Calvinism and Context?
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If that's as you say,then I'm wondering WHAT FORCED ITSELF INTO YOU THAT YOU COULDN'T RESIST!
There is only ONE camp,the redeemed!
The devil is deceptive and KNOWS the word also!
I have really tried with you and will do as God instructs me but you need to be alone with GOD for a while and test the spirits
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No, he didn't pen them as you read it. And I attempted to discuss the verses you cite claiming he did in the last thread and rather than engaging the question and presenting a counter argument you blustered and stated it was iron clad.
Paul wrote documents with context that informs their content. You strip individual statements of their context, interpret them incorrectly, and then attribute your incorrect interpretation to Paul.
And then you refuse to engage people seeking to understand Scripture on its own terms by insisting it must be read on your terms.
Paul wrote documents with context that informs their content. You strip individual statements of their context, interpret them incorrectly, and then attribute your incorrect interpretation to Paul.
And then you refuse to engage people seeking to understand Scripture on its own terms by insisting it must be read on your terms.
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Your words will not cause me to react again.....I was chosen,drawn by God and saved....if you twist it to say what you said of my saving above,so be it...you are blinded and don’t know the truth.
But you will never ever get me to say what you want me to say......your dogma is just that..dogma.
I am alone with God....how about you?.....
But you will never ever get me to say what you want me to say......your dogma is just that..dogma.
I am alone with God....how about you?.....
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Lol
I don't have a " dogma",I have the word of God!
I am NOT trying to get you to say what I want,I have control of only myself.
You on the other hand are controled by everything that comes your way which is why I'm questioning what was FORCED INTO YOU WITHOUT YOUR CHOICE!
Yes so I said what others are wondering with all the confusing things you say that ONLY you understand.
I'm sorry but I think you may need a " PRIEST)...... LOL
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In catching up with this discussion, since leaving on Saturday, it really has gained little traction and moved forward just as little.
However, the one thing that keeps jumping out at me, is how the "free will" arguers use the word "all", to defend their position. They claim the "free grace and election side" do damage to this words true meaning. Can we be honest here, just for a moment and admit that "all", often does not mean "all".
May I ask then, the "free will" side, or any who oppose election on this basis, if "all" means "all" and does "all" mean "all" of mankind in the following verses:
Mat 2:3 When Herod the king had heard these things, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him.
Mat 3:5 Then went out to him Jerusalem, and all Judaea, and all the region round about Jordan,
Mat 10:22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
Mat 12:23 And all the people were amazed, and said, Is not this the son of David?
Mat 14:20 And they did all eat, and were filled: and they took up of the fragments that remained twelve baskets full.
Mat 20:6 And about the eleventh hour he went out, and found others standing idle, and saith unto them, Why stand ye here all the day idle?
Mat 21:26 But if we shall say, Of men; we fear the people; for all hold John as a prophet.
Mat 22:10 So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests.
John 3:26 And they came unto John, and said unto him, Rabbi, he that was with thee beyond Jordan, to whom thou barest witness, behold, the same baptizeth, and all men come to him.
John 5:23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
John 13:35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.
Act 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Rom 15:14 And I myself also am persuaded of you, my brethren, that ye also are full of goodness, filled with all knowledge, able also to admonish one another.
That's enough for now. In each of the above verses, is not the word "all" limited in it's use and it's understanding?
However, the one thing that keeps jumping out at me, is how the "free will" arguers use the word "all", to defend their position. They claim the "free grace and election side" do damage to this words true meaning. Can we be honest here, just for a moment and admit that "all", often does not mean "all".
May I ask then, the "free will" side, or any who oppose election on this basis, if "all" means "all" and does "all" mean "all" of mankind in the following verses:
Mat 2:3 When Herod the king had heard these things, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him.
Mat 3:5 Then went out to him Jerusalem, and all Judaea, and all the region round about Jordan,
Mat 10:22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
Mat 12:23 And all the people were amazed, and said, Is not this the son of David?
Mat 14:20 And they did all eat, and were filled: and they took up of the fragments that remained twelve baskets full.
Mat 20:6 And about the eleventh hour he went out, and found others standing idle, and saith unto them, Why stand ye here all the day idle?
Mat 21:26 But if we shall say, Of men; we fear the people; for all hold John as a prophet.
Mat 22:10 So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests.
John 3:26 And they came unto John, and said unto him, Rabbi, he that was with thee beyond Jordan, to whom thou barest witness, behold, the same baptizeth, and all men come to him.
John 5:23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
John 13:35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.
Act 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Rom 15:14 And I myself also am persuaded of you, my brethren, that ye also are full of goodness, filled with all knowledge, able also to admonish one another.
That's enough for now. In each of the above verses, is not the word "all" limited in it's use and it's understanding?
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2 Peter 2.
V17
These false teachers are like places in the ground where water should come up.But there is no water.They are like clouds in a storm.The strong wind blows those clouds away quickly so that they bring no rain.
God has kept a completely black ,dark place where these false teachers will have to stay.
V17
These false teachers are like places in the ground where water should come up.But there is no water.They are like clouds in a storm.The strong wind blows those clouds away quickly so that they bring no rain.
God has kept a completely black ,dark place where these false teachers will have to stay.
You seem to misunderstand the objection, at least on my part. It is not that all has to mean each and every, but that in order to preserve the doctrine of election as presented under TULIP dishonest scales are used.
In one place, where Scripture appears to possibly agree with the doctrine the plain text cannot be assailed. There is no discussing of the context or other Scripture that need to be harmonized the text alone is sufficient.
Where Scripture appears to contradict, the doctrine takes precedence and the text has to give way.
There is no consistency, no standard by which Scripture is being discussed and its contents understood it is simply being twisted to suit the doctrine and preserve it.
In one place, where Scripture appears to possibly agree with the doctrine the plain text cannot be assailed. There is no discussing of the context or other Scripture that need to be harmonized the text alone is sufficient.
Where Scripture appears to contradict, the doctrine takes precedence and the text has to give way.
There is no consistency, no standard by which Scripture is being discussed and its contents understood it is simply being twisted to suit the doctrine and preserve it.
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