Its Coming Really Soon!

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Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
11,159
2,373
113
#61
Would think some would stop spreading Darby and Scofield false teaching and realize we are all going to be here and be put to the test....
This has nothing to do with Darby, Scofield or MacDonald. Why don't you just stop repeating what others are saying?

Jesus said that believers would be persecuted and suffer trials and that because of our faith in him and which believers have been suffering from the on-set of the church until this very day. These come at the hands of mankind and the powers of darkness. However, what is quickly coming upon the earth is the unprecedented wrath of God, which will be poured out via the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments.

The coming wrath of God, the day of the Lord, is not the same as the persecution and trials that Jesus said believers would suffer, but will be directed at a Christ rejecting world who continue to live according to the sinful nature. Believers are not appointed so suffer God's coming wrath, either upon this earth or the wrath to come from condemning judgment in the lake of fire.

Neither Darby nor Scofield are responsible for the teaching that the church will be gathered prior to God's wrath, for this teaching can be found right in scripture.
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
8,083
190
63
#62
Would think some would stop spreading Darby and Scofield false teaching and realize we are all going to be here and be put to the test....
Are Darby and scofield credited with the rapture teaching then?
 
Dec 21, 2012
2,901
39
0
#63
Something I do not understand.
You folks teach that all the saved are "the church".
You teach that "the church" will be "raptured".
Now you say only part of "the church" will be "raptured" and some will be left behind.
Very confusing.
Correct me if I am wrong.
Being taken depends on what YOU do.
How do you know you have done enough?
This could be very unnerving.
This could cause a new believer to live in fear.
By the grace of God and His help, we as disciples, are to make disciples of new believers that have been saved by faith in Jesus Christ.

Since we had been saved by grace through faith in Jesus Christ as our Saviour, we shall live by teh grace of God and faith in Jesus Christ as our Good Shepherd.

The whole point is to live that reconciled relationship with God through Jesus Christ, but not every saved believer will do that.

Salvation is not a stake, but what we build on that foundation will be judged by God at the pre trib rapture event; 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 wherein those left behind will suffer physical death for defiling the temple of God by sowing to the works of the flesh rather than sowing to the fruits of the Spirit; Revelation 2:21-23

That is what makes a saved believer "damned" as a vessel unto dishonor in His House when they become castaways for not looking to the author & finisher of our faith ( our Good Shepherd ) to help us discern inqiuity to lay down every weight & sin in running that race by faith in Jesus Christ to finish; Philippians 1:6-11 & 1 John 3:3,8 & 2 Timothy 4:18 & Jude 1:24-25 They are still His, even though left behind, but they will be resurrected after the great tribulation to serve the King of kings.

Only vessels unto honor will attend the Marriage Supper of the Lamb which is why even former believers are called to depart from iniquity ( 2 Timothy 2:18-21 ) for He still abides in them as He is faithful when saints are not ( 2 Timothy 2:11-13 )

So it is not about living in fear but leaning on Him as our Good Shepherd to continually apply faith in Jesus Christ in living that reconciled relationship with God through Him since He is more than just our Saviour, but our Good Shepherd as well.

Consider it as excommunication at the pre trib rapture event...whereas those left behind may never have that first inheritance, but they, as the prodigal son, that gave up that inheritance for wild living, will find that he is still son.

But it would be better to go before that throne of grace now and ask Jesus if everything is okay between you & Him and if not , to plead Him to help you to see what iniquity you need to depart from with His help so you can be received by Him.

2 Corinthians 5:[SUP]7 [/SUP](For we walk by faith, not by sight:)[SUP] 8 [/SUP]We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.[SUP]9 [/SUP]Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. [SUP]10 [/SUP]For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. 11Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

1 Peter 4:[SUP]17 [/SUP]For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God? [SUP]18 [/SUP]And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear? [SUP]19 [/SUP]Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.

So you are not running to obtain salvation because you are saved, but you are running by faith in Jesus Christ as your Good Shepherd to help you lay aside every weight & sin to abide in Him as His disciples to be received by the Bridegroom when He comes t avoid the consequence of not only losing the rewards of crowns but avoiding the dire consequence of becoming a castaway as well..

Hebrews 12:1Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, [SUP]2 [/SUP]Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.


1 Corinthians 9:[SUP]24 [/SUP]Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. [SUP]25 [/SUP]And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible. [SUP]26 [/SUP]I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air: [SUP]27 [/SUP]But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

1 John 3:[SUP]3 [/SUP]And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.....[SUP]8 [/SUP]He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

2 Timothy 4:[SUP]18 [/SUP]And the Lord shall deliver me from every evil work, and will preserve me unto his heavenly kingdom: to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

So apply your hope in Jesus Christ as your Good Shepherd in helping you to walk in the light as He is and help you to be willing to leave the cares & treasures & loved ones of this life into His hands when the Bridegroom comes.
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
5,928
685
113
#64
Are Darby and scofield credited with the rapture teaching then?
In it's dispensationalist form yes. Although there were whispers of it pre-Darby, some say he "enlarged" on the idea
 
P

Persuaded

Guest
#66
By the grace of God and His help, we as disciples, are to make disciples of new believers that have been saved by faith in Jesus Christ.

Since we had been saved by grace through faith in Jesus Christ as our Saviour, we shall live by teh grace of God and faith in Jesus Christ as our Good Shepherd.

The whole point is to live that reconciled relationship with God through Jesus Christ, but not every saved believer will do that.

Salvation is not a stake, but what we build on that foundation will be judged by God at the pre trib rapture event; 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 wherein those left behind will suffer physical death for defiling the temple of God by sowing to the works of the flesh rather than sowing to the fruits of the Spirit; Revelation 2:21-23

That is what makes a saved believer "damned" as a vessel unto dishonor in His House when they become castaways for not looking to the author & finisher of our faith ( our Good Shepherd ) to help us discern inqiuity to lay down every weight & sin in running that race by faith in Jesus Christ to finish; Philippians 1:6-11 & 1 John 3:3,8 & 2 Timothy 4:18 & Jude 1:24-25 They are still His, even though left behind, but they will be resurrected after the great tribulation to serve the King of kings.

Only vessels unto honor will attend the Marriage Supper of the Lamb which is why even former believers are called to depart from iniquity ( 2 Timothy 2:18-21 ) for He still abides in them as He is faithful when saints are not ( 2 Timothy 2:11-13 )

So it is not about living in fear but leaning on Him as our Good Shepherd to continually apply faith in Jesus Christ in living that reconciled relationship with God through Him since He is more than just our Saviour, but our Good Shepherd as well.

Consider it as excommunication at the pre trib rapture event...whereas those left behind may never have that first inheritance, but they, as the prodigal son, that gave up that inheritance for wild living, will find that he is still son.

But it would be better to go before that throne of grace now and ask Jesus if everything is okay between you & Him and if not , to plead Him to help you to see what iniquity you need to depart from with His help so you can be received by Him.

2 Corinthians 5:[SUP]7 [/SUP](For we walk by faith, not by sight:)[SUP] 8 [/SUP]We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.[SUP]9 [/SUP]Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. [SUP]10 [/SUP]For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. 11Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

1 Peter 4:[SUP]17 [/SUP]For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God? [SUP]18 [/SUP]And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear? [SUP]19 [/SUP]Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.

So you are not running to obtain salvation because you are saved, but you are running by faith in Jesus Christ as your Good Shepherd to help you lay aside every weight & sin to abide in Him as His disciples to be received by the Bridegroom when He comes t avoid the consequence of not only losing the rewards of crowns but avoiding the dire consequence of becoming a castaway as well..

Hebrews 12:1Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, [SUP]2 [/SUP]Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.


1 Corinthians 9:[SUP]24 [/SUP]Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. [SUP]25 [/SUP]And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible. [SUP]26 [/SUP]I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air: [SUP]27 [/SUP]But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

1 John 3:[SUP]3 [/SUP]And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.....[SUP]8 [/SUP]He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

2 Timothy 4:[SUP]18 [/SUP]And the Lord shall deliver me from every evil work, and will preserve me unto his heavenly kingdom: to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

So apply your hope in Jesus Christ as your Good Shepherd in helping you to walk in the light as He is and help you to be willing to leave the cares & treasures & loved ones of this life into His hands when the Bridegroom comes.
ALL will be gathered at one time.
Those left behind will be lost and suffer the wrath of God.
 
Aug 16, 2016
2,184
62
0
#67
Well the lord would like for his people to continue to live for him & pray they are counted worthy. However if some people desire to stay, suffer through the great tribulation & "be put to the test" he may give you what you asked for
 
P

Persuaded

Guest
#68
Well the lord would like for his people to continue to live for him & pray they are counted worthy. However if some people desire to stay, suffer through the great tribulation & "be put to the test" he may give you what you asked for
You need to stop reading the Tim LaHaye books.
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
5,928
685
113
#69
Now is the a real "soon" or a biblical any time "soon" soon like in the book of Rev:

The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show to His bond-servants, the things which must soon take place; and He sent and communicated it by His angel to His bond-servant John,
 
May 12, 2017
2,641
65
0
#70
It comes from a deeper study of the scripture Willie.

The ten virgins are all believers. Five of them have oil and five don't. After Jesus presents the parable he then says, "Therefore keep watch, because you do not know the day or the hour." Therefore, the oil represents ready watchfulness. The five foolish virgins didn't have any oil and therefore represent those believers as not being ready and watchful.

"Avoid godless chatter, because those who indulge in it will become more and more ungodly. Their teaching will spread like gangrene. Among them are Hymenaeus and Philetus, who have departed from the truth. They say that the resurrection has already taken place, and they destroy the faith of some.

Hymeneus and Philetus in preaching that the resurrection had already taken place, were said to have wandered from the truth. Since the church is still in the process of being built and the Lord has yet to gather his church, then those who are currently teaching the same as Hymeneus and Philetus are guilty of the same, having wandered from the truth.

It's not that difficult to compare the two.
How do you ignore the true meaning of the oil in this parable....oil represents the Holy Spirit in the Bible.....5 had the Seal of the Spirit and 5 did not....

Its really not that difficult , except for rapture teachers....
 
May 12, 2017
2,641
65
0
#72
No Willie! It means that whatever you are doing 24 hours a day, you as a believer in the midst of the daily routine of life that you are always meditating on the Lord and his word, anticipating the Lord's return, looking for the blessed hope. And especially now, because we are seeing the stage being set for the revealing of the antichrist/beast with the revealing of this technology for the chip implant under the skin of the hand. It tells those who are looking for the blessed hope, that the gathering of the church is very near and which must take place prior to the revealing of the beast and his mark.
Jesus said GO and MAKE......Not GO and WAIT and WATCH....

I would rather be working in the field and in the harvest, than sitting on the rock overlooking the field and scanning the eastern sky.....
 
Aug 16, 2016
2,184
62
0
#73
You need to stop reading the Tim LaHaye books.
I don't even kno who that is. But since you seem to look more so forward to the tribulation than the lords coming maybe you'll experience it but hopefully not
 
May 12, 2017
2,641
65
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#74
Um no, if you are living for the lord and anticipate his coming there's nothing to worry about. However if you go back into the world and live as if he's coming no time soon he will come & catch you off guard. In which you'd only have yourself to blame
I will repeat for the hearing and reading impaired here...

He said GO & MAKE, not GO & WAIT
 
P

Persuaded

Guest
#75
I don't even kno who that is. But since you seem to look more so forward to the tribulation than the lords coming maybe you'll experience it but hopefully not
I am not looking forward to the tribulation, I am looking for the coming of my Lord.
But I believe what the Word says.
There will be signs of His coming.
One of the signs is the great tribulation.
Have you not read Matthew 24?
 
May 12, 2017
2,641
65
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#76
And crying "why Lord?"
This ain't suppose to happen.
The greatest lie Satan has on the church is when the beast comes to power and many deceived say...Nope! stop it folks, that is not him...Jesus has not come back yet....
 
May 12, 2017
2,641
65
0
#77
This has nothing to do with Darby, Scofield or MacDonald. Why don't you just stop repeating what others are saying?

Jesus said that believers would be persecuted and suffer trials and that because of our faith in him and which believers have been suffering from the on-set of the church until this very day. These come at the hands of mankind and the powers of darkness. However, what is quickly coming upon the earth is the unprecedented wrath of God, which will be poured out via the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments.

The coming wrath of God, the day of the Lord, is not the same as the persecution and trials that Jesus said believers would suffer, but will be directed at a Christ rejecting world who continue to live according to the sinful nature. Believers are not appointed so suffer God's coming wrath, either upon this earth or the wrath to come from condemning judgment in the lake of fire.

Neither Darby nor Scofield are responsible for the teaching that the church will be gathered prior to God's wrath, for this teaching can be found right in scripture.
When you are waiting in line for them to take your head...I hope you talk this brave then...that is when many will fall and take the mark....
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
11,159
2,373
113
#79
Jesus said GO and MAKE......Not GO and WAIT and WATCH....

I would rather be working in the field and in the harvest, than sitting on the rock overlooking the field and scanning the eastern sky.....
watching does not interfere with bringing people to Christ. You are looking at as though you can only do one or the other.

Whatever you are doing in your daily life, your anticipation of the Lord's coming to gather the church, the blessed hope, should remain with you regardless of what you are doing. Therefore, when you are at work, or on vacation, testifying about Christ, sharing the word of God, etc., you are always conscious and looking forward to the Lord's appearing to gather the church. It is a state of ones spirit in looking forward to the Lord's promise.

When we say "watch" we are not talking about just sitting and waiting, but watch in the midst of whatever you are doing in life. Why are you being facetious when you know that is not what we mean by watching and being ready?
 
Last edited:
Aug 16, 2016
2,184
62
0
#80
I am not looking forward to the tribulation, I am looking for the coming of my Lord. But I believe what the Word says. There will be signs of His coming. One of the signs is the great tribulation. Have you not read Matthew 24?
You can believe in whatever you desire, no ones forcing you to believe in the rapture. As the scriptures says pray you are counted worthy to escape what will come to pass. If you desire to believe you will suffer through the tribulation you can do that. The important thing is to be prepared