baptism problem

[xino]

Have you been baptised?
a simple question.


I found out that Christiening (sprinkling water on an infant as baptism) means nothing and is not even in the bible.
It is just another human rule tradition.

Ever since I found out, I've been anxious to get baptised, now the problem is, many churches around me are turning baptism into what they want.

Originally when you repent, you get baptised straight away however churches are using baptism as an opportunity to trap people as members of their church.
This is what we call Church Denomination, meaning getting baptised with a church means you are a member of the church. Another way of saying Baptism by Membership.
To some people, this is a good thing but to others is stupid and just a trap.
Why should one be bounded by 1 church? what if that person wants to visit another church?

I want to get baptised at a usual church I started going to, they told me I must go through a training. What training!???
A friend of mine who is knowledgeable in the bible said he can find out if I can get baptised at his church, now him too is telling me his church needs to get money to perform baptism because they need to rent a pool and I need to be taught a few things before being baptised.
Now the new church I just went today, I asked the pastor if I could get baptised ASAP, he said I will have to wait till September to be baptised. Because it's much like a group baptism.


This is completely retarded and atrocious! What if Jesus comes tomorrow eh? and I'm still bloody waiting to be baptised.

All these churches and their rules!
It is not a big deal to get baptised or hard. All you need is a bathtub, water and dip the person inside. Why all the exaggeration and commotions? Why all the ceremonials man? these things are not even in the bible (unless someone can point them out to me here)


so have you been baptised recently? (not as an infant)
how was the baptism?
and how does your church baptise people?

 

[JaumeJ]

Baptism is something ceremonial, and it may be a duty to be baptized of your own free will. I do not believe our loving Father would bar anyone from heaven simply because he did not know to or have the means to be baptized.
I was baptized at the age of 28 in obedience.
My understanding of the procedure, if there really is any set manner, is to be baptized in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. As far as I know anyone who believes may perform this ceremony. In my case it was in a church (empty) by a brother in Christ.
Now any body of water is fine, even a bath tub.
I remember when the Ethiopian who was studying the Word of God saw a body of water and said, "There is water, what is to prevent me from being baptized?" And he was baptized right then and there.
If I were there, and you would permit, I would baptize you. God bless you always, in Jesus Christ, amen!

 

[Crosby]

I've never experienced any of those issues but you make some good points my brother. I know the churches I've been to will let you get baptize in their facilities at the next service day. At one church I know of, they will get ahold of some brothers and sisters in Christ and all go down to the closest river or body of water that day. Maybe that might be a good idea for you if possible.

 

[damombomb]

The Apostles baptized all the time in the name ofJesus for remission on sins
Baptism also requires repentence, as far as training, im not sure mabe it will help to know what to expect

 

[PopClick]

I believe that any other Christian can baptize you, even in a lake or pond. Don't owe any church your money or allegiance for doing what God has asked you to do. People will needlessly complicate anything, if you let them. But God knows your heart.

 

[WolfInOxHide]

Baptism is an outward reflection of the inner experience.
As long as you have the inner experience, you're good.

But I believe the outward experience is a very valuable thing to have, to help you understand the inner, and to promote the element of interaction with other like minded people.

If you can, be baptized outdoors in a natural setting by people who are embracing the experience, rather than using it as a signature on a dotted line.

And be baptized in the "name", which is to say, the core essence of Yeshua, which is, "Ya is OUR Salvation", not "my salvation".

 

[Crosby]

Our identification in Christ Jesus is emphasized through baptism (Rom Chapter 6).
I know when I hit that water thinking, "this is for real Lord, I'm dying to my old self, my old ways" I could really feel the cleansing of my soul that raised me in the newness of life as i came back up out of that water (and bellard out a big AMEN). Which brings to mind how an army chaplain reported his amazement at the large number of Desert Storm soldiers who gave their hearts and lives to Jesus Christ, then asked if they could be baptized. To accommodate their requests, a wise pastor used the only baptismal available in the middle of the Saudi Arabian desert, which was a coffin—a potent symbol of the death, burial, and resurrection of which baptism is a picture.

 

[WolfInOxHide]

To accommodate their requests, a wise pastor used the only baptismal available in the middle of the Saudi Arabian desert, which was a coffin—a potent symbol of the death, burial, and resurrection of which baptism is a picture.

NICE. Because the Jordan river is the same symbol.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

The problem is Baptism has become to the church what Circumcision was to the Jews. They have taken a thing which God used to shadow what God does to us spiritually, and turned it into a religious ceremony which has lost its original meaning.

In the NT, People were baptized IMMEDIATELY without any training, Yet as a Jew would say you must be circumcised before you can "Join Gods people", Many churches will say you must be baptized before you can "join the church" They even go as far as saying you can't be saved< Just like the jews did" unless you participate in this symbolic ceremony, which God did command, in both cases, but not as a prerequisite for salvation. It is the HS who circumcises us, by baptizing us into Christ. We need to worry that we have recieved the circumcision/baptism done by the hands of God before we worry about the ones done by the hands of men.

 

[Nautilus]

I think people put too much emphasis on the sprinkling versus immersion methods. Its the thought and heart behind the act not the technical way its done

 

[Abiding]

The problem is Baptism has become to the church what Circumcision was to the Jews. They have taken a thing which God used to shadow what God does to us spiritually, and turned it into a religious ceremony which has lost its original meaning.

In the NT, People were baptized IMMEDIATELY without any training, Yet as a Jew would say you must be circumcised before you can "Join Gods people", Many churches will say you must be baptized before you can "join the church" They even go as far as saying you can't be saved< Just like the jews did" unless you participate in this symbolic ceremony, which God did command, in both cases, but not as a prerequisite for salvation. It is the HS who circumcises us, by baptizing us into Christ. We need to worry that we have recieved the circumcision/baptism done by the hands of God before we worry about the ones done by the hands of men.

Oh i see your angle here....the point.
your wanting us to see the point!
Novel idear!

 

[Laodicea]

I think people put too much emphasis on the sprinkling versus immersion methods. Its the thought and heart behind the act not the technical way its done

The word baptism means to immerse

 

[Nautilus]

The word baptism means to immerse

No it doesn't.

baptism

[bap-tiz-uhm] &#8194; Example Sentences Origin
bap·tism

&#8194; &#8194;[bap-tiz-uhm] Show IPA
noun 1. Ecclesiastical . a ceremonial immersion in water, or application of water, as an initiatory rite or sacrament of the Christian church.


So there is Immersion, Affusion, Aspersion, and Submersion all as methods of baptism.

 

[Laodicea]

No it doesn't.

baptism

[bap-tiz-uhm] &#8194; Example Sentences Origin
bap·tism

&#8194; &#8194;[bap-tiz-uhm] Show IPA
noun 1. Ecclesiastical . a ceremonial immersion in water, or application of water, as an initiatory rite or sacrament of the Christian church.


So there is Immersion, Affusion, Aspersion, and Submersion all as methods of baptism.

Strong's Concordance
G907
&#946;&#945;&#960;&#964;&#953;&#769;&#950;&#969;
baptizo&#772;
bap-tid'-zo
From a derivative of G911; to make whelmed (that is, fully wet); used only (in the New Testament) of ceremonial ablution, especially (technically) of the ordinance of Christian baptism: - baptist, baptize, wash.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

No it doesn't.

baptism

[bap-tiz-uhm] &#8194; Example Sentences Origin
bap·tism

&#8194; &#8194;[bap-tiz-uhm] Show IPA
noun 1. Ecclesiastical . a ceremonial immersion in water, or application of water, as an initiatory rite or sacrament of the Christian church.


So there is Immersion, Affusion, Aspersion, and Submersion all as methods of baptism.

Baptism is not a native english word. It is a transliteration of the greek word Baptizo. Thus we should not use an english dictionary to interpret a word which is not english.

Baptizo is a derivative of the word Bapto, which means to dip, or to partially submerge, The word Baptizo means to completely submerge,

It also is used in other ways, As in a dyed garment is baptized in the dye, changing its characteristics.

Also, it is used (Scripturally) of a means of "placing into union with someone or something. IE, The children of isreal were placed into Moses (baptised) in the cloud and in the sea. Moses being the leader, the children were placed into union with him.

It also has a ceremonial function, as in the ceremonial washings of religious items in the OT jewish system.

It is not a sprinkling, There is another greek word for sprinking (rantizo)

 

[xino]

The problem is Baptism has become to the church what Circumcision was to the Jews. They have taken a thing which God used to shadow what God does to us spiritually, and turned it into a religious ceremony which has lost its original meaning.

In the NT, People were baptized IMMEDIATELY without any training, Yet as a Jew would say you must be circumcised before you can "Join Gods people", Many churches will say you must be baptized before you can "join the church" They even go as far as saying you can't be saved< Just like the jews did" unless you participate in this symbolic ceremony, which God did command, in both cases, but not as a prerequisite for salvation. It is the HS who circumcises us, by baptizing us into Christ. We need to worry that we have recieved the circumcision/baptism done by the hands of God before we worry about the ones done by the hands of men.

Well said man!
The church I was talking about said exactly WHAT you just said here!

telling me I need to do some training, which is basically the church's doctrine!
telling me Kingdom of God is the church and unless I am baptised I can only enter the Kingdom of God.
telling me we are all disciples/christians, unless you are a Christian/Disiciple you will not be saved!

I just lost my touch with them man, they can stuff their baptism to themselves.
I was even on the phone to one of them whom I branded a good friend, telling him I don't agree with the things they said to me (their teaching).

He was just using excuses on the phone.
I can't believe people do this!
Because we can only baptise people UNLESS you are a pastor/bishop or disciple. The church feels like they have the power to baptism and will use it as ransom. So basically if you want to be baptised, you have to join their church. Whereas Jesus allowed baptising to be free and we receive the Holy Spirit free. Yet in order to get the holy spirit through baptism, we need to join their church:/



And to others arguing below, seriously DOES IT MATTER what Baptism stands for!?

 

[Laodicea]

Those baptized in the days of the early church joined the early church. They could not have joined if they did not accept the doctrine the apostles taught.

 

[damombomb]

Acts 2:36-39

King James Version (KJV)

36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

 

[OFM]

I believe that any other Christian can baptize you, even in a lake or pond. Don't owe any church your money or allegiance for doing what God has asked you to do. People will needlessly complicate anything, if you let them. But God knows your heart.

I Agree With PopClick i was Baptizied in the Ocean on a Feb. Winter day in 28 Degree Water Temperture....

 

[greatblue]

The problem is Baptism has become to the church what Circumcision was to the Jews. They have taken a thing which God used to shadow what God does to us spiritually, and turned it into a religious ceremony which has lost its original meaning.

In the NT, People were baptized IMMEDIATELY without any training, Yet as a Jew would say you must be circumcised before you can "Join Gods people", Many churches will say you must be baptized before you can "join the church" They even go as far as saying you can't be saved< Just like the jews did" unless you participate in this symbolic ceremony, which God did command, in both cases, but not as a prerequisite for salvation. It is the HS who circumcises us, by baptizing us into Christ. We need to worry that we have recieved the circumcision/baptism done by the hands of God before we worry about the ones done by the hands of men.

Sinful man. It is this whole Pharisaic heart rooted in human pride, ego, and identity. The body of Christ is divided because of these things and on some of the smallest points people seek to proliferate their view like they are God's mouthpiece. Churches have a hierarchy of pastors, boards of elders, etc., and in some ways it seems they have made the church too structurally corporate. There are seriously checklists that churches have, from how much money people give, etc. This common story of church membership and baptism is so oppositional to John the Baptist. John was anointed by God, filled with the Holy Spirit from the womb, and he stood apart from anything corporate. Interestingly, the Holy Spirit did not descend upon Jesus until after He was baptized by John. I'm not saying that one must be baptized with water first, but Jesus did say that this way was necessary in that moment, "for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness." I've always praised God at the significance of this and I think churches need to slow their roll and think about where they are headed. Seriously, the church is becoming more like the world by the minute.

And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him: 17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

I've kind of gone all over the place on this one because it has me perturbed. Baptism should be solely about repentance and following Jesus (Matt 16:24). I like what JaumeJ offered...we need more believer's baptizing each other!