To comfort those who speak in tongues
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G
Yep. Many have used Gods word to put tongues in the proper context, who they were for,when they will cease.
There have been a few that pit scripture against scripture and don't make a cohesive argument.
But most want us to believe personal experience, and stand on their experiences. One recent post is extreme science fiction and laughable. One was probably true. And that one could be any Christian who prayed for a miraculous intervention. It wasn't the gift of tongues that answered her prayer.
Its a very hard subject to discuss....................because it is emotions that rule this movement. not objectivity from the Word.
There have been a few that pit scripture against scripture and don't make a cohesive argument.
But most want us to believe personal experience, and stand on their experiences. One recent post is extreme science fiction and laughable. One was probably true. And that one could be any Christian who prayed for a miraculous intervention. It wasn't the gift of tongues that answered her prayer.
Its a very hard subject to discuss....................because it is emotions that rule this movement. not objectivity from the Word.
Now you think I am attacking you! Well I am not. You asked a question that was answered in the OP by the Bible quote. So what am I to think? Didn't you read the Bible quote and take what God said to heart?
PW, I am attacked for speaking from experience which accords with the word of God. You are defending people for having an opinion that is popular doctrine but CANNOT agree with what God says in His word. The only way you will resolve this is by reading the word for yourself and listening to what God tells you REGARDLESS of what I say or anyone else on here.
That advice is for your good, not mine, or anyone else's. Are you born again? you need to be. If you are not, message me privately and I can tell you what you need to do. If you ARE born again then all you need to do is to read the Word and ask God to show you what His counsel is.
It is not all about me, or Ember, or Ricky....or VW or Phil....it is about JESUS and about YOUR walk with Him.
I fear you are in a dangerous place here with all the conflicting opinions. There is SO MUCH you need to know and to receive and to walk into....the Word and Your relationship with Jesus is the MAJOR priority and very start of everything.....don't be bombed off track by unspiritual men with private doctrines that QUENCH the Holy Ghost.
BTW there are many commentaries that teach popular but unbiblical doctrine. The Holy Spirit will put you right...HIM and no one else.
In love PW,
Convallaria
PW, I am attacked for speaking from experience which accords with the word of God. You are defending people for having an opinion that is popular doctrine but CANNOT agree with what God says in His word. The only way you will resolve this is by reading the word for yourself and listening to what God tells you REGARDLESS of what I say or anyone else on here.
That advice is for your good, not mine, or anyone else's. Are you born again? you need to be. If you are not, message me privately and I can tell you what you need to do. If you ARE born again then all you need to do is to read the Word and ask God to show you what His counsel is.
It is not all about me, or Ember, or Ricky....or VW or Phil....it is about JESUS and about YOUR walk with Him.
I fear you are in a dangerous place here with all the conflicting opinions. There is SO MUCH you need to know and to receive and to walk into....the Word and Your relationship with Jesus is the MAJOR priority and very start of everything.....don't be bombed off track by unspiritual men with private doctrines that QUENCH the Holy Ghost.
BTW there are many commentaries that teach popular but unbiblical doctrine. The Holy Spirit will put you right...HIM and no one else.
In love PW,
Convallaria
Roger, I do what the Bible says to do and I see the miraculous results that God says to expect to see. The proof is in the pudding, buddy. I've given you 2 clear examples of how it works to bring glory to God, others have shared their experiences as well. The only slander that is going on here is every time you close your eyes to the truth and deny the power of the Holy Spirit.
Look at it this way Roger. In the examples I have given, 2 people God brought to me to intercede for received the blessings they needed and grew closer to Him. If God had entrusted these two to you, one would have continued in his anger towards God, and the other would have slit her wrists.
You don't have to answer to me Rog. But I sure want to be there when you answer to God!
You don't have to answer to me Rog. But I sure want to be there when you answer to God!
K
What makes the what I have said about that chapter be the only one to look at it is because the whole context of the chapter is about love not the scriptures. To take one verse and make it stand alone to speak on something besides what the rest of the chapter is speaking on is improper exegesis, and by reading that chapter I as well as many others can not even see how the bible could even be mentioned as that which is perfect comes.
In the first couple centuries of the early church they had the scriptures, they just were not put together in the bible canon that we have today.
In the first couple centuries of the early church they had the scriptures, they just were not put together in the bible canon that we have today.
You are not telling the truth. You can make up all the stories you want but that does not make them genuine.
You are attempting to distract from the issue. A red herring by casting up accusations about miracles when the subject under discussion is tongues. You are avoiding the issue because you cannot back up your position with scripture.
You could claim to grow another eye in the center of your head and it would not be any more convincing than the other tales you relate. You simply demonstrate like the other thief on the cross your natural desire to manipulate God.
Scripture teaches that faith comes from God through the hearing of His word. The Holy Spirit creates faith in the believing heart through the word of God. Signs and wonders are for the Jews.
All the gifts of the Holy Spirit only three ended. The rest continue at Gods pleasure. But signs are for Jews and they will only return when God runs apostate Israel through the tribulation.
You have misplaced your faith. Claiming of yourself what only God can create. Back to Romans 1. Accept God as He is or receive the consequences.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
You are attempting to distract from the issue. A red herring by casting up accusations about miracles when the subject under discussion is tongues. You are avoiding the issue because you cannot back up your position with scripture.
You could claim to grow another eye in the center of your head and it would not be any more convincing than the other tales you relate. You simply demonstrate like the other thief on the cross your natural desire to manipulate God.
Scripture teaches that faith comes from God through the hearing of His word. The Holy Spirit creates faith in the believing heart through the word of God. Signs and wonders are for the Jews.
All the gifts of the Holy Spirit only three ended. The rest continue at Gods pleasure. But signs are for Jews and they will only return when God runs apostate Israel through the tribulation.
You have misplaced your faith. Claiming of yourself what only God can create. Back to Romans 1. Accept God as He is or receive the consequences.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
P
No, I don't think you're attacking me -- not sure why you said that, nor am I certain as to what question you are referring to in this post. Can you clarify?
I think I see how you are feeling attacked, but you're actually not being attacked.
As for reading the Bible without using any additional sources (to assist in understanding) consider this:
The Bible I own is in English. The original texts were in Hebrew and Greek (and Aramaic?). Right-off-the-bat, we're relying on outside tools in order to understand.
Also, consider this: I am really hungry and have not eaten for days. There's food in the refrigerator but I'm stuck in the bedroom, praying for food. God gave us a brain with the ability to think, reason, and understand logic. He also gave us emotions. Why would anyone ignore what they can prove to be true, and cling to an emotion?
I understand that some Christians draw a line between "born again" and "whatever is Christian but not born again", but I see them as one and the same; to ask me if I am "born again" is the same as asking me if I am a Christian or "know Christ" or "follow Christ" (John 3:3).
There may be some false commentaries out there, but that doesn't mean we should ignore ALL commentaries.
Do you know, or have you ever considered the origin(s) of the Bible (besides that it is "inspired by God")?
I think I see how you are feeling attacked, but you're actually not being attacked.
As for reading the Bible without using any additional sources (to assist in understanding) consider this:
The Bible I own is in English. The original texts were in Hebrew and Greek (and Aramaic?). Right-off-the-bat, we're relying on outside tools in order to understand.
Also, consider this: I am really hungry and have not eaten for days. There's food in the refrigerator but I'm stuck in the bedroom, praying for food. God gave us a brain with the ability to think, reason, and understand logic. He also gave us emotions. Why would anyone ignore what they can prove to be true, and cling to an emotion?
I understand that some Christians draw a line between "born again" and "whatever is Christian but not born again", but I see them as one and the same; to ask me if I am "born again" is the same as asking me if I am a Christian or "know Christ" or "follow Christ" (John 3:3).
There may be some false commentaries out there, but that doesn't mean we should ignore ALL commentaries.
Do you know, or have you ever considered the origin(s) of the Bible (besides that it is "inspired by God")?
K
Yes I have done that as well, studied history, traditions, and original usage of the language to understand what they were saying.
In that study I have found out how from the 4th century on is when bad defiling of the word took place to where they even added usages and definitions to the original Greek and Hebrew that was not original in the definition of those words.
One such is that of diakonos (deacon), the original definition and usage of this word tell the 3rd century was a ordained minister.
Servant was added in the 3rd century and the other offices of the church were added from the 4th century on, for diakonos never was meant for anything other than a minister role in the church.
There is a very bad study habit being taught now days of taking one scripture, or even one word out of the bible and making them stand alone to build understanding off of. For instance you can not take Matthew 10:22 without Hebrews 10:36 !!!
Yet I see some who take that scripture and make it stand alone or have it say the context of saved there is only referring to troubles/persecutions in life. However Hebrews, history, and other scriptures show that understanding to be wrong. Besides John all the other original Apostles ended up being killed. Jesus Himself said because they persecuted Him they will also persecute us...........John 15:20
Sorry got off topic but just had to give examples of how like you said as well, that history, study into how they spoke, and other scriptures must be taken into account to get proper understanding. And this is all done by going to God first to pray and ask for the truth in which He will give to us by the Holy Spirit.
In that study I have found out how from the 4th century on is when bad defiling of the word took place to where they even added usages and definitions to the original Greek and Hebrew that was not original in the definition of those words.
One such is that of diakonos (deacon), the original definition and usage of this word tell the 3rd century was a ordained minister.
Servant was added in the 3rd century and the other offices of the church were added from the 4th century on, for diakonos never was meant for anything other than a minister role in the church.
There is a very bad study habit being taught now days of taking one scripture, or even one word out of the bible and making them stand alone to build understanding off of. For instance you can not take Matthew 10:22 without Hebrews 10:36 !!!
Yet I see some who take that scripture and make it stand alone or have it say the context of saved there is only referring to troubles/persecutions in life. However Hebrews, history, and other scriptures show that understanding to be wrong. Besides John all the other original Apostles ended up being killed. Jesus Himself said because they persecuted Him they will also persecute us...........John 15:20
Sorry got off topic but just had to give examples of how like you said as well, that history, study into how they spoke, and other scriptures must be taken into account to get proper understanding. And this is all done by going to God first to pray and ask for the truth in which He will give to us by the Holy Spirit.
Gr8Grace, if you were not in some danger spiritually I would not need to correct you on this issue. As I have stated repeatedly, you don't need to speak in tongues to be saved. BUT you DO need to receive the Spirit of Christ in order to be saved: He is the Holy Spirit....without Whom Jesus will say to you "I don't know you", as the wise and foolish virgins scripture illustrates. Also if any man has not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His (Romans 8:9)
James 2:19 says, Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
So believing in itself is not enough, you need to then receive the Spirit of the Lord Jesus Christ: the Holy Spirit. This happens when you are born again.
When you come face to face with Jesus, will you meet Him with enough confidence in the Holy Spirit to know you are going to be received by Him? Is the oil in your lamp sufficient to go the distance?
We are all sealed with the Holy Spirit at new birth, but then we are admonished to be filled with the Holy Spirit, and then to trust that Jesus will baptize us in the Holy Spirit, and it is in this latter experience where many receive the gift of tongues....but with or without tongues at this point there is much other evidence of the experience through ministry, giftings, callings, and all accompanied by a demonstration of the power of God.
If your doctrine teaches that the demonstration of the power of God in signs and wonders is no more, where does that leave you? Outside of a closed door hearing Jesus say "I don't know you"? Outside of a closed door with a lamp gone out? Or worse, reluctantly realising you need your own oil supply and being excluded while you belatedly seek what the wise virgins already have?
This is where the salvation issue is, quite clearly. Please think about this seriously.
You know in your own heart whether or not you have sufficient for today, if you were to come face to face with Him. But none of us knows what is around the corner that we may face in our lives as conditions worldwide begin to deteriorate. This is where the wisdom comes in: wouldn't it be much better to seek the Lord for an infilling and baptism of the Holy Spirit now, and be confident in your own supply, rather than write everyone off who has already received what you need? Wouldn't it be better to receive a demonstration of the power of God in your own personal life right now, in order to go the distance...however long or short that distance is?
James 2:19 says, Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
So believing in itself is not enough, you need to then receive the Spirit of the Lord Jesus Christ: the Holy Spirit. This happens when you are born again.
When you come face to face with Jesus, will you meet Him with enough confidence in the Holy Spirit to know you are going to be received by Him? Is the oil in your lamp sufficient to go the distance?
We are all sealed with the Holy Spirit at new birth, but then we are admonished to be filled with the Holy Spirit, and then to trust that Jesus will baptize us in the Holy Spirit, and it is in this latter experience where many receive the gift of tongues....but with or without tongues at this point there is much other evidence of the experience through ministry, giftings, callings, and all accompanied by a demonstration of the power of God.
If your doctrine teaches that the demonstration of the power of God in signs and wonders is no more, where does that leave you? Outside of a closed door hearing Jesus say "I don't know you"? Outside of a closed door with a lamp gone out? Or worse, reluctantly realising you need your own oil supply and being excluded while you belatedly seek what the wise virgins already have?
This is where the salvation issue is, quite clearly. Please think about this seriously.
You know in your own heart whether or not you have sufficient for today, if you were to come face to face with Him. But none of us knows what is around the corner that we may face in our lives as conditions worldwide begin to deteriorate. This is where the wisdom comes in: wouldn't it be much better to seek the Lord for an infilling and baptism of the Holy Spirit now, and be confident in your own supply, rather than write everyone off who has already received what you need? Wouldn't it be better to receive a demonstration of the power of God in your own personal life right now, in order to go the distance...however long or short that distance is?
Its a very hard subject to discuss....................because it is emotions that rule this movement. not objectivity from the Word.
No PW this is wrong!!! It is only a hard subject to discuss for those who refuse what God plainly says in His word. The emotionalism is on their part, quite clearly, not ours. Speaking in tongues is not about fighting each other with whipped up emotions. Speaking in tongues is a God given language through which He accomplishes in the Spirit what cannot be accomplished in the flesh.
1 Cor 14:2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.
Speaking mysteries unto God is not emotionalism, it is a demonstration of the power of God to do what man alone cannot even conceive of.
That isn't answering my question, it is avoiding it.
Jesus said "Marvel not that I said ye MUST be born again" ...it isn't one of our many Christian options: it is a command.
John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
I hope you start to see how serious this is PW.
[FONT="] [/FONT] John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
If we are born again, whether tongues or interpretation or any other gift or manifestation listed, there will be SOME demonstration of the power of God.
To speak of that power is not emotionalism, and it is not boasting: it is testimony.
Jesus said "Marvel not that I said ye MUST be born again" ...it isn't one of our many Christian options: it is a command.
John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
I hope you start to see how serious this is PW.
[FONT="] [/FONT] John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
If we are born again, whether tongues or interpretation or any other gift or manifestation listed, there will be SOME demonstration of the power of God.
To speak of that power is not emotionalism, and it is not boasting: it is testimony.