CONDEMNATION IS THE ROOT CAUSE

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JennaLeanne

JennaLeanne

Senior Member
#141
Dec 26, 2015
411
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28
#141
Grace777x70 said:
That is a good thread as both sides of the discussion chime in with what they believe.

I know when I first heard it - I thought it was heresy too because it "conflicted" with my religious beliefs that I was taught in church but the Lord circumvented the one that I first heard it from and through various teachers in the body of Christ - He showed me the truth of it. Now, I can't believe I didn't see that before. What a glorious salvation and gospel we have in Jesus!
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Oh amen, I'm definetly doing a "I am so totally free" dance in my living room right now... Wish you could all see! Haha
.. What a glorious gospel.. Here's another great explanation of 1 John 1:9 it's very similar just a lot shorter.
What is the meaning behind 1 John 1:9? Who is John addressing? - Are You Ready for a Change?
 
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Ariel82

Guest
#142
#142
Wow, that link showed that this debate has been happening for years.

I wonder who has grown and what views have changed through the discussion.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#143
#143
Sorry if you want to change the meaning of "we" to mean only Gnostics because you can't simply accept that God might convict you of sin and thusly you need to Repent and confess that sin He has shown you, then you are living in an illusion.

Yes we have victory through Christ. Yes we should do a happy dance and focus on walking with Him.

However, we are human and we still have spiritual strongholds that need tearing down. That is why we need God's chastening, that is why we still,need to confess our sins and pray for guidance daily. Not for forgiveness alone but so that we can tear down the lies that entrap us and plant the truths God has given us.
 
JennaLeanne

JennaLeanne

Senior Member
#144
Dec 26, 2015
411
37
28
#144
Ariel82 said:
Wow, that link showed that this debate has been happening for years.

I wonder who has grown and what views have changed through the discussion.
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It's so important that we see everything in the context it was written in isn't it? Who 2, What for etc... People then will say well if u don't believe all of the bible then u shouldn't believe any, like trying to say you are picking bits out etc... This thread is clear proof that every part of the bible in its context is needed for today 2.. Praise God for his word that's alive and active xxx
 
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Ariel82

Guest
#145
#145
It's like saying you had a bath once, so you never need to bathe again.

Confession of sins allows God to wash us clean of the filth of this world and tell us He still loves us despite our mistakes and shows us how to,handle,the situation next time with more love, grace, patience and gentleness us,we can reflect His nature and love.
 
JennaLeanne

JennaLeanne

Senior Member
#146
Dec 26, 2015
411
37
28
#146
Ariel82 said:
Sorry if you want to change the meaning of "we" to mean only Gnostics because you can't simply accept that God might convict you of sin and thusly you need to Repent and confess that sin He has shown you, then you are living in an illusion.

Yes we have victory through Christ. Yes we should do a happy dance and focus on walking with Him.

However, we are human and we still have spiritual strongholds that need tearing down. That is why we need God's chastening, that is why we still,need to confess our sins and pray for guidance daily. Not for forgiveness alone but so that we can tear down the lies that entrap us and plant the truths God has given us.
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Yes, The finished work is already done isn't it but it's renewing our minds to this truth.. How can the finished work be done if we need to keep being forgiven? It's almost like the image of God seeing us as robots.. The freedom lies in the revelation that we have been forgiven now renew your minds to this.. See yourself as spotless, the righteous of God in Christ Jesus then watch the strongholds come tumbling down! Otherwise the stronghold that's says confess confess confess will keep our focus on sin instead of our freedom. Xx
 
JennaLeanne

JennaLeanne

Senior Member
#147
Dec 26, 2015
411
37
28
#147
Ariel82 said:
It's like saying you had a bath once, so you never need to bathe again.

Confession of sins allows God to wash us clean of the filth of this world and tell us He still loves us despite our mistakes and shows us how to,handle,the situation next time with more love, grace, patience and gentleness us,we can reflect His nature and love.
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Yes of course we a knowledge sin for what it is.. and we thank God for his forgiveness to remind us there is no condemnation.. But we are already cleansed.. it's like saying does Jesus need to die everytime I sin? Wow.. That would of been about 10000000000 times for me just this year alone...
 
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Ariel82

Guest
#148
#148
I guess if you have a stronghold that is condemning you, that might be true.

How do you respond when God convicts or chastens you about something?
 
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Ariel82

Guest
#149
#149
No Jesus doesn't have to die every time you sin and you only have to be born again once.

However shouldn't part of being born again be when you are taught how to not sin and become santified saints through God's chastenment? Should we not add to our faith, virtue, wisdom, self control, perservance, brotherly kindness and love?

It is great to be free of condemnation, but that is just the,beginning of the walk with Christ.

He told us to pick up our cross and follow Him. He said walk in the good works he made us to walk in.
 
JennaLeanne

JennaLeanne

Senior Member
#150
Dec 26, 2015
411
37
28
#150
Ariel82 said:
I guess if you have a stronghold that is condemning you, that might be true.

How do you respond when God convicts or chastens you about something?
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I respond by thanking him that he loves me so much he leads me into all truth and equips me with everything I need to do/or no do.. Ya know in Hebrews 10:6 It says the Lord chastens those he loves.. The Greek word for chastens there is "Paideuo" It means "a child under development so they mature and realise their full potential"

The English word chastens comes from the Latin word "castus" Which means purify.. I think we always need to study the words and the language.. Naturally when we think chasten well me myself I imagine a really mean school teacher with a whip or belt haha. . That just isn't our father is it? Xx
 
P

popeye

Guest
#151
#151
JustWhoIAm said:
Not saying I disagree, I don't, but that disobedience was rooted in deception - they took the bait. They were deceived. Then it snowballed.

Adam blamed the woman. Deception - failure to take accountability for disobedience.

Eve blamed the serpent. Same deal. "THE SERPENT DECEIVED ME."

Yes, there was condemnation there, but that condemnation was rooted in a lie... "I can shift blame to fool God because I know I screwed up but I do not want to take accountability for it."
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I would have to go back and read it,but I think God agreed with Adam,when he blamed the woman
 
G

God4me

Banned
#152
May 26, 2016
828
7
0
#152
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popeye

Guest
#153
#153
Ariel82 said:
Sorry if you want to change the meaning of "we" to mean only Gnostics because you can't simply accept that God might convict you of sin and thusly you need to Repent and confess that sin He has shown you, then you are living in an illusion.

Yes we have victory through Christ. Yes we should do a happy dance and focus on walking with Him.

However, we are human and we still have spiritual strongholds that need tearing down. That is why we need God's chastening, that is why we still,need to confess our sins and pray for guidance daily. Not for forgiveness alone but so that we can tear down the lies that entrap us and plant the truths God has given us.
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Yes

This is illustrated in the seven letters to the seven churches
 
JennaLeanne

JennaLeanne

Senior Member
#154
Dec 26, 2015
411
37
28
#154
God4me said:
That link is unscriptural, but the false grace teachers don't do Bible, the rather believe what erroneous men say.
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Hey brother :) Please tell me which part of it you don't believe to be biblical?
 
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God4me

Banned
#155
May 26, 2016
828
7
0
#155
Grace777x70 said:
I did read it and perhaps you can pray for me so that I can understand the bible like you can.

This could be one of those times where we can just agree to disagree. ...:)
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I can pray for you, but I can't make you believe the Bible.
 
G

God4me

Banned
#156
May 26, 2016
828
7
0
#156
Grace777x70 said:
On the contrary 1 John 1:9 was for us before we became a Christian and Jesus' blood washed us clean! We do not go in and out of righteousness because someone sins - righteousness is based completely on what Jesus did for us and He made us righteous.

In the theory that we lose righteousness when we sin - what happens if you get in a fight with your wife tonight and then fall asleep and then die...you have no righteousness in this theory and you would go to hell.

No. the scriptures are clear - Christ ahs become to us from God, righteousness and holiness. He has done it all - we are just walking out who we are in Christ as we get our minds renewed to the truth.

I realize this conflicts with our religious beliefs that we were taught but when we see the beauty of our Lord's finished work - we walk in freedom and sin doesn't have dominion over us.
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What you say, isn't what the Bible teaches
 
P

popeye

Guest
#157
#157
Ariel82 said:
Sorry if you want to change the meaning of "we" to mean only Gnostics because you can't simply accept that God might convict you of sin and thusly you need to Repent and confess that sin He has shown you, then you are living in an illusion.

Yes we have victory through Christ. Yes we should do a happy dance and focus on walking with Him.

However, we are human and we still have spiritual strongholds that need tearing down. That is why we need God's chastening, that is why we still,need to confess our sins and pray for guidance daily. Not for forgiveness alone but so that we can tear down the lies that entrap us and plant the truths God has given us.
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nicely put

Your last few posts were spot on.
 
Grace777x70

Grace777x70

Banned
#158
Nov 22, 2015
20,436
1,431
0
#158
JennaLeanne said:
Oh amen, I'm definetly doing a "I am so totally free" dance in my living room right now... Wish you could all see! Haha
.. What a glorious gospel.. Here's another great explanation of 1 John 1:9 it's very similar just a lot shorter.
What is the meaning behind 1 John 1:9? Who is John addressing? - Are You Ready for a Change?
Click to expand...

Thanks!..there is always something more that comes that shows the truth of the freedom in Christ and the awesome salvation we have in Him!
 
Grace777x70

Grace777x70

Banned
#159
Nov 22, 2015
20,436
1,431
0
#159
Ariel82 said:
Wow, that link showed that this debate has been happening for years.

I wonder who has grown and what views have changed through the discussion.
Click to expand...
This has been going on for years in different forms.

Sometimes we think some truths are new but in reality they are not. Here is someone back in the 1800's that had a "heretical" understanding of grace in the form of our sins being forgiven.

I was reading this morning about a hymn writer from the 1800's called Frances Ridley Havergal. She wrote many hymns and knew Latin, French, German, Greek and Hebrew. She also knew by heart the 4 gospels, epistles and the book of Revelation by the time she was 23 years old - yet she still lived in total defeat. She thought she had "great wickedness in her heart" - because of religious traditions taught to her.

It wasn't until she was reading in the Greek that the present tense was used for 1 John 1:7 ...His blood cleanseth us from all sin".

She realized all her sins were forgiven by the blood of Jesus and thus she believed it and experienced peace and joy in her life because of this truth.

Here is a direct quote:

" Have we not been limiting 1 John 1:7 , by practically making it refer only to "remission of sins that are past" instead of taking the grand simplicity of "cleanseth from all sin"?

"All" is all; and as we may trust Him to cleanse us from the stain of past sins so we may trust Him to cleanse us from all present defilement; yes, all!

By refusing to take 1 John 1:7 in it's fullness, we will lose the fullness of it's application and power in our lives. It goes on cleansing , and I have no words to tell how my heart rejoices in it."

She got the revelation that all her sins were forgiven because she was in Christ and in the Light. She was able to walk free in Christ from that point on. Today she would be called a "hyper-grace" heretic by some.

Believing the true gospel will change us as we grow in His grace.

Source: Jennie Chappell, "Women Who Have Worked and Won: the life story of Mrs. Spurgeon, Mrs. Booth-Tucker, F.R. Havergal, and Ramabai," London: S.W. Partridge & Co. Ltd. 1904
 
Grace777x70

Grace777x70

Banned
#160
Nov 22, 2015
20,436
1,431
0
#160
Ariel82 said:
Sorry if you want to change the meaning of "we" to mean only Gnostics because you can't simply accept that God might convict you of sin and thusly you need to Repent and confess that sin He has shown you, then you are living in an illusion.

Yes we have victory through Christ. Yes we should do a happy dance and focus on walking with Him.

However, we are human and we still have spiritual strongholds that need tearing down. That is why we need God's chastening, that is why we still,need to confess our sins and pray for guidance daily. Not for forgiveness alone but so that we can tear down the lies that entrap us and plant the truths God has given us.
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Nobody says not to repent from sin. That is not the issue at all and the "we" is all inclusive to include anyone who says that there is no sin in the world.

I realize this goes against our religious traditions and it did me too at first until the Lord showed me the truth. Knowing the truth has made me sin less then ever and it is life-changing to walk on in Christ knowing what He ahs done for us
 
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