What do you need for salvation again?

[trofimus]

It was a tough one for me. I had it drilled in my head that we needed to confess out loud. Now I know better.

And don't get me wrong. Confessing out loud is synonymous to agreeing to the Lordship of Christ.
ANd this is how we grow in Grace and knowledge. All we do is believe to be saved.

I am surprised how many people on this forums have problem with such a simple and comfortable verse about our salvation Paul is not talking about any slavelike repeating of some declaration just for being saved.

He speaks about a natural confessing of our inner faith to the outside world, people around us, in church etc...

 

[Depleted]

I thought this was a thread about a second or third salvation. How disappointing.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Wow! This is a new concept for me. There is a second or third salvation? What happened? The first one didn't take? Would you please elaborate? I honestly never heard of second and thirds.

 

[Depleted]

It was a tough one for me. I had it drilled in my head that we needed to confess out loud. Now I know better.

And don't get me wrong. Confessing out loud is synonymous to agreeing to the Lordship of Christ.
ANd this is how we grow in Grace and knowledge. All we do is believe to be saved.

Yup. More of a sanctification thing than salvation. We do work something out, but I'm still gathering a list for salvation.

 

[Depleted]

It's funny how people get roused up when obedience is mentioned, but are never moved a bit when "being faithful" is mentioned. They both mean the same thing. If "being faithful" was simply believing, then it would be written "believe". The just shall live by faith, & proving that faith is thru being faithful. "The devils believe, & tremble, but that kind of believing only with the mind saves nobody. It takes more than being persuaded that Jesus is Lord..... We are to be servants of the Lord if He's truly Lord. It's more than talk; it's a walk.

2 Corinthians 5:7-9 (KJV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP](For we walk by faith, not by sight [SUP]8 [/SUP]We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. [SUP]9 [/SUP]Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.

2 Corinthians 5:9 (NASB)
[SUP]9 [/SUP]Therefore we also have as our ambition, whether at home or absent, to be pleasing to Him.

Funner, that you think this is a good time to teach to "people," when you haven't answered the question. I'm not saying obedience has nothing to do with our relationship with God. I'm specifically asking about what is "needed" for salvation!

Suggestion. Assume "people" know what she's asking! This people does!

 

[Gr8grace]

Paul is not talking about any slavelike repeating of some declaration just for being saved.

Exactly what the Jews were doing. And Paul was trying to get them to understand that the God they were slave like repeating was the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[Depleted]

Hey! She answered the question to the best of her understanding. I do not agree with her, but I do admire her for really trying to explain what she thinks. Especially, since a few people are trying to tell me what I think. I know what I think. I'm asking what everyone thinks.

 

[trofimus]

Exactly what the Jews were doing. And Paul was trying to get them to understand that the God they were slave like repeating was the Lord Jesus Christ.

Its a letter to Romans...

 

[ladylynn]

4 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up, 15 that whoever believes in Him should not perish but[b] have eternal life.

Let's see the analogy Jesus was making:

The Bronze Serpent

4 Then they journeyed from Mount Hor by the Way of the Red Sea, to go around the land of Edom; and the soul of the people became very discouraged on the way. 5 And the people spoke against God and against Moses: “Why have you brought us up out of Egypt to die in the wilderness? For there is no food and no water, and our soul loathes this worthless bread.” 6 So the Lord sent fiery serpents among the people, and they bit the people; and many of the people of Israel died.
7 Therefore the people came to Moses, and said, “We have sinned, for we have spoken against the Lord and against you; pray to theLord that He take away the serpents from us.” So Moses prayed for the people.
8 Then the Lord said to Moses, “Make a fiery serpent, and set it on a pole; and it shall be that everyone who is bitten, when he looks at it, shall live.” 9 So Moses made a bronze serpent, and put it on a pole; and so it was, if a serpent had bitten anyone, when he looked at the bronze serpent, he lived.

The people admitted their sin, asked for a remedy, believed That ALL they had to do was look at the Bronze serpent. If they believed AND looked they LIVED.

Is it possible some said "that's silly, I'm not going to believe ALL I have to do is look at that thing"? Then Died! Scripture doesn't record if any rejected this cure. Probably because their death was imminent. If only we could all see that our death is imminent (immediate), and believe in Jesus!

Yes, the ONLY thing that could save them was looking-beholding-seeing the bronze serpent. It represented Christ and they needed to see. We are told to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved. We will learn more about the Bible,obedience and our walk as believers after we believe and are saved., not before or "to" be saved.

People make salvation complicated because we always want to DO something and find it hard to even comprehend that Jesus has done it all and we can do absolutely nothing to get salvation or be good enough or moral enough to even be able to follow a list. That's why the law (which is also a list) could not save, humans fail when they try to follow the "steps" on a list to be right with God. Only Jesus obeyed perfectly and did every step necessary We are told to believe. And actually we take that same instruction into our maturity as believers.

 

[Grace777x70]

Its a letter to Romans...

I agree..there were mostly romans/gentiles in their midst. There were some Jews there too because Paul talked about " speaking to those that know the law" in Romans 7:1.

As Gr8grace said...there is definitely more to this "confessing" business then meets the causal eye as what if a mute believed but can't speak out loud..does he go to hell because he can't speak even though he believes in his heart and is justified in Christ?

 

[ladylynn]

Hey! She answered the question to the best of her understanding. I do not agree with her, but I do admire her for really trying to explain what she thinks. Especially, since a few people are trying to tell me what I think. I know what I think. I'm asking what everyone thinks.

Not to worry Lynn!!., I was also going to put that picture up in response to what you think in your response to PurerInHeart and what she thinks. But I got to posting to Penn in regards to what he thinks and just now saw what you think of my use of the picture. I got that picture on my computer and use it often when I think of it.

 

[trofimus]

I agree..there were mostly romans/gentiles in their midst. There were some Jews there too because Paul talked about " speaking to those that know the law" in Romans 7:1.

As Gr8grace said...there is definitely more to this "confessing" business then meets the causal eye as what if a mute believed but can't speak out loud..does he go to hell because he can't speak even though he believes in his heart and is justified in Christ?

Paul is not talking about the only way to get saved in Christ. So your question has a simple answer - a mute does not have to speak.
As well as the criminal on the cross did not need to get baptized. At cetera et cetera. God is not stupid.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

(If you're forgetting, please check the title of my thread. It really is about salvation. "What do you/I need for salvation again?")

God is really quite clear in these verses:

Romans 10:

9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.


As stated before, in vs 9, to "confess" is to agree with what you have been told concerning the Lord Jesus Christ.

In vs 10, the word "confession" is the Greek word homologeitai and is from the same root word as "confess" in vs. 9.

So agreeing with what you hear from Scripture concerning Jesus Christ being Lord results in salvation.

And again, it is God Who increases His Word within.


Here's another way of looking at it from the view of those who do not come to faith:

Romans 1:

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

In vs 18, the words "who hold" are the Greek word katechontōn which means to suppress, restrain.

So when that person hears the truth of Scripture, he/she restrains it so that it does not reach the heart where God can bring the increase.

When someone spoke to you about the Lord Jesus Christ, did you "confess" (agree with) unto salvation what he/she told you ?

Or did you "restrain" the truth in unrighteousness so that God could not bring increase to your heart?

 

[MsSuzanna]

Do you think that there will ever come a day when repentance is not necessary to receive the gifts and calling of God?

Your question takes what I said out of context. I will not entertain it. Ty

 

[Zmouth]

Do you think that there will ever come a day when repentance is not necessary to receive the gifts and calling of God?

Actually, my question is about salvation, which is a gift, but not "gifts,"

LOL, surely you jest, right?

 

[RobbyEarl]

Your question takes what I said out of context. I will not entertain it. Ty

Hmmm Nebuchadnezzar was called of God and so was Pharaoh, The king of Assyria was called and none of them even acknowledged God except Nebuchadnezzar after he ate grass for 7 years.

 

[Zmouth]

Your question takes what I said out of context. I will not entertain it. Ty

Really? If there is always going to be new forms of repentance, and it is a process and we are brought to new forms of repentance then I how did I take it out of context?

Since we are being continually changed and continually brought to the knowledge of truth with continually renewed minds,there is always going to be new forms of repentance and change. As we grw and go deeper in the faith we are brought to new sight all the time. It is a process and we are brought to new forms of repentance: turning from.

"...and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you ..." 1 Peter 3:15

So thank you for your response.

 

[Zmouth]

Hmmm Nebuchadnezzar was called of God and so was Pharaoh, The king of Assyria was called and none of them even acknowledged God except Nebuchadnezzar after he ate grass for 7 years.

And Pharaoh said unto his servants, Can we find such a one as this is, a man in whom the Spirit of God is? Genesis 41:38


I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance. Luke 5:32


Jesus came to call the sinners to repentance, not the righteous. Genesis 13:13

 

[PurerInHeart]

Oh goodie! We must obey. Well, that one kills off salvation all together. Do you know anyone who obeyed right?

And, oh joy! Even after obeying, there is still more -- baptism, partaking just right, assembly, and... who feeds? Us? God? Someone else all together? Growing? Ooo, baby! I'm a goner. I couldn't even stay my original height, but now I need to grow spiritually? Yup. All is lost. And remaining faithful? Wow! Why did God keep talking about the adultery of his people if it is as easy as "remain faithful?"

Congrats! I think you have the biggest list I've ever seen. What's God doing? Sitting back and laughing at us, knowing no one has a chance of ever saving themselves?

All sin and fall short of the glory of God, however there IS the righteous (obedient) and the unrighteous (disobedient). Our obedience does not earn the gift of grace, but God only gives the gift of grace to those who obey Him. Our obedience does not earn it- that's why it's still a gift. But God does not give it to those who disobey Him. IF we confess our sins and have fellowship with Him, He will forgive us. "IF" is a condition that must be met. "With flames of fire God will take vengeance on those who know not God, and OBEY NOT the gospel of His Son."

I'm not saying we have to do everything perfectly all the time, I'm saying we have to put forth effort into trying, and ask for forgiveness when we fail. There are many scriptures with the words "must", "if", these are conditional statements, conditions must be met.

By feeding I meant feeding off the word of God (studying).

And what do you mean by saying you'd be a goner? Do you mean that if that was the case (and it is) that you would no long try to live as a Christian?

By remaining faithful until death I mean remain obedient to God until you die, remain in the category of the righteous who also fall short, but are forgiven because they uphold their part of the covenant (agreement) and God upholds His.

It is not enough for a baby to be born. They MUST continue blood circulation, they must feed, they must grow. If they do not they will die. In the same way, when you are born again, you must stay in the body of Christ (church- Christ's body) in order to keep the blood flowing (Lords Supper) because the bible says the life is in the blood. And Jesus says, "l tell you the truth, unless you eat of the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you." (Lords Supper).

Those who think that once they are saved they can just kick their feet up and wait for heaven, are in for a rude awakening. We MUST take up our cross DAILY and follow Him.
Not everyone who says to Him Lord Lord, but only those who do (not did, but ongoing) the will of His Father.

 

[PurerInHeart]

There are some good elements that are descriptive of a believer but some in there are just plain "baloney"..like these below

"Our obedience does not earn our salvation, but God will only save us if we obey"..this makes no sense - in truth we obey Christ by believing in what He did on the cross. This is called "obedience to the faith"

"We need to be born again (baptism)," - by this you mean "water baptism " this is wrong too..we are baptized into Christ when we believe - water baptism is a representation of what happened to us when we believed

"partake of the Lord's Supper on the first day of the week in the assembly of the saints," - just pure religious nonsense - we get to partake of the Lord's supper in remembrance of what He did.

"and remain faithful till the end" - what does that mean?..miss to partake of the Lord's supper the last week before you die - you go to hell?

"repent of sin" - we don't repent of sin to get saved. NO one ever got saved because they repented of sin. Christians stopping sinning is a by-product of being saved already.

Sorry to burst your bubble but this stuff is not the gospel of the grace of Christ.

We only obey Christ by believing? Even demons believe, they will not be saved. Paul's belief, prayer, fasting, etc did not save him. It wasn't until as Ananias said, "What are you waiting for, arise, be baptized and wash your sins away, calling on the name of the Lord." There is only one thing that saves- and that is Christ's blood- which we come in contact with through baptism. Romans 6:3- "Or don't you know that all of us who baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death." In His death is where He shed His blood.

Belief baptizes us into Christ? The only way we get IN Christ is we are baptized INTO Christ as Romans 6:3 says. Yes water baptism. 1 Peter 3:21 says this baptism saves us. If baptism does not save us, then God is made out to be a liar, cause He says it does.

Partaking of of the Lords Supper is religious nonsense? It is our covenant in His blood. He says, "I tell you the truth, unless you eat of the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you."

Remain faithful. No, if you miss taking the Lords Supper one Sunday you will not die, but if you did indefinitely you would. It's like when you cut of circulation to your foot and it falls asleep, and when it returns it hurts, but the tissue is not dead, because the absence of blood flow was temporary. But if you tied a rubber-band tightly around your finger and cut off blood flow so long that it turns gangrene and falls off, the tissue has died and can never be part of the body again. In the same way, spiritually speaking, life is in Christ's blood and we must stay in contact with it, faithfully until you die.

Repenting is an ongoing thing. We must put forth effort to turn away from our sins, otherwise we'd be living in sin like the world does, and to love the ways of the world is to hate God.

Why is it so hard for you to grasp the concept that our obedience does not earn grace, but God only gives grace to those who actively try to obey Him? God will not save one just because he believes. They would not call Jesus Lord Lord if they didn't believe, nor would they do things in His name. But he will say to them, depart from Me you who practice lawlessness (they did not OBEY His laws!) Don't you see that you must obey? Nothing we could possibly obey could earn us salvation, but it is only given to those who obey His commands. No, one has ever done so perfectly- and that's where grace comes in, but we only get that gift if we are trying. Effort is the evidence of love. "If you love Me you WILL obey what I command."

 

[Grace777x70]

We only obey Christ by believing? Even demons believe, they will not be saved. Paul's belief, prayer, fasting, etc did not save him. It wasn't until as Ananias said, "What are you waiting for, arise, be baptized and wash your sins away, calling on the name of the Lord." There is only one thing that saves- and that is Christ's blood- which we come in contact with through baptism. Romans 6:3- "Or don't you know that all of us who baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death." In His death is where He shed His blood.

Belief baptizes us into Christ? The only way we get IN Christ is we are baptized INTO Christ as Romans 6:3 says. Yes water baptism. 1 Peter 3:21 says this baptism saves us. If baptism does not save us, then God is made out to be a liar, cause He says it does.

Partaking of of the Lords Supper is religious nonsense? It is our covenant in His blood. He says, "I tell you the truth, unless you eat of the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you."

Remain faithful. No, if you miss taking the Lords Supper one Sunday you will not die, but if you did indefinitely you would. It's like when you cut of circulation to your foot and it falls asleep, and when it returns it hurts, but the tissue is not dead, because the absence of blood flow was temporary. But if you tied a rubber-band tightly around your finger and cut off blood flow so long that it turns gangrene and falls off, the tissue has died and can never be part of the body again. In the same way, spiritually speaking, life is in Christ's blood and we must stay in contact with it, faithfully until you die.

Repenting is an ongoing thing. We must put forth effort to turn away from our sins, otherwise we'd be living in sin like the world does, and to love the ways of the world is to hate God.

Why is it so hard for you to grasp the concept that our obedience does not earn grace, but God only gives grace to those who actively try to obey Him? God will not save one just because he believes. They would not call Jesus Lord Lord if they didn't believe, nor would they do things in His name. But he will say to them, depart from Me you who practice lawlessness (they did not OBEY His laws!) Don't you see that you must obey? Nothing we could possibly obey could earn us salvation, but it is only given to those who obey His commands. No, one has ever done so perfectly- and that's where grace comes in, but we only get that gift if we are trying. Effort is the evidence of love. "If you love Me you WILL obey what I command."

I'm sorry to inform you but most of this stuff is not the gospel..I know it is what some religious places teach. Water baptism no more saves a person then Daffy Duck and Donald Duck are the 2 witnesses in the book of Revelation.

We are baptized into the body of Christ by the Holy Spirit when we believe in Christ. Acts 10:43-47 is the example of this. Ephesians 1:13 shows it as well.

I said that communion is something that we get to do to remember what Christ has done for us.......what is religious nonsense is this false teaching that "partake of the Lord's Supper on the first day of the week in the assembly of the saints" - if we don't do this , then we are cast away from the Lord. This is what is complete religious nonsense - not the taking of communion.

I believe you mean well but these teachings are a mixed up works-based religion taught by man using scripture out of context.

Everything in the kingdom of God comes by believing in the finished work of Christ for us.

As far as the Lord, Lord scripture goes..

Notice that in Matt 7:19-23..Jesus said "I never knew you "...these people were not believers.....

Jesus did not say " I knew you once " but that He "never knew " them at all. These are unbelievers.

Everyone when they see Jesus will call Him Lord.....because He is Lord to believers and unbelievers alike.

John 10:14 (KJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.


Jesus did the "will of God"...and delivered us from this present evil world

Galatians 1:4 (KJV)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father:

It is God in us that gives us the will and the ability to do His will.

Philippians 2:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] for it is God who is at work in you, both to will and to work for His good pleasure.

The Will of the Father is to believe on Jesus.

1 John 3:23-24 (NASB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.

The good works we do are from "being in Christ"..being lead by the Holy Spirit. Notice God has prepared them for us. We walk them out as we life our lives dependent on Him.

Ephesians 2:8-10 (NASB)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;

[SUP]9 [/SUP] not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.

[SUP]10 [/SUP] For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.