healing according to Joseph prince, please do explain

[Grace777x70]

Thought some of you might enjoy this Commentary:

Online Bible Commentary - Andrew Wommack Ministries

Thank you! I have that on my software program as well as 5 others in my Wordsearch 10 program. They are all good and serve a purpose as we look at what they all say. At the end of the day it's what the Holy Spirit "illuminates" to us that matters.

I do love Andrew's wisdom and experience and of course he is a believer in being saved by grace through faith. That's always a blessing.

We can view scriptures through the "tree of the knowledge of good and evil" or view them through "the tree of Life which is Christ Himself" - we will have two very different outcomes depending on which "tree" we are eating from.

 

[followjesus]

It is only because I have read books people have written, espousing their beliefs, that I can say, "honestly," that I either agree with them, or I don't.

I don't agree, at all, with several of JP's beliefs, but I think I am only one of about a dozen people posting here who can say that because I actually "know" what he says he believes. Those who have less than just a handful of video clips to go by cannot possibly have any true idea of his teachings. And I know this because I tried the same thing, and came away from watching probably 40 full-length videos... still not knowing how he really believed.

the reason its hard to understand his beliefs is that he makes connections that aren't there willie. he may see well they were sick because they took communion unworthily, and now teach " if you want your healing, take communion"

if you know the word of God willie, its not hard to hear a fallacy and understand what it is. ive seen and heard and read plenty to understand thuis fellows thinking. really tho, what someone says needs to either be what the word says to be what should be taught to Christians, or accepted by Christians. Christians need desperately to understand Gods word and discernement just naturally comes from the spirit of Knowing Gods character. God will never say "lie" never say " cheat this person" He will never be okay with a Christian serving sin" hell never change. He is the same yesterday today and forever.

that's the faith we can take, Gods word needs no revision, no revolution, we need no new way to be saved, Jesus the actual savior laid all of it out. this jp doctrine claims pauls authority, okay, well why when paul repeats the same things about "living to please your sinful nateur = death, living to please the spirit= eternal life" why when paul says again more than once " we all must stand before the jsoc and give and account of the things done while in the flesh" why do these principles and truths suddenly make different sense than whats actually there? how when paul makes our behavior the difference between life and death, does jp, claim this unconditional you can never be wrong again doctrine? based on pauls authority?

like any deceitful doctrine, there are scriptures that seem to add up, if you arrange them right but pauls teachings are so similar in his epistles he lays out grace has come noe, you died, and your new now, but then He nearly always makes a huge point to give examples of the sinful nature, and makes a point to say clearly if you do not put these actions to death, you will die, oir hell say something like " those who live these ways have NO inheritance in Gods kingdom." there also are doctrines paul held to and repeats makes clear. the thing is, paul doesn't teach unconditional gog. you have to make several connections that do not exist, and even more you have to subtract every condition placed on a believers actions to say this is not a false doctrine, because the doctrine is no matter what now I'm saved, if I sin, I'm really noit sinning, I cant sin enough to displease God. fineshed work and all.

really how proud does a person need to be to go daily thinking they are perfect in Gods eyes already? that they need to do nothing in response to Jesus? paul nor any writer in the bible taught unconditional salvation apart from beliefs and also actions in response to Gods grace. thats what modern ideas say, but if you examine the word its not whats taught.

 

[Stephen63]

Well, it is TOO a REAL Bible commentary!! Charles Ryrie has a study Bible with commentary too and I use it often. I also have a Bible commentary by lots of old time preachers on my book shelves at home I have not looked at for years. Also a commentary by Joyce Meyers for the Amplified Bible..,And some others as well as some of Andrew Wommack's Bible commentary books but used the one on line from his web site so I could cut and paste. It was not a secret Stephen63. You didn't unlock a major secret or conspiracy here.

shhheeessshhh Stephen63 I read a lot of REAL Bible commentary and enjoy many different ideas but I don't agree with them all. For instance, Ryrie is not 100% my cup of tea but he has some very good commentary that I do agree with and find extremely helpful when discussing the rapture of the church., end times and also about dispensational truths. IF I had a Scofield Bible I'd use some of his commentary too since it was really helpful in years past when I first got saved. And since I do believe that the gifts of the Holy Spirit are still active for today (5 fold ministry) many of the commentary by some of the teachers I used to listen to are not 100% my cup of tea anymore but I still find them helpful and use them for a resource. I don't have to agree 100% with another believer in order to love them and not think ill of them., or be suspicious of them bringing damnable heresies. I know God was not my enemy when I was ignorant of the gifts of the Holy Spirit. He loved me just the same.

Wommack is what he is. If Benny Hinn wrote a commentary, I guess you would read his also? What ever happened to the older tried & true commentaries?

While we read many, we usually quote our favorites. I read yours.

 

[Stephen63]

Good grief! What fills the space between your ears?

Obviously it's not Andrew Wommack, Joyce Meyers, or Joseph Prince. Overrated & undertaught televangelists just don't do it for me. Maybe if they went to a real seminary instead of bragging about "honorary degrees" from someplace I might give them some attention.

With statements like yours I don't even want to know what's between your ears..... jus' sayin'.

 

[Willie-T]

Wommack is what he is. If Benny Hinn wrote a commentary, I guess you would read his also? What ever happened to the older tried & true commentaries?

While we read many, we usually quote our favorites. I read yours.

Has someone convinced you your favorite "oldies" were written by inspiration of the Holy Spirit, or something? They are only "opinions", just like those written by men today... with one major exception. Those old guys wrote with far less historical revelation and understanding than exists today. Not to mention, a whole lot less accumulated information.

You are, in effect, saying yesteryear's witch doctor's cures of burning smoke and shaking beads are better than today's medical procedures, simply because they are old.

 

[LaurenTM]

Stephen, it is my observation in and around these boards, that you are a cessationist and have argued vividly and with great conviction against speaking in tongues and other gifts, citing that we have the perfect already so the gifts have ceased

as that appears to be the case, I suspect no agreement will ever be reached, and no one wants to compromise truth of course, so, we have a situation where someone, you, does not believe all scripture is valid for today and we have others who believe all scripture concerning the Holy Spirit in the life of the believer, is absolutely valid for this age

therefore, I'm not sure what you are trying to say here, other than that you disagree because you have a very different mindset

so, you will remain unconvinced as your object here seems to be to either mock (which I think you are doing a good job at) or you just like to harangue...maybe both

in any case, you are addressing the BELIEVERS in this thread and mocking their choice in commentary. you are not discussing the topic; you are trying to belittle people. that is not what is referred to as a discussion

that, is actually a commentary on you, Stephen.

 

[Depleted]

It flabbergasts me how some people claim a certain group believes "whatever". Yet when an honest man like 777 quotes, verbatim, the beliefs of that group from their openly published website (for all the world to see), the haters come right back with, "No, they don't believe THAT, they believe what I said they believe."

Are these haters just inbred idiots?

If I told you I believe I should always wear dresses, would you trust I truly believe that?

There is what I "believe" and what I do that tells me what is really believed.

That, to me, is the difference between the list Grace777 copy-pasted and the reality.

(And so says the chick in the bibfront shortalls.)

 

[LaurenTM]

If I told you I believe I should always wear dresses, would you trust I truly believe that?

There is what I "believe" and what I do that tells me what is really believed.

That, to me, is the difference between the list Grace777 copy-pasted and the reality.

(And so says the chick in the bibfront shortalls.)

that might make sense to you

but not to someone who does not talk backwards to make sense forwards

that's about all I usually get out of your posts

sorry, but I thought you should know

I'm not defending anyone here; I just have noticed how you like to pop into a thread, drop a bomb like no one but you knows anything and then pop out

 

[Willie-T]

If I told you I believe I should always wear dresses, would you trust I truly believe that?

There is what I "believe" and what I do that tells me what is really believed.

That, to me, is the difference between the list Grace777 copy-pasted and the reality.

(And so says the chick in the bibfront shortalls.)

So, are you saying things you write here are not the truth, and we should not believe you since we read your posts that often may, or may not, reflect what you state you believe?

 

[followjesus]

Obviously it's not Andrew Wommack, Joyce Meyers, or Joseph Prince. Overrated & undertaught televangelists just don't do it for me. Maybe if they went to a real seminary instead of bragging about "honorary degrees" from someplace I might give them some attention.

With statements like yours I don't even want to know what's between your ears..... jus' sayin'.

all the commentary that's needed is found in matthew mark luke and John

john 12:49 "For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken."

ANY Christian should see this. and find any other person who has this authority. or someone who God spoke from heaven at baptism and said this is my son, LISTEN to HIM. and at His transfiguration, this is my son Listen to Him......Jesus is the one authorized By God, anyone speaking for Jesus, is only a steward of HIS authority including paul, and all the other original apostles. Jesus words are perfect and complete straight from God. we shouldn't need jp to explain how whats clearly there means what His ideas say it means, why not trust Jesus and His way of thinking and Hois knowledge, His authoprity. His will is shown in the 4 gospels, all of it is there. he showed grace, forgiveness, Love, He showed repentance, righteousness, obedience even to death, He showed the way of eternal life. all that came after was pointing only to Him, His gospel the good news that now we have access to an ETERNAL KINGDOM of life and liberty in the presence of God. the good news isn't now were all saved for no responsibility. were free from the mosaic law, we are bound now to the holy spirit of Jesus Christ. He is present now so our behavior should be as if were in Gods presence. if we know Jesus, then read other folks, we have discernment and the spirit of prophecy

for the " spirit of prophecy is the testimony of Jesus "

 

[Stephen63]

Has someone convinced you your favorite "oldies" were written by inspiration of the Holy Spirit, or something? They are only "opinions", just like those written by men today... with one major exception. Those old guys wrote with far less historical revelation and understanding than exists today. Not to mention, a whole lot less accumulated information.

You are, in effect, saying yesteryear's witch doctor's cures of burning smoke and shaking beads are better than today's medical procedures, simply because they are old.

Noooooo..... I'm saying, "tried & true" commentaries, that agree with one another & esp. the scriptures, is a good place to start researching.

You are, in effect, saying yesteryear's witch doctor's cures of burning smoke and shaking beads are better than today's medical procedures, simply because they are old

You know what this is? C-R-A-P. You are, in effect, full of it. You'll say anything to make somebody that disagrees with you look like an ignoramus. It's the tool of choice for the hypergracers, right next to quoting scriptures whose meanings don't match the context of a subject.

 

[LaurenTM]

You know what this is? C-R-A-P. You are, in effect, full of it. You'll say anything to make somebody that disagrees with you look like an ignoramus. It's the tool of choice for the hypergracers, right next to quoting scriptures whose meanings don't match the context of a subject.

reported

this has to stop

 

[Willie-T]

Noooooo..... I'm saying, "tried & true" commentaries, that agree with one another & esp. the scriptures, is a good place to start researching.



You know what this is? C-R-A-P. You are, in effect, full of it. You'll say anything to make somebody that disagrees with you look like an ignoramus. It's the tool of choice for the hypergracers, right next to quoting scriptures whose meanings don't match the context of a subject.

Yes, I may do that some with you because it is so obviously easy.

But, in this case, I am saying it is foolish to sit here and swear that things men wrote about when they had only very limited information, have to be the truth, and nothing but the truth, while men who write today have vastly more information through discoveries and compiled resources that was never available to the writers who lived a thousand years after any of these events occurred.... and died long before any of these new discoveries were made.

 

[Depleted]

Gods grace changes the believer, enables man to live upright godly Lives. it does not in any way negate our responsibility to live in obedience to God. how we live determines our eternal destination. Grace came by the suffering and death of Jesus. forgave all our sins and gave us for free a brand new spirit, clean and born of God. the purpose of this is to learn and grow in the nature of Jesus, by following and applying His teachings to life. grace doesn't take away the importance of how we live, it gives us grace to live right. to be a slave to righteousness as we once were slaves to sin. but paul even says clearly again andagain.

you are a servant of who you obey whether it is sin which leads to death, or righteousness wich leads to eternal life. grace doesn't take our responsibility away, it enables us to live up to it. grace is awesome. it is mistaught by the modern grace doctrine. not what paul taught jesus taught james taught john taught...they all taught obedience to the gospel because of the grace which was poured upon us and made us new and clean. simply this doctrine of grace grace, is false. grace is true, the false teaching of grace is not. grace doesn't mean you say jesus is lord and now you can never sin enough, never do enough wrong to end up in hell. that's ridiculous according to scripture.


jesus himself, paul, john, peter, james all make very clear how you live, what you say, what you think all of these things have a place in determining eternal life of the other destination. grace. doesn't change God or His standards or his holiness. it takes our sin away and teaches us to live right before God.


titus 2:11-12 "For the grace of God has appeared that offers salvation to all people. It teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age."

that's Grace. its not a free pass, its repentance, overcoming worldly passions and a teaching to live upright and godly lives. that's what Gods grace is this is pauls writing here. grace is not what is taught by this false doctrine. it is our forgiveness, our teaching, our strengthening, our new life, our freedom from sin and so much more. to stand in grace is to press on toward the goal of the nature of Christ, the nature taught in His teachings. grace doesn't change the word, it changes the man

I used the phrase "cancerous growth in the church" when describing Prince's teaching on this site. So, don't take me as a JP follower.

But honestly? For someone so offended by him, you really have no idea of what grace means either. Grace is "unmerited favor." Not "Unmerited favor to...blahblahblah." Just unmerited favor.

One of my brothers is self-employed as a financial planner, makes gobs of money, loves his job, loves his wife, loves his kids, loves his dogs, loves his life, has a wonderful life, and, sure enough, he isn't a Christian. God graced him!

Grapes grow because of God's grace. We have air that we can live on because God graced us. Earth? Grace! Life? Grace! That we can breath even in our sleep? Grace! Chocolate? Grace! Liver? Grace! (Well, for some, I suppose. lol) Surviving a fame? Grace!

Just because you think Grace is God doesn't really make you all that much different than JP followers. Grace does NOT change anyone! God does!

 

[Depleted]

Of cause clothing matter to God, Especially as Ministers, scruffy dressing could offend people, and the Bible says give no offence in anything.
The Mormons and JWs put some Christians to shame, as they always dress smart.
Those scruffy ministers have no respect for God, their ministry or the people they are ministering to.

It's very different if one is poor and can't afford to buy clothes.
When I first got saved, is was a long haired hippy who only had scruffy clothes, I just knew I had to have a hair cut, No one told me to, I just knew, and I felt bad for not being able to dress smart. And God knew this, So He led someone to buy clothes for me, What a transformation.
And that's what being a Christians does, It transform's people.
The love of God will transform those who love Him, they would want to go to Church well dressed.

If scruffy clothes offends someone, that person is in deep need to be offended! lol

I do dress "smart." Bibfronts. Pain around my waist, so I can't wear clothes that bind around the waist. My other choice is dresses. Me in a dress would be offensive, since I tend to forget what I'm wearing and my two favorite positions are crossed legged or hugging my left leg against my left shoulder. Wouldn't it be offensive to see my undies?

I've lost weight in the last few years, and guess what you can't buy anymore -- bibfronts. So, I'm wearing 10-17 year old baggy, frayed bibfronts, because I'm not really into showing my undies either. And I can't afford tailor made bibfronts.

And this offends you? It doesn't offend God. He likes my body better than I do, and knows me past the undies.

So, I offend you? Cool! I feel good in that. Someone should!

 

[Stephen63]

Stephen, it is my observation in and around these boards, that you are a cessationist and have argued vividly and with great conviction against speaking in tongues and other gifts, citing that we have the perfect already so the gifts have ceased

Bold-faced lie. All that your observations prove is that you're a terrible observer. I believe in the Gifts. I hate cessationism.
But I'm not surprised..... twisting statements & scriptures is what hypergracers do.

as that appears to be the case, I suspect no agreement will ever be reached, and no one wants to compromise truth of course, so, we have a situation where someone, you, does not believe all scripture is valid for today and we have others who believe all scripture concerning the Holy Spirit in the life of the believer, is absolutely valid for this age

therefore, I'm not sure what you are trying to say here, other than that you disagree because you have a very different mindset

I do have a different mindset..... a real one.

so, you will remain unconvinced as your object here seems to be to either mock (which I think you are doing a good job at) or you just like to harangue...maybe both

in any case, you are addressing the BELIEVERS in this thread and mocking their choice in commentary. you are not discussing the topic; you are trying to belittle people. that is not what is referred to as a discussion

No, your statements are the real mocker, with your hyper names. Seems to me that the one throwing out these accusations is the one belittling people.

that, is actually a commentary on you, Stephen.

And there you have it, folks, in her own words. She just wrote a commentary on me, with every statement 100% false. This is why I say read a tried & true commentary..... 'cause now we see how anybody can write a piece of trash.

 

[Depleted]

I think maybe we should just copy and paste from the other threads about JP or Grace. This would save us a lot of time and we could get on to better topics

BUT how would I ever learn scruffy is sin? Or was that already covered, but I ignore him too often?

 

[Depleted]

again, because for some reason you missed the post where I said I hardly have watched him, this is not about a defense of anyone; rather a defense of what Christ has already done

I defend God's unmerited favor

I don't defend anyone else; I'm sure God probably does though

this sarcastic response of yours does not serve any purpose IMO

scripture says that the earth is God's footstool...if you think the world is getting poorer and poorer, do you suppose it is getting worse as more and more turn from God and accept secular human reasoning and a diluted gospel that attacks others if they have more?

Disclaimer first: I am too lazy to be PC proper, so have decided to give us gals the same labels I give guys. So don't take the word "Dude" as if I did not notice you are a gal.

Yo, Dude. Why is your sarcasm right and Oldethennew's "serves no purpose?"

And, for the record JP is "secular humanism" package as-if Biblical. Pretty much the problem.

And, YES! We are to judge that! 1 Cor. 5 and 6 (Full chapters, not merely a verse or two.) So why do you defend the someone you know so little about who does teach falsely while judging a true believer? (Or two, since I'm never sure if that's Mr., Mrs., or both OldeandNew writing. lol)

 

[Depleted]

My..... that's straining at a knat & swallowing a camel if I've ever seen it! You cover JP's sins & ride this in the ground like a dead horse.

Pssst, that wasn't JP's teaching. That's on God4Me.

 

[Depleted]

John the Baptist was in a different culture in a different time, He couldn't go to a shop that sold suits, shirts or ties.
Wake up.

There's a whole section of The Law that goes into how folks can take on John's lifestyle. Big to-do, requiring purification, sacrifices, and preparation to go into that lifestyle for the Lord. So, if God has the rules for it, he's not opposed to it. He taught it. If you weren't so sure you alone have the gospel, (when all along you just invented your own), you should know this.

There is actually a name for people that do that, but I have the memory of a seive and can't remember it.

(If anyone else remembers it, please include the name for the ones who God has convicted to live like that. I'd appreciate it.)