Both thieves were hurling insults at Jesus while they were all hanging on their crosses in the beginning per Matthew and Mark's gospel accounts. Would a baptized Christian hurl insults at their Lord Jesus while they all hang there dying? No.
Note that Jesus died before the two thieves did. That means they both witnessed everything that Jesus said and did while on the cross. Witnessing all that changed the mind of one of the thieves and converted him. So before Jesus died, he finally stood up for Jesus and asked his now Lord Jesus to remember him. He was also repentant because he knew what he did was wrong and was rightfully crucified for them while also acknowledging that Jesus didn't deserve the crucifixion. Jesus then said that the thief will be with Him in paradise.
So definitely saved without being water-baptized.
I was baptized but not to get saved. If Jesus did, even though He of all people didn't need to, then I would do it too. It also means a lot to God the Father and the Holy Spirit. They all rarely ever show up all three at the same time, but this is one of the few times ever recorded in the Bible when they did. So I think people should get baptized if it means so much to God.
I also think it's a test. If you can do this, such a little thing, then you can be trusted and encouraged to do a lot more for God. But if you make excuses not do this when you have the ability to do so, then you might be someone God can't trust to do more in service to Him. I mean, if you make excuses not to do it, what else would you excuse in regard to God and His leading?
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Yeah man that’s a good logical opinion you have there …..
can I ask though you simply don’t believe Luke’s gospel ? Based on marks and Matthews account of the crucifixion? you then don’t believe Luke’s ?
sounds like you are pretty sure the thief who was dying on the cross couldn’t possibly have been baptized I think this makes it very much possible
“John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins. And there went out unto him all the land of Judæa, and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the river of Jordan, confessing their sins.”
Mark 1:4-5
It doesn’t prove he was but if he was around the area in the prior three of more years it makes it very possible and even likely to me even after reading your post and logic there I don’t mean any disrespect just I don’t agree with you which should be fine given baptism for remission of sins is a pretty consistent part of doctrine in the Bibles New Testament before and after the cross hard for me to just pretend it’s not there
Jesus getting baptized
“And it came to pass in those days, that
Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee, and was baptized of John in Jordan. And straightway
coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him: and
there came a voice from heaven, saying, Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.”
Mark 1:9-11 KJV
After the cross
“Then Peter said unto them,
Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,
and
ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For
the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.”
Acts 2:38-39
Still water baptism
“But
when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.
….And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain
water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and
they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him. And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.”
Acts 8:12, 36-39 KJV
I’m just not willing to pretend Gods doctrines like baptism for remission of sins is irrelevant or that it doesn’t exist . Some are willing to reject it and make
logical arguments like well if this dying thief didn’t get baptized we don’t need it
and use thier logical reasoning to erase what’s actually written there to accept and believe and act upon there’s never been any reason for any Christian to say “ hey we don’t really need to get baptized to be saved “ it’s a lack of faith
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and
preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;
but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
Mark 16:15-16 KJV
That’s why they were doing this
“Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus. And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.”
Acts 8:35-38 KJV
I’ve never understood why we try to ask can we be saved by not believing what Jesus said about being saved ? I just got baptized when I really heard and believed that you know ? I just believe it is what it says it is for maybe that’s not what we’re supposed to do but I’ll probably die on the hill of believing the Bible when it’s repetetive and clear like it is regarding baptism
but is god going to send a person to hell because they didn’t actually have an opportunity to get baptized ? Naw I’ve never claimed anything like this . But we use far fetched scenarios to try to justify saying we don’t need to get baptized for remission of sins I’ve never understood the motivation why not just be believers and accept the gift ?
