THIRD TEMPLE NEWS

[iamsoandso]

You are Getting us off SUBJECT, constantly.

The subject's the temple their going to build correct?

 

[massorite]

What the heck is this? "Great words of peace?" "Fatal head wounds?" "Resurrection after 3 days." "Declaring himself to be God." None of these things are told to us.

Let's deal with the fatal head wound first from Rev 13:

Revelation 13 paints a picture of first century Rome, the Beast of the Sea and later, the Earth.

The beast with the 7 heads rising up out of the sea was the Roman Empire. "The SEA" often represents a Gentile Nation while the "Earth" represents a specific Land, usually Israel. The 7 heads were the 7 leaders of Rome up to this time:

1. Julius Caesar
2. Caesar Augustus
3. Tiberius
4. Caligula
5. Claudius
6. Nero
7. Vespasian

The sixth head was the beast with the mortal wound, Nero, who committed suicide by stabbing himself in the neck.

Everything I mentioned is right there in the Word of God
The antichrist will speak of peace when he appears and will deceive most of the world by speaking great words of peace.
Dan 8:25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.

The antichrist will rise from the dead after 3 days just as Christ did because the antichrist will clam to be Christ. It is the only way he can convince the Jews to believe in him as they are still waiting for the arrival of the Messiah for the first time and in order to convince the Jews that he is the true Christ he would need to fulfill prophetic scripture just as Christ has already done which means that he will stay dead for three days and then rise from the dead just as Christ did.
Rev 13:3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
Rev 13:4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
Rev 13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
Rev 13:6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
Rev 13:9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.
Rev 13:10 He that leads into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

The antichrist will sit in a new temple of God and declare himself to be God.
2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2Th 2:4 Who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sits in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
You said "The 7 heads were the 7 leaders of Rome up to this time" but you are wrong and you left out the 10 horns on that seven headed dragon. So lets talk about all of the scriptures that talk about the beast with seven heads and ten horns. Scripture itself tells us what the seven heads represent .
Rev 17:9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sits.
When you look up the meaning of the word "mountain" in that scripture it is actually talking about seven mountains that are geographically located in Europe. I the word of God the "horn" always represents power and authority and scripture tells us that those ten horns represent ten kings.
Rev 17:12 And the ten horns which thou saw are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
The ten kings you are talking about are not actually talking about seven kings but are talking about seven "kingdoms".
Rev 17:10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, (the Assyrians, the Babylonians twice, the Persians, and Alexander the Great) and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he comes, he must continue a short space.
In Rev. 17:10 the five fallen kings are five kingdoms that have conquered Israel and enslaved its people. The kingdom that is at the time the book of Revelation was written was the Roman Empire, which is the kingdom that "is" in verse 10. The kingdom that is "yet to come" in verse 10 will be the kingdom of the antichrist and he will also conquer and oppress the Jewish people.

The antichrist will do miracles and even call fire down from heaven.
Rev 13:13 And he does great wonders, so that he makes fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
Rev 13:14 And deceives them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
Notice here in verse 13:14 it says that the antichrist will preform miracles which is further proof that the antichrist will fulfill prophetic scripture just as Christ has already done. The antichrist will declare himself to be Christ.

You said "The sixth head was the beast with the mortal wound, Nero, who committed suicide by stabbing himself in the neck."
Just as I have already pointed out, The beast will receive a mortal wound but will live and rise from the dead.
Rev 13:14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
Nero might have killed himself but he never raise from the dead so you conclusions are incorrect and not according to the Word of God.
Sorry but I needed to remove some of your post so I could fit my reply in.

 

[massorite]

Amen, even so Come Lord Jesus. I am not sure if it will be called a Holy Temple.

Thank you and I am not sure about that also because it doesn't appear to be very logical.

 

[PlainWord]

The plan of the Elite is to upload everyone's consciousness into the cloud where they will spend eternity. Will God allow that, I don't know. Maybe that is what hell is, eternal separation from God. All I know is, the futurists are setting people up to be deceived.

They are indeed. And they do so with such righteous indignation. The Jews who missed the first coming were utterly destroyed from among the people. The Evangelicals who missed the second coming were.........

 

[PlainWord]

Still you should notice that the Apostles were told to wait and not leave Jerusalem and they did not. Then in Acts 2 they received the Holy Spirit as they were promised and then afterward the Holy Spirit had them remain in Jerusalem at least until the death of James. So if the AoD that Jesus referred to was his death then they would have left Judea at his death and not 35 or more years later. Remember Matthew 24 where Jesus says to flee when they saw the AoD spoken of in Daniel https://biblehub.com/matthew/24-16.htm .

Again it's like I said before of who is an apostle and whose not helping me decide who sees this correct. I know that if James,the elders and even Paul remained in Jerusalem up to Acts 21 https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Acts 21&version=KJV and saw the temple then still standing as functional and valid then they did not see it as polluted in about ad59 https://biblehub.com/timeline/acts/1.htm . Now they had not left because they did not see the AoD Jesus referred to in Matthew 24 and so then as Paul stated in 2 Thess. 2 https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2+Thessalonians+2&version=KJV until that son of perdition sits showing that he is God I will follow the Apostles opinions on this matter.

Not that I mean disrespect to your opinion but that it is clear that neither the Apostles nor the Holy Spirit felt that the Temple had been polluted and by their actions(Acts of the Apostles) made sacrifice in it,in Jerusalem as if it was valid,potent,not polluted ect. You said you don't understand how I might not see what you see and so to show you I thought it best to show you how the Apostles and the Holy Spirit treated the matter of fleeing when they saw the AoD.

The trigger to flee is clear if one looks at all 3 relevant passages and understands what is to be desolated and finds the trigger to flee. The trigger to flee is easy:

Mat 24: 15 “Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place” (whoever reads, let him understand), 16 “then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

Mark 13:15 14 “So when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not” (let the reader understand), “then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

Luk 21: 20 “But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation is near. 21 Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those who are in the midst of her depart, and let not those who are in the country enter her.

The text in all three passages clearly state only those in Judea are to flee so we can rule out the futurist's model of a global event as impossible and irrelevant not worthy of any serious consideration. Both Mat and Mark have the reader flee when they see the abomination of desolation in one instance "standing in the holy place" and in the other instant "standing where it ought not." Luke has them flee when Jerusalem is surrounded by armies which would soon desolate (Jerusalem). Since Daniel is being invoked in two of these passages it is appropriate to see what Daniel says. It was their house, their holy house and their city which was to be desolated. According to Dan 9:27 it was to be consumed (by fire as we now know) by the people of the prince to come. The next prince who came and desolated Jerusalem was Titus. Daniel adds, "And till the end of the war desolations are determined." Thus we know a war causes the desolation.

When Daniel is told this, Jerusalem lay in ruins, it's temple destroyed by the Babylonians. Daniel is told when it would be rebuilt, in 7 weeks of years and how it would be destroyed again and that it would be destroyed after Messiah was cut off. The 70 AD events were not omitted and the return to the Land in 1948 is not mentioned, Daniel was not being told how a third Jerusalem and third temple were to be destroyed. Daniel was not told of a massive gap after week 69 either, thus the futurists interpretation here is just as faulty as their global tribulation theory/nonsense.

Since history confirms the Word that the next time Jerusalem was desolated was in 70 AD by Roman soldiers, we know who caused the desolation. But who or what was the abomination? Did this abominable person or thing cause the Roman solders to fall on them, or did this abominable person or thing carry out the desolation itself? I don't think it was Titus who was the abominable thing standing in the holy place because by the time Titus stood there, it would be too late to flee. Thus we need to look for something abominable that would be recognized by Jewish Christians in Jerusalem and Judea which they would immediately see as the time to flee and this abominable person or thing must be standing (not sitting as the MOS was) in a holy place or a place where it ought not.

To be continued...

 

[PlainWord]

... Part 2.

In Luke 21:20, Jesus declared, “When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near.” In fulfillment of Luke 21:20-21 and Matthew 24:15, the Roman army surrounded Jerusalem on three separate occasions during the Jewish War.

The first time was at the very beginning of the revolt. In the middle of Iyyar of A.D. 66, the Procurator Gessius Florus entered the holy city with the Roman army and killed 3,600 people in the Upper Marketplace of Jerusalem. This slaughter occurred just a couple days before the miraculous army was seen in the clouds on the 21st of Iyyar of A.D. 66. Seeing the slaughter and the miraculous armies in the sky would have been a major sign to the Christians living on Mt. Zion to flee. The next occasion was during the Feast of Tabernacles of A.D. 66 when Cestius briefly besieged Jerusalem with the 12th Legion before mysteriously departing shortly thereafter. The final time in which the Roman army surrounded Jerusalem during the Jewish War was in A.D. 70 just before the fall of the city under Caesar Titus.

As warned in Luke 21:20-21, the presence of the Roman army and its ensigns outside of Jerusalem in Iyyar of A.D. 66 under Florus and perhaps later in Tishri of A.D. 66 under Cestius was a sign to the Christians in Jerusalem to flee the city. The great slaughter at the Upper Marketplace upon Florus’ entry into Jerusalem in Iyyar of A.D. 66 was the reason Jesus urged His people to immediately flee to the mountains in Matthew 24:16-18.

The same might be said concerning Cestius’ arrival at Jerusalem. After Cestius withdrew from the city, civil war and uprisings subsequently caused a catastrophic death toll in Jerusalem even before the arrival of Titus in A.D. 70. The violence following the times in which the Roman army arrived outside of Jerusalem under Florus and Cestius in A.D. 66 appears to be the reason Jesus warned His people in Matthew 24:16-18 and Luke 21:21 to immediately drop everything and flee the city after seeing this sign. I believe Christians seeing these armies outside of Jerusalem began to flee in Iyyar of A.D. 66 when seeing Florus’ army outside of Jerusalem while the rest fled in Tishri after seeing the Romans again surround Jerusalem under Cestius later that year.

Matthew 24:15 says that the abomination that causes desolation will stand (not sit) “in the holy place.” In every instance in which “holy place” occurs in the Bible, it is always used to refer to the Temple–not the city of Jerusalem or the nation of Israel, the Holy Land. Josephus says that Titus and his generals entered the holy place of the Temple before fire engulfed the building:

And now, since Caesar [Titus] was no way able to restrain the enthusiastic fury of the soldiers, and the fire proceeded on more and more, he went into the holy place of the temple, with his commanders, and saw it, with what was in it, which he found to be far superior to what the relations of foreigners contained, and not inferior to what we ourselves boasted of and believed about it. But as the flame had not as yet reached to its inward parts, but was still consuming the rooms that were about the holy house.​

If it was Jesus’ intention to say that the abomination that causes desolation was to actually stand inside the Temple, then this prediction appears to have been fulfilled at the time in which Titus entered the holy place with his generals and the Roman army set-up their ensigns on the eastern wing of the Temple and worshiped them shortly thereafter in A.D. 70. If this interpretation is correct then “’the abomination that causes desolation,’ spoken of through the prophet Daniel” mentioned in v. 15 is a direct reference to Daniel 9:26-27 and Daniel 12:11-12. As will be touched on below, both of these references to the abomination that causes desolation mentioned in the Book of Daniel were fulfilled at least in part when the Romans set-up their ensigns on the eastern wing of the Temple on the 9th of Av of A.D. 70. Let us first take a look at Daniel 9:26-27:

The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood: War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed. He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’ In the middle of the ‘seven’ he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on a wing of the temple he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.​

Notice that the abomination that causes desolation is depicted within the Temple, the holy place, in Daniel 9:27. Also notice that the abomination that causes desolation is set up by the people of “the ruler who will come.” “The ruler who will come” is sometimes translated prince. Caesar Titus; the son of Vespasian, the emperor of Rome; is the prince predicted in these verses as he was the emperor’s firstborn son and had already been named his father’s successor at that time. The seven mentioned in Daniel 9:26-27 refers to the Jewish War itself which lasted approximately seven years from Iyyar of A.D. 66 to the fall of Masada on Passover of A.D. 74. Half way through this war Titus destroyed the Temple on the 9th of Av of A.D. 70 which permanently put an end to “sacrifice and offering.” And on that same day the Romans under Titus’ leadership set up their idolatrous ensigns on the eastern wing of the Temple and worshiped them there fulfilling the rest of v. 27.

However, it was too late to flee Jerusalem when Titus entered the Temple in A.D. 70 as the siege was nearly over at that time and the Romans built a wall around Jerusalem to prevent escape. However, the Interlinear from Greek to English of Mt 24:15 more literally reads, “When therefore you shall see the abomination of desolation which having been spoken of by Daniel the prophet standing in the holy place the one reading let him understand then those in Judea let them flee to the mountains.” Did you catch that?? When read literally “which having been spoken of by Daniel the prophet standing in the holy place the one reading let him understand” appears to be a parenthetical statement! We know at least that “the one reading let him understand” must be parenthetical as Jesus spoke to His audience, He did not write to them. Therefore Jesus never said (whoever reads, let him understand), this was added by the authors, Matthew and Mark, so that those reading there Epistle would understand. This phrase and the text immediately preceding it appears to be an explanatory insert to help readers link the abomination of desolation mentioned here with that mentioned in Dan 9:26-27 where the prince who destroyed Jerusalem and its Temple set up the abomination of desolation inside the Temple three and a half years into the war. So, it is most likely that Jesus never utters any of this, "spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place whoever reads, let him understand." All of this was likely a parenthetical insert by the authors. What Jesus likely said was this, "Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains" which now matches Luke's account.

The Bible makes many parenthetical statements but since parenthesis did not exist at the time it is up to modern translators to use context clues to determine when to insert parenthesis. If I am correct, this verse is telling people to leave the city as soon as they “see the abomination of desolation,” not necessarily when it stands in the Temple. When read as a parenthetical statement Mt 24:15 now aligns perfectly with its synoptic equivalent in Lk 21:20-21: “When you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near. Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those in the city get out, and let those in the country not enter the city.” (Lk 21:20-21) In both Mt 24:15 and Lk 21:20-21 Jesus tells his people to flee to the mountains when they first see the Romans. When people are instructed to drop everything and flee there is no room for two different signs taking place at different times (zealots in the Temple vs armies outside). This interpretation also jives perfectly with Mt 24:15’s explicit reference to Dan 9:26-27 where “prince” Titus ordered the worshiping of the idolatrous ensigns in the Temple.

History informs us of a mass Exodus of Christians from Judea prior to the start of hostilities between the zealots and the Romans. More on that next....

 

[garee]

I don't understand how people can't see that the abomination that makes desolate was the Jews killing Christ. I mean the bible evens says that Jesus became an abomination unto them and Jesus said "behold thy house is left desolate".... How much more clearer can that be?

To make desolate is to make without effect or make void. Or place the things seen in the unseen holy place of God . Removing the object of faith, the unseen holy place. In that way making faith without effect.

Kings in Israel made the unseen faith of Christ working in mankind without effect.

The faithless Jews acting as fools that did not have the born again spirit caled themselves together .(Not led by the Lord).

They had no interest in walking by faith. They refused to serve a God as King not seen. They became jealous of the surrounding pagan nations that walked after the temporal what the eyes see and not the holy place of faith not seen.

God gave them over until the time reformation when he declared the temple made with human hand was desolate.

1 Samuel 8 Then all the elders of Israel gathered themselves together, and came to Samuel unto Ramah, And said unto him, Behold, thou art old, and thy sons walk not in thy ways: now make us a king to judge us like all the nations.
But the thing displeased Samuel, when they said, Give us a king to judge us. And Samuel prayed unto the Lord.
And the Lord said unto Samuel, Hearken unto the voice of the people in all that they say unto thee: for they have not rejected thee, but they have rejected me, that I should not reign over them. . . . (The abomination of desolation.)

The first time they attempted to perform the abomination of desolation the Lord attempted to bring unity giving them Saul. Saul proved to he was faithless and performed a abomination of desolation .Seeking after workers with familiar spirits rather than God the King of kings and Lord of lords .

1 Samuel 10:19 And ye have this day rejected your God, who himself saved you out of all your adversities and your tribulations; and ye have said unto him, Nay, but set a king over us. Now therefore present yourselves before the Lord by your tribes, and by your thousands.

 

[garee]

In Luke 21:20, Jesus declared, “When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near.” In fulfillment of Luke 21:20-21 and Matthew 24:15, the Roman army surrounded Jerusalem on three separate occasions during the Jewish War.

It would seem the fulfilment is seen in the parable found in Mathew 24 .Walking out of the temple moving the kingdoms of this world to mount of Olives to represent a kingdom or mountain .

Making the temple useless, powerless to deceive the all the nations. Moving it to the high Mountain is used to represent all the kingdoms of the world becoming the kingdoms of God in the new order not seen.

The unseen understanding was hid from the apostles in that parable in order to keep teaching how to walk by faith the unseen eternal and not after what the eyes see the temporal . The disciples must of thought Jesus was blind . They desired he re-enter the abomination of desolation after making desolate .


Mathew 23 and 24 . .Behold, your house is left unto you desolate. (Not will be) For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord. And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple:(AoD) and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple. And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

No sign as a wonder was given. Its a evil faithless generation(natural unconverted mankind). That places the things seen in the unseen holy place of God.

 

[PlainWord]

Massorite,

Everything I mentioned is right there in the Word of God
The antichrist will speak of peace when he appears and will deceive most of the world by speaking great words of peace.
Dan 8:25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.

Daniel 8 deals with Antiochus IV Epiphanes in the 160s BC.

Rev 13:3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
Rev 13:4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
Rev 13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
Rev 13:6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
Rev 13:9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.
Rev 13:10 He that leads into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

As I explained exhaustively in another post. The Sea Beast was the Roman Empire and the 7 heads were their leaders. John is borrowing Daniel's beasts as empires analogy of Dan 7. The sixth head Nero committed suicide by stabbing himself in the neck. Since Nero did not name a successor the beast almost "died" and was reborn over a year later when Vespasian restored order in the empire. Those who dwell upon the earth refer to the religious leaders of Israel.

The antichrist will sit in a new temple of God and declare himself to be God.
2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2Th 2:4 Who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sits in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
You said "The 7 heads were the 7 leaders of Rome up to this time" but you are wrong and you left out the 10 horns on that seven headed dragon. So lets talk about all of the scriptures that talk about the beast with seven heads and ten horns. Scripture itself tells us what the seven heads represent .
Rev 17:9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sits.
When you look up the meaning of the word "mountain" in that scripture it is actually talking about seven mountains that are geographically located in Europe. I the word of God the "horn" always represents power and authority and scripture tells us that those ten horns represent ten kings.
Rev 17:12 And the ten horns which thou saw are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
The ten kings you are talking about are not actually talking about seven kings but are talking about seven "kingdoms".
Rev 17:10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, (the Assyrians, the Babylonians twice, the Persians, and Alexander the Great) and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he comes, he must continue a short space.
In Rev. 17:10 the five fallen kings are five kingdoms that have conquered Israel and enslaved its people. The kingdom that is at the time the book of Revelation was written was the Roman Empire, which is the kingdom that "is" in verse 10. The kingdom that is "yet to come" in verse 10 will be the kingdom of the antichrist and he will also conquer and oppress the Jewish people.

The term, "Antichrist" is not found in any of those passages you cited. There is a man of sin who sits in the temple and there were several candidates in the first century towards the end of the second temple, Eleazar, John, Simon and Titus, to name a few.

The antichrist will do miracles and even call fire down from heaven.
Rev 13:13 And he does great wonders, so that he makes fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
Rev 13:14 And deceives them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
Notice here in verse 13:14 it says that the antichrist will preform miracles which is further proof that the antichrist will fulfill prophetic scripture just as Christ has already done. The antichrist will declare himself to be Christ.

You are mixing up multiple characters and rolling them into one which you call the "antiChrist." You are now calling the beast of the earth the antichrist after you previous said the beast of the sea was the antichrist and you called the man of sin the antichrist. Vespasian performed several miracles and he came from the earth (Israel) to Rome as its emperor.

You said "The sixth head was the beast with the mortal wound, Nero, who committed suicide by stabbing himself in the neck."
Just as I have already pointed out, The beast will receive a mortal wound but will live and rise from the dead.
Rev 13:14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
Nero might have killed himself but he never raise from the dead so you conclusions are incorrect and not according to the Word of God.

Again, the beast does not receive the mortal wound, one of it's heads or leaders does and that was Nero. When it says, "his deadly wound was healed" it doesn't mean Nero was healed, it means the beast was healed. The Beast doesn't die, it almost dies. This sea beast was the fourth beast of Dan 7, which clearly was Rome.

Who was able to make war with Rome back then?

 

[KJV1611]

Still you should notice that the Apostles were told to wait and not leave Jerusalem and they did not. Then in Acts 2 they received the Holy Spirit as they were promised and then afterward the Holy Spirit had them remain in Jerusalem at least until the death of James. So if the AoD that Jesus referred to was his death then they would have left Judea at his death and not 35 or more years later. Remember Matthew 24 where Jesus says to flee when they saw the AoD spoken of in Daniel https://biblehub.com/matthew/24-16.htm .

Peter denied Jesus 3 times when they took him to be crucified and there's doubting Thomas. I don't know that they understood what Jesus meant by the abomination of desolation at that time any more than most people of today understand what it means.

You have to remember that at that time, the sun was blotted out, there was a great earthquake and dead bodies came out of the ground. That was the time of Jacob's trouble.

Jer 30:7 Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble; but he shall be saved out of it.
Jer 30:8 For it shall come to pass in that day, saith the LORD of hosts, that I will break his yoke from off thy neck, and will burst thy bonds, and strangers shall no more serve themselves of him:

That is the day that Jacob was saved by the death of Jesus and it is the time when Esau's yoke (Esau representing the Jew's that lorded over God's people) was broken off of Jacob's neck.

Jacob represents saved Jews that were under the bondage of the wicked unsaved Jew's. It is the time when the kingdom was taken from the Jews and given to the saved Jews and gentiles.

Again it's like I said before of who is an apostle and whose not helping me decide who sees this correct. I know that if James,the elders and even Paul remained in Jerusalem up to Acts 21 https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Acts 21&version=KJV and saw the temple then still standing as functional and valid then they did not see it as polluted in about ad59 https://biblehub.com/timeline/acts/1.htm . Now they had not left because they did not see the AoD Jesus referred to in Matthew 24 and so then as Paul stated in 2 Thess. 2 https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2+Thessalonians+2&version=KJV until that son of perdition sits showing that he is God I will follow the Apostles opinions on this matter.

Not that I mean disrespect to your opinion but that it is clear that neither the Apostles nor the Holy Spirit felt that the Temple had been polluted and by their actions(Acts of the Apostles) made sacrifice in it,in Jerusalem as if it was valid,potent,not polluted ect. You said you don't understand how I might not see what you see and so to show you I thought it best to show you how the Apostles and the Holy Spirit treated the matter of fleeing when they saw the AoD.

I know you don't mean any disrespect brother nor do I.
When Jesus died, the earthly literal temple was done, the real temple, that the old temple was a foreshadow of, had come and once the real comes, we never go back to foreshadows. There is no such thing as polluting a temple made with man's hands AFTER the real temple has come.

Zec_6:12 And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the LORD:

The BRANCH, which is Jesus, he is the one that builds the TRUE temple of God. When he died and raised that TEMPLE up in three days, that's when the old earthly temple of God was finished.

 

[KJV1611]

To make desolate is to make without effect or make void. Or place the things seen in the unseen holy place of God . Removing the object of faith, the unseen holy place. In that way making faith without effect.

Kings in Israel made the unseen faith of Christ working in mankind without effect.

The faithless Jews acting as fools that did not have the born again spirit caled themselves together .(Not led by the Lord).

They had no interest in walking by faith. They refused to serve a God as King not seen. They became jealous of the surrounding pagan nations that walked after the temporal what the eyes see and not the holy place of faith not seen.

God gave them over until the time reformation when he declared the temple made with human hand was desolate.

1 Samuel 8 Then all the elders of Israel gathered themselves together, and came to Samuel unto Ramah, And said unto him, Behold, thou art old, and thy sons walk not in thy ways: now make us a king to judge us like all the nations.
But the thing displeased Samuel, when they said, Give us a king to judge us. And Samuel prayed unto the Lord.
And the Lord said unto Samuel, Hearken unto the voice of the people in all that they say unto thee: for they have not rejected thee, but they have rejected me, that I should not reign over them. . . . (The abomination of desolation.)

The first time they attempted to perform the abomination of desolation the Lord attempted to bring unity giving them Saul. Saul proved to he was faithless and performed a abomination of desolation .Seeking after workers with familiar spirits rather than God the King of kings and Lord of lords .

1 Samuel 10:19 And ye have this day rejected your God, who himself saved you out of all your adversities and your tribulations; and ye have said unto him, Nay, but set a king over us. Now therefore present yourselves before the Lord by your tribes, and by your thousands.

The "abomination of desolation" isn't a phrase or a thing or an event.
An abomination is something that is done by someone that is utterly disgusting and repugnant to another person.
Desolation means to make something depressingly empty or bare.

Common sense says that killing the guy sent to save you is an abomination. Common sense says that Jesus making the Jews desolate and taking the kingdom of heaven from them is a desolation.

 

[PlainWord]

It would seem the fulfilment is seen in the parable found in Mathew 24 .Walking out of the temple moving the kingdoms of this world to mount of Olives to represent a kingdom or mountain .

Making the temple useless, powerless to deceive the all the nations. Moving it to the high Mountain is used to represent all the kingdoms of the world becoming the kingdoms of God in the new order not seen.

The unseen understanding was hid from the apostles in that parable in order to keep teaching how to walk by faith the unseen eternal and not after what the eyes see the temporal . The disciples must of thought Jesus was blind . They desired he re-enter the abomination of desolation after making desolate .


Mathew 23 and 24 . .Behold, your house is left unto you desolate. (Not will be) For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord. And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple:(AoD) and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple. And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

No sign as a wonder was given. Its a evil faithless generation(natural unconverted mankind). That places the things seen in the unseen holy place of God.

Actually, Mat 24 doesn't have a parable until vs. 32. Before then it is all straightforward prophesy and it dealt with the literal temple that they had just left. no hidden meanings. When Jesus uses a parable, we are told that He is. He doesn't mention a parable until vs. 32 and this parable was just to let them know when they see the signs He mentioned earlier that His return would be imminent.

 

[KJV1611]

Actually, Mat 24 doesn't have a parable until vs. 32. Before then it is all straightforward prophesy and it dealt with the literal temple that they had just left. no hidden meanings. When Jesus uses a parable, we are told that He is. He doesn't mention a parable until vs. 32 and this parable was just to let them know when they see the signs He mentioned earlier that His return would be imminent.

What are your thoughts on this PW. What is "your redemption draweth nigh" talking about?
(Luk 21:27) And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
(Luk 21:28) And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

 

[VCO]

Video Posted May 13, 2020

The very next Prophecy that may be fulfilled will we setting up of the Tabernacle out side the camp, and the SACRIFICE OF THE RED HEIFER. It could be on the Mount of Olives, which is the Traditional place for this to take place, and some say it could be on the Temple Mount next to the Dome of the ROCK. But if it is the Mount of Olives, a NEW BRIDGE must be built to carry both the High Priest and the Red Heifer to the TABERNACLE. WHY? Being around dead bodies would defile both the RED HEIFER and the High Priest. And the Mount of Olives is covered with Graves. Watch for the start of that Bridge, because I seriously doubt the Palestinians would allow it on the so-called Temple Mount. So the bridge would be built up and over the GRAVES.

 

[KJV1611]

Video Posted May 13, 2020

The very next Prophecy that may be fulfilled will we setting up of the Tabernacle out side the camp, and the SACRIFICE OF THE RED HEIFER. It could be on the Mount of Olives, which is the Traditional place for this to take place, and some say it could be on the Temple Mount next to the Dome of the ROCK. But if it is the Mount of Olives, a NEW BRIDGE must be built to carry both the High Priest and the Red Heifer to the TABERNACLE. WHY? Being around dead bodies would defile both the RED HEIFER and the High Priest. And the Mount of Olives is covered with Graves. Watch for the start of that Bridge, because I seriously doubt the Palestinians would allow it on the so-called Temple Mount. So the bridge would be built up and over the GRAVES.

I don’t think God really cares if a bunch of God hating people who call themselves Jews sacrifice a red Heifer or if they don’t. It certainly doesn’t have anything to do with God or the Bible in fact in direct rebellion to God.

 

[iamsoandso]

Peter denied Jesus 3 times when they took him to be crucified and there's doubting Thomas. I don't know that they understood what Jesus meant by the abomination of desolation at that time any more than most people of today understand what it means.

You have to remember that at that time, the sun was blotted out, there was a great earthquake and dead bodies came out of the ground. That was the time of Jacob's trouble.

Jer 30:7 Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble; but he shall be saved out of it.
Jer 30:8 For it shall come to pass in that day, saith the LORD of hosts, that I will break his yoke from off thy neck, and will burst thy bonds, and strangers shall no more serve themselves of him:

That is the day that Jacob was saved by the death of Jesus and it is the time when Esau's yoke (Esau representing the Jew's that lorded over God's people) was broken off of Jacob's neck.

Jacob represents saved Jews that were under the bondage of the wicked unsaved Jew's. It is the time when the kingdom was taken from the Jews and given to the saved Jews and gentiles.


I know you don't mean any disrespect brother nor do I.
When Jesus died, the earthly literal temple was done, the real temple, that the old temple was a foreshadow of, had come and once the real comes, we never go back to foreshadows. There is no such thing as polluting a temple made with man's hands AFTER the real temple has come.

Zec_6:12 And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the LORD:

The BRANCH, which is Jesus, he is the one that builds the TRUE temple of God. When he died and raised that TEMPLE up in three days, that's when the old earthly temple of God was finished.

No I know you mean know you do not mean any disrespect, I just wanted you to know I also do not in what I say.

It strikes me as if Jesus spoke of the AoD as if he knew that they understood it(he didn't speak of it as if they did not) but the things they did not understand like his death burial and resurrection the Scriptures usually say "but they did not yet understand" each time he told them about it. Peter going back fishing,the women thinking he was the gardener, doubting Thomas ect. shows that they were not expecting Jesus to rise from the grave(we spoke of this in another thread) but their understanding of the AoD from Daniel Jesus seemed to think they would recognize it and also whoever put "...him that readeth understand ect..." so which is why I think it was something most Jews commonly would see as the AoD from Daniel.

 

[iamsoandso]

... Part 2.

In Luke 21:20, Jesus declared, “When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near.” In fulfillment of Luke 21:20-21 and Matthew 24:15, the Roman army surrounded Jerusalem on three separate occasions during the Jewish War.

The first time was at the very beginning of the revolt. In the middle of Iyyar of A.D. 66, the Procurator Gessius Florus entered the holy city with the Roman army and killed 3,600 people in the Upper Marketplace of Jerusalem. This slaughter occurred just a couple days before the miraculous army was seen in the clouds on the 21st of Iyyar of A.D. 66. Seeing the slaughter and the miraculous armies in the sky would have been a major sign to the Christians living on Mt. Zion to flee. The next occasion was during the Feast of Tabernacles of A.D. 66 when Cestius briefly besieged Jerusalem with the 12th Legion before mysteriously departing shortly thereafter. The final time in which the Roman army surrounded Jerusalem during the Jewish War was in A.D. 70 just before the fall of the city under Caesar Titus.

As warned in Luke 21:20-21, the presence of the Roman army and its ensigns outside of Jerusalem in Iyyar of A.D. 66 under Florus and perhaps later in Tishri of A.D. 66 under Cestius was a sign to the Christians in Jerusalem to flee the city. The great slaughter at the Upper Marketplace upon Florus’ entry into Jerusalem in Iyyar of A.D. 66 was the reason Jesus urged His people to immediately flee to the mountains in Matthew 24:16-18.

The same might be said concerning Cestius’ arrival at Jerusalem. After Cestius withdrew from the city, civil war and uprisings subsequently caused a catastrophic death toll in Jerusalem even before the arrival of Titus in A.D. 70. The violence following the times in which the Roman army arrived outside of Jerusalem under Florus and Cestius in A.D. 66 appears to be the reason Jesus warned His people in Matthew 24:16-18 and Luke 21:21 to immediately drop everything and flee the city after seeing this sign. I believe Christians seeing these armies outside of Jerusalem began to flee in Iyyar of A.D. 66 when seeing Florus’ army outside of Jerusalem while the rest fled in Tishri after seeing the Romans again surround Jerusalem under Cestius later that year.

Matthew 24:15 says that the abomination that causes desolation will stand (not sit) “in the holy place.” In every instance in which “holy place” occurs in the Bible, it is always used to refer to the Temple–not the city of Jerusalem or the nation of Israel, the Holy Land. Josephus says that Titus and his generals entered the holy place of the Temple before fire engulfed the building:

And now, since Caesar [Titus] was no way able to restrain the enthusiastic fury of the soldiers, and the fire proceeded on more and more, he went into the holy place of the temple, with his commanders, and saw it, with what was in it, which he found to be far superior to what the relations of foreigners contained, and not inferior to what we ourselves boasted of and believed about it. But as the flame had not as yet reached to its inward parts, but was still consuming the rooms that were about the holy house.​

If it was Jesus’ intention to say that the abomination that causes desolation was to actually stand inside the Temple, then this prediction appears to have been fulfilled at the time in which Titus entered the holy place with his generals and the Roman army set-up their ensigns on the eastern wing of the Temple and worshiped them shortly thereafter in A.D. 70. If this interpretation is correct then “’the abomination that causes desolation,’ spoken of through the prophet Daniel” mentioned in v. 15 is a direct reference to Daniel 9:26-27 and Daniel 12:11-12. As will be touched on below, both of these references to the abomination that causes desolation mentioned in the Book of Daniel were fulfilled at least in part when the Romans set-up their ensigns on the eastern wing of the Temple on the 9th of Av of A.D. 70. Let us first take a look at Daniel 9:26-27:

The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood: War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed. He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’ In the middle of the ‘seven’ he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on a wing of the temple he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.​

Notice that the abomination that causes desolation is depicted within the Temple, the holy place, in Daniel 9:27. Also notice that the abomination that causes desolation is set up by the people of “the ruler who will come.” “The ruler who will come” is sometimes translated prince. Caesar Titus; the son of Vespasian, the emperor of Rome; is the prince predicted in these verses as he was the emperor’s firstborn son and had already been named his father’s successor at that time. The seven mentioned in Daniel 9:26-27 refers to the Jewish War itself which lasted approximately seven years from Iyyar of A.D. 66 to the fall of Masada on Passover of A.D. 74. Half way through this war Titus destroyed the Temple on the 9th of Av of A.D. 70 which permanently put an end to “sacrifice and offering.” And on that same day the Romans under Titus’ leadership set up their idolatrous ensigns on the eastern wing of the Temple and worshiped them there fulfilling the rest of v. 27.

However, it was too late to flee Jerusalem when Titus entered the Temple in A.D. 70 as the siege was nearly over at that time and the Romans built a wall around Jerusalem to prevent escape. However, the Interlinear from Greek to English of Mt 24:15 more literally reads, “When therefore you shall see the abomination of desolation which having been spoken of by Daniel the prophet standing in the holy place the one reading let him understand then those in Judea let them flee to the mountains.” Did you catch that?? When read literally “which having been spoken of by Daniel the prophet standing in the holy place the one reading let him understand” appears to be a parenthetical statement! We know at least that “the one reading let him understand” must be parenthetical as Jesus spoke to His audience, He did not write to them. Therefore Jesus never said (whoever reads, let him understand), this was added by the authors, Matthew and Mark, so that those reading there Epistle would understand. This phrase and the text immediately preceding it appears to be an explanatory insert to help readers link the abomination of desolation mentioned here with that mentioned in Dan 9:26-27 where the prince who destroyed Jerusalem and its Temple set up the abomination of desolation inside the Temple three and a half years into the war. So, it is most likely that Jesus never utters any of this, "spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place whoever reads, let him understand." All of this was likely a parenthetical insert by the authors. What Jesus likely said was this, "Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains" which now matches Luke's account.

The Bible makes many parenthetical statements but since parenthesis did not exist at the time it is up to modern translators to use context clues to determine when to insert parenthesis. If I am correct, this verse is telling people to leave the city as soon as they “see the abomination of desolation,” not necessarily when it stands in the Temple. When read as a parenthetical statement Mt 24:15 now aligns perfectly with its synoptic equivalent in Lk 21:20-21: “When you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near. Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those in the city get out, and let those in the country not enter the city.” (Lk 21:20-21) In both Mt 24:15 and Lk 21:20-21 Jesus tells his people to flee to the mountains when they first see the Romans. When people are instructed to drop everything and flee there is no room for two different signs taking place at different times (zealots in the Temple vs armies outside). This interpretation also jives perfectly with Mt 24:15’s explicit reference to Dan 9:26-27 where “prince” Titus ordered the worshiping of the idolatrous ensigns in the Temple.

History informs us of a mass Exodus of Christians from Judea prior to the start of hostilities between the zealots and the Romans. More on that next....

lol, I feel guilty not waiting any longer but you ended this post(part 1 of 3?) after quoting me with the statement, "More on that next" so not to be rude I was waiting before I ask the questions that came to mind(several),lol....

 

[VCO]

I don’t think God really cares if a bunch of God hating people who call themselves Jews sacrifice a red Heifer or if they don’t. It certainly doesn’t have anything to do with God or the Bible in fact in direct rebellion to God.

You missed the whole Point. THEY BELIEVE IT!

 

[iamsoandso]

You missed the whole Point. THEY BELIEVE IT!

Yep their helping create the OWG, kingdom of the beast,image ect. but they don't know it. They believe that they are helping along God when they are on the incorrect side of this. While at the same time others see it as insignificant because they force fit the mark,image ect. back with the other things fulfilled in ad70.

 

[massorite]

Simple Logic, If the sole Purpose for the Third Temple is to fulfill the Antichrist's plans to sit in the Temple of GOD, Perhaps GOD WOULD PREFER THAT TEMPLE BE ON THE WRONG SITE, when Satan's Antichrist sits down. Do you know the only seat in the TEMPLE is the Mercy Seat in the Holy of Holies.

There is actually no proof that the temple spoken of in 2Thess chapter two is the "third Temple". All we know from those scriptures is that the antichrist must have a temple to sit in before he can sit in a temple of God and declare/show himself to be God. Scripture is not telling us any lies here so if the Word of God is telling us that the antichrist will sit in the temple of God and declare/show himself to be God then the antichrist will do just that.