CONDEMNATION IS THE ROOT CAUSE

[God4me]

You have just added your own religious beliefs to 1 John 1:9 ...it does not say what you said here "OUR past repented sins have been forgiven, and our present and future sins will be forgiven when we repent. " ...this is your own words here.

Forgiven in 1 John 1:9 is in the aorist tense which is past all the time only when used in the indicative form...this is in the active form - which can mean an on-going thing.

Here is a quote about the aorist tense.

Remember that Greek tenses indicate not only time of action, but more especially kind of action. The aorist tense is a secondary tense, and accordingly, in the indicative mood it indicates past action. In other moods, it does not indicate absolute time, and often does not even indicate relative time.

Course II, Lesson 2

You have to say that, because you know the Biblical truths prove you wrong.

You are just as bad as J Prince, only quoting half Greek tenses, because the Greek covers every tense, meaning our past repented sins have been forgiven, and our present and future sins will be forgiven when we repent.

1 Jn 1: 8--10 proves your Greek tense wrong, as John was writing to believers, So if what you say was true, then God didn't know that we have to repent and confess our sins, Because He told John that we have to.

I will believe God, and you can believe the false grace teachers.

 

[Grace777x70]

The problem with the false grace teachings, is, Nowhere in the New Testament Church does the sinner gave to confess their sins.
Confession of sins us for the believers.

So, every time we sin, We, "The believer ", has to confess our sins and repent.
You should forget what the false grace teachers say, as they are the end time deceivers, and their doctrines are the same as the Nicolaitions, which Jesus hates.

Joseph Prince, "A false grace teacher", said the only qualifications that we need to go up in the rapture, Is to be here when it happens, then he said,
You don't have to be faithful or holy, just on earth when Jesus comes for us.

And that IS NOT what the Bible says.
J Prince is a deceiver.

If this confessing of sins "in order" to receive forgiveness is so important to believers...why wouldn't Paul talk about it in any of his epistles?

I believe all Christians should be confessing all things with their Father and Lord. We should be confessing ( which means to say the same thing, to agree with - in Greek ) not only all sins but everything Jesus has provided for us in His finished work.

I agree with you BTW that scriptures do not say for the unbeliever to confess sins. 1 John 1:9 was telling those people that didn't believe in "sin" at all to confess that there is sin and that you need a Savior.

 

[JennaLeanne]

The problem with the false grace teachings, is, Nowhere in the New Testament Church does the sinner gave to confess their sins.
Confession of sins us for the believers.

So, every time we sin, We, "The believer ", has to confess our sins and repent.
You should forget what the false grace teachers say, as they are the end time deceivers, and their doctrines are the same as the Nicolaitions, which Jesus hates.

Joseph Prince, "A false grace teacher", said the only qualifications that we need to go up in the rapture, Is to be here when it happens, then he said,
You don't have to be faithful or holy, just on earth when Jesus comes for us.

And that IS NOT what the Bible says.
J Prince is a deceiver.

Admitting we are sinners is what we all do when we accept Jesus as our savior.. We aknowledge our sins and confess he is Lord, the ultimate sacrifice for our sins.. This is what 1john 1:9 is talking about.. Without first aknowledging you are a sinner how can u then say u need a savior? If u have no conviction of sin then u will not believe u need a savior will u. Tell me brother, what do u believe Jesus has done for you ?

 

[God4me]

James 5:16
Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much.

The false grace teachers, wouldn't accept James 5: 16.

 

[God4me]

Admitting we are sinners is what we all do when we accept Jesus as our savior.. We aknowledge our sins and confess he is Lord, the ultimate sacrifice for our sins.. This is what 1john 1:9 is talking about.. Without first aknowledging you are a sinner how can u then say u need a savior? If u have no conviction of sin then u will not believe u need a savior will u. Tell me brother, what do u believe Jesus has done for you ?

Nowhere does the Bible teach that the sinner has to confess their sins, to be saved.

John, in1 Jn 1 is talking to the beleavers.

 

[Grace777x70]

You have to say that, because you know the Biblical truths prove you wrong.

You are just as bad as J Prince, only quoting half Greek tenses, because the Greek covers every tense, meaning our past repented sins have been forgiven, and our present and future sins will be forgiven when we repent.

1 Jn 1: 8--10 proves your Greek tense wrong, as John was writing to believers, So if what you say was true, then God didn't know that we have to repent and confess our sins, Because He told John that we have to.

I will believe God, and you can believe the false grace teachers.

Okie dokie....( again you have added your own beliefs with this statement - "meaning our past repented sins have been forgiven, and our present and future sins will be forgiven when we repent" )

It is the aorist active tense for the word "forgiven" but you are allowed to believe whatever you want...and as we have said - you are entitled to your opinions....

 

[JennaLeanne]

The false grace teachers, wouldn't accept James 5: 16.

I totally agree with this scripture also.. I often tell my fellow brothers and sisters what I am struggling with and ask them to stand with me

 

[JennaLeanne]

Nowhere does the Bible teach that the sinner has to confess their sins, to be saved.

John, in1 Jn 1 is talking to the beleavers.

Whaaaaaat? Are we reading the same bible... Is the whole point of Jesus dying not for sinners?

 

[Grace777x70]

You have to say that, because you know the Biblical truths prove you wrong.

You are just as bad as J Prince, only quoting half Greek tenses, because the Greek covers every tense, meaning our past repented sins have been forgiven, and our present and future sins will be forgiven when we repent.

1 Jn 1: 8--10 proves your Greek tense wrong, as John was writing to believers, So if what you say was true, then God didn't know that we have to repent and confess our sins, Because He told John that we have to.

I will believe God, and you can believe the false grace teachers.

Here are the scriptures if you say you believe in the Bible. I realize that this conflicts with your religious beliefs.

Forgiveness is a done deal bought for by the blood of our Lord. Despite what our religious upbringing has taught us. This is what scripture has to say about forgiveness but men's made up terms to support their religious views.

1 John 2:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] I am writing to you, little children, because your sins have been forgiven you for His name's sake.

have been forgiven = perfect passive

Perfect Tense

The basic thought of the perfect tense is that the progress of an action has been completed and the results of the action are continuing on, in full effect.

In other words, the progress of the action has reached its culmination and the finished results are now in existence. Unlike the English perfect, which indicates a completed past action, the Greek perfect tense indicates the continuation and present state of a completed past action.

passive = voice = action is happening to you....you are not doing it

Without a doubt this verse says that the sins are forgiven from a past action that remains in a continuous state and that was put on them....not something they did


Brethren ...we have a great salvation in our Lord!

Here are some more scriptures on the forgiveness of God thru the precious blood of our Lord!....


Ephesians 1:7 (KJV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

We have redemption = present continuous action...so this means we have present continuous forgiveness of our sins...

and look...that grace stuff shows up again!...it's all according to our loving Father's grace that He has given to us in Christ our Lord.

Colossians 1:13-14 (NASB)
[SUP]13[/SUP] For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,

[SUP]14[/SUP] in whomwe have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

Same thing here too...present continuous action = forgiveness of sins


Redemption!..we have been bought with the precious Blood of Jesus... Let's honor His work!

 

[God4me]

If this confessing of sins "in order" to receive forgiveness is so important to believers...why wouldn't Paul talk about it in any of his epistles?

I believe all Christians should be confessing all things with their Father and Lord. We should be confessing ( which means to say the same thing, to agree with - in Greek ) not only all sins but everything Jesus has provided for us in His finished work.

I agree with you BTW that scriptures do not say for the unbeliever to confess sins. 1 John 1:9 was telling those people that didn't believe in "sin" at all to confess that there is sin and that you need a Savior.

1 Jn 1: 8--10, is telling the believers to confess their sins.
Not to those who didn't believe in sin.

 

[Grace777x70]

Admitting we are sinners is what we all do when we accept Jesus as our savior.. We aknowledge our sins and confess he is Lord, the ultimate sacrifice for our sins.. This is what 1john 1:9 is talking about.. Without first aknowledging you are a sinner how can u then say u need a savior? If u have no conviction of sin then u will not believe u need a savior will u. Tell me brother, what do u believe Jesus has done for you ?

The gnostics didn't believe there was such a thing as "sin" in the world which is why John was telling then to confess ( say the same thing that God says ) that there is sin and you need to be cleansed from all unrighteousness.

1 John 1 was written to believers about non-believers. When the gnostic people heard this epistle being read to them - it would have spoken to them. When the believers heard it - they would have been encouraged and not fall for the false teaching that there is no "sin" in the world as some taught back then.

 

[JennaLeanne]

1 Jn 1: 8--10, is telling the believers to confess their sins.
Not to those who didn't believe in sin.

Read the book of 1john.. Study the history of it.. They believed Jesus never came in human form and that they were spiritual beings with flesh being an illusion therefore they couldn't sin.. That's why John was writing the letter because he was an eyewitness of Jesus living, breathing and walking the earth

 

[God4me]

Here are the scriptures if you say you believe in the Bible. I realize that this conflicts with your religious beliefs.

Forgiveness is a done deal bought for by the blood of our Lord. Despite what our religious upbringing has taught us. This is what scripture has to say about forgiveness but men's made up terms to support their religious views.

1 John 2:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] I am writing to you, little children, because your sins have been forgiven you for His name's sake.

have been forgiven = perfect passive

Perfect Tense

The basic thought of the perfect tense is that the progress of an action has been completed and the results of the action are continuing on, in full effect.

In other words, the progress of the action has reached its culmination and the finished results are now in existence. Unlike the English perfect, which indicates a completed past action, the Greek perfect tense indicates the continuation and present state of a completed past action.

passive = voice = action is happening to you....you are not doing it

Without a doubt this verse says that the sins are forgiven from a past action that remains in a continuous state and that was put on them....not something they did


Brethren ...we have a great salvation in our Lord!

Here are some more scriptures on the forgiveness of God thru the precious blood of our Lord!....


Ephesians 1:7 (KJV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

We have redemption = present continuous action...so this means we have present continuous forgiveness of our sins...

and look...that grace stuff shows up again!...it's all according to our loving Father's grace that He has given to us in Christ our Lord.

Colossians 1:13-14 (NASB)
[SUP]13[/SUP] For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,

[SUP]14[/SUP] in whomwe have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

Same thing here too...present continuous action = forgiveness of sins


Redemption!..we have been bought with the precious Blood of Jesus... Let's honor His work!

That is a typical J Prince error.
1 Jn 2: 12, in the Greek tense, is past repented sins have been forgiven, and our present and future sins will be forgiven when we repent.
John was telling them that their repented and confessed sins have been forgiven, because they did repent and confess, in 1 Jn 1: 9.

 

[Grace777x70]

1 Jn 1: 8--10, is telling the believers to confess their sins.
Not to those who didn't believe in sin.

WOW..I wonder if Paul ever read John's epistle as he never once mentions this theory you have said here. I know this teaching conflicts with our religious beliefs. I too had a hard time with it when I first heard it but prayed about it and the Lord showed me the truth and it is wonderful and it exalts the Lord greatly!

 

[God4me]

Read the book of 1john.. Study the history of it.. They believed Jesus never came in human form and that they were spiritual beings with flesh being an illusion therefore they couldn't sin.. That's why John was writing the letter because he was an eyewitness of Jesus living, breathing and walking the earth

NO it wasn't.
Every Spirit filled Greek Bible scholars say John was writing to believers.
And there is no Biblical reason to doubt it, as the Bible wasn't written in chapter and verse,
So 1 John chapters 1--5, is for the Christians.

 

[Grace777x70]

That is a typical J Prince error.
1 Jn 2: 12, in the Greek tense, is past repented sins have been forgiven, and our present and future sins will be forgiven when we repent.
John was telling them that their repented and confessed sins have been forgiven, because they did repent and confess, in 1 Jn 1: 9.

So, do you figure all these scriptures that Paul wrote on forgiveness of sins - that Prince is really now an incarnation of the apostle Paul of some sort?

You do know that 1 John 2:12 is in the perfect tense...right?

Here you are again making up your own definitions of greek tenses and then adding your own beliefs into them - I"s past repented sins have been forgiven, and our present and future sins will be forgiven when we repent."

The perfect tense in Greek in 1 John 2:12 says the complete opposite of what you made up in blue above.

 

[God4me]

So, do you figure all these scriptures that Paul wrote on forgiveness of sins - that Prince is really now an incarnation of the apostle Paul of some sort?

You do know that 1 John 2:12 is in the perfect tense...right?

Here you are again making up your own definitions of greek tenses and then adding your own beliefs into them - I"s past repented sins have been forgiven, and our present and future sins will be forgiven when we repent."

The perfect tense in Greek in 1 John 2:12 says the complete opposite of what you made up in blue above.

If you read 1 Jn 1: 8--10, through to 1 Jn 2: 1, you'll see that John was writing to believers.
The Bible wasn't written in chapter and verse, the translators put them in for clarification.

1 Jn 2: 12, isn't just the perfect tense, That's the mistake J Prince made when he deceived the people.
The Greek uses all the tenses, meaning, Past repented sins have been forgiven, and present & future repented sins will be forgiven.

There's a lot of people being deceived by your false grace teachings.
PS, Paul and Jesus talks about repenting.

 

[God4me]

So, do you figure all these scriptures that Paul wrote on forgiveness of sins - that Prince is really now an incarnation of the apostle Paul of some sort?

You do know that 1 John 2:12 is in the perfect tense...right?

Here you are again making up your own definitions of greek tenses and then adding your own beliefs into them - I"s past repented sins have been forgiven, and our present and future sins will be forgiven when we repent."

The perfect tense in Greek in 1 John 2:12 says the complete opposite of what you made up in blue above.

Confessing sins, means, Agreeing with God that we have sinned, See 1 Jn 1: 8, & v10. And confessing that we have sinned.
See 1 Jn 1: 9.
You false grace teachers won't accept any Bible scriptures that prove you wrong, so you deceive people by saying we don't have to confess our sins.

 

[Grace777x70]

If you read 1 Jn 1: 8--10, through to 1 Jn 2: 1, you'll see that John was writing to believers.
The Bible wasn't written in chapter and verse, the translators put them in for clarification.

1 Jn 2: 12, isn't just the perfect tense, That's the mistake J Prince made when he deceived the people.
The Greek uses all the tenses, meaning, Past repented sins have been forgiven, and present & future repented sins will be forgiven.

There's a lot of people being deceived by your false grace teachings.
PS, Paul and Jesus talks about repenting.

My goodness......here is the greek for 1 John 2:12....it is definitely the perfect tense but you can believe what ever you want. I could tell you that Daffy Duck and Donald Duck are the 2 witnesses in the book of Revelation but I would hope someone would ask for scripture.

[TABLE="class: tablefloat"]
[TR]
[TD="align: left"]863 [e]
apheōntai
ἀφέωνται
have been forgiven
V-RIM/P-3P =

Part of Speech: Verb

Tense: Perfect
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
Where does Paul say for us to confess our sins "in order to be forgiven " if it is so important ?

I believe is confessing sins and talking about everything to the Lord but not "in order to receive forgiveness ". I'm a believer in what Christ has done for us in His perfect work - especially His blood taking away all sin.

 

[Ariel82]

That doesn't make sense.


You say sorry because you want forgiveness.


Only difference is that God with His love and grace forgives us,while it's more uncertain if people will be so,loving.