Is there ONLY Grace or are we seeing what we want to see?

[followjesus]

Greetings followJesus,

Just FYI, the scripture that you posted above takes place when Jesus returns to the earth to end the age. There will be a judgment of the sheep and the goats, which are those great tribulation saints who will have made it alive through the end of that seven year period and will be judged based on those qualities mentioned above. The church is not apart of the judgment of the sheep and the goats, as we will have already been judged at the Bema seat of Christ prior to God's wrath being poured out. When we are judged it will not be for sin, but to receive reward or to suffer loss of reward.

The true Christian is saved by trusting in Christ as the One who alone provided salvation by His work on the cross and not by anything that we can do. The true believer is walking in Christ and being led by the Spirit. As we continue going from faith to faith we are being transformed into His image, being sanctified by the Holy Spirit, which is the life-long process of being made holy. When we sin, if we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us of all unrighteousness. Our salvation is not based on works, but on faith in Christ as the One who alone purchased mankind for God with His own blood. As we walk in Christ the Spirit is going to bring to our attention whatever is not pleasing to God in our lives, which again is the process of being transformed into his image.

how bout these ones lol how do they not apply..

matthew 7:21-27"“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’


“Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock. The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house; yet it did not fall, because it had its foundation on the rock. But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like a foolish man who built his house on sand. The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house, and it fell with a great crash


if the evildoers were prophesying in his name, driving demons out in His name, miracles in His name....id say they believed in His name right? whats the difference here? one group DID , the other Group Heard and did not do....hang on ill send you guys more to tell me why were all saved no matter if we do what were told, and btw made fully able to do through the atonement...1 sec

 

[Magenta]

Listen. Jesus already did enough for us don't you think? He was rejected, falsely accused, SPIT on, beaten repeatedly, mocked, made a spectacle of, spit on again, insulted, whipped, drug our cross up a hill, where He willingly accepted the nails driven through the bones in His hands and feet, was lifted as a spectacle for onlookers, mocked and insulted again, where He forgave us, and slowly died over 6 hours of agony. that's enough, Hes done enogh of our work, He didn't stop there tho. He went and crushed death and hades, took the keys to eternal Life and rose again, all to make us new and clean, forgiven By the Lord justified, born again children. that's where grace ends friend, and who among men is going to complain and say He didn't do enough??? that doctrine is insulting to me. anyone who denys Jesus or His words, insult me deeply. I see its deception oi see people fall into it and who its from.

No bones were broken. It fulfills prophecy. John 19:36

These things happened so that the scripture would be fulfilled: "Not one of his bones will be broken,"

 

[followjesus]

how bout these ones lol how do they not apply..

matthew 7:21-27"“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’


“Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock. The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house; yet it did not fall, because it had its foundation on the rock. But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like a foolish man who built his house on sand. The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house, and it fell with a great crash


if the evildoers were prophesying in his name, driving demons out in His name, miracles in His name....id say they believed in His name right? whats the difference here? one group DID , the other Group Heard and did not do....hang on ill send you guys more to tell me why were all saved no matter if we do what were told, and btw made fully able to do through the atonement...1 sec

matthew 24..42“Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come. 43But understand this: If the owner of the house had known at what time of night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. 44So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him.
45“Who then is the faithful and wise servant, whom the master has put in charge of the servants in his household to give them their food at the proper time? 46It will be good for that servant whose master finds him doing so when he returns. 47Truly I tell you, he will put him in charge of all his possessions. 48But suppose that servant is wicked and says to himself, ‘My master is staying away a long time,’ 49and he then begins to beat his fellow servants and to eat and drink with drunkards. 50The master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he is not aware of. 51He will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

the servant was in service to the master....ends up deciding to not do what he should hows it end for Him?

rather than continue though thers a ton more. you guys can stick to the doctrines that say your saved, not my place to save or decide for someone. I just keep following the Lord and His words. that's where my life is and will always be. and it proves itself to the one who will do it.


btw the above comment " we are transformed into His likeness, by accepting and following His teachings, His commands. that's how we know Jesus, what Hes like. not by avoiding and trying to say his words don't say what they say.


matthew 25 is infact the same jsoc that pauls refers to in romans 2, and Corinthians. the indoctrination that people buy into is what blinds, Not Jesus words, they are the True words of God. again tho, I'm immovable because of the Holy spirit, so its kinda fruitless ive already identified the truth that Is Given by Grace, its Jesus Life, including all He said, His death, and resurrection. the gospel isn't Just him dying. its just Like JESUS says before and after the cross. who ever will practice His teachings, is thw one abiding in Him, Who ever Loves Him will obey His commands, whoever doesn't Love him, wont. already posted that one earlier in this thread. He also said after the resurrection ( to stifle that lie about pre cross) Go forth and teach all nations TO OBEY EVERYTHING I COMMANDED YOU." its sad to see grace distorted , but free will is Gods design, as is the coming Judgement for those who deny Jesus authority.

 

[followjesus]

No bones were broken. It fulfills prophecy. John 19:36

These things happened so that the scripture would be fulfilled: "Not one of his bones will be broken,"

didn't say there were bones broken, I said there were nails driven through the bones in his hands and feet. do you know how many bones are in the feet? they didn't break your correct. they were pierced tho by our nails

 

[Ahwatukee]

that's where grace ends friend, and who among men is going to complain and say He didn't do enough??? that doctrine is insulting to me.

You are sorely mistaken, as the grace of God is always with us to the end. What kind of doctrine are you preaching anyway? Because its not the one of Scripture. You seem to say a lot without saying anything. The true believer in Christ is always in the process of being transformed into the image of Christ. It is a life-long process. If we walk in Him and are led by the Spirit of God, then we will sow to the Spirit and produce fruit. God's grace is always operating in the lives of those who trust in Him.

 

[followjesus]

Greetings followJesus,

Just FYI, the scripture that you posted above takes place when Jesus returns to the earth to end the age. There will be a judgment of the sheep and the goats, which are those great tribulation saints who will have made it alive through the end of that seven year period and will be judged based on those qualities mentioned above. The church is not apart of the judgment of the sheep and the goats, as we will have already been judged at the Bema seat of Christ prior to God's wrath being poured out. When we are judged it will not be for sin, but to receive reward or to suffer loss of reward.

The true Christian is saved by trusting in Christ as the One who alone provided salvation by His work on the cross and not by anything that we can do. The true believer is walking in Christ and being led by the Spirit. As we continue going from faith to faith we are being transformed into His image, being sanctified by the Holy Spirit, which is the life-long process of being made holy. When we sin, if we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us of all unrighteousness. Our salvation is not based on works, but on faith in Christ as the One who alone purchased mankind for God with His own blood. As we walk in Christ the Spirit is going to bring to our attention whatever is not pleasing to God in our lives, which again is the process of being transformed into his image.

the true Christian lol. How does the Christ define a "true Christian" read john 14-15 and that may explain what a true Christian is and how they are identified. ill definitely take Jesus word over joseph princes doctrine any day. truth is found in Jesus words. cant see any Christian arguing what Jesus Himself said, but I'm no ones Judge. I just trust Jesus like you are all saying you do. I trust His words as well as everything He did and does daily. bless you and greetings also.


anything that makes a person think Jesus doesn't Know how to define what a Christian is should reconsider where the wisdom came from in that. ill take Jesus definition anyday on any subject, thanks for adding tho.

 

[followjesus]

the true Christian lol. How does the Christ define a "true Christian" read john 14-15 and that may explain what a true Christian is and how they are identified. ill definitely take Jesus word over joseph princes doctrine any day. truth is found in Jesus words. cant see any Christian arguing what Jesus Himself said, but I'm no ones Judge. I just trust Jesus like you are all saying you do. I trust His words as well as everything He did and does daily. bless you and greetings also.


anything that makes a person think Jesus doesn't Know how to define what a Christian is should reconsider where the wisdom came from in that. ill take Jesus definition anyday on any subject, thanks for adding tho.

john 14
15“If you love me, keep my commands. 16And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be[SUP]c[/SUP] in you. 18I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. 21Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.”
22Then Judas (not Judas Iscariot) said, “But, Lord, why do you intend to show yourself to us and not to the world?”
23Jesus replied, “Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them. 24Anyone who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me.


Jesus definition unless now all the sudden Loving Jesus has nothing to do with Christianity, to that of Coarse id say look top the greatest commandment. also if any one actually wants to continue knowing How its defined, read on

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Jesus never said to obey His commands???

Another person who wants to read something i never said into my comments. Please stop..

have you ever read the gospel? or do you like so many stick with paul? naw its not unwarranted favor, saved no matter what, sorry, that's not Jesus.

Yeah I did, Paul did not contradict Jesus, Jesus said whoever believes in him has eternal life. Shall never perish. Will never be lost. And he will raise them on the last day.

What, do you think you can EARN salvation? think again..

if we could earn salvation, Jesus could have stayed in heaven, and just let those who could earn it.. WHile sending everyone else to hell.

 

[followjesus]

john 14
15“If you love me, keep my commands. 16And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be[SUP]c[/SUP] in you. 18I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. 21Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.”
22Then Judas (not Judas Iscariot) said, “But, Lord, why do you intend to show yourself to us and not to the world?”
23Jesus replied, “Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them. 24Anyone who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me.


Jesus definition unless now all the sudden Loving Jesus has nothing to do with Christianity, to that of Coarse id say look top the greatest commandment. also if any one actually wants to continue knowing How its defined, read on

john 15 1“I am the true vine, and my Father is the gardener. 2He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit, while every branch that does bear fruit he prunes[SUP]a[/SUP] so that it will be even more fruitful. 3You are already clean because of the word I have spoken to you. 4Remain in me, as I also remain in you. No branch can bear fruit by itself; it must remain in the vine. Neither can you bear fruit unless you remain in me.
5“I am the vine; you are the branches. If you remain in me and I in you, you will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing. 6If you do not remain in me, you are like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned. 7If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you. 8This is to my Father’s glory, that you bear much fruit, showing yourselves to be my disciples.

theres more lol Jesus words...now I found out about bible hub so uh oh....truth coming

 

[followjesus]

john 15 1“I am the true vine, and my Father is the gardener. 2He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit, while every branch that does bear fruit he prunes[SUP]a[/SUP] so that it will be even more fruitful. 3You are already clean because of the word I have spoken to you. 4Remain in me, as I also remain in you. No branch can bear fruit by itself; it must remain in the vine. Neither can you bear fruit unless you remain in me.
5“I am the vine; you are the branches. If you remain in me and I in you, you will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing. 6If you do not remain in me, you are like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned. 7If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you. 8This is to my Father’s glory, that you bear much fruit, showing yourselves to be my disciples.

theres more lol Jesus words...now I found out about bible hub so uh oh....truth coming

john 8:12 "12When Jesus spoke again to the people, he said, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life.”

follow Jesus live forever.

31To the Jews who had believed him, Jesus said, “If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples. 32Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”


before the ( he said that to only the Jews comes forth...remember IN CHRIST there is neither Jew nor Gentile...Christ is in all and through all...Pauls words not mine.

how bout 1 john ?

1Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves the father loves his child as well. 2This is how we know that we love the children of God: by loving God and carrying out his commands. 3In fact, this is love for God: to keep his commands. And his commands are not burdensome, 4for everyone born of God overcomes the world. This is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. 5Who is it that overcomes the world? Only the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God.


see any connection between faith and what we actually do??? I do but I'm sure I should let it go, you all already know this stuff and choose the doctrines that sound better than Jesus.

bless you

 

[Grace777x70]

There are 2 aspects to grace.

The very first thing that Jesus does with the woman caught in adultery is that He gets rid of her accusers - the religious Pharisees that wanted to condemn her because the "bible" said so in the Old Covenant. ( the law condemns us )

1) acceptance grace - which has nothing to do with our behavior - as seen with the woman caught in adultery. Our Lord beautifully says " I do not condemn you".

It is in knowing you are not condemned that releases the other aspect of grace.

2) now, go and sin no more - this is empowering grace.

Empowering grace enables you to be who the Father sees you are in Christ now because you are a new creation in Him.


The religious mindset says to the woman caught in adultery - 'Do not sin and we will not condemn you."

The grace of God and the blood of Jesus speaks of better things in this New Covenant of grace!

"Knowing" that we are not condemned in Christ "releases" the life of the empowering grace to transform us. It's all about Christ! It's His fruit being manifested in us!

Acceptance grace which is not based on our behavior needs to be cemented in our hearts before empowering grace is able to be truly manifested.


What believers in a self-effort/self-performance D.I.Y. holiness/righteousness based mindset and the self-appointed "fruit inspectors" have a very hard time with is the "acceptance grace" part...this just drives them nuts...and I understand why..it is scandalous and it "conflicts" with their religious man-made traditions.

Let us grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ and be who God made us to be by His Son's sacrifice and blood - His beloved children. Let's honor our Lord by believing in all that Jesus has already done for us. He is awesome and mighty to save.

 

[followjesus]

Another person who wants to read something i never said into my comments. Please stop..


Yeah I did, Paul did not contradict Jesus, Jesus said whoever believes in him has eternal life. Shall never perish. Will never be lost. And he will raise them on the last day.

What, do you think you can EARN salvation? think again..

if we could earn salvation, Jesus could have stayed in heaven, and just let those who could earn it.. WHile sending everyone else to hell.

right bit its belief that is true. the difference in saying I believe and believing is what the action shows. If a person believes in Jesus, His words should be accepted.

if Jesus said to you. there is a bag of 10000 dollars in your front yard buried, would you "believe" him and not go dig it up? or would you "believe " him and just know its there?

belief has to be sincere. Just like paul says of Love.

and you are right, paulk does not contradict Jesus. Paul is easily distorted because of His writing style and the revelations about the gospel that He was putting forth. peter warns of this fact that pauls writings are hard to understand and are easily distorted"....that's why Jesus words come first, it guards against distortion of the rest, because in Jesus words are the wisdom and insight of the holy spirit. then paul makes perfect sense and wont lead to a plucking of a verse here n there to create a false doctrine like the gog. ever notice how its the gospel of grace, or the gospel of the grace of Christ? the name of Gods Son is Jesus. His title is Christ ( the anointed one of God.) His name removed is the first sign, everything we do is in JESUS name. at least it should be the "grace of Jesus Christ" would make the deception a little easier to see but that's just me

 

[Grace777x70]

There are many terms used in relation to the gospel. By far the number #1 way the gospel is talked about is the gospel of Christ. Check in out and you will see this is true.

Acts 20:24 (KJV)
[SUP]24 [/SUP] But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.

Romans 1:1 (KJV)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,

Romans 1:9 (KJV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] For God is my witness, whom I serve with my spirit in the gospel of his Son, that without ceasing I make mention of you always in my prayers;

Romans 1:16 (KJV)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

Romans 10:15 (KJV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

Ephesians 1:13 (KJV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Mark 1:1 (NASB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God.

 

[Nikki84]

I believe the "grace only" crowd is mislead and falsely told sin is of no consequence

 

[followjesus]

There are 2 aspects to grace.

The very first thing that Jesus does with the woman caught in adultery is that He gets rid of her accusers - the religious Pharisees that wanted to condemn her because the "bible" said so in the Old Covenant. ( the law condemns us )

1) acceptance grace - which has nothing to do with our behavior - as seen with the woman caught in adultery. Our Lord beautifully says " I do not condemn you".

It is in knowing you are not condemned that releases the other aspect of grace.

2) now, go and sin no more - this is empowering grace.

Empowering grace enables you to be who the Father sees you are in Christ now because you are a new creation in Him.


The religious mindset says to the woman caught in adultery - 'Do not sin and we will not condemn you."

The grace of God and the blood of Jesus speaks of better things in this New Covenant of grace!

"Knowing" that we are not condemned in Christ "releases" the life of the empowering grace to transform us. It's all about Christ! It's His fruit being manifested in us!

Acceptance grace which is not based on our behavior needs to be cemented in our hearts before empowering grace is able to be truly manifested.


What believers in a self-effort/self-performance D.I.Y. holiness/righteousness based mindset and the self-appointed "fruit inspectors" have a very hard time with is the "acceptance grace" part...this just drives them nuts...and I understand why..it is scandalous and it "conflicts" with their religious man-made traditions.

Let us grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ and be who God made us to be by His Son's sacrifice and blood - His beloved children. Let's honor our Lord by believing in all that Jesus has already done for us. He is awesome and mighty to save.

Gotta accept His words , cant deny Jesus words and claim you have faith in him, He says it repeatedly, your doctrine is lacking. trust in His finished work good, denying His words to fit a doctrine that HAS to omit half of them is not good same as denying Jesus. who says Himself whoever has my commands and follows...says "why do you call me lord lord and do not do what I say??? the many many things he says just like that. your trying to remove Jesus and put your faith in Grace without His words, which are the Only words that save a person.

a person who believes in Jesus, will believe what He says. period. if any doctrine has to change the plain meaning of Jesus words, its false. period, there is no argument against that. Jesus is everything you need. empowering Grace is to trust Jesus enough to do what He says, then the power of freedom comes. period, the way to see it is to do it, Jesus teaching not mine.

there is no medium between your doctrinal beliefs and Jesus words which are Life. That's my choice, I choose Jesus and His words. that's why the word makes sense. wisdom comes from Jesus. to paul, not from paul to jesus. grace is true, Gods grace, not mans. Gods grace is found throughout the gospel of matthew, mark, luke and John, paul then makes a revelation OF what Jesus already made happen. Jesus first, keeps a doctrine true and the hearer safe from deception.


but again brewski, friend. no hard feelings, I just trust in Jesus and His own words purposed By God to be written By 4 witnesses, and love paul as well, I just know that salvation is only in Jesus, paul knew that as well.

bless ya man. we can always just agree to disagree ill stick with Jesus. and live a blessed and wonderful life knowing and following Him.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I believe the "grace only" crowd is mislead and falsely told sin is of no consequence

Who said this? Your pastor? Well he does not know us at all.

 

[followjesus]

I believe the "grace only" crowd is mislead and falsely told sin is of no consequence

its not their fault, its a clever deception built on the warning peter made of pauls writings. and then popular "teachers" see the money to be made by making Gods word sound appealing to human nature. like theres no repentance, no confession of sin, no accountability or punishment ect..ect... its clever and the way to see the deception ois always top jusy Know Jesus own words. He makes it all clear, in matthew, mark , luke and John. But the issue is, the false doctrine has to convince that those words, Jesus words, don't apply because he warns d=so much of disobedience. and judgement like a good father would do. telling us repent these things are death but it doesn't feel good to the human nature to hear, so there you have a false appealing doctrine that sells massive amounts of books, and in the process turns minds away from Jesus words. sad stuff really. Jesus is able though to gather His own

 

[eternally-gratefull]

right bit its belief that is true. the difference in saying I believe and believing is what the action shows. If a person believes in Jesus, His words should be accepted.

if Jesus said to you. there is a bag of 10000 dollars in your front yard buried, would you "believe" him and not go dig it up? or would you "believe " him and just know its there?

belief has to be sincere. Just like paul says of Love.

and you are right, paulk does not contradict Jesus. Paul is easily distorted because of His writing style and the revelations about the gospel that He was putting forth. peter warns of this fact that pauls writings are hard to understand and are easily distorted"....that's why Jesus words come first, it guards against distortion of the rest, because in Jesus words are the wisdom and insight of the holy spirit. then paul makes perfect sense and wont lead to a plucking of a verse here n there to create a false doctrine like the gog. ever notice how its the gospel of grace, or the gospel of the grace of Christ? the name of Gods Son is Jesus. His title is Christ ( the anointed one of God.) His name removed is the first sign, everything we do is in JESUS name. at least it should be the "grace of Jesus Christ" would make the deception a little easier to see but that's just me

Jesus words still stand, Whoever trusts me (belief/faith) will live forever, never die, has eternal life, and will be risen on the last da.

Lets take him at his word. and not make him contradict himself.

 

[followjesus]

Who said this? Your pastor? Well he does not know us at all.

no one really knows anyone on this site. Jesus is the only one who knows us, and the only one we need to know

 

[followjesus]

Jesus words still stand, Whoever trusts me (belief/faith) will live forever, never die, has eternal life, and will be risen on the last da.

Lets take him at his word. and not make him contradict himself.

why do you suppose that's not the entire of what He said? but yes you should believe as you do, and not worry about what I believe. its pretty obvious where my trust is. in whose words. ive quoted about a quarter of JESUS words here so. we should DEFINATELY all believe as we are free to do. bless ya, keep the faith