I expect an answer from you so called learned Christians

[journey41]

OK Journey.., lets say you are right

How do I be a good little "Goyim"? Donate all my money to the Nation State of Israel?

Have many sons that they might fight and die for Israel to take over the world?

Kill a Palestinian?

And whats the plan? We takeover the surrounding nations., rebuild the temple and reinstate animal sacrifice right?

Good little Noahides who know their place will serve the Jews right?

[/QUOTE]
No, you dont donate all your money to Israel.
You dont worship Israel.
You dont hate Israel.
You just have to find out how God is using Israel for his purposes and for his name.


Dont forget God is angry with them, but that doesn't mean we have to be.


The scriptures have to be fulfilled first. Israel gets punished first, then the rest of the nations will get their serve.


We dont get mixed up in politics. Let it run it's course, because God is in charge and prophesies have to carry out exactly as foretold.

Everything good that will come out of Israel will only be after Christ's 2nd coming, not before. After God disciplines them.

 

[cronjecj]

Cronjecj,

Thought you knew did ya?

Yea other then the fact you believe everyone will be saved in the end including the wicked.

Peace.

 

[CrimsonFlames]

[
[/QUOTE]They didn't know Christ, they were under the law. Christ was not born yet, so how could they go through him. They were not instructed to then.

They didnt know Christ?

Jesus is God

Are you saying they didnt know God?

 

[journey41]

Well, I am not one of these learned Christians who could endlessly debate the differences between pre-dispensational post-milleniial juxtapositions and plan-B post-tribulationary amilenial paridigms, but I'm willing to make a guess that the pre-NT saints of old were saved through righteousness and faith. Yeshua called Abel "Righteous" when confronting the scribes, so I'm going to assume he went to Heaven, even though the only prophecy he would have known at the time that we are aware of was that someone from his mothers seed would bruise the serpent. That's pretty limited information about Christ.

Also, Abraham had faith in Gods promise, and it was accredited to him as righteousness. He didn't have much in the way of law, and his knowledge of Yeshua was fairly limited. So there you go.

As far as the prophets and suchlike, I'm guessing the same rules applied. BTW, call me nutty, but I always assumed that Jeremiah got a standing ovation from the saints when he entered heaven, because whew, did he have a rough life.

Thanks for your reply. Actually, Jesus was the first one who died and rose to heaven. No one went there before him. Not even those whose graves were opened when Christ was crucified. Because otherwise Jesus wouldn't be the firstborn of the dead.


Collossians 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

 

[2knowhim]

Cronjecj,

I believe the wicked will be destroyed in the people, and what is left is of God
I do not believe the people themselves will be destroyed.

After all isn't that what He did for us?
or were you not wicked before you were saved?

Forgive me brother for believing on the side of Hope, and Love, instead of hate and Death.

I'd rather be on this side of believing and be wrong than what you believe.

 

[cronjecj]

ey Journey would you like some ice cream?






Was that nice?





















So you ready to answer?









is Christ the Father also?

 

[cronjecj]

2knowhim,

nothing to forgive about just against the fact that God will allow unrepentant wicked people into His kingdom.

It's not biblical.

 

[CrimsonFlames]

So here is a question Journey

Israel is currently preparing to attack Iran

Am I expected to blindly support this instigation of war?

When an Israeli sniper randomly shoots a Palestinian kid for kicks and giggles am I supposed to call it the will of God?

And if Israel attack Iran and brings upon itself the retaliation of the surrounding nations am I supposed to condemn those countries for exercising the right to self defense?

I mean Im really confused so you gotta help me

Why is it some countries maintain the right to bomb anyone at will while we condemn the injured parties for defending themselves

It all seems like arrogance to me.., if I had a neighbor like Israel I'd certainly be arming up too and if that neighbor attacked me I would retaliate

Help me out will you., what am I missing here?

 

[2knowhim]

Cronjecj,

Never said He did, Never said He would.

You and me ought to have a loooooooonggg talk one day.
But I don't want to hyjack this thread more than we already have.

 

[journey41]

I realise this post is not about slavery but you made a plea to emotion when you brought up Israeli slaves apparently building the pyramids.., I dont see anywhere in scripture where it says they were made to build the pyramids so that claim is mighty presumptuous

However I also asked about your claim that God was silent before Moses.., apparently noone was saved before Moses laid down the law? Is that so is it?

I didn't say anything about Pyramids.

In regards to your last question....well it was my question, and so far not one person has answered this correctly or told me how they go through Christ. I want someone with knowledge to explain how this process will work.

My question was relating to all the prophets of the old testament. Will they get into the kingdom, because Christ said that no man can come to the Father but by me, and no matter how hard they twist, every one knows (well obviously not) that the Israelites did not have Jesus back then to go through, because they were under the law. Jesus was not even born yet. They were not under grace, but the law.

Gods word cant be broken. So if they never went through Christ, how do they go through him, because they are all dead before Christ was even born.

 

[CrimsonFlames]

I didn't say anything about Pyramids.

In regards to your last question....well it was my question, and so far not one person has answered this correctly or told me how they go through Christ. I want someone with knowledge to explain how this process will work.

My question was relating to all the prophets of the old testament. Will they get into the kingdom, because Christ said that no man can come to the Father but by me, and no matter how hard they twist, every one knows (well obviously not) that the Israelites did not have Jesus back then to go through, because they were under the law. Jesus was not even born yet. They were not under grace, but the law.

Gods word cant be broken. So if they never went through Christ, how do they go through him, because they are all dead before Christ was even born.

So you are basically denying that Christ is God?

 

[Nalu]

The word says that Christ was slain before the foundation of the world Revelation 13:8 (KJV)

All the saints in the OT was saved because they believed God, through Christ they were saved.

Moses, Isaiah and all the prophets knew about the messiah which was still to come.

Yes, I agree.

 

[2knowhim]

Journey,

The Salvation of our Lord Goes far beyond this Physical Realm

Don't limit God by your understanding, that a person can only be saved while in
the flesh.

Your answer is in these post, people has answered you, but you don't get it, for some reason.

Have you not read?

Mat 12:41 The men of Nineveh shall rise in judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: because they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here.
Mat 12:42 The queen of the south shall rise up in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for she came from the uttermost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and, behold, a greater than Solomon is here.

When He rose so did they
Mat 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
Mat 27:53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.


They heard, God is not limited by time and space
When Christ was Crucified, All Men were Drawn unto Him All

Don't you get it, He bridge the gap so to speak between the past the present and
the future

You were'nt even born yet , how do you know Him?
The same way they did and do

 

[journey41]

So you are basically denying that Christ is God?

Can I ask you a personal question

Are you on drugs?

 

[CrimsonFlames]

Can I ask you a personal question

Are you on drugs?

Was gunna ask you the same question actually!

 

[CrimsonFlames]

You asked the question., how did they come to God without Jesus

yet Jesus is God., but you asked how could they get to God without knowing Jesus.

Did they or did they not know God? If they knew God then they knew Jesus., simple

Or are you denying Jesus is God? You dont get out of the question by shooting below the belt

 

[Nalu]

you're as arrogant as you ever were journey.

i'm not interested in any answers you have. people are trying to help you, but you are DENYING Christ and what is written.

Matthew 2:15
where he stayed until the death of Herod. And so was fulfilled what the Lord had said through the prophet: "Out of Egypt I called my son."

Hosea 11:1
"When Israel was a child, I loved him, and out of Egypt I called my son.

Matthew 2:15
where he stayed until the death of Herod. And so was fulfilled what the Lord had said through the prophet: "Out of Egypt I called my son."

Matthew 2:15
where he stayed until the death of Herod. And so was fulfilled what the Lord had said through the prophet: "Out of Egypt I called my son."

Matthew 2:15
where he stayed until the death of Herod. And so was fulfilled what the Lord had said through the prophet: "Out of Egypt I called my son."

Matthew 2:15
where he stayed until the death of Herod. And so was fulfilled what the Lord had said through the prophet: "Out of Egypt I called my son."

Yes, I agree with Zone. Journey you are wise in your'e own opinion and display an unusually high level of arrogance. The answer has been explained to you sufficiently, many times.

You have your'e mind made up in this area, and ask this question in an effort to prove your'e feeble point.

 

[Raistlin]

The word says that Christ was slain before the foundation of the world Revelation 13:8 (KJV)

In other words God planned from before the beginning of the world; and creation for that matter, that His Son would be slain as the SACRIFICIAL LAMB.
Meaning it was PREORDAINED.
Declaring the end at the beginning.
Thats the meaning.

All the saints in the OT was saved because they believed God, through Christ they were saved.

All those of old were under ONE law.
The priesthood did not change until Christ.
No dual covenant then or now or future.
Man could only go through Christ the door AFTER His death, not before, the door wasn't opened yet.
The testament is not in effect until the testator is dead.
So these are not yet saved through Christ.
It was not available either in the physical nor spiritual world until after crucifiction.

Moses, Isaiah and all the prophets knew about the messiah which was still to come.

Knowing He was to come does not equal being subject to the new covenant and its grace.
Otherwise, Moses, Isaiah and all the prophets would have lived that way instead of being burdened with the old law.
Knowing a law is to come does not mean it is in effect UNTIL it actually comes into effect.

 

[CrimsonFlames]

Yes, I agree with Zone. Journey you are wise in your'e own opinion and display an unusually high level of arrogance. The answer has been explained to you sufficiently, many times.

You have your'e mind made up in this area, and ask this question in an effort to prove your'e feeble point.

It hurts Nalu.., when you must accept you've been fed a lie

Me? I was ready to blow things up lol when I realised I was being spoonfed Zionist propaganda

Theres a certain pride involved.., and a fear that these groups create about daring to question what they say

 

[Nalu]

They didnt know Christ?

Jesus is God

Are you saying they didnt know God?

Amen to that. Jesus is God.