Who Justifieth the Ungodly

[reneweddaybyday]

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

You provide no post submitted by me which proves up your accusation and you will not find any post submitted by me which corroborates your claim.

So again, those words came directly from your keyboard ... you are the only one who has made that blasphemous statement in this thread.

I gave you my reason for saying that. Anyone who claims as you do, that Christ died for sinners that still go into lost perdition for their sins, are in essence saying Christs death for their sins was worthless. I stand by that !

 

[brightfame52]

renewd

No, it is not "hogwash". It is rude on your part to combine your statements with my statements and submit a post where it appears I made both statements.

Yes it is hogwash, it matters not who hides the Gospel from the lost, the point is, its still hid from the lost and they cannot believe it.

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

Limited atonement is the "L" in TULIP aka the five-points of calvinism.

I know that, nevertheless limited atonement is a key truth in the Gospel of gods Grace, regardless what you or others call it. So when you reject Limited atonement, or unconditional election and the others, you are rejecting key truths of the Gospel and will be accountable to God for the same !

 

[brightfame52]

renewd

the verse does not state that faith "will be given".

Galatians 3:22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.

Because to believe it must be given, thats a fact from scripture Phil 1:29

29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

So when scripture mentions believing in the context of salvation, its been given to believe in behalf of Christ !

And Gal 3:22 is speaking about the Faith of Jesus Christ, His Faithfulness not the persons faith.

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

Since Scripture is very clear in telling us that faith ≠ works, you are in error when you claim "thats works, thats law keeping".

You are in error, its you who make faith and condition to get saved, which makes it law keeping/works.

I have the right perspective of Faith in salvation, its a fruit of the Spirit, given when one is born again, and it receives the testimony of God that one is Justified.

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

When the Lord Jesus Christ walked the face of the earth, He studied the Scriptures. He is our example ... we are to follow Him.

Studying Scripture was good enough for Him and I will follow Him.

Maybe if you studied the Scriptures a little more diligently, you'd be able to see the erroneousness of your dogma.

2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Again, scriptures dont save anyone from their sins, Christ does whom they reveal.

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

Please provide the post where I said that, brightfame52.

Its implied since you believe the natural man, the unregenerate man has the ability to have faith in Christ. The scriptures reveal Christ ! I believe the scriptures can only be read and understood by a regenerate person, one who has been born again by the Spirit.

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

Psalm 119:130 The entrance of thy words giveth light; it giveth understanding unto the simple.

That's just the entrance of thy words ... when a person first starts reading Scripture. Scripture tells us about itself ... Scripture gives light ... Scripture gives understanding. Again, this is just the beginning, when a person first starts to read Scripture.

Yes this is true of the regenerate

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick

[Greek zaō = life], and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

It is, so whats your point ?

Yet another lie from the pit because you do not understand the power of the Scriptures.
.

Its true, I dont see where you understand the scriptures. I dont think you understand one verse you have posted yet. Im just being honest.

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

Nope. Salvation is wholly by grace through faith.

Ephesians 2:8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

vs 8 by grace through faith

You quote that, yet you turn around and condition salvation on your faith, which constitutes works, even law keeping ! See Matt 23:23 again

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

(see also Romans 4:1-5 for Scripture which tells us faith ≠ works).
.

I already know that, its you who makes faith a condition, a work you meet to get saved, not me. My Faith is a Gift from Gods Grace that gives evidence that God saved me by His Grace !

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

your notion of "human faith" and "natural mans faith out of his flesh" and "faith is law" is just more of your vain imagining in your continued attempt to support your erroneous dogma.

No its not

Faith is faith ... there is only one faith with which mankind believes.

Wrong again

The born again one believes in God

Thats True, that Faith is the fruit of the Spirit, not his natural human faith ! The rest of your comment is garbage

Those who do not believe in God are without excuse because God has provided to all mankind all that is necessary to believe in Him.

More garbage. Everyone by nature are unbelievers, dont seek the True God Rom 3:11

11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

God gives His Elect out of mankind Faith to believe, the rest of mankind God hardens in their native unbelief !

Ephesians 1:13 In whom

[the Lord Jesus Christ] ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise

This refers to the regenerated elect, those who had been chosen in Christ before the foundation, read the context from Eph 1 :1-12. The reason why these heard was because they were born of God, spiritually alive.

After

you heard, you believed.

Correct after they heard spiritually they believed, all who have been chosen to, and ordained to eternal life believe Acts 13:48
48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

The hearing in both instances is spiritual hearing, not the natural man !

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

The issue is "in WHOM do you have faith".

Yep, does one have faith in the Jesus Christ revealed in the scripture who died to save exclusively a Chosen People of God Matt 1:21,Jn 10 given to Him before the foundation Eph 1:4, or are they trusting in the counterfit christ that died for everyone making their salvation only possible ?

 

[brightfame52]

Scripture clearly states that faith ≠ works:

Romans 4:

2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.


READ YOUR BIBLE!!!
.

I actually know what scripture says, to bad you dont seem to know, since you contradict it and make salvation contingent upon your action, which is works !

 

[brightfame52]

nope ... it shows you need to learn how to submit posts so that it is clear as to who said what.
.

Lol, its only you and i in this exchange, its clear, you just trying to avoid your contradictions.

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

just more of your "one must be born again in order to believe that through which a person is born again" dogma

You're saying that Ephesians 1:13 applies to the believer after he/she is born again????


Ephesians 1:13 In whom [the Lord Jesus Christ] ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise


After you heard, you believed.

After you believed, you were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise (regenerated / born again)

There is no spiritual hearing without being born of God. Men naturally cannot hear/understand the words of God Jn 8:43

43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

Thats word hear akouō is the same word in Eph 1:13, so man naturally cannot hear spiritually the word of God, But Jesus tells us who does hear the word of God and understand it here Jn 8:47

47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

Now what does it mean to be of God ? It means to be born of God ! So quite frankly Eph 1:13 is referring to those who have been born of God, they were hearing the Gospel of their salvation. !

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

that is not how the verse is written. You again manipulate the text in order to force Scripture to align with your erroneous dogma. tsk, tsk ... such poor workmanship. Your manipulation again fails.

to be "regenerated, or born of God" is to be sealed with the holy Spirit of promise.

Acts 1:

4 And, being assembled together with them [speaking of Jesus and the apostles], commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

The promise of the Father spoken of in Acts 1:4 = the holy Spirit of promise spoken of in Eph 1:13.

again, under your erroneous dogma, how many times must a person be born again before he/she is truly, really, really, really, scout's honor "born again"???

.
Its simple, Eph 1:13 is about the regenerate elect, after hearing of their salvation, the good news of it, they believe with God given Faith, and that testimony is sealed into their minds permanently, by the Spirit ! Thats why a true believer cannot apostatized from the faith, they are sealed. They are the servants of God Rev 7:1-3

And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.

2 And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,

3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.

 

[brightfame52]

... just more of your "born again in order to believe that through which a person is born again" dogma ...

John 1:

11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

verse 12 explains what occurs when a person receives [Greek lambanō – to lay hold by aggressively (actively) accepting what is available] the Lord Jesus Christ as opposed to those who reject Him as those shown in vs 11.

Those who lay hold by actively accepting the Lord Jesus Christ are granted the privilege, honor, right to become sons of God.

even to them that believe on his name ... those who receive Him (lambanō – to lay hold by aggressively (actively) accepting) are the ones who believe on His name.

verse 13 explains that those who receive Him ... those who believe on His name are begotten of God ... not in some distant time in the past to which you continuously infer ... but at the time they received [Greek lambanō – to lay hold by aggressively (actively) accepting what is available] the Lord Jesus Christ and believed on his name (vs 12).

Again, under your erroneous dogma how many times must a person be born again before they are really, truly, really, really, really, scout's honor born again???
.

Again, Jn 1:12-13 Vs 13 gives the foundation of why some during the ministry of Christ did receive Him and believed on His name, opposed to the many many that did not receive Him in Israel, they did because they had been born of God. Jesus said later why some hear Him Jn 8:47
47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

Those who lay hold by actively accepting the Lord Jesus Christ are granted the privilege, honor, right to become sons of God.

Yes, but they were born again previously in order to believe on Him, to receive Him. Thats what Vs 13 tells us !

 

[brightfame52]

renewed

verse 13 explains that those who receive Him ... those who believe on His name are begotten of God

No, they had been begotten of God, born of God is in the aorist past and passive voice, that's an action from the past. Now anyone knows that an action/activity comes after birth. So the receiving, believing both actions, came after having been born of God !