact preparations have already started.
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Israel has not existed for some 2,000 years and still does not exist in the eyes of God, whether 1948 happened or not. Man calling Israel a nation in 1948 does not mean God calls this physical land Israel or not.

This is not a fulfillment of Prophecy according to Scripture. Whether many so called pastors, teachers or prophets of today say so. The physical does not fulfill the spiritual nature of prophecy ever.

Again....Search to see if such things are so. :)
 
C

charisenexcelcis

Guest
#162
#162
NewJerusalem said:
Israel has not existed for some 2,000 years and still does not exist in the eyes of God, whether 1948 happened or not. Man calling Israel a nation in 1948 does not mean God calls this physical land Israel or not.

This is not a fulfillment of Prophecy according to Scripture. Whether many so called pastors, teachers or prophets of today say so. The physical does not fulfill the spiritual nature of prophecy ever.

Again....Search to see if such things are so. :)
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While I am not enthusiastic about much of the popular escatology of today, I do not think that the earthly is always so easily disentangled from the spiritual. Did not Jesus' incarnation provide an earthly fulfillment of numerous "spiritual" prophecies? And has not one of the greatest heresies been the denial of this earthly fulfillment?
The nature of revelatory prophecy is that it is difficult to gain perspective and often we do not recognise fulfillment until it is passed.
 
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NewJerusalem

Guest
#163
#163
charisenexcelcis said:
While I am not enthusiastic about much of the popular escatology of today, I do not think that the earthly is always so easily disentangled from the spiritual. Did not Jesus' incarnation provide an earthly fulfillment of numerous "spiritual" prophecies? And has not one of the greatest heresies been the denial of this earthly fulfillment?
The nature of revelatory prophecy is that it is difficult to gain perspective and often we do not recognise fulfillment until it is passed.
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Of course Jesus incarnation was a physical fulfillment of prophecy. This is not the point, neither the fulfillment of Prophecy after His incarnation.
 
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charisenexcelcis

Guest
#164
#164
NewJerusalem said:
Of course Jesus incarnation was a physical fulfillment of prophecy. This is not the point, neither the fulfillment of Prophecy after His incarnation.
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You said that the physical never fulfills the spiritual. I just don't think that is so clear cut.
 
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NewJerusalem

Guest
#165
#165
charisenexcelcis said:
You said that the physical never fulfills the spiritual. I just don't think that is so clear cut.
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I do not believe i ever stated that the physical never fulfills the spiritual.
 
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greatkraw

Guest
#167
#167
Graybeard said:
don't you see....Israel has to exist for this to take place.....now they exist, from aprox 2500 years ago till 1948 they have been scattered all over the world.
So now that they are a nation again what is the next step?...they will build the Temple for the third time so that they can continue the sacrifice/Mosaic Law. The new Temple will most likely be built next to the Dome Mosk. In fact preparations have already started.
Click to expand...
that is right.

indications are that the original site of the Holy of Holies WAS NOT under the dome of the rock

I have been on top of the temple mount
 
G

greatkraw

Guest
#168
#168
NewJerusalem said:
Israel has not existed for some 2,000 years and still does not exist in the eyes of God, whether 1948 happened or not. Man calling Israel a nation in 1948 does not mean God calls this physical land Israel or not.

This is not a fulfillment of Prophecy according to Scripture. Whether many so called pastors, teachers or prophets of today say so. The physical does not fulfill the spiritual nature of prophecy ever.

Again....Search to see if such things are so. :)
Click to expand...
I posted the text from from Ezekial and that is the text that David Ben Gurion(their first prime minister) used to justify the existence of the modern state of Israel

Isa 66:7 "Before she travailed, she brought forth; before her pain came, she was delivered of a manchild.

(Israel came into existence and then began the birth pangs(conflicts with her neighbours) of her existence

8Who hath heard such a thing? Who hath seen such things? Shall the earth be made to bring forth in one day? Or shall a nation be born at once? For as soon as Zion travailed, she brought forth her children.

1948 the birth of Israel: in May 1948, the Jews of Palestine declared an independent state in their ancient homeland. Arab armies immediately attacked, and the conflict drags on six decades later
 
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Graybeard

Guest
#169
#169
NewJerusalem said:
Israel has not existed for some 2,000 years and still does not exist in the eyes of God, whether 1948 happened or not. Man calling Israel a nation in 1948 does not mean God calls this physical land Israel or not.

This is not a fulfillment of Prophecy according to Scripture. Whether many so called pastors, teachers or prophets of today say so. The physical does not fulfill the spiritual nature of prophecy ever.

Again....Search to see if such things are so. :)
Click to expand...
I have searched and such things are not so
 
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NewJerusalem

Guest
#172
#172
greatkraw said:
well you oughta know lol
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I believe i have been one of the only ones who has said that I don't have all understanding and am willing to learn more as well have stated, I still search to see if such things are so ;)
 
A

ASSIYAH

Guest
#173
#173
NewJerusalem said:
Israel has not existed for some 2,000 years and still does not exist in the eyes of God, whether 1948 happened or not. Man calling Israel a nation in 1948 does not mean God calls this physical land Israel or not.

This is not a fulfillment of Prophecy according to Scripture. Whether many so called pastors, teachers or prophets of today say so. The physical does not fulfill the spiritual nature of prophecy ever.

Again....Search to see if such things are so. :)
Click to expand...
LOL! WOW! I dont even know what to say to this. Is this for real?
 
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Graybeard

Guest
#174
#174
So what are you saying??

NewJerusalem said:
Israel has not existed for some 2,000 years and still does not exist in the eyes of God, whether 1948 happened or not. Man calling Israel a nation in 1948 does not mean God calls this physical land Israel or not.

This is not a fulfillment of Prophecy according to Scripture. Whether many so called pastors, teachers or prophets of today say so. The physical does not fulfill the spiritual nature of prophecy ever.

Again....Search to see if such things are so. :)
Click to expand...
then you say...
NewJerusalem said:
Of course Jesus incarnation was a physical fulfillment of prophecy. This is not the point, neither the fulfillment of Prophecy after His incarnation.
Click to expand...
then you are asked...
charisenexcelcis said:
You said that the physical never fulfills the spiritual. I just don't think that is so clear cut.
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then you say....
NewJerusalem said:
I do not believe i ever stated that the physical never fulfills the spirituall.
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are you for real?? or have I misread these posts:confused::confused:
 
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greatkraw

Guest
#175
#175
The defining moment of the start of the tribulation will not be the rapture!!

the rapture will have already occurred; possibly decades before

when a great leader confirms a 7 year treaty with israel; then the clock starts ticking

3 1/2 * 360 days later he will sit in the (rebuilt) temple and proclaim himself the only god
 
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NewJerusalem

Guest
#176
#176
ASSIYAH said:
LOL! WOW! I dont even know what to say to this. Is this for real?
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Sorry, i worded it completely wrong.. that was not what I meant. my apologies folks.!

:eek:
 
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NewJerusalem

Guest
#177
#177
greatkraw said:
The defining moment of the start of the tribulation will not be the rapture!!

the rapture will have already occurred; possibly decades before

when a great leader confirms a 7 year treaty with israel; then the clock starts ticking

3 1/2 * 360 days later he will sit in the (rebuilt) temple and proclaim himself the only god
Click to expand...
Been there, done that.. believed that.....

Sounds like Lindsey, LaHaye, and oh soooooo many others..... makes for good story books, massive cultish fantasy today. I dont blame them, they are simply teaching what they , themselves have been taught.

However unbiblical it may be. Would do them better to forget and rid themselves of what they were taught and search out the Truth of the matter in Scripture instead.
 
K

kevin33

Guest
#178
#178
you say the tribulation has occured already wow are you ever lost matthew 13 read it all brother
 
Z

Zilla64007

Banned
#179
Jan 14, 2010
1,010
5
0
#179
kevin, Matthew 13 talks about the parable of the wheat and the tares, and how they are both here until the harvest... it doesn't necessarily talk about tribulation
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

Banned
#180
Jan 8, 2009
7,576
23
0
#180
The tribulation did occur it was called the destruction of Jerusalem. Doesn't mean there won't be future one of course.
 
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