Daniel is out of chronological order.

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Therapon

Guest
#81
REALLY?
which author? you?

A. ch.2-3…...The Seven Churches…The Church
B. ch.6……….The Seven Seals……….World Judged
C. ch.7:4-8..The 144,000…………….Old Testament

C. ch.7:9-14…..The Great Multitude….New Testament
B. ch.8-9………..The Seven Trumpets…World Judged
A. ch.11………….The Two Witnesses……The Church

A. ch.12…..Woman with 12 Stars……….Israel
B. ch.13…..Leopard-Lion-Bear Beast….Satanic Kingdom
B ch.14…..144,000 & The Gospel……..The Saved Within It
C. ch.15…..Song of Moses and Lamb…Victory for Redeemed

C. ch.16…..Bowls of Wrath……………..Wrath for the Wicked
B. ch.17…..Seven-Headed Beast…….Satanic Kingdoms
B. ch.18…..Babylon………………………….Satanic System
B ch.19…..King of Kings…………………Destruction of Wicked
A. ch.20…..The Thousand Years……..The Church

this is 4 then 5...not 4 and 4 or 5 and 5....so what happened to your step ladder?

The Two Witnesses are the Church and the Old-Wineskin-Saved-through-Blinding-Jews are both “witnesses to the God of heaven”.

“At the end of the Two Witnesses the Church and the Jews will lose their spiritual power.”


wasn't that in 1948?

how did the Two Witnesses of God lose their spiritual power in 1948?



A. ch.12…..Woman with 12 Stars……….Israel
B. ch.13…..Leopard-Lion-Bear Beast….Satanic Kingdom
B ch.14…..144,000 & The Gospel……..The Saved Within It
C. ch.15…..Song of Moses and Lamb…Victory for Redeemed

C. ch.16…..Bowls of Wrath……………..Wrath for the Wicked
B. ch.17…..Seven-Headed Beast…….Satanic Kingdoms
B. ch.18…..Babylon………………………….Satanic System
B ch.19…..King of Kings…………………Destruction of Wicked
A. ch.20…..The Thousand Years……..The Church


so SATAN rules over the Holy Land throughout history via seven (7) Satanic Kingdoms?
But throughout all that God is preserving His Two Witnesses the Jews and the Church?

................

straighten out any misunderstanding ellis. before we go on.
Just who do you think you are, quoting my chiasms as if they were your own. No wonder I have difficulty tolerating you.
 
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Ariel82

Guest
#82
??? i think she wanted to see if they were your chiasms

before debating/posting why she thinks you are wrong....

I'm pretty sure she's not pretending that they are hers....just an observation..
 
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Therapon

Guest
#83
??? i think she wanted to see if they were your chiasms
before debating/posting why she thinks you are wrong....
I'm pretty sure she's not pretending that they are hers....just an observation..
Ever since I've been on this forum, Zone has been following me around, misrepresenting and distorting what I have written in an unsuccessful attempts to disprove my posts and I'm sick of it.
 
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Ariel82

Guest
#84
well.... there is the ignore button.

its an open forum.

people look at both sides, hopefully pray about it and decide for themselves who speak truth and who is mislead.

as people say it takes two to tango.

I haven't been paying that close attention to the interaction between you and Zone, but in this thread it seems like she is posting your old work as you say.

You might not like her comments on your work, but its her opinion.

most people will be able to tell the difference between your own words and what she writes.

i'll go back and skim this thread again....
 
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Ariel82

Guest
#85
not the nicest way to disagree with you, but I do wonder at why you don't just continue with the thread instead of get upset with what she is talking about.

I suggest you either ignore it or address it.

I would like an answer to one of her questions:

"do you read or write Hebrew OR Aramaic ?"

Don't know if I agree with your understanding of Daniel for a number of reasons.

would you like to discuss the topic, or would your rather not?

i'm still trying to figure out how you got 1967 as the fulfillment of the Gentile time and if there really is a basis for this "gentile" time you purpose.
 
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cfultz3

Guest
#86
Ever since I've been on this forum, Zone has been following me around, misrepresenting and distorting what I have written in an unsuccessful attempts to disprove my posts and I'm sick of it.
Like people has been telling you, ignore it and move on. Take it from people who has been here awhile, it won't stop as long as you respond to it.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#87
Just who do you think you are, quoting my chiasms as if they were your own. No wonder I have difficulty tolerating you.
ELLIS IS THIS YOUR WORK?

please answer so i can proceed.

Hebrew poetry is parallel in nature. A Hebrew poet would say something one way and then repeat the same idea later on in different words. These repeats could be a sentence, a paragraph, or even several chapters long. So how can we identify repetitive prophecies when we see them? By recognizing the Hebrew poetic style in which it was written.

The most elegant of the Old Testament poets was Isaiah. In his book we spot one poetic style very quickly. Isaiah is divided into two almost equal parts, and these two parts are repetitive.1 Isaiah 1 through 33 is parallel to Isaiah 34 through 66, not just in a general sense, but in actual content. The last half of Isaiah contains a different description of the same subjects that are covered in the first half. Textual scholars call this type of repetition the bifidic form.2

.....

That AB=BA stepladder is called a Chiasm,3 pronounced kee-ahzum. Chiasms appear throughout Scripture, from Genesis to Revelation.

What an author declares in the steps going up, he repeats in the steps going down.


.....

are these your words, Ellis? i'll wait before proceeding. don't want to MISREPRESENT anything you wrote.

also........do you read or write Hebrew OR Aramaic Ellis?



REALLY?
which author? you?



A. ch.2-3…...The Seven Churches…The Church
B. ch.6……….The Seven Seals……….World Judged
C. ch.7:4-8..The 144,000…………….Old Testament

C. ch.7:9-14…..The Great Multitude….New Testament
B. ch.8-9………..The Seven Trumpets…World Judged
A. ch.11………….The Two Witnesses……The Church



A. ch.12…..Woman with 12 Stars……….Israel
B. ch.13…..Leopard-Lion-Bear Beast….Satanic Kingdom
B ch.14…..144,000 & The Gospel……..The Saved Within It
C. ch.15…..Song of Moses and Lamb…Victory for Redeemed

C. ch.16…..Bowls of Wrath……………..Wrath for the Wicked
B. ch.17…..Seven-Headed Beast…….Satanic Kingdoms
B. ch.18…..Babylon………………………….Satanic System
B ch.19…..King of Kings…………………Destruction of Wicked
A. ch.20…..The Thousand Years……..The Church


this is 4 then 5...not 4 and 4 or 5 and 5....so what happened to your step ladder?


The Two Witnesses are the Church and the Old-Wineskin-Saved-through-Blinding-Jews are both “witnesses to the God of heaven”.

“At the end of the Two Witnesses the Church and the Jews will lose their spiritual power.”


wasn't that in 1948?

how did the Two Witnesses of God lose their spiritual power in 1948?



A. ch.12…..Woman with 12 Stars……….Israel
B. ch.13…..Leopard-Lion-Bear Beast….Satanic Kingdom
B ch.14…..144,000 & The Gospel……..The Saved Within It
C. ch.15…..Song of Moses and Lamb…Victory for Redeemed

C. ch.16…..Bowls of Wrath……………..Wrath for the Wicked
B. ch.17…..Seven-Headed Beast…….Satanic Kingdoms
B. ch.18…..Babylon………………………….Satanic System
B ch.19…..King of Kings…………………Destruction of Wicked
A. ch.20…..The Thousand Years……..The Church



so SATAN rules over the Holy Land throughout history via seven (7) Satanic Kingdoms?
But throughout all that God is preserving His Two Witnesses the Jews and the Church?

................


straighten out any misunderstanding ellis.
before we go on.
CAN'T READ?
OR CAN'T BE BOTHERED?

YOU THINK I'D POST THAT STUFF AS MY OWN?
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#88
Just who do you think you are, quoting my chiasms as if they were your own. No wonder I have difficulty tolerating you.
you ain't payin attention. at all
i'd never post that as my own work.

none of your stuff i post (in the days to come) will be my own.
it comes FROM YOUR OWN WORK.

doesn't it ellis.

let's see how you did your magic trick.

the barely tolerating part is mutual i assure you
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#89
Ever since I've been on this forum, Zone has been following me around, misrepresenting and distorting what I have written in an unsuccessful attempts to disprove my posts and I'm sick of it.
not unsuccessful.
too bad you're sick of it.

you're here to promote yourself, i'm here to defend the FAITH.

not let some crackpot new soteriology that Old Testament Wine Skin Jews ARE SAVED BY NOT ACCEPTING JESUS CHRIST - THE ONE FROM THE NT - JESUS OF NAZARETH - THAT MESSIAH.

your claim is they are saved BY NOT HAVING THE NEW WINE POURED INTO THEM - lest they should explode.

heresy.
 
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Abiding

Guest
#90
Therapon, why not discuss your work with those questioning it?
Why else are you here?
 
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Therapon

Guest
#91
Therapon, why not discuss your work with those questioning it? Why else are you here?
Look Abiding, there is a vast difference between not agreeing with my posts and saying so, and distorting, misrepresenting and in some cases lying about them, coupled with ridicule and disrespect, which I bend ever effort not to do, because, Scripture says, "Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him," Proverbs 16:4.

A lot of guests come on here and read the discourtesy and open insults, and what do you suppose that does to our supposedly Christian witness? Frankly, I'm sick of it and you should be, too. You guys chief worry seems to be that everyone is on the same doctrinal page, my major concern is that I do not displease the Lord in what I post.
 
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Ariel82

Guest
#92
nope most people are not on the same doctrinal page.

and I have two chief concerns when posting or reading post:

1. learning God's truth in others posts
2. Sharing God's love with the world.

You can't control others actions and as the post in the family forum says... you do better seeing the good in others than being distracted by the bad.

I really dislike the phrase "you guys" as if we are all some mob and not individual, unique and beloved children of God.

I came back to see if you were going to answer any questions. Guess i was too optimistic. sigh....
 
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Therapon

Guest
#93
nope most people are not on the same doctrinal page.

and I have two chief concerns when posting or reading post:

1. learning God's truth in others posts
2. Sharing God's love with the world.

You can't control others actions and as the post in the family forum says... you do better seeing the good in others than being distracted by the bad.

I really dislike the phrase "you guys" as if we are all some mob and not individual, unique and beloved children of God.

I came back to see if you were going to answer any questions. Guess i was too optimistic. sigh....
Ask me a question without a hook in it and I'll answere you right now.
 
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Ariel82

Guest
#94
what languages are you fluent in and have you study Daniel in the original languages?

what's a hook?
 
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Therapon

Guest
#95
what languages are you fluent in and have you study Daniel in the original languages? what's a hook?
A hook is a hidden insult or agenda that after you answer in good faith, the person says to himshef, "Gotcha."
 
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Therapon

Guest
#96
I read a smattering of Greek and Hebrew, but by no means consider myself a scholar in either language. However, I have friends who are both, so when I run into some linguistic problem for which I cannot find the answer in my library (which is rather extensive) I ask them. The Tanack (the Jewish trnslation into English) gives me some of what I need. I'm no casual student, brother. I've been at it for 35 years.
 
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Therapon

Guest
#97
Ariel82;960373I really dislike the phrase "you guys" as if we are all some mob and not individual said:
Please don't take offence, but the "you guys" was not about you at all, my dear. It was about the post I was answering, i.e., Abiding and his compadres.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,429
6,707
113
#98
Yahweh, God, comes to each person as that person needs, or does anyone believe that each's salvation occurs in the same manner? This being true, it is a fact that each believer does have something between himself and Yahweh, that other's may not have which is not written in the lessons of the Body of Yeshua in the Word. These articles of faith, individual as is their character, are not to be imposed upon others because though the individual has a clear conscience in the sight of Yahweh concerning thèm, not being written and not given the power of the Holy Spirit to impart them, they are only for the individual. All who know Yeshua, Jesus, do have much in common concerning doctrine, they believe the Bible is Yahweh's Word, and that Yeshua, Jesus, is the Word. Christ crucified for the propition of sin and the resurrection are common belief and doctrine. There is much that is common doctrine, and there is much for individual's to keep to themselves. In all we believe, be it a personal privilege or written and empowered by the Holy Spirit, we believe nothing that goes against the Gospel of Jesus Christ, Yeshua, amen.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#99
my major concern is that I do not displease the Lord in what I post.
really?
how do you think He feels about all that false doctrine you cooked up?
and you're pretending manners are what this is about?
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
I read a smattering of Greek and Hebrew, but by no means consider myself a scholar in either language. However, I have friends who are both, so when I run into some linguistic problem for which I cannot find the answer in my library (which is rather extensive) I ask them. The Tanack (the Jewish trnslation into English) gives me some of what I need. I'm no casual student, brother. I've been at it for 35 years.
i read elsewhere in your own writings you said you did not read or write hebrew.