He writes the law of love (Mt 22:37-40) on our hearts, not the entire Mosaic code.Originally Posted by p_rehbein
I wonder how many commenting here have actually read through all of the 613 Laws? It might be an eye opener or game changer for some, for many here who profess that it isn't necessary to obey those Laws will be shocked to find out they have been living in obedience to them all their lives. Wow..........
Seriously, might want to read through all of the 613 Laws before commenting too much.
MarcR: 613 laws:
Yes, and did you see any on that list that are still valid today? I sure do. There are those on that list that are both in keeping with the Gospel of Jesus Christ under the New Covenant Grace, and the teachings of Paul, and the Laws of the Land.
Why it is important for people to actually read through the list of all 613. Now, there are surely many (I listed) that do not apply to me, or to my walk with Christ, but there are some that surely do. Yes, He writes His Laws on our hearts, but does that mean we can disregard them? I don't think so. If He went to the trouble to write them on our hearts, I would suspect He considered them important to us and to Him. But, now, that may just be me.
Which laws are and are not valid?
- Thread starter Matthew4Jesus
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So if they are something they already do because of the indwelling Holy Spirit, why do they need the written code?
If people actually read through these 613 Laws, I think they would be shocked to realize how many of them they accept as necessary for a true walk with Christ, and a fruitful relationship with Him.
Yes, obedience to God's New Covenant commands, starting with Mt 22:37-40, is the means of
1 John 3: 21-22 "Beloved, if our heart condemn us not, [then] have we confidence toward God.And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because
we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight."
godliness/holiness/sanctification through the Holy Spirit.
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J
JesusIsAll
Guest
Two things I'd like to see of those with oddball, legalistic doctrines answer to, with scripture:
1. Where is the Old Testament commandment to keep the sabbath anywhere repeated in the New Testament? (As a matter of fact, believers meeting on Sunday is explicitly mentioned.)
2. Where, in the entirety of the Bible, is a distinction made between what people claim is moral law versus ceremonial law? Where is this in scripture?
Scripture please, word of God only, no human philosophizing or commentary. No cult false prophets blather.
1. Where is the Old Testament commandment to keep the sabbath anywhere repeated in the New Testament? (As a matter of fact, believers meeting on Sunday is explicitly mentioned.)
2. Where, in the entirety of the Bible, is a distinction made between what people claim is moral law versus ceremonial law? Where is this in scripture?
Scripture please, word of God only, no human philosophizing or commentary. No cult false prophets blather.
That is, the teaching of our Salvation Jesus Christ whose words spoken in these last days (Heb 1:1-2) through the NT writers are his complete teaching, without truncation.
Actually, God's law was given to God's people.
And the law written on scrolls was from God just as much as the law on tablets of stone, no difference.
The Ten Commandments were the basis of the Old Covenant, which is why they were kept in the Ark of the Testimony.
But only the Book of the Covenant, which was not the entire Moasic code, was kept beside the Ark.
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The Mosaic Law is actually divisible into the ceremonial and the moral, but no such distinction is made or even assumed in Scripture.
It's like grouping Jesus' parables according to subject, which distinction is not made in Scripture.
J
JesusIsAll
Guest
Therefore, assumed by man. The fact is, in the New Testament, there are the Nine Commandments, as it were, as it's explicit the Christian is not to have sabbaths laid on them. Another fact is, when you examine the truth of scripture, the house of cards of the Jew-lites tumbles down.
N
newlife7
Guest
Thanks Elin for your help as I was trying answer the young man Matthew4Jesus about his question. As much as this has been a struggle here on CC, I have to believe that God might be using us and others here that agree with NT scripture about this topic to help people because we are speaking the truth in a world where even pastors on TV and all around the world are also in error about what we are trying to explain. I have been called a hieratic, a demon, and who knows what else for speaking the truth. I want to also tell Matthew4Jesus that in Romans 3:19 when it mentions the law in that verse according to the Greek it means the whole Old Testament but I do not want to get pelted with rocks for doing so. Please understand everyone that agrees or disagrees with me that I am not trying to start any quarrels I have just come to a deeper understanding of Hebrews 13:10 and this is a serious matter.
Elin, if you read my previous posts today, I believe you will find they condur with your responses to some lines from what I have posted. I believe they do anyway. It is a shame that in a thread oft times it is easy to misunderstastand another because responding to one post not having read the related earlier posts leads to a wrong conclusion.
I have shared, as you have, no one in Jesus Christ is in condemnation.
As you have responded, I have made it clear that we learn about how to behave by Christs' Example and teaching.
Yes we live in Grace after coming to Jesus Christ, but as taught in the NT we also become children of obedience, no longer as we were, children of disobedience.
If we obey Christ, we will be, as best we can, obeying the law, though we do falter , but Jesus Christ has been perfect for us and now we are regarded as sin free and pure by God. If we do sin, we are not damned for Jesus is our Mediator.
Living in grace is no excuse not to learn and DD God's will as best we can, kn owing we will never be perfect until God' good , great and glorious day, at which time He will personally finish the work He began in each of us in an instant. Meanwhile we are to do His Word as best we are able.
Our Salvation is free, and no good work or law abiding saves us , not does it contribut to salvation, but our freedom is never an excuse to be purposely disobedient. Jesus teaches us all.
God bless you Elin. I pray you are well and always on and in the Way given you by our Lord, Jesus Christ......amen.
I have shared, as you have, no one in Jesus Christ is in condemnation.
As you have responded, I have made it clear that we learn about how to behave by Christs' Example and teaching.
Yes we live in Grace after coming to Jesus Christ, but as taught in the NT we also become children of obedience, no longer as we were, children of disobedience.
If we obey Christ, we will be, as best we can, obeying the law, though we do falter , but Jesus Christ has been perfect for us and now we are regarded as sin free and pure by God. If we do sin, we are not damned for Jesus is our Mediator.
Living in grace is no excuse not to learn and DD God's will as best we can, kn owing we will never be perfect until God' good , great and glorious day, at which time He will personally finish the work He began in each of us in an instant. Meanwhile we are to do His Word as best we are able.
Our Salvation is free, and no good work or law abiding saves us , not does it contribut to salvation, but our freedom is never an excuse to be purposely disobedient. Jesus teaches us all.
God bless you Elin. I pray you are well and always on and in the Way given you by our Lord, Jesus Christ......amen.
L
Lifetrack
Guest
I'm sorry but i dont agree with you.
This is what Jezus said in Mathew 5
21 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
23 Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee;
24 Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.
25 Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison.
26 Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing.
27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
31 It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement:
32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.
It's about the ten commandements, nothing else, for all of us.
L
Lifetrack
Guest
Yes it is about grace en mercy, Remember that Jezus said: love God above all and your neighbour as yourself ?
Its the 4 commands to God and 6 to our neighbour, makes 10. Grace and mercy has made that where forgiven, but we still are are askt to strive to do them.
Its the 4 commands to God and 6 to our neighbour, makes 10. Grace and mercy has made that where forgiven, but we still are are askt to strive to do them.
[FONT="]Cor 13:2[/FONT][FONT="]"And if I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing."
Colossians 3:
5.[/FONT][FONT="] Put to death therefore your members which are upon the earth: fornication, uncleanness, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry;[/FONT]
[FONT="] 6. for which things` sake cometh the wrath of God upon the sons of disobedience:[/FONT]
[FONT="] 7. wherein ye also once walked, when ye lived in these things;[/FONT]
[FONT="] 8. but now do ye also put them all away: anger, wrath, malice, railing, shameful speaking out of your mouth:[/FONT]
[FONT="] 9. lie not one to another; seeing that ye have put off the old man with his doings,[/FONT]
[FONT="] 10. and have put on the new man, that is being renewed unto knowledge after the image of him that created him:[/FONT]
[FONT="] 11. where there cannot be Greek and Jew, circumcision and uncircumcision, barbarian, Scythian, bondman, freeman; but Christ is all, and in all.[/FONT]
[FONT="] 12. Put on therefore, as God`s elect, holy and beloved, a heart of compassion, kindness, lowliness, meekness, longsuffering;[/FONT]
[FONT="] 13. forbearing one another, and forgiving each other, if any man have a complaint against any; even as the Lord forgave you, so also do ye:[/FONT]
[FONT="] 14. and above all these things put on love, which is the bond of perfectness.[/FONT]
[FONT="] 15. And let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to the which also ye were called in one body; and be ye thankful.[/FONT]
LET GOD BLESS YOU ALL!
Colossians 3:
5.[/FONT][FONT="] Put to death therefore your members which are upon the earth: fornication, uncleanness, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry;[/FONT]
[FONT="] 6. for which things` sake cometh the wrath of God upon the sons of disobedience:[/FONT]
[FONT="] 7. wherein ye also once walked, when ye lived in these things;[/FONT]
[FONT="] 8. but now do ye also put them all away: anger, wrath, malice, railing, shameful speaking out of your mouth:[/FONT]
[FONT="] 9. lie not one to another; seeing that ye have put off the old man with his doings,[/FONT]
[FONT="] 10. and have put on the new man, that is being renewed unto knowledge after the image of him that created him:[/FONT]
[FONT="] 11. where there cannot be Greek and Jew, circumcision and uncircumcision, barbarian, Scythian, bondman, freeman; but Christ is all, and in all.[/FONT]
[FONT="] 12. Put on therefore, as God`s elect, holy and beloved, a heart of compassion, kindness, lowliness, meekness, longsuffering;[/FONT]
[FONT="] 13. forbearing one another, and forgiving each other, if any man have a complaint against any; even as the Lord forgave you, so also do ye:[/FONT]
[FONT="] 14. and above all these things put on love, which is the bond of perfectness.[/FONT]
[FONT="] 15. And let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to the which also ye were called in one body; and be ye thankful.[/FONT]
LET GOD BLESS YOU ALL!
Forgive my repetition but this falls into something addressed earlier.
Yes, we live in grace and mercy after coming to Jesus Christ, thus we know the law from our hearts for teh veil is lifted fro our hearts andminds.
Those who are afraid of the law are still reading the law as though it is still engraved on stone, with no room for the uinderstanding that should come with truly understanding the law, justice, judgement, mercy and grace, not to mention love.
We who do our best to obey God's will keep in mind those precious teachings from Jesus Christ never usiing th elaw to condemn, for condemnation and death were defeated on the cross, this is that curse of the law, no longer in effect rending the law holy and good until the earth and the moon are no more. After this time there will be no need of teh education given us all by our turor, the law, for we shall have been made perfect, like Jesus Christ. We will not be Jesus Christ, but it is enough to be just like He. It is an incredible reward to consider.
So we, now children of obedience, no longer need that tutor, but we certainly need to always refer to the education that tutor has given us.....the law with no fear, for we do not read it as if it were in stone, cold with no judgmen, justice, grace, mercy and love...............now the Holy Spirit show us the way. Do not fear being children of obedience for w are obedient to our Teacher, amen.
Yes, we live in grace and mercy after coming to Jesus Christ, thus we know the law from our hearts for teh veil is lifted fro our hearts andminds.
Those who are afraid of the law are still reading the law as though it is still engraved on stone, with no room for the uinderstanding that should come with truly understanding the law, justice, judgement, mercy and grace, not to mention love.
We who do our best to obey God's will keep in mind those precious teachings from Jesus Christ never usiing th elaw to condemn, for condemnation and death were defeated on the cross, this is that curse of the law, no longer in effect rending the law holy and good until the earth and the moon are no more. After this time there will be no need of teh education given us all by our turor, the law, for we shall have been made perfect, like Jesus Christ. We will not be Jesus Christ, but it is enough to be just like He. It is an incredible reward to consider.
So we, now children of obedience, no longer need that tutor, but we certainly need to always refer to the education that tutor has given us.....the law with no fear, for we do not read it as if it were in stone, cold with no judgmen, justice, grace, mercy and love...............now the Holy Spirit show us the way. Do not fear being children of obedience for w are obedient to our Teacher, amen.
I totally agree with you. I find the law God gave to Moses a tool for better understanding of my human nature, as God always knew me better than I knew myself. I see a more clear picture of God's excellent endorsements based on His love for mankind, and actually have been given a better glimpse (outlook) of His divine character which is actually His Name. In that respect it is clear that I am not under the law, but I have been lifted up by Christ Jesus who enables me to see the law in a Spiritual way rather than with a carnal mind as I did before being born again.
We are blessed in having earnest desire to do God's will, and we are shown by the law just how desperately we need salvation. As the Word teaches in the OT, we cannot ransom ourselves.. PraiseYahweh for Yeshua, amen. Theree is no faith without hope, and hope leads to faith in Jesus Christ. As Paul teaches us all, faith establishes the law, and I believe anythng establishd is confirmed for all of this age and in the next we will be perfectede.
Again I ask how can we be properly obedien children if we do not refer constantly to that education insilled within us by our tutor? Also, confirming all of our education is Jesus Christ's teaching and example, that is if we do indeed model ourselves after His Example. He was perfect for us, but this does not leave us to use our grace as license, we too must do our best to be obedient. Sin will not condemn us now, for we are in Christ, and He is our Mediator. It is not difficult, but it does rrequire faith to continue in this Way provide by our Salvation, Jesus Christ,.[
QUOTE=just-me;2065700]I totally agree with you. I find the law God gave to Moses a tool for better understanding of my human nature, as God always knew me better than I knew myself. I see a more clear picture of God's excellent endorsements based on His love for mankind, and actually have been given a better glimpse (outlook) of His divine character which is actually His Name. In that respect it is clear that I am not under the law, but I have been lifted up by Christ Jesus who enables me to see the law in a Spiritual way rather than with a carnal mind as I did before being born again.[/QUOTE]
Again I ask how can we be properly obedien children if we do not refer constantly to that education insilled within us by our tutor? Also, confirming all of our education is Jesus Christ's teaching and example, that is if we do indeed model ourselves after His Example. He was perfect for us, but this does not leave us to use our grace as license, we too must do our best to be obedient. Sin will not condemn us now, for we are in Christ, and He is our Mediator. It is not difficult, but it does rrequire faith to continue in this Way provide by our Salvation, Jesus Christ,.[
QUOTE=just-me;2065700]I totally agree with you. I find the law God gave to Moses a tool for better understanding of my human nature, as God always knew me better than I knew myself. I see a more clear picture of God's excellent endorsements based on His love for mankind, and actually have been given a better glimpse (outlook) of His divine character which is actually His Name. In that respect it is clear that I am not under the law, but I have been lifted up by Christ Jesus who enables me to see the law in a Spiritual way rather than with a carnal mind as I did before being born again.[/QUOTE]
N
newlife7
Guest
"(For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.)" 2 Corinthians 6:2
Tomorrow will be also. It's a new life, not something that was finalized in the past with us. Jesus completed it, but we haven't yet. By His grace we will make it.
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